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Uncharted 2/3 vs 4 on Hard

Uncharted 2 remaster is so much fun in Hard. No matter how many times I play it, it just hits that sweet spot. You can't play stupidly, running around and getting shot, but there's enough room for error to improvise and try different tactical approaches without working everything out exactly through trial and error. Guns lack serious recoil, so shooting is a simple and fun exercise. It builds confidence, and stealth is not a requirement but rather a fun little addition that lets you mix it up.

Uncharted 3 (also remaster) has famously inferior level design compared to 2, but its mechanics are still a lot of fun to execute. Again, you can't just run around in the open, but different tactical approaches are fun to try out without making it a cerebral exercise a-la Metal Gear. The mechanics of throwing back grenades are tons of fun, and in general it's like 2 but with a few nice tweaks and additions.

2 and 3 on Hard lead to fun tactical sequences that I find myself recording.

Uncharted 4 which I am currently playing in Hard (played on Moderate at launch and enjoyed it other than lacking 60fps) is kind of a chore. I was really looking forward to it, but through Scotland I am finding myself frustrated. Mind you, not "I can't progress" type of frustration. More like, "why am I doing this?" frustration.

The game doesn't want to let you stay in cover for more than a few seconds. 2 and 3 applied pressure too, but 4 is far less forgiving. Once you're getting shot, you have very little leeway. If you don't find more cover ASAP, you are dead. Meanwhile the game discourages shooting. People are hard to see somehow, and I find myself relying on the reticule turning colors and shapes A LOT. The recoil on AK at least is out of control. So moving around is forced yet discouraged, and shooting is necessary yet feels like a chore. Grenade tossbacks from 3 are gone inexplicably.

Stealth is kind of mandatory. Starting one of those big fights without stealth is nearly unthinkable: everyone converges on you with no possibility for attrition. You have to thin out the herd. Maybe you don't HAVE to, but it's too advantageous not to. Except stealth turns into trial and error, which is not creative and not fun.

What's frustrating is that so much sophistication IS there. Tons of climbing opportunities, traversal with the hook, stealth, fighting with Sam/allies, etc. Getting weapons from people upon beating them up, it's great. At times it feels like like playing a stunning war movie. On Moderate I was able to do that stuff, but on Hard much of it is too risky.

Much of the time, it's kind of a slug fest. Sometimes I find myself hitting a checkpoint that gets me past half of a fight. This feels ambivalent. I got past some of it, cool. But the fluidity of the battle is lost, as is the sense of accomplishment of winning the entire battle in one fluid sequence. So the game might actually be guilty of simultaneously too many checkpoints yet being too hard on Hard.

I haven't wanted to record a single battle in 4 so far. That's a good barometer of what it's like vs. 2 and 3.

Disclaimer: it's possible this will improve in the coming chapters. I do recall combat and level design getting better throughout with some amazing levels with verticality and all kinds of goodness.
 

Noobcraft

Member
Just wait until you get to the elevator shootout. That encounter was miserable on crushing.

Overall I prefer 2's difficulty settings personally.
 
I'm pretty sure no one playtested Uncharted 4 on Hard or Crushing based on the later parts of the game like the mansion and ship graveyard.
 

Nev

Banned
Well despite what the trolls usually say, Uncharted is actually a great shooter and it shines on hard.

Uncharted 4 is probably the best TPS ever. The mechanics, controls and encounter design are just masterful.

It's a shame it's buried under Druckmanns' pretentious narrative non-gameplay walking simulator spam X press triangle to inspect nothing crap.

Thankfully there's always multiplayer. Oh wait they killed that too.
 

L.O.R.D

Member
You should try crushing on 4,it's stupid hard,it's not fun at all,and very very cheap.

The final boss was really really cheap.
 

kobu

Member
I love all the Uncharted games on crushing.There's nothing I enjoy more than endless waves of enemies that can kill me in 2 hits and no I'm not being sarcastic
 
Well despite what the trolls usually say, Uncharted is actually a great shooter and it shines on hard.

Uncharted 4 is probably the best TPS ever. The mechanics, controls and encounter design are just masterful.

It's a shame it's buried under Druckmanns' pretentious narrative non-gameplay crap.

Thankfully there's always multiplayer. Oh wait they killed that too.

Oh I'm not a "Uncharted sucks as a shooter" troll at all. 2 is certainly a classic on several levels, and it's meat-and-potatoes shooter aspect is top-notch. 3 was a step back in level design but still tons of fun.

But I am not feeling you with 4 at all.

I think 60fps would be a HUGE step for it, but this Hard experience is just not doing it for me. I am a huge Uncharted fanboy and am finding myself crushingly disappointed.

I wonder how Lost Legacy compares.
 
I'm pretty sure no one playtested Uncharted 4 on Hard or Crushing based on the later parts of the game like the mansion and ship graveyard.

Nah, Uncharted 3 takes that award to latter half of the game. There are no rooms for error in Uncharted 3 hard/crushing.
For some reason Uncharted 4 on crushing just came and went for me (mostly because I used stealth most of the time). The only hard part I can remember was the final boss fight with the 1/2 shot kills.
 

SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
Uncharted 2 on crushing was incredible.

Uncharted 3 was kinda cool because you could memorize enemy spawns and plan out some of the more challenging sections.

Uncharted 4 was frustrating even on normal. enemies had laser aim. i spent half of the game in black and white because i thought uncharted was about moving around and traversing the environment. its a game where the gun mechanics were great but everything else just wasnt fun.

not bad. just not as fun.
 

KingBroly

Banned
3 on Hard was SHIT. 3 on Crushing wasn't too terrible because you knew how much bullshit was coming your way because you played on Hard.
 

ItIsOkBro

Member
uncharted 4 was the best at having a dual approach to combat (stealth vs guns blazing), and it was also the best at encouraging the players to be mobile during combat. uncharted 3 tried to do this but it ended up being cheap with shit spawning behind you. uncharted 2 is a bit too safe when you're behind cover.
 

Nev

Banned
But I am not feeling you with 4 at all.

Eh Uncharted 4 is the perfect execution of Uncharted as a TPS.

I can see why somebody would be disappointed on the lack of action and such, but the core gameplay is absolutely incredible, if underused.

I agree crushing was handled better in 2 though. It's just too much in 4, which makes no sense since it's the one with better/more mobility options.

Hard is the best difficulty setting in 4.
 
Well despite what the trolls usually say, Uncharted is actually a great shooter and it shines on hard.

Uncharted 4 is probably the best TPS ever. The mechanics, controls and encounter design are just masterful.

It's a shame it's buried under Druckmanns' pretentious narrative non-gameplay walking simulator spam X press triangle to inspect nothing crap

Thankfully there's always multiplayer. Oh wait they killed that too.

Talks about people trolling then proceed to act like them. We get it, you don't like Druckmann's take on Uncharted. No need to spread that on every single thread, especially as you are saying the same thing each time.
 

jrush64

Banned
Uncharted games on Crushing are bs annoying and frustrating. Uncharted 3 in particular is just so annoying. I did not have a good time finishing the game on crushing. Uncharted 4 was pretty damn annoying too but definitely not as shitty as 3 was.
 

Nev

Banned
Talks about people trolling then proceed to act like them. We get it, you don't like Druckmann's take on Uncharted. No need to spread that on every single thread, especially as you are saying the same thing each time.

Nah I'm fine saying the same thing each time. Maybe that way he won't destroy TLOU too.
 

jts

...hate me...
I completed Uncharted 1 and 2 on crushing. Loved it.

Was playing Uncharted 4 on normal difficulty, and when I returned to it after a hiatus I was right on the ship graveyard, got so frustrated I ended up just saying "fuck it I just wanna know how this shit ends" and set to the lowest difficulty. No shame.
 
UC2 is still perfection with its difficulty settings. It never get unfair to me.

I assure you it can be unfair! It's just a level design bug though, so I forgive them.

On Crushing, if you forget that in Monastery while descending a certain tower, suddenly everything explodes, and then you have to fight off huge group of goons coming at you across a bridge, with nowhere to retreat and snipers and RPG trained on you... well, if you forget about that, you'll be stuck without adequate weapons and unable to realistically proceed. Then you have to restart chapter.

But other than that, yes, it's lots of fun.
 

SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
Nah I'm fine saying the same thing each time. Maybe that way he won't destroy TLOU too.

lol thats one way to look at it.

neil, if you are reading, please keep the gameplay v walkiing balance in tlou2 the same as it was in the first game.

U4's walking and platforming wouldve been a lot more fun if they had the crafting system of tlou or even tomb raider. hide better weapons, attachments, xp and upgrade materials and have that meta game going when you are doing nothing but climbing and walking. that would've made the exploring an integral part of the game.
 

Neith

Banned
Just wait until you get to the elevator shootout. That encounter was miserable on crushing.

Overall I prefer 2's difficulty settings personally.

Is the elevator the one with the two levels and stairs in the ruins? Well, that was where 4 got real for me. That and the waterway section too. Both of those were intense as hell on Crushing.

I turned ON auto aim at that exact point in the ruins after dying--ALMOST winning--like 40 times lol. Holy balls that was tough as nails without auto aim and whatever weapons you happen to have had. They could have at least geared me the fuck up before that. Even with auto aim it was tough on Crushing.

But I gotta say I disagree here. Never even played hard and I really enjoyed being challenged on Crushing.

Too many gamers just want it easy. It's called Hard mode, so you would think it would be a little hard.
 
Well, you guys are definitely confirming my feelings here. I should probably drop it and save it for LL and hope that one is fun on Moderate or Hard.

I'll just just jump back to warm, cuddly Uncharted 2 and finish that guy up from where I decided to stop to jump to 4. End of Monastery, here I come.
 

Neith

Banned
I disagree with everyone that says these games are annoying on Crushing. In reality everyone wants to play the mode to confirm how great they are at it. Struggle equals fuck this game it's shit. I've heard this so many times over so many years. Uncharted is really not that cheap. It can be cheap, and without auto aim in 4 it can be tough as hell, but it's usually very well designed.

The hardest fight was that mid level fight in the ruined house/museum/whatever. I think it is actually 3 levels and they throw everything at you. The cheap part is you need to be prepared for it when you hit that point in the level because you will use all of your ammo and need theirs too on Crushing. It was a beastly bastard, but it was fun in the end.

Keep the difficulty the same. The AI was fucking great in Uncharted 4. They were no bullshit and you couldn't just hide behind some piece of cover when they had an arsenal. Yes, the perfectly accurate grenades could be annoying but it's CALLED CRUSHING. Deal with it.
 

Z..

Member
4 is just a turd when played on hard mode. Not designed for it and it shows. Played it on hard my first playthrough and will certainly not be doing that ever again.

Uncharted 4 is probably the best TPS ever. The mechanics, controls and encounter design are just masterful.

It's a contender... but Vanquish is still the GOAT by quite a margin. Mechanics and controls are essentially perfect. That's Platinum in a nutshell I suppose.
 

Neith

Banned
4 is just a turd when played on hard mode. Not designed for it and it shows. Played it on hard my first playthrough and will certainly not be doing that ever again.



It's a contender... but Vanquish is still the GOAT by quite a margin. Mechanics and controls are essentially perfect. That's Platinum in a nutshell I suppose.

Not designed for it? My one and only Crushing playthrough was amazing. I have no idea what you are even talking about really. It's pretty much like it always was except the AI is better.
 

Dadasch

Member
I genuinely don't remember anymore on which difficulty I played U2 and U3 but it probably wasn't the highest.
For TLoU I decided to try Crushing and oh boy, that's definitely too hard. I played that sequence with Joel hanging upside down like 50 times and I'm not even exaggerating. I did that but there eventually was a point later on where I didn't want to anymore...that difficulty is not fun.

I didn't even bother anymore with Uncharted 4 on highest difficulty. I wanted to replay it sometime soon though; maybe I will give it a try.
 
Not designed for it? My one and only Crushing playthrough was amazing. I have no idea what you are even talking about really. It's pretty much like it always was except the AI is better.

For one thing, both he and this thread aren't talking about Crushing....

If you do want to talk about Hard, then there's a detailed write up in the OP about how it's different from before.
 

Neith

Banned
For one thing, both he and this thread aren't talking about Crushing....

If you do want to talk about Hard, then there's a detailed write up in the OP about how it's different from before.

Hard and Crushing are pretty close. I always try the AI out in all the difficulty levels. Crushing just gives you fewer moments of down time and makes you shoot more accurately.

IDK I have played hard and crushing in all the games, but I just thought that they had better AI in 4. I just got done with 3 on Crushing as well.

If you think Hard is cheap I have no idea why you would think Crushing is less cheap anyway. The modes are related. Factors just increase or decrease to make things tougher. Talking about one enables you to talk about the other if you have played the highest difficulty.

If you are talking about doing a lot of melee focused combat well then Hard has always been a bit iffy in places IMO.
 

Z..

Member
Not designed for it? My one and only Crushing playthrough was amazing. I have no idea what you are even talking about really. It's pretty much like it always was except the AI is better.

I'm talking about the fact that the game's locations and encounters were clearly not balanced to accomodate the higher difficulties. This is a very common point around all LTTP threads dedicated to the game around here, including mine so if you're not seeing it you are clearly not representative of the majority of players. Stealth becomes pretty much essential if you're playing on hard or crushing, which is hilarious since the stealth mechanics are about as shallow as it gets so raising the challenge forces you to play the game a certain way for it to not be ridiculously overwhelming and yet that way of playing it makes the game actively worse since it becomes increasingly focused on the weakest aspect of it's great combat engine. The extra waves of enemies were also clearly not play tested in plenty of locations since the whole experience becomes an agoraphobic mess if you decide not to be stealthy... you can't go anywhere for a breather since the whole scenario is packed with an excessive amount of enemies which are more damaging and less prone to error. It's overkill and makes the game worst instead of better.

Edit: I played 1, 2 and 3 on Hard. Twice each. The second time just before playing 4. None of the issues I'm talking about were present in any of them.
 
Medium is the best way to enjoy the game the first time, I played it on hard and it was still a blast (even one of my games of the gen) but Uncharted is a game where everything has to look like a movie and dying in the middle of a set piece or watching the game in black and white defeats the purpose imo.

I think is the only game in the world where I prefer medium over hard.
 

Neith

Banned
For me this is why I appreciated the down time just walking and searching for treasure. To me they actually did playtest Crushing fairly well, but that is just my opinion. I don't know how everyone wants to play this game. I assume people who are less skilled with shooter games are playing on easier difficulties.

I do agree with sackman that too many deaths really can get into the way of the story, but eh I'm over it I only play the games once usually and I need my Crushing.
 
I normally play games on hard, and UC4 was a chore. It was my first UC so maybe I'll give it another go. What difficulty is recommended?
 
I'm talking about the fact that the game's locations and encounters were clearly not balanced to accomodate the higher difficulties. This is a very common point around all LTTP threads dedicated to the game around here, including mine so if you're not seeing it you are clearly not representative of the majority of players. Stealth becomes pretty much essential if you're playing on hard or crushing, which is hilarious since the stealth mechanics are about as shallow as it gets so raising the challenge forces you to play the game a certain way for it to not be ridiculously overwhelming and yet that way of playing it makes the game actively worse since it becomes increasingly focused on the weakest aspect of it's great combat engine. The extra waves of enemies were also clearly not play tested in plenty of locations since the whole experience becomes an agoraphobic mess if you decide not to be stealthy... you can't go anywhere for a breather since the whole scenario is packed with an excessive amount of enemies which are more damaging and less prone to error. It's overkill and makes the game worst instead of better.

Edit: I played 1, 2 and 3 on Hard. Twice each. The second time just before playing 4. None of the issues I'm talking about were present in any of them.

This is exactly right.

It is hard for me to imagine playtesters on Hard coming back with tons of "that was fun!" reviews. Whereas in 2 that's exactly what I imagine the feedback being. (Normal was definitely a huge cakewalk though.)
 
I normally play games on hard, and UC4 was a chore. It was my first UC so maybe I'll give it another go. What difficulty is recommended?

Moderate was fun. IMO. I still preferred 2/Hard, but 4 was a strong game on Moderate. Of course there was a lot more to it which loses impact in subsequent playthroughs. Namely the interminable climbing and banter and storytelling was enjoyable the first time. Not going to be all that in more playthroughs. 2 is balanced away from excessive climbing and gabbing which can be considered weakness for play 1 but definitely a strength subsequently.
 
To prepare for U4, I played the trilogy on Crushing (the remastered version). I don't remember exactly why, but U4 just didn't feel right on crushing. It was my least favorite experience on crushing, by far. It could have also been because there was too much walking narrative going on, and I got bored watching the same stuff over again. I like the stuff, like exploring with the boat on that island and the car. They should go for more of that, and less of the walking simulator stuff. That will help ease playthroughs.

Cause...man. My second playthrough was not nearly as fun as the others. I played U2 like 5 or 6 times, and have never went back to U4. Its higher difficulties just suck, and it's just not as replayable. Shame cause it was such a great experience the first time through.
 

Enzo88

Member
Uncharted 2 remaster is so much fun in Hard. No matter how many times I play it, it just hits that sweet spot. You can't play stupidly, running around and getting shot, but there's enough room for error to improvise and try different tactical approaches without working everything out exactly through trial and error. Guns lack serious recoil, so shooting is a simple and fun exercise. It builds confidence, and stealth is not a requirement but rather a fun little addition that lets you mix it up.

Uncharted 3 (also remaster) has famously inferior level design compared to 2, but its mechanics are still a lot of fun to execute. Again, you can't just run around in the open, but different tactical approaches are fun to try out without making it a cerebral exercise a-la Metal Gear. The mechanics of throwing back grenades are tons of fun, and in general it's like 2 but with a few nice tweaks and additions.

2 and 3 on Hard lead to fun tactical sequences that I find myself recording.

Uncharted 4 which I am currently playing in Hard (played on Moderate at launch and enjoyed it other than lacking 60fps) is kind of a chore. I was really looking forward to it, but through Scotland I am finding myself frustrated. Mind you, not "I can't progress" type of frustration. More like, "why am I doing this?" frustration.

The game doesn't want to let you stay in cover for more than a few seconds. 2 and 3 applied pressure too, but 4 is far less forgiving. Once you're getting shot, you have very little leeway. If you don't find more cover ASAP, you are dead. Meanwhile the game discourages shooting. People are hard to see somehow, and I find myself relying on the reticule turning colors and shapes A LOT. The recoil on AK at least is out of control. So moving around is forced yet discouraged, and shooting is necessary yet feels like a chore. Grenade tossbacks from 3 are gone inexplicably.

Stealth is kind of mandatory. Starting one of those big fights without stealth is nearly unthinkable: everyone converges on you with no possibility for attrition. You have to thin out the herd. Maybe you don't HAVE to, but it's too advantageous not to. Except stealth turns into trial and error, which is not creative and not fun.

What's frustrating is that so much sophistication IS there. Tons of climbing opportunities, traversal with the hook, stealth, fighting with Sam/allies, etc. Getting weapons from people upon beating them up, it's great. At times it feels like like playing a stunning war movie. On Moderate I was able to do that stuff, but on Hard much of it is too risky.

Much of the time, it's kind of a slug fest. Sometimes I find myself hitting a checkpoint that gets me past half of a fight. This feels ambivalent. I got past some of it, cool. But the fluidity of the battle is lost, as is the sense of accomplishment of winning the entire battle in one fluid sequence. So the game might actually be guilty of simultaneously too many checkpoints yet being too hard on Hard.

I haven't wanted to record a single battle in 4 so far. That's a good barometer of what it's like vs. 2 and 3.

Disclaimer: it's possible this will improve in the coming chapters. I do recall combat and level design getting better throughout with some amazing levels with verticality and all kinds of goodness.

That`s one of the things i hated the most about uncharted 4, not much room for run and shoot, while i was doing crazy stuff in 2/3. I guess the game assumes you`re gonna stealth kill a bunch of people first.
 

jayu26

Member
Pro tip, if you are going to play Uncharted 2 and 3 on PS4, switch shooting to L1 and R1. It makes the game much easier. They were originally designed for those buttons.
 

cheez124

Member
I never was a fan of Uncharted on higher difficulties. The lack of freedom is my biggest issue. You can't jump, or climb, or use your grappling hook, because if you stick your head out of cover for even a second, you get put into low health. You're pretty much forced to either find a good place to camp or use stealth.

I think the problem is that the enemies have unrealistically good accuracy even when you're jumping/climbing/swinging. If they tweaked it so that enemies were less accurate while you're doing those things, it might be more bearable.
 
I found on the harder difficulties you could still run and gun on hard but you had to be more deliberate about it. Risky moves like rope swinging and running and gunning were harder to pull off but a little more rewarding.

Crushing however can be a little too much. Cool for the challenge, but crushing is definitely not Uncharted at its best.

And yeah the ship graveyard and that three story building in New Devon was death city for me on crushing. Pretty much had to have the perfect run or it was over.

Makes me wish Naughty Dog could take a stab at a John Woo Hard Boiled type shooting game. Cause I enjoy the shootouts in Uncharted a lot.
 

carlsojo

Member
The difficulty spikes in Uncharted 4 are ridiculous and unfun. The encounters are incredibly poorly designed. When you play on the harder difficulties this becomes very, very apparent.
 

BHK3

Banned
I dont know how people can say Uncharteds difficulty didn't go downhill with 3. Go fight the skeleton soldiers in 3 on crushing and die once, enjoy your terrible checkpoint where you spawn into instant death everytime, thank me later.
 

Revven

Member
I dont know how people can say Uncharteds difficulty didn't go downhill with 3. Go fight the skeleton soldiers in 3 on crushing and die once, enjoy your terrible checkpoint where you spawn into instant death everytime, thank me later.

That's like the only bad part on Crushing in 3. And if you know it's coming, you know to be prepared by grabbing the extra Hammer before even going into that area. And on top of that, you should know where the power weapons are laid out in that area as well. Granted, it is impossible to get it done first try due to how the Djinn soldiers are but still it doesn't drag down the whole Crushing difficulty. At best, you retry that part like ten times before you get it (and those ten times are quick deaths so you're not even stuck on it for awhile).

As for the elevator in Uncharted 4 on Crushing... this is what I came up with after several tries when I did Crushing over a year ago. Still a lot of luck involved, though, for sure. It is probably the most unfair and uneven scenario on Crushing, I'll agree. Very little area to move and not to mention, you can barely pick up the weapons the enemies drop due to their location when they die and the enemies that spawn at the top. Definitely goes against the movement and traversal elements of Uncharted's combat, IMO, it's just bad design.

If shooting from ledges had actually been improved upon in some manner, then this section would be better. But because there's so much cooldown and startup to shooting from the ledge, it's just poor design to force the player to engage in this action when you're being shot at from all angles.

Uncharted 2 had a similar scenario in Nepal but they gave you two bullboards as cover you could shift between, here you have to climb -> jump -> climb to reach the next ledge and the actions between getting to the pillars leave you wide open. In Uncharted 2's scenario, you're seamlessly able to shift between the billboards and you're not at all asked to let go of the billboard and jump to another one; they just plant you on them and you're stuck there but due to how they designed it you have multiple options in being able to survive all the angles you're shot at. And, well, how that section is paced compared to the elevator also matters.

Like, the elevator section is a troubling one in not just how you have to traverse to the pillars but in how it's also partially an autoscroller. The elevator determines when you can actually climb to the next pillar in addition to triggering when the next wave of enemies appear. If you take too long killing the first wave, the second wave is out while you're still dealing with the first wave. It's pretty bad. Again, pacing. It's the only combat scenario you can't control the pacing of.
 

Markitron

Is currently staging a hunger strike outside Gearbox HQ while trying to hate them to death
UC4 is noticeably harder on Crushing than the rest. That ship graveyard was a nightmare
 

Servbot24

Banned
Just wait until you get to the elevator shootout. That encounter was miserable on crushing.

Overall I prefer 2's difficulty settings personally.
That's where I got stuck on crushing. You have to find the perfect path, execute perfectly, and even then you have to have some luck. And I've only gotten halfway up.
 
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