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What confuses me about Wii U
- Thread starter gafneo
- Start date
Poimandres
Member
I would actually use my Wii U more if most games allowed full screen + gamepad for the 2nd player. Looking at you, Mario Kart.
Imbarkus
As Sartre noted in his contemplation on Hell in No Exit, the true horror is other members.
Every unique idea you could come up with for the WiiU was already tried and spent in the years that a dual touch-screen innovation was first new, on the DS.
It was a big miss not to make the console support multiple gamepads for multiple players. It could have been the fucking LAN party console, plus the gimmicky stuff from NintendoLand you mentioned.
Instead it's just a bummer.
It was a big miss not to make the console support multiple gamepads for multiple players. It could have been the fucking LAN party console, plus the gimmicky stuff from NintendoLand you mentioned.
Instead it's just a bummer.
Refreshment.01
Member
The idea was always to include a screen in a controller, that's been brewing for decades at NIntendo. If the company is bothering to do that, then why not equip the controller with a screen suitable to do many things? If they went with a subscreen just to be a terminal to dump small notifications, you would have people complaining about how they missed the opportunity to do off screen play. If Nintendo went with the same size but no touch, then there would be more criticism.
As it is now:
-You can do local assymetrical multiplayer. Which was a big selling focus at launch with Nintendo Land and NSMB U. And the local multiplayer push hasn't stopped since with stuff like Wii Party, 3D World, Super Smash and Mario Party.
-Off TV play. Which is ending up becoming a standard and the Wii U (except for a limited range) pull it of very well.
-Miiverse. Making a Nintendo social Network is an idea with lots of potential and that can transcend diferrent generations of Nintendo consoles. The Gamepad working as a drawing tablet lends an unique touch to the community, that sets it appart to some extent from other social networks.
-UI Applications. Stuff like virtualizing buttons, artifacts or objects had many uses that range from convinience to inmersion. Something like handling the browser is more efficient, just like having a virtual keyboard or the menu UI always available at your finger tips.
i didn't say you were claiming it was a ginmick and even if you thinked that way theres nothing wrong at all with it. i was just citing how some people label the gamepad as an useless ginmick and that's unwarranted. It just failed to catch on with any audiences and is misunderstood by almost everybody. Nintendo was in a tight spot when people started to think about the Gamepad as a tablet and not a traditional controller with a screen in it.
Seth Enosh
Member
Game and wario has pictionary, it's called Sketch.
I love the GamePad when its features are actually utilized in games. I still have fun with the asymmetric multiplayer games in NintendoLand with friends all the time, 2.5 years later.
But yeah basically no one does anything with it anymore. It's sad. The potential with the GamePad is so much higher than it was with the wiimote waggling last gen.
But yeah basically no one does anything with it anymore. It's sad. The potential with the GamePad is so much higher than it was with the wiimote waggling last gen.
Fbh
Member
It's a Nintendo console. Like all Nintendo systems over the past few years it's build with weaker hardware than the competition and designed around some gimmick that adds nothing to most of the good games.
IMO, Motion controlls aren't fundamental for any of the best games on Wii, Dual Screen or touch screen aren't fundamental for any of the best DS games, the 3D effect isn't fudamental for any 3DS game and the Gamepad isn't fundamenta for any WiiU game.
At least the gamepad adds a genuinely useful feature in the form of off-TV play and the best internet browser on consoles
But hey, they keep making some of the best games in the industry, so their consoles are still worth owning
IMO, Motion controlls aren't fundamental for any of the best games on Wii, Dual Screen or touch screen aren't fundamental for any of the best DS games, the 3D effect isn't fudamental for any 3DS game and the Gamepad isn't fundamenta for any WiiU game.
At least the gamepad adds a genuinely useful feature in the form of off-TV play and the best internet browser on consoles
But hey, they keep making some of the best games in the industry, so their consoles are still worth owning
Jaded Alyx
Member
There are games with both mic and keyboard (typing) support.
Mario & Donkey Kong: Tipping Stars came out like last week and has user created levels shared via Miiverse.
A bit of research next time.
Trevelyan9999
Banned
Gamepad is really only useful as a portable-like way to play while someone else is watching TV. Other than that, I haven't found any use for it. And I'm grateful. The last thing I want is another gimmick-driven system like the Wii. The system is awesome enough without it.
This was only true of the Wii. Every other Nintendo system was on par with or better than the competition in terms of raw horsepower. I also can't think of any other Nintendo console--except the Wii--that was driven by a gimmick.
Fbh
Member
Yeah sorry. I forgot to put "over the past few years" in there.
I've edited it
there is incredible potential with the gamepad but unfortunately it doesn't seem like any developer wants to give it a fair shake. I'm hoping for some indie dev to toss some great ideas at it and watch it become a system seller. There's so many gameplay opportunities open it's just a matter of someone actually.. you know.. making something.
I think a game like NSMB would be fun if the Wii U gamepad let you play as lakatoo dropping turtles on players. Maybe even let you be the annoying hammer bros while the normal controllers let you play co-op. In a way, that would be a new way of playing competitive mp. If you kill Mario enough times you could win the game while Mario loses because he couldn't make it to the flag.
Refreshment.01
Member
That could be a nice concept. We could extrapolate that in other way. Maybe the user could take the role of any enemy in the map. We can even go further and imagine a mode in Mario Maker in which one player tries to reach the goal, while the Gampead player alters the level in real time by dropping enemies or creating obstacles. Or an FPS where the gamepad player has it's own view and can control the enemies on a level to prevent player 1 from advancing.
Really the Gamepad is a beast for local multiplayer, but this wasn't enough to spark good sales of a console in today's videogame market conditions.
Thank you very much. The Wii U is what it is and it's fine like that.
block tower
Member
lol this list is laughable. almost none of those games you listed use the gamepad in a meaningful way.
I would think that even if Wii U had sold better, we'd still generally not see third parties care to use the GamePad in meaningful ways when most would just be last generation multiplatform ports. Quite frankly, you know it 's a bad sign when even Nintendo is having a fairly hard time coming up with ideas for asymmetric gameplay. Anyway, it is kind of disappointing to see the GamePad go to waste when it is basically the equivalent of a pocket knife.
TheGreatMightyPoo
Banned
I am sure they considered(and tried) that but it probably had performance issues not to their liking.
ClayKavalier
Banned
It's not used much, but I'm still glad to have it. Playing games on it while my wife is watching TV is nice, and there's a few games like Wind Waker that don't do anything too interesting with it but still make the game more convenient. Once you've played a Zelda where you can equip stuff on a touch screen it's hard to go back to traditional menus.
Yeah, there's so many ways to experiment with mp.
Like imagine an old school Donkey Kong. Wiiu pad for dk throwing the barrels, other player is Mario.
Duck Hunt: Wii u pad for controlling ducks with touch. wiimote shoots.
Zelda: Wiiu pad for playing the hand that grabs link in dungeon or annoying money stealing bird in Hyrule field. Controller 1 plays link, player 2 designed for Epona and Skyloft.
Punchout: WiiU pad for all the bad guys in story mode. Wiimote for Little Mac or Wii Fit trainer girl.
Mario Kart: WiiU pad for dropping deathtraps and hazzards( ala Split Second). Controllers for racers.
If you look back at the Wii, only a handful of game really took advantage of the Wiimote in a creative way that really enhanced the gameplay. If the Wii launched with Skyward Sword instead of Twilight Princess (and Red Steel!), I bet we would've been sold on the idea of motion control for hardcore gaming. If the same story repeat with the Wii U, we will probably see a few games that make a good use of the Wii U gamepad before the end of the console cycle. Finger crossed for Starfox!
Maneauleau
Member
Me and my kids are hooked on off-tv.
I can't imagine the next Nintendo console not supporting it. Even if it ships without gamepad and relies on the handheld to do that then we are good.
Do you hear me Ninty?
I can't imagine the next Nintendo console not supporting it. Even if it ships without gamepad and relies on the handheld to do that then we are good.
Do you hear me Ninty?
That's a negative sir. Besides Smash Bros where split screen is redudant, as good as no first party WiiU title supports using the Gamepad as an own screen for local coop.
Pikmin 3 just shows the map or streams both the split screens onto the Gamepad, same with Mario Kart 8.
MegamanPoweredUP
Member
Same here, off-tv is great.
You know what? I think only adults can really enjoy the WiiU. Too bad teenagers rule the market.
Refreshment.01
Member
Do you think Nintendo is having a hard time coming with ideas for assymetric gameplay? Even from launch Nintendo Land did the job to show of many ways in which the Gampead can be used. We can't expect Nintendo to include this for every game they make. There's quite a lot of games from them using the Gamepad for dual screen or assymetrical play.
i think people that consider that Nintendo does not have software that uses the device in many ways are ignoring reality, there's various examples in the list i made earlier. Is not realistic to expect hundreds of games using the Gamepad when there's only Nintendo supporting the Wii U mostly.
Having two player with co op with an screen for each player is in the realm of possibilities. But maybe they wanted 5 player local and couldn't pull it off with good performance. So it was an all or nothing decision.
Soodanim
Member
It's insanely useful in families where someone can play (with headphones) a game without taking the living room TV. Marketing that feature alone would probably have sold them a fair few units.
johnnyfive
Banned
Nice post.
I'll be more direct about why the gamepad is a nice device but not more popular:
*Nintendo has a vision of local multiplayer that is not happening at many Wii U owners' households. They simply never get to enjoy NSMBU as it was intended. They will probably not get to experience Mario Party 10 that way, either. They are looking for online multiplayer.
* Handheld play is not as obviously impressive as Nintendo hi-def on a big screen: Mario 3D World on gampad -- great, I can play on the toilet! Mario 3D World on a 60" HD set --- woah, I am in Mario land!
Solution: make the successor to the 3DS able to function as the gamepad for the successor to the Wii U. Make both available separately or as a bundle. But include a pro controller with the console.
What's that supposed to mean?
If you mean the "gamepad as a window into a game" feature, that was actually used in at least the Batman games plus Game&Wario.
Game&Wario
Microphone is used by games supporting voice chat. For example Splinter Cell, Resident Evil Revelations and quite a few others.
Took advantage? For some games, even 1st party games, motion controls were just tacked on and had no use/worked worse than a simple button. Which means always using them just because it was possible to use them was a silly thing to do.
For example: Smash Bros Brawl and Donkey Kong Country Returns.
Motion controls (especially forced one) actually hurts Donkey Kong Country Returns. That's why I'm using a cheat to get my button support.
Also not every single 1st party game used motion controls. For example Xenoblade Chronicles didn't. And thank god for that. I like motion controls in some games, but there is simply no need to use it everywhere. It's like analog stick support. Sure, that's great and all, but some games work better using a digipad.
xDUMPWEEDx
Banned
It's obvious at this point that the new and interesting features that the Gamepad would bring ended up being more or a less a bust. The Gamepad does add some cool functionality, though.
Sorceror12
Member
Basileus777
Member
Games can barely find a good use of the 3DS's 2nd screen, let alone a different 2nd screen that prevents you from looking at the TV while using it. The Gamepad just doesn't have that much use, it never had much potential. 90% of what is it used for can be replicated in other ways on one screen with little loss.
luigi's mansion on nintendoland is hands down the most fun i've had in multiplayer.
Nintendoland is better local multiplayer game than smash and kart imo. I wish there was some dlc or Nintendoland 2 or something or whatever. Wish there were more games that used the gamepad more creatively.
Nintendoland is better local multiplayer game than smash and kart imo. I wish there was some dlc or Nintendoland 2 or something or whatever. Wish there were more games that used the gamepad more creatively.
Sorceror12
Member
Nintendoland 2 with amiibos... believe.
Refreshment.01
Member
i think other wise in regards to the Wii U Pro controller, there's no point for a extrictly Dual Analog controller anymore. Nintendo next system should be based on a different control method and for traditional gaming the sell the Gamepad separetly or (like you said) use the handheld system. Save for any improbable events happening in the future, touch screens will get better and cheaper.
i already explained this, if Nintendo was set to include a screen in the controller then might as well include one that open many possibilities. Including a small touch screen will have made people complain about the things that it can't do.
And no, besides off screen you also have local assymetrical multiplayer which was/is a big deal for Nintendo. Probably the off screen play is a by product of the assymetrical gameplay functionality. There's also the ideas Nintendo had in mind where the Gamepad works as terminak for "mid range" use, you can see some examples of that in Wii Party and Wii Fit U.
Labrynian Rebel
Member
The Wii's motion controls were (IMO) 100% pointless except for Skyward Sword, Wii Sports Resort, and navigating menus easier.
Pretty sure Miyamoto said pretty much exactly what you did, but with different words, and he was making several games himself to rectify that.
An all around spectacular failure of potential.
An all around spectacular failure of potential.
Imbarkus
As Sartre noted in his contemplation on Hell in No Exit, the true horror is other members.
Was the unique thing about the WiiU gamepad the fact that it had a touch screen? A microphone? Motion sensors?
No.
The unique thing about the WiiU gamepad was that it displayed a lag-free video signal from the central console. Yes the pad had a number of other features but those are all near standard on phones, portable gaming devices, tablets, etc.
So if Nintendo failed to take the console's unique feature and place it front and center, and make it the star of the show. To make it the star of the show, the console needed to support multiple gamepads and symmetric gameplay.
Seriously. For the company that put four ports on every console since the N64, even four WiiMote light indicators, to design a console that can only support multiplayer gameplay in an unbalanced was nuts. All this asymetric gameplay innovation that has occurred (not much, mind you) could still have been developed.
But the console could have also been a local multiplayer LAN party dream for even traditional Goldeneye 64 type gameplay, and have unlocked so much more potential in combining shared and private views in multiplayer.
No.
The unique thing about the WiiU gamepad was that it displayed a lag-free video signal from the central console. Yes the pad had a number of other features but those are all near standard on phones, portable gaming devices, tablets, etc.
So if Nintendo failed to take the console's unique feature and place it front and center, and make it the star of the show. To make it the star of the show, the console needed to support multiple gamepads and symmetric gameplay.
Seriously. For the company that put four ports on every console since the N64, even four WiiMote light indicators, to design a console that can only support multiplayer gameplay in an unbalanced was nuts. All this asymetric gameplay innovation that has occurred (not much, mind you) could still have been developed.
But the console could have also been a local multiplayer LAN party dream for even traditional Goldeneye 64 type gameplay, and have unlocked so much more potential in combining shared and private views in multiplayer.
Refreshment.01
Member
How would Nintendo bend the laws of physcis of the Wii U wireless protocol and transfer not one but four different frame buffers for that 4 player Golden Eye match you propose?
The reason we get that low latency up to 60 fps signal is because it's tranfering a SD image to one terminal at a relative short range. Nintendo has gone on a record to say two Gamepads is a posibility but with the penalty of splitting the frame rate in half.
Imbarkus
As Sartre noted in his contemplation on Hell in No Exit, the true horror is other members.
Halve the resolution instead of the frame rate. Goldeneye was pretty Lo res as I recall.
Or solve the problem to enable it in some other way before you release the console, on account of all the voices and opinions at the time of initial announcement that insisted it was necessary.