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Apple won't allow PC emulators on iOS; App Store rules breach EU tech rules, EU regulators say

Bernoulli

M2 slut
This information has surfaced via two developers of such emulators, iDOS 3 (a new version of the popular DOS emulator) and UTM SE (which wanted to let you emulate Windows on iOS). Both of those have been shot down by Apple, however.

The developer of iDOS 3 got the following rejection notice from Apple: "The app provides emulator functionality but is not emulating a retro game console specifically". This puts iDOS 3 in breach of Apple's guideline 4.7.




This should be fixed when the EU takes actions for not following the DMA

This is what you can do with a PC emulator











AMSTERDAM (Reuters) - Apple's App Store rules breach EU tech rules known as the Digital Markets Act (DMA) because they prevent app developers from steering consumers to alternative offers, EU antitrust regulators said on Monday.
The European Commission, which also acts as the EU antitrust and technology regulator, said it had sent its preliminary findings to Apple following an investigation launched in March.
The EU executive said it was also opening an investigation into the iPhone maker over its new contractual requirements for third-party app developers and app stores.
 

Robb

Gold Member
GIF by Giphy QA
 
Out of interest, would the Amiga be caught by this? It was not a console, but was primarily for gaming.

You could could make a really good Amiga emulator - chuck in a load of games - and that would be a popular app.
 

Bernoulli

M2 slut
Out of interest, would the Amiga be caught by this? It was not a console, but was primarily for gaming.

You could could make a really good Amiga emulator - chuck in a load of games - and that would be a popular app.
when EU forces them to follow the DMA rules Devs can upload anything they want without apple's approval
 

Starhowl

Member
I am grateful for living in the EU and going to have free choice about what browser or otherwise software I am allowed to install and use.

Also Apple's walled garden is anti-competitive, since other payment processors weren't allowed for NFC-payments or in apps.

Europe Brussels GIF by European Commission
 

Comandr

Member
The EU doesn't give a fuck. They are overregulating everything digital
You do see why.. right?

1) Target big company.
2) Setup a bunch of bullshit, moving goal post regulations.
3) Penalize company for 5% of their global profit per day out of compliance.
4) Laugh all the way to the bank.

Pro consumer my ass. The EU wants Apple to resist. Someone somewhere has a mountain of money to make off of it.
 
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Starhowl

Member
You do see why.. right?

1) Target big company.
2) Setup a bunch of bullshit, moving goal post regulations.
3) Penalize company for 5% of their global profit per day out of compliance.
4) Laugh all the way to the bank.
You are forgetting that the European Union plus Switzerland isn't the only economic region that's been doing that.
 

Comandr

Member
You are forgetting that the European Union plus Switzerland isn't the only economic region that's been doing that.
No I'm aware Japan has also smelled the blood in the water. It's just funny that like, this wasn't that big of an issue for a long time. It's not like anyone has a gun to your head forcing you to buy Apple anything. There is tons of choice from other manufacturers.

Why does everyone have to be the same?

Why doesn't my Xbox play Switch games? These regulators should go after gaming companies too.

Why doesn't my Ralph's card get me discounts at Safeway? I'm buying general groceries, general consumable goods. Why should I be bullied to drive 10 minutes down the road to save 70 cents on eggs?

Why doesn't my Circle K rewards card get me discounts on gas at Shell?

Why can't I go to a sushi restaurant and order hamburgers? Food is food? There's no difference. They should serve me what I want because I'm the consumer, regardless of what's on offer.

If the iPhone is a general computing device, then so are consoles. Grocery stores are also general goods vendors. And gasoline is also a general good.

You see what I'm saying? Where's the line?
 
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Hudo

Gold Member
You do see why.. right?

1) Target big company.
2) Setup a bunch of bullshit, moving goal post regulations.
3) Penalize company for 5% of their global profit per day out of compliance.
4) Laugh all the way to the bank.

Pro consumer my ass. The EU wants Apple to resist. Someone somewhere has a mountain of money to make off of it.
Well, seeing that Apple and other big tech companies do a lot of bullshit to avoid paying taxes here, if the EU can get their money that way, why the fuck not.
 

Starhowl

Member
No I'm aware Japan has also smelled the blood in the water. It's just funny that like, this wasn't that big of an issue for a long time. It's not like anyone has a gun to your head forcing you to buy Apple anything. There is tons of choice from other manufacturers.

Why does everyone have to be the same?

Why doesn't my Xbox play Switch games? These regulators should go after gaming companies too.

Why doesn't my Ralph's card get me discounts at Safeway? I'm buying general groceries, general consumable goods. Why should I be bullied to drive 10 minutes down the road to save 70 cents on eggs?

Why doesn't my Circle K rewards card get me discounts on gas at Shell?

Why can't I go to a sushi restaurant and order hamburgers? Food is food? There's no difference. They should serve me what I want because I'm the consumer, regardless of what's on offer.

If the iPhone is a general computing device, then so are consoles. Grocery stores are also general goods vendors. And gasoline is also a general good.

You see what I'm saying? Where's the line?
You might be right about no one being forced to buy an iPhone, but in the US alone a whole whopping 68% of the market share falls to iPhones when it comes to the group of up to 29 year olds.

Soon, there will be nothing left but iPhones anymore and you want to call that free choice?

Often read on 4chan (I'm so happy I'm off that platform and don't have to browse it anymore - thanks guys for finally respecting my free choice!!! Also remember that account "I, hypocrite" on Twitter from that time, hypocrites.) "Only an idiot would not want any competition!".

Also developers cannot compete on the market anymore, because they cannot release their apps on the platform because of Apple rules while if they can they have to pay untimely royalties.

In other words, at that point it's not only not a free market anymore, the market doesn't even exist at all for whole sectors, like they adult sector (BTW also strange you guys complaining considering that elsewise you love to whine about how they're stealing your titties from games and stuff while Apple would not allow it at all!!!), since they're not allowed to release their apps on the platform at all!
season 10 episode 23 GIF


P.S.: I don't think I'll have to mention that I'm very well aware I'm not talking to 4chan-people here, but some views and attitudes are very similar.
 

Bernoulli

M2 slut
You do see why.. right?

1) Target big company.
2) Setup a bunch of bullshit, moving goal post regulations.
3) Penalize company for 5% of their global profit per day out of compliance.
4) Laugh all the way to the bank.

Pro consumer my ass. The EU wants Apple to resist. Someone somewhere has a mountain of money to make off of it.
Apple's fault for being Anticompetitive
 

Dacvak

No one shall be brought before our LORD David Bowie without the true and secret knowledge of the Photoshop. For in that time, so shall He appear.
when EU forces them to follow the DMA rules Devs can upload anything they want without apple's approval
What do you mean anything they want? Does that mean all software would get automatically approved, or are you just talking about emulators?
 

Rockondevil

Member
Also Apple's walled garden is anti-competitive, since other payment processors weren't allowed for NFC-payments or in apps.
I dread the day anyone can use the NFC chip for payments.
Long gone will be the days of simple double tapping a button to access all my bank cards and choosing which to pay with.

You can bet your bottom dollar that each bank will use their own shitty apps to pay from.
Yay for making things less convenient.
 

Bernoulli

M2 slut
Please elaborate.
Apple is closing the device that you bought by not allowing you to install anything outside their app store, imagine if windows didn't allow you to install anything other than apps and programs from the windows store, even on Mac you can
Phones nowadays are used by billions of people as their device for everything and they need to be able to do what they want with them.
 

Panajev2001a

GAF's Pleasant Genius
The EU doesn't give a fuck. They are overregulating everything digital
That is not true. Apple has not allowed unrestricted side loading. Apple still reviewed apps on third party app stores and has rejected apps for not following its guidelines that were not doing anything sketchy.
 
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The EU doesn't give a fuck. They are overregulating everything digital

Wonder if that Microsoft plant who removed herself from the running to join the EC is still running favors for Microsoft BTS.

It's just still very "convenient" all of these other tech companies with very successful closed ecosystems are being pressured to open up for a massive conglomerate who's failed with their own closed platforms and only seen success having to play by everyone else's rules as a guest in their respective closed ecosystems 🤔
 

Comandr

Member
You might be right about no one being forced to buy an iPhone, but in the US alone a whole whopping 68% of the market share falls to iPhones when it comes to the group of up to 29 year olds.

Soon, there will be nothing left but iPhones anymore and you want to call that free choice?

Often read on 4chan (I'm so happy I'm off that platform and don't have to browse it anymore - thanks guys for finally respecting my free choice!!! Also remember that account "I, hypocrite" on Twitter from that time, hypocrites.) "Only an idiot would not want any competition!".

Also developers cannot compete on the market anymore, because they cannot release their apps on the platform because of Apple rules while if they can they have to pay untimely royalties.

In other words, at that point it's not only not a free market anymore, the market doesn't even exist at all for whole sectors, like they adult sector (BTW also strange you guys complaining considering that elsewise you love to whine about how they're stealing your titties from games and stuff while Apple would not allow it at all!!!), since they're not allowed to release their apps on the platform at all!
season 10 episode 23 GIF


P.S.: I don't think I'll have to mention that I'm very well aware I'm not talking to 4chan-people here, but some views and attitudes are very similar.
Do you... are you aware of what you are saying? 68% of the US market share is iphone. Fine. That's because consumers are CHOOSING iPhone instead of the alternative, because the iPhone ecosystem, function, service, et al, is attractive to them. Even in the united states no one is forced to buy iphone. People WANT to. Have you considered that Apple is successful because their product is GOOD the way they DESIGNED it? Why has Nintendo sold 146 million switches? Because people like the product and services it offers.

Don't buy a fuckin switch and then complain that you can't install playstation games on it. There's a solution for that, and everyone in the world has the choice to pursue that.

All this EU stuff, and other regulators, is about squeezing money out of big fish. It's never been about free markets or any of that shit. This is an opportunity to squeeze billions and billions of dollars out of a company, and put it all under the banner of free markets and pro consumerism. They get to look like the good guy and make a fuckload of money doing it.


And let's not get started on app developers not making any money. You think developers are crying NOW when people are forced at gun point to use the app store to buy their apps? Just wait until you can easily sideload paid apps. Let's see how much they cry then. This is why many programs are always-online or internet authenticated subscription based services now. It's a lot harder to pirate them. So get ready for more of that. Sorry you can't play Death Stranding 2 because we were unable to verify your subscription from your Koji ID, please try again :(

Fuckin' Flappy Bird was making $50,000 a DAY. Oh boo hoo with mean ol Apple's evil tax, Dong Nguyen was only making $35,000 a day. You know, more money than a lot of people see in a year.

Should Apple get a cut of that? Yes. You put your game on their store, and they advertised it to billions of people for you. That's fair.

If you rent a 1 bedroom apartment in someone else's building, you are expected to pay rent to be there.

Apple does this in the App Store. Google does this in the Play Store. Epic does this on their store. Nintendo, Microsoft, Sony, and Steam all do this in their respective stores.

If you want to live on someone else's property, you have to pay the price. Period. That's just the cost of doing business. This is a lesson that Tim Sweeney already learned very well.


To summarize; I'm not saying competition is bad. But competition is only relevant while each product is discernably different. What's the point of competition if everything is exactly the same?

Furthermore, some people don't want a lot of choice and freedom. iPhone doesn't permit any bloatware whatsoever on their devices. You know when you buy an iPhone, all of the apps on it are totally safe. All of your apps come from the one app store, and you know those have all been checked by human beings and are safe to use and download. Outliers remain but let's not conflate downloading apps from a trusted source with sideloading from a given website or being tricked into side loading something somehow. Have you considered that some people choose iPhone because it's locked down, and relatively simple? It's okay if that doesn't meet your needs, that's why there are dozens of companies that make alternative phones that would better fit you. See? They aren't necessarily competing, they are catering to different audiences.

This is one reason why many people buy consoles instead of a PC. Virtually every game on Xbox is also on PC. PCs are more powerful and much more versatile. So on paper of course PC is always the better choice, right?

Buuuut on an Xbox you can just jam the game in and play. You don't have to worry about drivers or if your system has enough ram or if your graphics card supports a given feature or tweaking settings a ton or any of that bullshit. Even an inexpensive "PC" like the steam deck can be very user unfriendly if you try to do anything but play certain steam games. But that's the choice that people have to pursue those things.

That's why having a diverse array of products is good. To cater to different audiences.

Let me ask you this: do YOU have an iPhone? Go ahead and screenshot this post. I'll wait. And if not, why do you even give a shit? You don't have a dog in this fight. I have a theory that the people being the most vocal aren't even part of the affected group.

*~\/Rant over\/~*

Anyway let's keep this about the topic, huh?! The notion of playing emulating PC games on a phone is... fascinating but... In practice, who fuckin' cares? Oh good, some of today's most powerful devices can run old games like shit. The science behind it is fascinating. It's cool that you can do that. But it's about as useful as playing DOOM on a calculator, or a microwave, or a fucking fish or whatever people have ported it to now. It's just not an ideal way to play. Even native big kid games like RE4/7/8 and now AC: Mirage have shown us -- today's most powerful devices still run these games like butt due to one constraint or another. Wake me up in 10 years when mobile chips have evolved to a point where playing big budget games on them is actually worthwhile.
 
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M1chl

Currently Gif and Meme Champion
The level of American brain in this thread is something else. Oh poor Apple, I also hate when I have less options, because big scary government does not do anything. I find very rich that "EU likes money", given how far the lobbying is going on in the USA.

Please behave.
 

Sophist

Member
Most usanians have knowledge about the european nations (France, Germany, Italy, ...) but not much about the European Union itself and its philosophy. We could say the same about europeans towards the USA; they know California, New York, ... But much less about the federal government, the founding fathers...

The European Union is based on four freedoms: the free movement of goods, capital, services, and people. These four freedoms are implemented under a single market. The EU sees digital platforms like apple store, Steam, amazon, ... as markets too and thus they have to comply to the four freedoms if they want to have access to the EU single market. It's simple as that.

It's not different than the rest of world. For example, to access the chinese market, apple has to comply to the rules of the Communist party (Especially about censorship).
 
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nkarafo

Member
I do wonder though, if you are interested in emulation and homebrew stuff in general, why did you end up buying any Apple device in the first place? It's known they are at the very bottom of the list for that stuff, they always were. Even on emulators that managed to get through, the experience is almost always inferior since important stuff is missing, such as JIT (which makes a lot of emulators run at a usable speed in every other device).
 

Robochobo

Member
Wonder if that Microsoft plant who removed herself from the running to join the EC is still running favors for Microsoft BTS.

It's just still very "convenient" all of these other tech companies with very successful closed ecosystems are being pressured to open up for a massive conglomerate who's failed with their own closed platforms and only seen success having to play by everyone else's rules as a guest in their respective closed ecosystems 🤔
The EU in the past 24-48h just hit Microsoft with an Antitrust claim over Teams. Quit smoking crack. Not everything is some big conspiracy.
 
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