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What Microsoft NEEDS to do with Minecraft and Ocolus to put you INTO the game...

Z3M0G

Member
Edit: Or rather, What Microsoft NEEDS to do to make Minecraft playable for the masses with Ocolus...

... aside from simply "look in" to the game world using HoloLense, which is still pretty cool in its own way. But I suspect what will truly grab kids and adults alike is VR putting you INTO the game. Where you can move around, mine, build, etc from the same perspective they are already familiar with.

VR comes with major challenges to put you into a game world using VR... especially when it involves freely exploring an open environment. On-Rail experiences where you are sitting or standing in one spot are much more natural. But this E3 has shown us one very simple and basic method that can be applied to almost ANY FPS experience to make it simply "Work"!

So here it is:

MinecraftVR_zpseqty54zg.png~320x480


So... why the robot suite? It's actually incredibly important... this image was a stolen example from the internet with some photoshop applied, but when playing with a controller (Mouse KB in VR will likely not be feasible) I believe we are going to learn that games where you are simply "walking around with your virtual feet" in VR games (using controller with analog stick) will be rather immersion breaking, nausea inducing, and likely take some adjustment... while some people may never be able to adjust to it at all.

While you are playing a game, you are not walking around in the real world, but rather you are typically sitting down on a sofa or in a chair. It's important to match in the VR world what you are doing in the real world. SO, if you are also "sitting" in the VR world, and controlling a vehicle with a virtual set of hand controls, that feels much more natural and less likely to invoke nausea. This is clearly a key factor to the future success of RIGS on Morpheus (wanted to post a gameplay perspective pic, but my limited image access at work isn't helping me out).

While in Mincraft using VR, simply place your avatar in a robot mech suite (something not too large so it takes up relatively the same space and provides same perspective), that you would in theory be controlling with hand controls (no need to make them visible in the game world). Pressing a button to swing a tool or weapon would feel natural from a gameplay standpoint, and also natural from an immersion standpoint.

Keeping a "locked environment" around your body is important to maintain a connection between your stationary and sitting presence in the world, and the surrounding explorable world itself. So as you look around with the headset, you would see various parts of your suite cockpit (shoulders, console, Tool/Inventory HUD, etc). Interacting with your inventory would happen within the suite HUD itself.

Going into free-flying mode to build would also be pretty natural... the robot suites could have jetpacks to give that a sense of realism and connection to the world. You won't feel like you are just freely flying, but flying in a vehicle.

Looking down to mine/build below you could be a challenge, since your mind expects to see your body... but looking down with your head would be different than looking down using the analog stick on your controller, which could instead "tip" your mech suite down so you can indeed see directly down. This part could be tricky to get right.

So this is how you make existing and moving around the Minecraft world using VR much more natural. Players can meet up and play/work together each using VR (Ocolus), while other players could look into that same world using AR (HoloLense).

You can have that one for free, Microsoft / Majong. Your experts should have already considered this, I would hope. But if you are trying to just have a normal Minecraft avatar walk around in VR and it is encountering problems, I would suggest this approach.
 

Cynn

Member
While I'm not sure you'd need vehicle based things to make Minecraft work in VR, I'm absolutely certain that VR not AR is the killer app for the game.

I don't want to see a cave sitting on my coffee table. I want to see it through the eyes of my character.
 
Unless they allow it on Morpheus, Minecraft VR won't take off because most kids aren't going to have access to a 1000 dollar PC plus Oculus.
 

Azzawon

Member
I can understand where you're coming from with this, and it does actually make sense. This can probably go for any first person game using VR to be fair, which is why I can see RIGS being successful - I bet the titan sequences in Titanfall would be incredible too...
 

jaypah

Member
While I'm not sure you'd need vehicle based things to make Minecraft work in VR, I'm absolutely certain that VR not AR is the killer app for the game.

I don't want to see a cave sitting on my coffee table. I want to see it through the eyes of my character.

I would like to own both so this is a very exciting time for me.

To the point of the thread, I would like for more people to try first person full control VR games. I keep hearing about how it's a no-no for VR but obviously it's on a person to person basis as I have zero disorientation playing First Person games in VR. At most I have a bit of eye strain when frames drop but naturally that's with any perspective.
 

Reallink

Member
Unless they allow it on Morpheus, Minecraft VR won't take off because most kids aren't going to have access to a 1000 dollar PC plus Oculus.

You don't need anything approaching a $1000 PC to play Minecraft at 90fps. Intel's semi-modern laptop iGPU's can probably run it.
 

Z3M0G

Member
Would it even be safe for kids?

Not oculus but samsung suggests 13 and up for gear vr.

http://www.trustedreviews.com/news/samsung-gear-vr-headset-is-not-suitable-for-children

Good point actually! I should have considered this before suggesting Kids in the OP. But yah... VR should be kept away from pre-teens or younger, I'd say.

I would like to own both so this is a very exciting time for me.

To the point of the thread, I would like for more people to try first person full control VR games. I keep hearing about how it's a no-no for VR but obviously it's on a person to person basis as I have zero disorientation playing First Person games in VR. At most I have a bit of eye strain when frames drop but naturally that's with any perspective.

If this is truly the vibe in the VR world, this is EXACTLY the point that I'm trying to get across with my OP... and RIGS is a Fast Paced, competitive FPS that people seemed to grasp quite naturally! I don't know if anyone experience Nausea during many E3 demo's this year... someone on Giantbomb Day3 video (watching now) mentioned getting nauseous during the horse bicycle demo... makes sense, since there is a bit of a disconnect between real and VR worlds (your body feels you riding a bike locked in place, yet in VR you are on a flying horse).

I'm predicting now that after the initial wave of VR games come and go, the vast majority of successful VR games intended to be played from a sofa or chair will have you sited in some kind of a "cockpit" while you move around the VR world in a vehicle. Be it flying, walking, swimming, etc.

Again, this is for games where you are using a controller to control movement of your body around the VR space.
 
You don't need anything approaching a $1000 PC to play Minecraft at 90fps. Intel's semi-modern laptop iGPU's can probably run it.

You need a better PC than 90% of the kids into Minecraft probably have. My non gaming computer can barely run Minecraft at 30fps with a low draw distance. Its not a well optimized game.
 

RdN

Member
Unless they allow it on Morpheus, Minecraft VR won't take off because most kids aren't going to have access to a 1000 dollar PC plus Oculus.

Microsoft would never make an exclusive VR experience to their biggest competitor, so your point makes no sense here.

On topic, I don't know about mechs, but having messed around on mine craft using the Samsung VR, I agree that walking around isn't going to work.
 

jaypah

Member
You need a better PC than 90% of the kids into Minecraft probably have. My non gaming computer can barely run Minecraft at 30fps with a low draw distance. Its not a well optimized game.

They'd probably just hold on to it until phones could run it with GearVR or something. Lol, Morpheus probably isn't going to be the answer.
 
I never had any problems with sickness using Minecraft in the DK2. It's a slow paced game, as long as you're not spinning around fast with the mouse it should be OK for most people and didn't feel particularly unnatural to me. A robot suit seems overkill. I'd slow down turning speeds (which are offset by the fact that you can twist your head to look around too), and offer the tap-to-turn mechanic that has worked well in games like Windlands (you tap the left and right bumper to turn 90 degrees instantly. Quick snap cuts like that aren't a cause of nausea).

Incidentally, Minecraft is super cool in VR. The sense of scale is awesome. Even individual blocks look much bigger than you imagine them to be on a screen. And digging down is claustrophobic as fuck.
 

IMACOMPUTA

Member
I agree that games where you are stationary and controlling something (airplane, spaceship, car, mech) work best in VR. Using the rift in HL2 made me really nauseous. I felt like I was sliding/being pulled around.

I'm sure they will overcome this issue though.
 

Z3M0G

Member
I agree that games where you are stationary and controlling something (airplane, spaceship, car, mech) work best in VR. Using the rift in HL2 made me really nauseous. I felt like I was sliding/being pulled around.

I'm sure they will overcome this issue though.

The key may be nothing more than locking the HUD relevant to "your body", rather than keeping it locked with your center of view at all times.
 

weevles

Member
I thought MS was using Hololens with Minecraft. What does Oculus have to do with Hololens/Minecraft? I haven't seen anything about MS partnering with Facebook to deliver Minecraft on Oculus, but then I haven't really been keeping track of who is doing what with VR at the moment....
 
Decent is the killer ip that NEEDS to be revived for VR. Or a game that you play as a nano machine inside the human body fighting off a crazy virus. Don't get me started on freespace.

Btw that nano machine idea is free if any indie devs are reading. Make it like that movie that had the suit they shrunk and injected into a women.
 

Z3M0G

Member
Yeah, I really don't think it would take very long for people to get used to moving a body with a controller in VR.

VR wont succeed if people need to train themselves to overcome the disorientation and nausea of moving around in VR, but there are tricks popping up to make it much more natural and comprehensive for your inner senses.

But there are people who always get nauseous playing any form of FPS game... as there will be people who will always feel nausea with VR. But for some who struggle with FPS games on a screen, VR could be fine for them if done right.
 

Enk

makes good threads.
I played Minecraft already in VR. Hours of it actually and in long, nonnauseating sessions even with the DK1. It works really well too.

No robot suit needed.
 

Steel

Banned
VR wont succeed if people need to train themselves to overcome the disorientation and nausea of moving around in VR, but there are tricks popping up to make it much more natural and comprehensive for your inner senses.

But there are people who always get nauseous playing any form of FPS game... as there will be people who will always feel nausea with VR. But for some who struggle with FPS games on a screen, VR could be fine for them if done right.

As you said, some people get nauseous with a 2d screen. Not to mention that people have to train themselves to use the camera for any game, and that's a barrier to entry that gets overcome all the time.
 
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