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HomeGAF – Putting your hard hat on!

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p_xavier

Authorized Fister
As someone who loves to build stuff, I’m amazed that GAF doesn’t have its own construction thread (or I’m lousy at handling the search engine). My new place is currently in construction, and I would like to show you the complete process of reconverting an old factory space to a modern loft, be it from the actual construction work, from negotiating mortgage fees to selecting the paint color.

Any contribution to this thread will be appreciated as your experience might have differed. Ask your questions too as I know many people in the field and I’m sure some gaffers work in the industry too.

*Please write me if you find any typos, as I’m not the best writer.


Who am I?
I’m a Canadian who lives in Montréal, Québec. I currently work as a senior security project manager for a big firm and I teach aerospace engineering part time. As for my lifestyle, I’m someone who travels at least once a month for leisure and like living in an urban setting. I own a car (2012 Audi TT) and a motorbike (2010 Ducati Monster) but I take the metro when I’m in town as it’s more efficient. I have a wild Bengal as a pet and I’ve been single for the last decade. I spend most of my nights and weekends in bars and clubs. I still need to be really comfortable at home since it’s the only setting that relaxes me thoroughly. That’s about it for me!


Why am I doing this?
I recently sold my loft due to some issues I had with the place. No balcony, terrace and parking space for my car were the biggest issues. You could say that I didn’t plan properly and you would be right. Here are some pictures of my old place in which I lived from 2011-2014. For that place I wanted a more modern take on the Bauhaus style. But really, I had kept the place if I hadn’t been kicked out the province last year.

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Specifically, I’m writing in this thread because I have too much free time on my hands these days since I’m living in a small apartment, and I would like to share my experience of the whole process. Plus gaffers from the “show your gaming setup…” thread suggested me to do this one.
 

p_xavier

Authorized Fister
Step 1: Finding a space
Most realtors would shout, location, location, location! But I disagree; it’s not because your new neighborhood is hip right now that you’ll be happy in it. My old neighborhood was really pretty but no restaurants were opened on weekends, so nightlife was practically nonexistent.

The location of your home should always be based on an objective list of requirements. Those who can’t choose between two plates at a restaurant should get help from a friend. Like I previously mentioned, I misread myself when I assumed that I would never need a terrace. I really missed to BBQ.

I never choose a price range as a first requirement, as your location setting shouldn’t be directly related.

First question: Country, Suburb or City
This is a tough one, because as someone from the countryside, I always missed living away from there. Thus when I decided to sell my loft, I wanted to have some money left to have a country home as well as a place in the city. I understand that might not be a choice for many, but in Montréal, having a condo in the city and a house in the country costs less than a house in the city.

As someone who never liked compromises in the first place, owning a condo in the city and a house in the country was the best choice for me.

Second question: Choosing your neighborhood
I’m someone who likes to optimize his time, so I needed a neighborhood with a high walking factor. Other factors which influenced my choice of a neighborhood are:
· Metro stations
· High-end restaurants
· Farmers’ market
· 15 minutes max commute to my job
· Low crime index
· Gentrification potential
· Club scene

Most people with children would probably say, nice parks, good schools etc. But since I’m single these were my main determining factors. It’s important afterwards to go to potential neighborhoods and walk and the area many times to get a good feeling of the place. You might not know that a park is a junkie place at night if you didn’t see it yourself.

Third question: House, townhouse, or condo?
Each of them has its advantage, if you have a big family; a three-bedroom condo could cost as much as a house. Myself I decided to go for a condo, as I’m single and I don’t need much space to be comfortable. I also don’t need to care for yard work and such as my condo fees pay for these services and someone manages the workers.

Fourth question: House styling
For me it’s pretty simple, if it’s less than 80 years old, I don’t find the place to have much charm nor character so I’m not interested. Plus having an old place protects you from trends and the build quality of the frame is usually top notch. Many people paid big prices for McMansion but the resell value is just not there, as younger people find those houses to be really tacky. Same thing is happening with condo glass towers, I don’t think they will age well into the future. That’s my opinion of course. I also prefer to be the first owner of the home, as I’m pretty OCD about cleanliness in general.

I’m probably in the minority, but I would never buy a house or condo built with a wooden frame. Wood works and creeks, many might find that charming, but on top of being a bigger fire hazard, wood isn’t as resilient as either steel or concrete.

At this stage, it was clear that I wanted an old condo (loft) conversation within the city, limited to three potential neighborhoods.


Step 2: Planning your finances
I would suggest talking to your financial manager as soon as possible if you can. In Canada there are many mortgage brokers firms, but I never had really good service with them. They usually deal with people from the suburbs with standard requirements. I prefer dealing with directly with a banker who knows all about my financial issues. I had the same financial planner since I was a first year university student and it served me well so far.

For the first condo in my late teens (which I had paid the down payment with my student loans), I had a debt ratio of 41. You usually can get a mortgage if you are under 42 of Total Debt Service. I didn’t know much at the time, but looking back, it was probably a big mistake, especially for my social life. I couldn’t afford to eat at restaurants or go out much. I only had enough money to repay my debts. Eventually I got raises at work and the TDS fell, but the first years can be problematic, especially if something bad happens and you need money urgently.

Reasonably, I wouldn’t go over 35 if you have a car or other vehicle, and over 30 if you want to have some kind of social life besides your home. As someone who likes to travel frequently, I fixed my TDS at 25. Gifts also counts towards lowering your TDS, so if you have generous parents (I didn’t), it helps a lot.

Thus, by inverting formulas found on your banking website for TDS calculation, I had found my maximum price I would like to pay for new loft. In my case that is 425 000$ for my loft and a remainder of 550 000$ for my house (the land is already purchased for the house). This, obviously, includes money I had from my previous sales and the appreciation from those sales. I’ve been working full time for 16 years now so I accumulated wealth during all of these years.

The next step is to already have a pre-approved mortgage by your bank. Especially if you have a lower TDS, it shouldn’t be much of an issue if your credit score is good.

You think that because you got your pre-approved mortgage that you will actually get financing? That’s what I assumed too and it caused me many headaches afterwards. What I didn’t know when I bought my first loft, is that historical building conversations are not covered by government mortgage insurances. In Canada, that means that you will need to give at least a 20% deposit. Since I intended to give only %10, it was quite a surprise. In that case I needed to find $50 000 in additional financing in less than a week, just before closing. Most mortgage brokers or realtors don’t know that and assumed that I was just broke, which was insulting and irritating to say the least. My banker talked to the realtor and explained the situation and I opened a line of credit for the remainder. It still pushed my TBD to 35%, something I wasn’t happy with.

Most banks won’t lend you money for non-government insured buildings, even if you only ask for a 5% value mortgage. Other types of mortgages that most banks don’t insure are undivided interest houses or buildings. A majority of buildings in Montréal in old neighborhoods fall under this, so most banks don’t offer financing at all for these properties. This is a big surprise for many.

Also, most new constructions now ask for a 20% deposit at signature of the initial contract; you can always ask your bank for a line of credit in the meantime, as long as you can put the 5% down.


Step 3: Finding your new home
By searching Realtor listings or builders websites, you can find property for sales in your favored neighborhoods and by your maximum budget. Some people prefer to deal with a realtor, but I absolutely hate dealing with them; they usually don’t know anything besides riding in their luxury cars and having a fake smile. Many times, I was the one who told them how to do their job and it pissed me off. For my previous loft, I had specifically put in my contract that I wanted a mortgage-insurable building, and at the end, the place I had bought wasn’t and I had to fine additional financing last minute. Your success may vary and realtors might be upset to read it, but I’ve yet to see the value added of using a realtor, and I’ve used one 3 times.

Most realtors use sites like mls to search for your house. In my opinion, this is something you can do yourself. Many houses are not listed on mls and might be “by owner type” of sales. Specific websites are available by region; I know here duproprio and propriodirect are really popular ones. Higher end houses are usually not available on those websites though.

If you’re looking for new constructions, many cities have house and homes shows where promoters present their new projets. There are also “open house” days where you can go see to the demo unit directly.

If you’re looking for a piece of land to build your new home, they can be found cheaper on websites like eBay, craigslist or Kijiji than on MLS. This is how I found my piece of land for my future house. Make sure you do an environmental assessment of the land before closing though. It took 5 offers before finding and unpolluted piece of land, and I had to buy in a different area altogether.

At this point you should come up with a list of all properties of potential interest for you. If you have significant other, I would suggest coming up with a list of common requirements before visiting. I would even suggest that to leave your significant other at home if of the emotional kind, and bring a friend from the construction industry. At this stage, it is not about the colour of the kitchen but the build quality and layout of the properties you’re looking at.

Don’t be discouraged, it can take dozens of visits before finding a house that you could call home. I find that people expect too much. A house was built for someone else’s specifications, it is normal that it doesn’t fit all your needs. A 80/20 ratio is usually what I would recommend in looking into. That means, a house that fits your style 80% and only needs 20% renovations is a good potential buy. But make sure, beforehand, that you have the budget for these renovations. Also, if a house interests you, visit it three times as you were dating. As the first date you might thing you have found the love of your life, but at the third date you discover that you’re really incompatible.

Concerning my new place to be, as I’m not someone who compromises easily, it was important for me to have a contractor that would let me be active in the construction process as to have that 80/20 ratio. Bigger contractors usually only give you standard finishings with no possibility of having anything customized. That might be good for a first owner but for me, my home needs to fit my lifestyle 100%. For me, there were 4 potential buildings under renovation that fit my initial list of requirements. For many, that list could contain a pool, two parking spaces etc. My other requirements were to have two indoor parking spaces, a private terrace, a brick wall, concrete floors, natural gaz, industrial windows and absolutely no engineering floors/carpet (you would be surprised how many condos still have those).

As one of my friend worked for one of these 4 contractors, he told me that I should meet the promoters to see if there were interested in doing custom work, which I did. I finally managed to put in my contract a clause which allowed me to do whatever I wanted for my unit, including selecting the potential space in the building. I’m someone that needs to be hands on in the process as you can definitely save on costs by doing most of the work yourself, but then again, this is not for everybody. At this stage I had thus found my new place, and agreed on which work would be handled by the promoter and which I would do myself.
 

p_xavier

Authorized Fister
Step 4: Putting the offer in
Putting an offer of your dream home can be one of the most stressful events of your life. A home is a big investment and many things can complicate the sale. If you intend of using your current home as a financial leverage for your next home, sell it first. You certainly don’t want to be in a position where you’ll have two mortgages to pay, in the event that your house doesn’t sell. If you have the money, good for you!

As home prices are higher in the spring, I would suggest putting an offer late in the fall. Historically, prices are lower in late November/early December. Thus closing time can be early January and moving time April/May for an existing home.

After discussion with the contractor and builders, I decided to reserve a unit, thus I put a formal offer on a smallish 774sf two-storey penthouse-style loft unit with a ~100sf English Court terrace and two indoor parking spaces (bike and car) for $372 800 (tax included), which is an incredible price per sf considering the parking spaces. Some work will still need to be done as I wanted to have many things customized. And most of all, I’ve calculated that with $50 000 of renovations when building, I’ll still be within my fixed budget. The floor plan that I finally put an offer on was not available initially as I got the chance of being an early bird.

If it’s a condo that you’re buying, make sure that you discuss taxes and condo fees. Most promoters present their projets as having low taxes and condo fees and jack up the price the year after. Have condo fees included in your contract for the next five years as to protect yourself from this. Your success may vary though.

Many people are not comfortable to buy a place on a plan, and it can be quite intimidating to put money one something you can’t see or touch. This is understandable, but for me, the joy of owning a custom unit will always be bigger than to buy an already built home.

Deposit was 10% at signature and 90% remainder at closing. My legalese is quite good, but at this stage most would like to deal with a lawyer to review the contract, especially if you didn’t deal with a realtor. I didn’t, as I’m comfortable with these kinds of papers. You usually have a week to desist from buying if you change your mind.

If it’s an existing house that you are buying, make sure that you include complete and thorough inspection clauses. Don’t cheapen out at this stage. It’s better to have surprises now and deal with it in your purchase offer than to find surprises in the 5-10 and lose your main life investment.

Another point I would suggest to have added to your contract is a mortgage title insurance clause. This protects you in the event that the previous owner or the promoter hasn’t paid the builder or subcontractors. Mortgage title insurance is usually cheap (couple of hundreds) so I always had put it up in my contract.
 

Zoc

Member
Nice thread idea.

Is that your old place? I bet it would be great to see before/after pics of your loft conversion. My uncle did the same thing in Montreal a few years ago, and the end result was seriously beautiful.
 

p_xavier

Authorized Fister
Nice thread idea.

Is that your old place? I bet it would be great to see before/after pics of your loft conversion. My uncle did the same thing in Montreal a few years ago, and the end result was seriously beautiful.

Yeah it is. I'll be showing steps along the way for the whole process and be adding sections as I go along with the reconversion.
 

p_xavier

Authorized Fister
As someone in the flooring industry, thank you for staggering your planks. Good job.
Ah thanks! It was a pain in the ass with black bamboo though, really difficult to see the lines on the black soundproofing rubber underneath.
 

Tiolazo

Member
Nice one man!

Everything is about the Planning and do a good Research about what you Want and Need. Because one of the most communs errors that people do are about to rush to something that they cant afford or need.

We can think BIG, but first start small like everyone.

I`m 25 years old and 5 at my own bussines, for my pesronal planning i think more 5 years and i can have my own place. but its like you said, we have to do somes sacrifices like, 95% of time when ppls are on vacation, i`m at my store selling to then haha.

Subscribed btw! when i get some more time, i will post there my Lazo`s home Plan!
 

mrklaw

MrArseFace
I'd love to extend our house, but the layout is tricky. Ideally we'd extend at the rear over the patio, and at minimum move the dining table and a sofa in there. But every time I think about it, I feel like I should be trying to move the kitchen too (current small and at the front of the house) to have a nice kitchen/diner. I might scan in the plans to see if anyone has any ideas.
 

Black1ce

Member
I'm subscribing to this thread. I'm in the prospect of getting a place for myself within the next 12 months in the Ottawa area. Will follow some of the tips offered.
 

p_xavier

Authorized Fister
I'm subscribing to this thread. I'm in the prospect of getting a place for myself within the next 12 months in the Ottawa area. Will follow some of the tips offered.

Not to sound already pessimistic but the build quality in Ottawa is incredibly lacking. I lived there 5 years so don't be shy to ask any questions.
 
I just sd my first home after a coue improvements myself. I'm in the market for a new home and want to try tackling making my own cabinets for a kitchen ...

Great thread. Hope it stays active.
 

p_xavier

Authorized Fister
I just sd my first home after a coue improvements myself. I'm in the market for a new home and want to try tackling making my own cabinets for a kitchen ...

Great thread. Hope it stays active.

What kind of cabinets are you intending to make?
 

Zoe

Member
As a rule when you're building a new home, is it generally going to be cheaper to do the upgrades through a third party after the home is complete, or is it better to just go with the builder? Things like hardwood flooring everywhere, outdoor kitchens, walling off a study, showers instead of tubs, etc
 

turtle553

Member
As a rule when you're building a new home, is it generally going to be cheaper to do the upgrades through a third party after the home is complete, or is it better to just go with the builder? Things like hardwood flooring everywhere, outdoor kitchens, walling off a study, showers instead of tubs, etc

Most of the time it should be cheaper to let the builder do the upgrades or at least at the same time if they will let other contractors in on the build. No point in paying a builder to put in carpeting if you will just rip it out right away. Especially true with anything structural.

If it is based off of a model in a new development, there are usually upgrades you can get (granite counter tops, flooring, etc.) when buying.
 

p_xavier

Authorized Fister
If it is based off of a model in a new development, there are usually upgrades you can get (granite counter tops, flooring, etc.) when buying.

Upgrades in a new project are akin to options when buying a car, they are a complete rip-off. What I suggest is asking the builder to deal with his sub-contractors directly. There is usually a 10% project management fee though for the main contractor, but way cheaper than to go with upgrades or having another contractor to do the rest of the work.
 

p_xavier

Authorized Fister
Since some people wanted me to post about where I'm in the project, I'll use the previous thread I started last year.

Basically, the last year was mostly spent dealing with engineering issues, as well as finding asbestos in the walls... The frame of the building was mostly made of wood and steel. I wanted concrete floors, so they put concrete without realizing that the framing couldn't support the concrete... No the brightest ideas the construction crew had. So it took many months to find a solution for the extra weight.
 

p_xavier

Authorized Fister
These were taken late Summer when the concrete floors were finally poured and sanded :


It was really problematic since the basement was not deep enough for 9' ceilings, they had to dig everything up first.
 

p_xavier

Authorized Fister
There were many issues with the electric and water engineering plans. I had made them myself and the crew didn't respect some of it. So they had to redo some of the work to fit my plans. Basically 3 weeks lost just there. I'm extremely OCD with work, they had to fit everything up to the centimetre.

At this point the window concrete wall was removed and the terrace excavated, and water, gaz and some electricity work done :
 

p_xavier

Authorized Fister
Sandblasting of both storeys done, all plumbing, gaz and framing work done :

The last pics, the set up didn't respect my engineering plans, nor the construction code. I had them modify the electricity set up.
 

p_xavier

Authorized Fister
Electricity and isolation finally done (that was a month ago). Some pics of the basement. We had much issues with the steel beam, I had cut it up a bit to better finish up that wall.
 

p_xavier

Authorized Fister
No this is easy, it's all 45's. The hard part is bringing the saw and stand.
Lol, it's like making wine, you take a raisin and ferment it until it's wine. Repeat a million times. Reality is not like that ;-) I had to redo my epoxy floors three times. Still waiting for the basement to dry. It seems easy but mastering it is challenging.
 
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