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Hdr on PS4 warning : hdmi black level ?

f@luS

f@luS

More than a member.
Hi

Since last'of us has been updated to support hdr I've been trying it

My PS4 is set on hdmi full as my tv is on game mode
I've been trying last of us with hdr and though it was pretty strangely bright

As discussed on previous thread regarding hdr games and at least on lg oled , with hdr games you need dynamic contrast or picture it too dimm and bright

Yet dynamic control + hdmi full (PS4 and tv ) makes it too bright. Dynamic on + hdmi low looks wrong as well too dark

The only correct setting I got is PS4 hdmi full , tv low with dynamic contrast.

Try for yourself at least ,waiting for your opinion.
 
I

inner-G

Banned
I have a Samsung TV (not a PS4 though) but whether Netflix, XBO or whatever input, I need to set dynamic contrast to high for HDR content to look right. If it's turned off the picture looks washed out
 
f@luS

f@luS

More than a member.
inner-G said:
I have a Samsung TV (not a PS4 though) but whether Netflix, XBO or whatever input, I need to set dynamic contrast to high for HDR content to look right. If it's turned off the picture looks washed out
Click to expand...
Indeed that's what I concluded with gears 4 and forza h 3

It looks like hdr on PS4 full is forcing limited , and limited by itself is broken. At least from what i see
 
Unknown?

Unknown?

Member
What I noticed in dark environments is that it wasn't very dark and looked like gamma was set too high even though it wasn't. Idk what to do about that. Turning down the black level on TV helped but I got the feeling it shouldn't be so low to get rid of that so I turned it back up.
 
B

bennibop

Member
I think it is important people state there TV make and model number before each comment, otherwise we will all be chasing our tail!!
 
A

Always-honest

Banned
f@luS said:
Hi

Since last'of us has been updated to support hdr I've been trying it

My PS4 is set on hdmi full as my tv is on game mode
I've been trying last of us with hdr and though it was pretty strangely bright

As discussed on previous thread regarding hdr games and at least on lg oled , with hdr games you need dynamic contrast or picture it too dimm and bright

Yet dynamic control + hdmi full (PS4 and tv ) makes it too bright. Dynamic on + hdmi low looks wrong as well too dark

The only correct setting I got is PS4 hdmi full , tv low with dynamic contrast.

Try for yourself at least ,waiting for your opinion.
Click to expand...
None of this makes sense if your tv doesn't support any of it.
So what kind of tv is it? Game mode is just to reduce lag i think.
 
f@luS

f@luS

More than a member.
Always-honest said:
None of this makes sense if your tv doesn't support any of it.
So what kind of tv is it? Game mode is just to reduce lag i think.
Click to expand...

lg oled C6

im saying game mode as i just have it set up for the best IQ

overall i think RGB full is in limited, when running HDR content on PS4
and limited on PS4 is broken
 
Caayn

Caayn

Member
f@luS said:
lg oled C6

im saying game mode as i just have it set up for the best IQ

overall i think RGB full is in limited, when running HDR content on PS4
and limited on PS4 is broken
Click to expand...
I remember that I had to put the XB1s on limited to get a correct HDR picture in games. Will need to check if that's indeed true.

I use a LG EG920v, the predecessor of your C6.
 
E

EvB

Member
f@luS said:
lg oled C6

im saying game mode as i just have it set up for the best IQ

overall i think RGB full is in limited, when running HDR content on PS4
and limited on PS4 is broken
Click to expand...

To be honest, it's pretty confusing as HDR content is neither of these options. Make sure you have deep Colour enabled on your PS4 as this is the 10bit output that is part of HDR.
 
M

Mœbius

Member
You should only be using RGB Full (in PS4 settings) when the TV is set to Game mode and for gaming in general (with whatever other personal settings you have). However for accurate HD movie content you absolutely should not use Full or Auto - set it to Limited.
 
Rbk_3

Rbk_3

Member
Mœbius;222573987 said:
You should only be using RGB Full (in PS4 settings) when the TV is set to Game mode and for gaming in general (with whatever other personal settings you have). However for accurate HD movie content you absolutely should not use Full or Auto - set it to Limited.
Click to expand...
For HD Movie content you should be using yCbCr
 
f@luS

f@luS

More than a member.
EvB said:
To be honest, it's pretty confusing as HDR content is neither of these options. Make sure you have deep Colour enabled on your PS4 as this is the 10bit output that is part of HDR.
Click to expand...
Of course I have. It's all setup with Xbox one already
 
D

DonkeyKong

Member
f@luS said:
Hi

Since last'of us has been updated to support hdr I've been trying it

My PS4 is set on hdmi full as my tv is on game mode
I've been trying last of us with hdr and though it was pretty strangely bright

As discussed on previous thread regarding hdr games and at least on lg oled , with hdr games you need dynamic contrast or picture it too dimm and bright

Yet dynamic control + hdmi full (PS4 and tv ) makes it too bright. Dynamic on + hdmi low looks wrong as well too dark

The only correct setting I got is PS4 hdmi full , tv low with dynamic contrast.

Try for yourself at least ,waiting for your opinion.
Click to expand...

I have the c6 too, do you really need dynamic contrast on? I assume you can't use the same HDR settings you would to watch HDR movies/demos etc?
 
I

infinityBCRT

Member
This dynamic contrast stuff should be off. The whole point of HDR is that the wide range of luminosity is in the picture and you don't want to process it out. I have a 60" ks8000 calibrated to rtings recommended settings and it looks fine and not washed out. I've found non HDR content can be a mixed bag because some streaming apps are in consistent in how they present videos on Xbox one and Apple tv. But that shouldn't be an issue with HDR content.
 
M

mordecaii83

Member
f@luS said:
Hi

Since last'of us has been updated to support hdr I've been trying it

My PS4 is set on hdmi full as my tv is on game mode
I've been trying last of us with hdr and though it was pretty strangely bright

As discussed on previous thread regarding hdr games and at least on lg oled , with hdr games you need dynamic contrast or picture it too dimm and bright

Yet dynamic control + hdmi full (PS4 and tv ) makes it too bright. Dynamic on + hdmi low looks wrong as well too dark

The only correct setting I got is PS4 hdmi full , tv low with dynamic contrast.

Try for yourself at least ,waiting for your opinion.
Click to expand...

A bit off topic, but I'm so glad I saw your post about turning Dynamic Contrast on, I was watching HDR content on my LG OLED but it looked way darker than I thought it should, but that setting fixed it! Thanks!
 
M

Mœbius

Member
Rbk_3 said:
For HD Movie content you should be using yCbCr
Click to expand...
Or that yes! You're right in that video processing is usually done in the component domain, so using YCbCr (4:2:2) would reduce the number of processing stages and it's probably best to err that way and use that setting (for movies); but it's not necessarily always the case that it gives the best results. There are so many other factors and in reality, if the black level and the white level in RGB are set correctly, you shouldn't really see any difference. In the context of HDMI, these are just digital representations of generic VGA and component connections. Where there are differences, they are probably down to the respective video settings.

Anyway this is off-topic; in the context of HDR gaming on a TV (non-PC mode) it's fine to stick with RGB Full.
 
B

b0bbyJ03

Member
Holy shit, I didn't realize HDR would be such a cluster fuck. I have the B6 so I'm very interested in figuring this out before the PS4 Pro releases. Can we create a thread for HDR TV settings? Like a spreadsheet with recommendations as we figure this stuff out?
 
L

Lucifon

Junior Member
NewDust said:
I'm pretty sure the C6 doesn't offer HDR in game mode. It's either game mode or HDR.
Click to expand...

It does not. When in HDR mode there's 3 HDR presets - vivid, standard and bright (bright is default). Personally on my B6 on the One S I've found Vivid to look the best in HDR.
 
F

Futurevoid

Member
infinityBCRT said:
This dynamic contrast stuff should be off. The whole point of HDR is that the wide range of luminosity is in the picture and you don't want to process it out. I have a 60" ks8000 calibrated to rtings recommended settings and it looks fine and not washed out. I've found non HDR content can be a mixed bag because some streaming apps are in consistent in how they present videos on Xbox one and Apple tv. But that shouldn't be an issue with HDR content.
Click to expand...
I agree on the Dynamic Contrast setting. I have the 55inch KS8000 and enabling that on Gears of War 4 just blows the image out from a brightness/contrast perspective to me. During night scenes in that game, it looks wrong to my eyes. I've tested it across a number of games and don't find it appealing at all.

That having been said, the PS4's RGB range setting is funky and automatic doesn't appear to function properly. It's irksome having to change settings around to get a proper picture.
 
B

b0bbyJ03

Member
Futurevoid said:
I agree on the Dynamic Contrast setting. I have the 55inch KS8000 and enabling that on Gears of War 4 just blows the image out from a brightness/contrast perspective to me. During night scenes in that game, it looks wrong to my eyes. I've tested it across a number of games and don't find it appealing at all.

That having been said, the PS4's RGB range setting is funky and automatic doesn't appear to function properly. It's irksome having to change settings around to get a proper picture.
Click to expand...

Don't forget, he not only has a different brand then you, but a different display tech altogether (OLED). you can't really compare apples to oranges. Especially at a time when we are still trying to figure out the basics.
 
C

Chao

Member
Lg C6 here, when I switch on HDR I've noticed that the games go super dark, if I check the game's settings I need to move the brightness bar all the way to the right to make it take it to the same level as it was before , while it is ok in the middle when non HDR content is being played. Black level is set to limited in the PS4 and to "low" in the tv

Are the black levels fucked in the PS4 or what?

Trying to play second son here and it's just too dark at night time, can't see shit
 
Karak

Karak

Member
Dynamic meta would help some of this especially how the dark scenes work. But honestly not incredibly happy with LOU HDR anyway. it seems to have issues
 
F

Futurevoid

Member
b0bbyJ03 said:
Don't forget, he not only has a different brand then you, but a different display tech altogether (OLED). you can't really compare apples to oranges. Especially at a time when we are still trying to figure out the basics.
Click to expand...
Sure. That's precisely why I stated what television I was using and the game in question. So as to NOT compare apples to oranges.;)
 
f@luS

f@luS

More than a member.
Lucifon said:
It does not. When in HDR mode there's 3 HDR presets - vivid, standard and bright (bright is default). Personally on my B6 on the One S I've found Vivid to look the best in HDR.
Click to expand...
That is because vivid enable automatically dynamic contrast. You can check the setting is not here. I have it on hdr standard with dynamic contrast on and it looks like vivid minus artifact of over exposure of any vivid settings.

I forgot where I saw that on lg oled + hdr dynamic contrast must be on and my eyes are telling me the same

Doesn't change that it does look off when PS4 and tv are full Rgb. It likes hdr on normal PS4 as pro isn't available set the PS4 in limited even if it's supposed to be full
 
S

seb

Banned
I can't believe we have to put up with all this bullshit. They exchange cryptography keys continuously to implement hdcp but can't exchange one bit to set this automatically. HDMI was a mistake.
 
C

Candeez

Member
I have a 65 inch LG B6 and the 55 inch Samsung KS8000.

For both TVs, PS4 RGB setting should maunally set to Full, and the Black Level on LG should be "High" and on the Samsung "Normal"

Tested these settings out with Last of Us HDR patch on PS4 and the image quality is significantly better than RGB Limited/Black Level Low on both TVs.

I also prefer Dynamic Contrast jacked up to Max on both TV Sets, but this is a personal preference.

To make sure you are not getting black crush and have the proper brightness setting:

1) make sure UHD is enabled on the HDMI port for your TV. This can be found in TV settings (read your manual), this setting was disabled by default on both the LG and the Samsung

2) make sure your TV and Console are set to use the same black level. This means TV/Console RGB and Black Level is either "Full/High" or "Limited/Low". "Full/High" is preferred for PS4, this will match intended 0-255 levels.

3) In PS4 web browser, goto http://www.lagom.nl/lcd-test/black.php and make sure the test image is centered on your TV.

4) in the test image you should see all black numbered boxes except 1 and 2 on most TV sets. If you do not see the black boxes, set your TV's brightness setting to Max, then lower the brightness setting until box 3 just barely appears. This will be the correct brightness setting to avoid black crush.

5) Start an HDR game or movie/video so the TV switches to HDR mode. Check the brightness setting to see if it is close or matches the brightness setting you set in step 4. Adjust as needed, but the brightness setting should be the same.
 
f@luS

f@luS

More than a member.
Candeez said:
I have a 65 inch LG B6 and the 55 inch Samsung KS8000.

For both TVs, PS4 RGB setting should maunally set to Full, and the Black Level on LG should be "High" and on the Samsung "Normal"

Tested these settings out with Last of Us HDR patch on PS4 and the image quality is significantly better than RGB Limited/Black Level Low on both TVs.

I also prefer Dynamic Contrast jacked up to Max on both TV Sets, but this is a personal preference.
Click to expand...
It looks good but better when tv is low. Try the uncharted 4 wallpaper as I did you will understand
 
T

thisisamul

Neo Member
I have a Samsung 65JS8500 and I'm noticing that with HDR enabled games look VERY dark on my PS4 (have only tried TLOU and Infamous so far) - something seems off. I have both my samsung and PS4 on the "auto" setting for RGB range and have never noticed a problem before.

What should I change? Changing any standard picture settings on my tv doesn't help.
 
S

Slackbladder

Member
I have a Samsung KS7500 (KS8500 in the US) and the only HDR content from a game I've tried so far is Shadow Warrior 2 on PC. It doesn't look right with HDR as it looks washed out. Unfortunately I'm at work so I can't remember the settings clearly. I think it's Limited - ycbcr 4:2:0 - 12bpc. I may have changed it once but the game still looked washed out.
I guess once my PS4Pro arrives I'll have test the settings on that.
 
C

Candeez

Member
f@luS said:
It looks good but better when tv is low. Try the uncharted 4 wallpaper as I did you will understand
Click to expand...

I edited my post to include calibration steps, try them out first and see if they look better for you.

Mismatching TV/Console black level settings is not recommended because you will either lose black detail or wash out the image
 
T

thisisamul

Neo Member
Candeez said:
I have a 65 inch LG B6 and the 55 inch Samsung KS8000.

For both TVs, PS4 RGB setting should maunally set to Full, and the Black Level on LG should be "High" and on the Samsung "Normal"

Tested these settings out with Last of Us HDR patch on PS4 and the image quality is significantly better than RGB Limited/Black Level Low on both TVs.

I also prefer Dynamic Contrast jacked up to Max on both TV Sets, but this is a personal preference.

To make sure you are not getting black crush and have the proper brightness setting:

1) make sure UHD is enabled on the HDMI port for your TV. This can be found in TV settings (read your manual), this setting was disabled by default on both the LG and the Samsung

2) make sure your TV and Console are set to use the same black level. This means TV/Console RGB and Black Level is either "Full/High" or "Limited/Low". "Full/High" is preferred for PS4, this will match intended 0-255 levels.

3) In PS4 web browser, goto http://www.lagom.nl/lcd-test/black.php and make sure the test image is centered on your TV.

4) in the test image you should see all black numbered boxes except 1 and 2 on most TV sets. If you do not see the black boxes, set your TV's brightness setting to Max, then lower the brightness setting until box 3 just barely appears. This will be the correct brightness setting to avoid black crush.

5) Start an HDR game or movie/video so the TV switches to HDR mode. Check the brightness setting to see if it is close or matches the brightness setting you set in step 4. Adjust as needed, but the brightness setting should be the same.
Click to expand...

Thanks for this, will give it a shot! But why is this not an issue when not using HDR? Having my PS4 and Samsung TV on Auto works well with no washed out/black crush.
 
C

Candeez

Member
thisisamul said:
Thanks for this, will give it a shot! But why is this not an issue when not using HDR? Having my PS4 and Samsung TV on Auto works well with no washed out/black crush.
Click to expand...

When TVs detect HDR content, they switch to another HDR mode which may have vastly different TV settings then what non-HDR content uses, this could explain the discrepancy. Check your TV settings before and after HDR mode is triggered.
 
T

thisisamul

Neo Member
Candeez said:
When TVs detect HDR content, they switch to another HDR mode which may have vastly different TV settings then what non-HDR content uses, this could explain the discrepancy. Check your TV settings before and after HDR mode is triggered.
Click to expand...

Got it - thanks!

Last thing, for some reason I thought on samsung TV's that LOW was 0-255 and Normal is 16-235. That's not right?
 
f@luS

f@luS

More than a member.
Candeez said:
I edited my post to include calibration steps, try them out first and see if they look better for you.

Mismatching TV/Console black level settings is not recommended because you will either lose black detail or wash out the image
Click to expand...
I think that PS4 full is in fact limited in hdr imho
 
Popsickles

Popsickles

Member
People are actually activating HDR in the ps4 settings and not just switching it on the tv expecting the ps4 to automaticly output HDR
 
dano1

dano1

A Sheep
HDR does not work in game mode.

Also make sure your hdmi input on you tv is not still in standard mode.
 
F

Figboy79

Aftershock LA
I have this one: Samsung UN50KU6300 50-Inch 4K Ultra HD Smart LED TV

Any advice would be great! Dynamic Contrast looks good, but sometimes it still appears too dark. Not to mention that watching television makes things look like a soap opera because the Dynamic picture mode also turns on Auto Motion Plus.
 
C

Chao

Member
Something is definitely not right with Infamous second son.

Game is too freaking dark and I don't think I'm having my blacks crushed because of any black level settings, it's the game.

PS4 is set at full , tv at high, wide color range, ultra deep hdmi color, but unless I set some dynamic contrast option on, the picture is still too dark.

Oled lg c6
 
N

NewDust

Member
Chao said:
Something is definitely not right with Infamous second son.

Game is too freaking dark and I don't think I'm having my blacks crushed because of any black level settings, it's the game.

PS4 is set at full , tv at high, wide color range, ultra deep hdmi color, but unless I set some dynamic contrast option on, the picture is still too dark.

Oled lg c6
Click to expand...

Game mode or HDR mode?
 
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