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Sony FY14 Q1: 3.5M PS3+PS4, 0.75M PSV/TV+PSP shipped
- Thread starter SwiftDeath
- Start date
KillerMan91
Member
They just got their supply levels back to what normal products have this quarter so yes in a way they overshipped but it was not exactly unexpected. Until this quarter PS4 was pretty much sold out so it makes sense that even with smaller sales this Q they still shipped pretty much everything they could make. Retailers always usually have little extra stock so there are some consoles always in the channel. I don't know if I would call that they ''massively overshipped''.
Agreed on all counts.
Sidewinder
Member
Yes and YES please!
For TVs it could take many years to get there I guess, but who knows, maybe they'll manage to get back into TV business with a bang through OLED.
Edit: what about CLED, Sony showed that stuff several years ago, haven't heard anything since then ;(
DaSorcerer7
Member
Exactly.
Xbox has never outsold PlayStation 3:1 I can bet you that much.
And PS3 came out a year after the Xbox 360 & came back from like a 8 million lead.
Counter to Mediamarkt's sales tax discount.
I simply would not put too much hope on TGS console content based on this. Consoles sales fell 800M$ last year and mobile gaming software is now 1 billion bigger than console software/hardware combined. I think TGS will reflect that.
It is even more impressive how well PS4 is performing in Europe and US considering this.
WELL DONE, Sony and PS4!
PS4 hardware is barely profitable, or it looses very little money.
When Sony starts earning $50 on each console, then it will get its gif.
TerryLee81
Member
Good Q for Sony.
Game division posted 4.3B yen ($42m) opt profit.
Finance division doing fantastic as usual ($430 opt profit)
Company as whole posted $260m net profit.
What category are cameras? Devices? Intersted if they're profitable, because Sony makes amazing cameras.
Just finished listening to the briefing. Overall a good quarter but they are cautious going forward and they should be, really. The one segment that needs work now is Mobile as they are absolutely fucked there. I'll make a thread about it later. Everything else seems to be doing fine, considering there were still restructuring expenses recorded and expenses related to the sell off of Vaio and spinning off Bravia amounting to around 160 million dollars it's impressive they turned a nice a profit.
BlackBuzzard
Banned
How is mobile fucked too many sku's? I thought Xperia phones especially the Z is doing pretty well here in Europe atleast.
Zok310
Banned
Are folks actually making that claim?
TF did not help, price parity did not help, but EA:A will?
Anyway, pleasantly surprised by Sony financials. It was an ok start for the year.
1st Course
Member
Camera is IP&S (Imaging Products & Solutions)
If you look at the chart on the first page of this thread they seem to have made a lot of sales but the division lost money overall. It appears to be the only division that lost money.
I've an Xperia Z1 anyway and it's probably the best phone I've ever had, will not be going back to Samsung any time soon I reckon.
PS4 hardware is barely profitable, or it looses very little money.
When Sony starts earning $50 on each console, then it will get its gif.
So once again we can be clear ps3s make money for sony for every system sold ..
It got to that point some time ago to be more clear June 30th of 2010 sense then the profit per system goes up on the monthly basis seen how parts used in electronics go down in price fast ...
But any ways..
Was thinking we were done with the it's does not make SONY money thing ..
Now if you had said they are making up what they lost still with the ps3 I'd give you a shot but ya ..
EDITE
won't change my post lol
But this one is on me did not read right and you were talking about the Ps4
In thy case yes your kinda right .. They do make a small profit on every sold system
SwiftDeath
Member
Yes, there's millions of PS3 and PS4 sitting on japanese shelves.
PS4 hardware is barely profitable, or it looses very little money.
When Sony starts earning $50 on each console, then it will get its gif.
Andrew house said the ps4 is already profitable.
http://www.ign.com/articles/2014/07/11/playstation-4-the-best-is-yet-to-come
SwiftDeath
Member
Ps4 is profitable by $18 since launch. Sorry.PS4 hardware is barely profitable, or it looses very little money.
When Sony starts earning $50 on each console, then it will get its gif.
The fact is that we're working with best cases scenario, i.e. PS3 shipping a million and Europe accounting for 1 million sales of PS4. Now the latter could still be possible (I think it did less, but still...), but PS3 has certainly shipped less than 1 million, given how it dropped in US, Japan and I suppose Europe as well. So, something like 700,000 for PS3 is far more reasonable, which would lead to around 1 million of units still on shelves.
I think this answers your question?
Thanks and sorry, really tired and was afraid I messed up my PRECIOUS Vita calculations.
Those are both sad and kinda refreshing. Glad to see that Europe seems to like them and sad that US hasn't gotten the chance to like them.
Probably even more in Europe.
kenji_sama
Member
In the forseeable future, September will be interesting.
TerryLee81
Member
Ah thanks. Looks like they doubled their operating income, that's good.
If Destiny takes off in any significant way, PS4 will benefit from it far more than XB1, not just due to marketing and brand association but also because it is already the system that is selling better in every market in the west.
Once momentum is established it just kinda spills over and affects everything. Biggest games this holiday season are once again third party games.
Once momentum is established it just kinda spills over and affects everything. Biggest games this holiday season are once again third party games.
They were doing very well but they recorded their first fall in sales looking at Q1 2013 and Q1 2014. Which is quite awful when you consider mobile is still very much a growing market and the fact that Z2 really launched in this quarter.
It seems their mid-range phones and low-range are to blame, though. It doesn't take a genius to figure out that they are overpriced and many times actually compete with each other. So yes, too many SKUs are a big problem. What is the point, for example, of having C3, T3 and M2? They're all pretty much the same phone with minor difference. They didn't specifically mention it but E1 seems to be an underperformer too, since they said that emerging markets are underperforming. Also this could have been seen from miles off as the E1 launched at around 130 euro which is ridiculously expensive for what it is. Should have been 99 euro really.
The problem is it is only now that they are "rethinking" their strategy, which comes 2 years after they were doing the exact same in 2012. They went from "we'll compete in every category" to "we'll deliver high-end products only" to "here's all our phone ideas buy some!!!". They seem to be shifting to high-end again, specifically mentioning that they don't want scale but profitability. That is good, but their high end phones need to be absolutely amazing (and on time) for that. They probably should adopt Apple's strategy of phasing out the previous fllaghsip as the current mid-range phone, seeing that they release 2 flagships per year anyway.
Destiny releases on September 9th..Xbox One is being outsold by Ps4 Destiny bundle currently on Amazon in the US. It was the same case last month. Xbox One won't be taking September.
zomgbbqftw
Banned
Oh look, a profit!
Forecast is still for a 50bn yen net loss though which either means they are playing it very safe or they are going to backload a bunch of restructuring costs like they have done for the last couple of years. It's probably the latter.
Even then it's a solid quarter, taking out the 19.6bn yen from the sale of property and their stake in Square Enix, it leaves an operating profit of almost $500m, which is actually a good result for them.
The TV division made money, but the annual sales forecast has decreased. Mobiles didn't make money but they say it is because of increased marketing expenditure, one would hope that it is not an unsustainable spend and it leads to a higher level of sales, it seems unlikely though given that the forecast has gone down from 50m to 43m...
Pictures actually made money without having to sell something off. Disappointing otherwise given they had a tentpole released during the quarter. $700m revenue for ASM2 isn't enough to justify a $350m production and marketing budget, the results show that no money was made for the BO release of ASM2, $70m profit for the quarter makes it very clear. Hopefully their rethink leads to them putting quality first for the series and they get in a new writing and production team. Avi Arad could turn Fort Knox into a pile of shit.
Digital imaging made a decent amount of money, it looks like Sony have overcome their addiction to cheap digital compacts and have successfully shifted the business into higher margin CSCs, premium compacts (RX) and professional and broadcast cameras.
Semi-conductors keeps on trucking, with an all new CapEx round announced. The curved sensors are really going to shake up the industry, let's see who gets them first after SDI.
Finally Game. The highlight of this little roundup. Made money early on in the PS4's lifecycle, helped, no doubt, by weak yen, but still it's a great performance. The OI figures include the network services division which is pretty much all losses so the game division alone probably made even more money. They even mention that the OI forecast has increased by 5bn yen because of a decrease in PS4 hardware cost. That PS4 model that was certified must include 8Gbit GDDR5 chips because there is no other major cost reduction that could improve the margins to that extent.
Group wise, the gross margin was static at 36%, this is still poor and their cost base is still way too high. Competing companies have gross margins closer to 60% so Sony need to put some serious work into reducing the build cost of their products while maintaining the quality, the still need to take a serious look at how Apple do business and copy it. Production-lite. They also need to reduce SG&A costs, too much money is spent employing people in Japan to push paper around. Abe must deliver employment reform if Japan is going to move into this century, their companies can't be hamstrung by legacy costs and not being able to move people on. AIUI Sony currently has around 8,000 people basically turning up for work and then doing nothing all day because Japanese employment law allows employees to choose whether or not they can be fired. That alone is a minimum 50bn yen operating cost per year for zero gain in the "all other" division.
They also paid off $2.3bn worth of debt this quarter and drained $3.6bn in cash. I think the poor credit ratings are starting to bite. Reducing their indebtedness is going to be a key part of Sony's business over the next couple of years. Most of the losses this year are paper losses so the business will still be generating cash and I think the board will have set aside a significant proportion to pay down debt. If Abe's economic plan works interest rates in Japan are going to rise from record lows which means corporate Japan is going to have to deleverage quite fast. This could be the start of Sony's deleveraging efforts. I can't think of any other reason they would drain $3.6bn from their cash reserves and use over half of that to pay down debt, usually Sony just issues new debt or uses their revolving facility with their syndicate.
Forecast is still for a 50bn yen net loss though which either means they are playing it very safe or they are going to backload a bunch of restructuring costs like they have done for the last couple of years. It's probably the latter.
Even then it's a solid quarter, taking out the 19.6bn yen from the sale of property and their stake in Square Enix, it leaves an operating profit of almost $500m, which is actually a good result for them.
The TV division made money, but the annual sales forecast has decreased. Mobiles didn't make money but they say it is because of increased marketing expenditure, one would hope that it is not an unsustainable spend and it leads to a higher level of sales, it seems unlikely though given that the forecast has gone down from 50m to 43m...
Pictures actually made money without having to sell something off. Disappointing otherwise given they had a tentpole released during the quarter. $700m revenue for ASM2 isn't enough to justify a $350m production and marketing budget, the results show that no money was made for the BO release of ASM2, $70m profit for the quarter makes it very clear. Hopefully their rethink leads to them putting quality first for the series and they get in a new writing and production team. Avi Arad could turn Fort Knox into a pile of shit.
Digital imaging made a decent amount of money, it looks like Sony have overcome their addiction to cheap digital compacts and have successfully shifted the business into higher margin CSCs, premium compacts (RX) and professional and broadcast cameras.
Semi-conductors keeps on trucking, with an all new CapEx round announced. The curved sensors are really going to shake up the industry, let's see who gets them first after SDI.
Finally Game. The highlight of this little roundup. Made money early on in the PS4's lifecycle, helped, no doubt, by weak yen, but still it's a great performance. The OI figures include the network services division which is pretty much all losses so the game division alone probably made even more money. They even mention that the OI forecast has increased by 5bn yen because of a decrease in PS4 hardware cost. That PS4 model that was certified must include 8Gbit GDDR5 chips because there is no other major cost reduction that could improve the margins to that extent.
Group wise, the gross margin was static at 36%, this is still poor and their cost base is still way too high. Competing companies have gross margins closer to 60% so Sony need to put some serious work into reducing the build cost of their products while maintaining the quality, the still need to take a serious look at how Apple do business and copy it. Production-lite. They also need to reduce SG&A costs, too much money is spent employing people in Japan to push paper around. Abe must deliver employment reform if Japan is going to move into this century, their companies can't be hamstrung by legacy costs and not being able to move people on. AIUI Sony currently has around 8,000 people basically turning up for work and then doing nothing all day because Japanese employment law allows employees to choose whether or not they can be fired. That alone is a minimum 50bn yen operating cost per year for zero gain in the "all other" division.
They also paid off $2.3bn worth of debt this quarter and drained $3.6bn in cash. I think the poor credit ratings are starting to bite. Reducing their indebtedness is going to be a key part of Sony's business over the next couple of years. Most of the losses this year are paper losses so the business will still be generating cash and I think the board will have set aside a significant proportion to pay down debt. If Abe's economic plan works interest rates in Japan are going to rise from record lows which means corporate Japan is going to have to deleverage quite fast. This could be the start of Sony's deleveraging efforts. I can't think of any other reason they would drain $3.6bn from their cash reserves and use over half of that to pay down debt, usually Sony just issues new debt or uses their revolving facility with their syndicate.
FinalStageBoss
Banned
Not surprising, Playstation brand is pretty big WW. Going to be an uphill battle for MS.
Zeuanimals
Member
I really hope this "PS/XB family" thing dies. Just give us the real numbers, preferably individual console sales but if not, then give us individual shipping numbers.
BlackBuzzard
Banned
Okay thank you for the explanation, i can see that being problematic indeed.
XONE will be a success at japan
Don't forget they are also going to launch in China
I wouldn't say it will do better than PS4 but even if it did...well it's still bad.
scoobs
Member
I can't tell if this is sarcasm... but it has to be
Captain Tuttle
Member
I wouldn't go so far as to say it's impossible, just highly unlikely.
Great numbers for Sony though.
Thank you , as always, for your take
GoofsterStud
Member
For the low price of 599 USD. So much value.
unknownstranger
Member
PS4 will probably sell close to 1 million consoles in September alone because of Destiny.
thekiddfran
Member
No problem. I forgot to mention that the mid-tier phone market sector in general, I expect, will be a problem for many manufacturers due to the Moto G. It is too big a disruptive force on the market and really makes most 200-300 phones obsolete. Also, as opposed to the Nexus line, it is widely available.
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