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An In-Depth Look At Online Multiplayer in Splatoon 2

J@hranimo

Banned
Oliver Brammer, also known as Octobyte in the Splatoon Community has done a write up of his research of Splatoon 2's Online Multiplayer from the past two weekends. His findings have been enlightening with regard to have player interactions have been online so far. Full write up is here.

The main takeaways from his research is that Splatoon 2 uses Peer-to-Peer Networking much like the first game on Wii U. It isn't ideal, but it works well enough for now. What's intriguing is that Splatoon 2 has a update rate of 16Hz, compared to Splatoon's 25Hz. As some may know, this is an improvement over the 12.5Hz update rate that was measured from the Splatoon 2 Global Testfire in March. In basic terms, the game in general online runs 30% slower than Splatoon did. Additionally, regarding the game's bandwidth and transmission data size, it was supposedly claimed to have been reduced to decrease the amount of connection errors.

According to Octobyte's calculations, both games' packet sizes are as follows:

Splatoon 1 Packet Size (Smallest / Largest / Average):
90 bytes / 1250 bytes / 214 bytes

Splatoon 2 Packet Size (Smallest / Largest / Average):
102 bytes / 1062 bytes / 320 bytes

which would show the data rate to be:

Splatoon 1 Data Rate (25Hz): 146kbps, 66 MB/hour

Splatoon 2 Data Rate (16Hz): 80kbps, 36 MB/hour


Although, if you were to hypothetically set Splatoon 2's update rate to 25Hz, like Splatoon, then the numbers would equal out to:

Splatoon 1 Data Rate (25Hz): 146kbps, 66 MB/hour

Splatoon 2 Data Rate (25Hz): 132kbps, 58 MB/hour


Which only really gives the evidence that the transmission data size is smaller only because the game runs 30% slower due to the 16Hz. Again, not good. He goes into these numbers further in his write up too.


--

How is this bad? It makes it much harder to react to incoming shots, specials, movements, etc going from player to player. It can lead to strange behavior, such as dying in unfair manners or even players appearing "ahead" or "behind" and your shots not mattering much in encounters. It does not bode well for the game competitively for the future. See this clip for a visual example of how this can be unfair. It also doesn't give confidence in wanting to pay for Nintendo's online service in 2018 with how poor the experience appears, especially compared to the Wii U.

I love this game and series and is one of my favorite series now in the past several years. Seeing this type of implementation is very disappointing. If they do not add dedicated servers for the playerbase and increase the update rate to accomodate a much faster, higher quality online environment then I personally do not see myself paying for the service as this would be my #1 online game for the Switch.

...until that time, I would recommend spreading this write up around respectfully to gain exposure so they can see the demand for wanting to invest in Splatoon 2's online multiplayer.

Nintendo's Twitter

Nintendo of America's Twitter

Nintendo of Europe's Twitter

Nintendo AUNZ's Twitter

The core gameplay is fantastic, but these issues among others expressed will ultimately hold the game back and prevent Nintendo from wanting to grow the competitive scene to even having events like this:

Splatoon-600x299.jpg


Again, his full write up is here for those interested in the more in-depth research in the game's online multiplayer, comparisons to other online multiplayer shooters, and the methods he used to get these results. It falls under the Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 International License
 

Blam

Member
Wow that's a pretty bad thing to do with 16hz. It really drops how much you can do and can make for some pretty bad spectator sports.
 

nynt9

Member
16hz tickrate for a major game by a major publisher is comical. Haven't delved a lot into online yet but this really needs to be fixed.
 

Geg

Member
The full article is really good and highlights what's probably the game's biggest issue. It's why weapons like the Splattershot are still the strongest in the game, as well as any other weapon with fast, reliable kill times. If you hit all the shots on your end in quick succession then you've basically already killed someone before the other player even registers that they're being shot at on their end. It's noticeably worse in this game compared to Splatoon 1, even with the quasi-regional/ping-based matchmaking.

I was always (probably) naively optimistic that the online would improve once Nintendo started charging for it, and I still hope they do.
 
Additionally, regarding the game's bandwidth and transmission data size, it was supposedly claimed to have been reduced to decrease the amount of connection errors.

Let me tell ya. It didn't work.
 
Oliver Brammer, also known as Octobyte in the Splatoon Community has done a write up of his research of Splatoon 2's Online Multiplayer from the past two weekends. His findings have been enlightening with regard to have player interactions have been online so far. Full write up is here.

The main takeaways from his research is that Splatoon 2 uses Peer-to-Peer Networking much like the first game on Wii U. It isn't ideal, but it works well enough for now. What's intriguing is that Splatoon 2 has a update rate of 16Hz, compared to Splatoon's 25Hz. As some may know, this is an improvement over the 12.5Hz update rate that was measured from the Splatoon 2 Global Testfire in March. In basic terms, the game in general online runs 30% slower than Splatoon did. Additionally, regarding the game's bandwidth and transmission data size, it was supposedly claimed to have been reduced to decrease the amount of connection errors.

According to Octobyte's calculations, both games' packet sizes are as follows:



which would show the data rate to be:




Although, if you were to hypothetically set Splatoon 2's update rate to 25Hz, like Splatoon, then the numbers would equal out to:




Which only really gives the evidence that the transmission data size is smaller only because the game runs 30% slower due to the 16Hz. Again, not good. He goes into these numbers further in his write up too.


--

How is this bad? It makes it much harder to react to incoming shots, specials, movements, etc going from player to player. It can lead to strange behavior, such as dying in unfair manners or even players appearing "ahead" or "behind" and your shots not mattering much in encounters. It does not bode well for the game competitively for the future. See this clip for a visual example of how this can be unfair. It also doesn't give confidence in wanting to pay for Nintendo's online service in 2018 with how poor the experience appears, especially compared to the Wii U.

I love this game and series and is one of my favorite series now in the past several years. Seeing this type of implementation is very disappointing. If they do not add dedicated servers for the playerbase and increase the update rate to accomodate a much faster, higher quality online environment then I personally do not see myself paying for the service as this would be my #1 online game for the Switch.

...until that time, I would recommend spreading this write up around respectfully to gain exposure so they can see the demand for wanting to invest in Splatoon 2's online multiplayer.

Nintendo's Twitter

Nintendo of America's Twitter

Nintendo of Europe's Twitter

Nintendo AUNZ's Twitter

The core gameplay is fantastic, but these issues among others expressed will ultimately hold the game back and prevent Nintendo from wanting to grow the competitive scene to even having events like this:

Splatoon-600x299.jpg


Again, his full write up is here for those interested in the more in-depth research in the game's online multiplayer, comparisons to other online multiplayer shooters, and the methods he used to get these results.

Not to mention that the wifi receptors in the Wii U and the Switch are weaker than the ones you'll find in a laptop or another device so you'll get hit with the disconnect alot
 
Good god in heaven, I hope this game is improved dramatically over time. This is just one more reason why I believe Splatoon 1 is the better overall game.

Let me tell ya. It didn't work.

It's weird. I had so many connection errors in the first game, but only one in Splatoon 2 (so far). That being said, my teammates seem to get disconnected often, so it's clearly still a big problem.

The Switch is very bittersweet, I feel. It does so many things right, but its online aspects are a complete disaster. Like, worse than 3DS and Wii U by a mile.
 
Of all the things that need to be fixed for Splatoon 2, I am hoping that Nintendo will fix this. I'm not sure what the lower tickrate has achieved in any positive way, but it doesn't seem to be a sidegrade in any way, it is a net poorer game overall.

I'm still having fun playing Splatoon 2 at this time, but I can definitely notice the issues that the article is bringing up.
 
The full article is really good and highlights what's probably the game's biggest issue. It's why weapons like the Splattershot are still the strongest in the game, as well as any other weapon with fast, reliable kill times. If you hit all the shots on your end in quick succession then you've basically already killed someone before the other player even registers that they're being shot at on their end. It's noticeably worse in this game compared to Splatoon 1, even with the quasi-regional/ping-based matchmaking.

I was always (probably) naively optimistic that the online would improve once Nintendo started charging for it, and I still hope they do.

I was in the same boat with regards to your last bit. At this point I have given up however.

This at least kind of kills the game as an esport? At least with any big pros participating.
 

Nightii

Banned
Of all the things that need to be fixed for Splatoon 2, I am hoping that Nintendo will fix this. I'm not sure what the lower tickrate has achieved in any positive way, but it doesn't seem to be a sidegrade in any way, it is a net poorer game overall.

I'm still having fun playing Splatoon 2 at this time, but I can definitely notice the issues that the article is bringing up.

On paper, the lower tickrate means the demand for broadband is less intensive, making it so that people with poorer internet connections can get to play more consistently, instead of their connections crapping out at the higher data pack transmissions, resulting in disconnections.

It's basically a terrible way (that in reality doesn't work at all) to ensure people can play no matter to what kind of connection they are hooked to, even if it is a "totally better than most" phone hotspot.
 

Yukinari

Member
The amount of mutually assured destruction and difficult to react to attacks in this game is what kills it.

Basically if you have no range or damage output you should never play ranked.
 

Peltz

Member
It's baffling that Nintendo can create such amazing games with phenomenal gameplay, then cripple them with such insanely poor decisions, time after time.
 

NotLiquid

Member
Wondering whether the lower tickrate has something to do with the game being portable.

I seem to get into a lot less games that have opponents/team mates disconnecting at the very least. I think it's only happened once or twice for me.
 

J@hranimo

Banned
It's weird. I had so many connection errors in the first game, but only one in Splatoon 2 (so far). That being said, my teammates seem to get disconnected often, so it's clearly still a big problem.

The Switch is very bittersweet, I feel. It does so many things right, but its online aspects are a complete disaster. Like, worse than 3DS and Wii U by a mile.

Yeah I definitely agree with that. I'm loving it in regards to software and how much more there is thus far compared to all 4 years of the Wii U, but all the online stuff is concerning. Really hope they fix this ASAP.

Nekketsu Kõha;245032096 said:
I was in the same boat with regards to your last bit. At this point I have given up however.

This at least kind of kills the game as an esport? At least with any big pros participating.

Yeah, I think so. Maybe some on GAF will chime in with their thoughts.

On paper, the lower tickrate means the demand for broadband is less intensive, making it so that people with poorer internet connections can get to play more consistently, instead of their connections crapping out at the higher data pack transmissions, resulting in disconnections.

It's basically a terrible way (that in reality doesn't work at all) to ensure people can play no matter to what kind of connection they are hooked to, even if it is a "totally better than most" phone hotspot.

Basically this. It seems to accommodate the hybrid form factor of the Switch itself.
 
It's baffling that Nintendo can create such amazing games with phenomenal gameplay, then cripple them with such insanely poor decisions, time after time.

Fix stuff like this and throw in a simple text chat with friends letting you add anyone of course in the games, they even have to accept it. I don't think that would be demanding too much :(
 

SuperSah

Banned
I have played about 15-20 matches today. I only managed to finish 3-4 due to shitty connection errors.

It isn't me because all my other games seem to be okay.
 

nynt9

Member
Yeah I definitely agree with that. I'm loving it in regards to software and how much more there is thus far compared to all 4 years of the Wii U, but all the online stuff is concerning. Really hope they fix this ASAP.



Yeah, I think so. Maybe some on GAF will chime in with their thoughts.



Basically this. It seems to accommodate the hybrid form factor of the Switch itself.

I don't know how the Japanese community will react, but this is definitely way below par for a modern FPS that wants to be an esport. Minimum 60-64hz tickrate is generally the norm for real FPS esports.

Overwatch, Battlefield, COD WWII, Siege etc. Are all in the 60s. CSGO has 128hz servers.
 
I have played about 15-20 matches today. I only managed to finish 3-4 due to shitty connection errors.

It isn't me because all my other games seem to be okay.

You playing wired or wireless?

If its wireless, you probably have something kicking the Switches connection off
 
On paper, the lower tickrate means the demand for broadband is less intensive, making it so that people with poorer internet connections can get to play more consistently, instead of their connections crapping out at the higher data pack transmissions, resulting in disconnections.

It's basically a terrible way (that in reality doesn't work at all) to ensure people can play no matter to what kind of connection they are hooked to, even if it is a "totally better than most" phone hotspot.
Yeah, in practice this just means everyone gets to play a game that works terribly =\ I can't speak for folks with poor internet connections, but I think this situation sucks for them no matter what.
 

NotLiquid

Member
An easy solution would be to up the tickrate in Private Lobbies (and maybe back to 25 on Ranked/League). If you want to talk esports/competitive that's where it matters the most. Anyone who's serious about playing competitive Splatoon would most likely have the internet connection to back that up anyways. If I recall correctly, the original Splatoon once received an update that upped the minimum required upload speed or such to decrease disconnects, which for a few people here on GAF I recall rendered the game unplayable.
 

nynt9

Member
woof

rip competitive splatoon :(

does the wired lan mode negate any of these findings?

That doesn't make sense. You can't feasibly mix low and high tick rate players. What if someone removes their switch mid game?

Looks like I'm playing a different game, the game just works for me other than a few disconnections here and here.

This has nothing to do with the game "just working". It's about responsiveness of actions and hit registration online, andsit's an objective fact and a hard limitation.
 

J@hranimo

Banned
I don't know how the Japanese community will react, but this is definitely way below par for a modern FPS that wants to be an esport. Minimum 60-64hz tickrate is generally the norm for real FPS esports.

Overwatch, Battlefield, COD WWII, Siege etc. Are all in the 60s. CSGO has 128hz servers.

I'm always curious how the Japanese community will react to this information. Then again, a lot of their bigger tournaments are local with many setups across the country so they don't necessarily have to be online half the time. See the now yearly Koshien tournaments.

Regading Overwatch in particular, didn't that launch with a much lower tick rate? like in the 20s or 30s?

Looks like I'm playing a different game, the game just works for me other than a few disconnections here and here.

These findings do not render the game unplayable, it is just less than ideal for the competitive environment. The game is still fun.
 

KooopaKid

Banned
That doesn't make sense. You can't feasibly mix low and high tick rate players. What if someone removes their switch mid game?

This has nothing to do with the game "just working". It's about responsiveness of actions and hit registration online, andsit's an objective fact and a hard limitation.

Well I haven't encountered a single unfair death because of lag since release on my front.
 

nynt9

Member
I'm always curious how the Japanese community will react to this information. Then again, a lot of their bigger tournaments are local with many setups across the country so they don't necessarily have to be online half the time. See the now yearly Koshien tournaments.

Regading Overwatch in particular, didn't that launch with a much lower tick rate? like in the 20s or 30s?

Launched with 30ish, patched to 60 after a minor outcry. Blizzard's first competitive shooter, so it seemed like they didn't really understand the importance at first.
 
An easy solution would be to up the tickrate in Private Lobbies (and maybe back to 25 on Ranked/League). If you want to talk esports/competitive that's where it matters the most. Anyone who's serious about playing competitive Splatoon would most likely have the internet connection to back that up anyways. If I recall correctly, the original Splatoon once received an update that upped the minimum required upload speed or such to decrease disconnects, which for a few people here on GAF I recall rendered the game unplayable.
I don't like this solution, because this means playing in turf wars ends up being a different environment than playing in ranked/league/private. This is particularly odious to new players that want to try getting better and/or wanting to compete, then having them suddenly learning that their muscle memory and expectations from turf wars are completely off. This can also apply to players which are trying to practice a particular weapon in turf wars and jumping into ranked/league/private once they think they're "comfortable".
 
I'm always curious how the Japanese community will react to this information. Then again, a lot of their bigger tournaments are local with many setups across the country so they don't necessarily have to be online half the time. See the now yearly Koshien tournaments.

Regading Overwatch in particular, didn't that launch with a much lower tick rate? like in the 20s or 30s?

It did, but it is a different case. OW servers were 3x the refresh rate compared to the client, which prevented many problems like mutual kills.

The main justification for the low client tick-rate was the fear that some systems wouldn't play it well. Upping the tick rate isn't free client resource wise.

I mean for local tournaments where Switches will be connected via local wired lan

what happens then?

Nothing, it lowers the additional delay which happens from the network setup, but it doesn't do anything against the refresh rate of clients/servers.
 

J@hranimo

Banned
I mean for local tournaments where Switches will be connected via local wired lan

what happens then?

Wired LAN play should definitely be better.

Launched with 30ish, patched to 60 after a minor outcry. Blizzard's first competitive shooter, so it seemed like they didn't really understand the importance at first.

It did, but it is a different case. OW servers were 3x the refresh rate compared to the client, which prevented many problems like mutual kills.

The main justification for the low client tick-rate was the fear that some systems wouldn't play it well. Upping the tick rate isn't free client resource wise.

Ah that's interesting, thanks for clarifying. They really need dedicated servers...
 

nynt9

Member
I mean for local tournaments where Switches will be connected via local wired lan

what happens then?

I mean, does the game even support this? I don't know of it having a LAN feature. Even then, the game would need to be programmed to support it.

Yes that's why I said it looks like I'm playing a different game. Not sure how common it is.

You might not be able to perceive it, but with this low a tickrate issues will occur constantly. You might not have the experience or attention to fast movement to notice it, but slowed down videos usually reveal these issues very clearly, especially around corners. 16hz is slower than basically any game out there so in a competitive setting this will be a major barrier.
 

phanphare

Banned
Wired LAN play should definitely be better.

ok cool, well hopefully this doesn't outright kill the competitive community

Nintendo definitely needs to address this, this is their biggest game for Switch

I mean, does the game even support this? I don't know of it having a LAN feature. Even then, the game would need to be programmed to support it.

yeah it does

Previously, we've reported that Splatoon 2 will allow up to eight Nintendo Switch systems to connect via local wireless to play Private Battles. In addition to this, a new feature called LAN Play will enable players to connect eight docked systems using a wired LAN setup. This feature allows players to create local Private Battle tournaments without the need for an Internet connection.

If you're willing to put in the work to set up LAN Play, you can also use the Private Battle Spectator View feature by hooking up two additional Nintendo Switch systems. Local wireless play is perfect for your regular gaming get-togethers, but LAN Play is where it's at when you want to organize a serious tournament event with your fellow players.

https://splatoonus.tumblr.com/post/157089940714/previously-weve-reported-that-splatoon-2-will
 

nynt9

Member
ok cool, well hopefully this doesn't outright kill the competitive community

Nintendo definitely needs to address this, this is their biggest game for Switch



yeah it does



https://splatoonus.tumblr.com/post/157089940714/previously-weve-reported-that-splatoon-2-will

Oh cool, that would help.

Theoretically how hard would it be for them to up the tick rate?

It's a matter of system and server resources. Upping the rate should be simple in theory but it could cause a lot of ancillary effects.
 
Not to mention that the wifi receptors in the Wii U and the Switch are weaker than the ones you'll find in a laptop or another device so you'll get hit with the disconnect alot

Did you just make this up based on anecdotal experiences? Because I've yet to have anything approaching even spurious disconnects and based on a teardown, the Switch uses a Broadcom BCM4356 which is a pretty good antenna
 

Raysoul

Member
Biggest issue for me here is it being peer to peer, which means I can't play on a NAT type D connection, which is the common NAT type for mobile and wireless networks here in the Philippines.
 

Azure J

Member
Glad to see this thread made, thanks Jah!

It sucks that it's Splatoon 2 that had to have such a baffling design decision made considering how much I love the game (and franchise to date), but I do hope that something changes sooner rather than later. I want the game to be as good as it possibly can be and for more people to see its merits. Things like this however actively make it a lesser experience, even with its fantastic core game play.
 

NotLiquid

Member
Theoretically how hard would it be for them to up the tick rate?

Theoretically speaking it ought to be easy but then the question seems to come down to a matter of why it's so low in the first place, and presumably that might have to do with the console it's on and letting people play the game portably/with hotspots etc.

They did update the original Splatoon so it would demand a little more from the user's connections so the possibility of a similar update once they analyze how Splatoon 2 is working is definitely there.
 

Patch13

Member
Theoretically how hard would it be for them to up the tick rate?

It depends on why they have a low tick rate in the first place. If they did it to save battery and make things work better when people are tethered to a mobile connection, then it would be as hard as dealing with the fallout when battery life drops and suddenly people can't play it reliably on the go (or slurp right through their data plan on the go).

I think that it is a "what is the Switch?" issue more than it is an issue with the bits on the disk, in other words. Is it more important that you can play on the train, or more important that you can rely on your reflexes to save you when you're caught out in the open in game?
 

-shadow-

Member
Well that would explain why very often I lose a 1-1 battle despite hitting them multiple times in the face to the point where they should've splatted but just don't and me being gone with just a single hit of a weak weapon. I truly hope that they'll eventually raise the tick rate, because at this very moment it's just very annoying.
 
Well that would explain why very often I lose a 1-1 battle despite hitting them multiple times in the face to the point where they should've splatted but just don't me being gone with just a single hit of a weak weapon. I truly hope that they'll eventually raise the tick rate, because at this very moment it's just very annoying.

And it begins
 
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