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Why do people keep saying that "Wii won last gen?"
- Thread starter Comandr
- Start date
Brawly Likes to Brawl
Member
This thread perfectly showcases how stupid someone can look when they get overly invested over who "wins" a console generation. Lot's of moving goalposts and insecurity in here.
Crimsonsky
Member
The "win" comes from money made on hardware, it discounts everything else. Because if you count anything else the Wii auto losses. It's attach rate for software was atrocious.
With that caveat in place, it "won" because it made more money off units sold at it's initial asking price. 360 and ps3 on the other hand sold most of their units at discounted rates.
In this instance, it is in fact a race, and the Wii won.
With that caveat in place, it "won" because it made more money off units sold at it's initial asking price. 360 and ps3 on the other hand sold most of their units at discounted rates.
In this instance, it is in fact a race, and the Wii won.
I never did understand this argument. Especially here on GAF. I doubt anyone was sifting through mountains of shovelware. Most informed gamers know well beforehand what they want to play. I've never stopped at my game store and said to myself "Hmm, self. Should I get this awesome looking Chicken Shoot game or should I get Super Smash Bros. Brawl. Damn!, decisions, decisions."
Would you mind explaining what you think is a more reasonable metric for concluding which console was the most successful during its generation? If its not consoles sold or profits, then I'd love to hear your reasoning.
So what are the software attach rates for each of the three?
Given that the word 'Wii' contains two thirds of the letters necessary to spell 'Win', it doesn't seem like this was a fair contest in the first place. Also, it was smaller, so more of them could be placed on shelves for consumers to pick up. Another unfair advantage.
Basically, it fought dirty. We shouldn't reward that kind of behaviour and I'd hope to see the device struck from the annals of history. Like a shamed athlete or a butcher found to be using human parts in their pies.
Basically, it fought dirty. We shouldn't reward that kind of behaviour and I'd hope to see the device struck from the annals of history. Like a shamed athlete or a butcher found to be using human parts in their pies.
I totally support this post. As a Wii aficionado I'm not disappointed by the games it did get overall, but the gen really was strong for everyone when you look across the total bandwidth of games. Next gen (now gen?) will be the real deciding factor, I'm not sure all 3 consoles will make it through alive...
Have you tried soylent green? Maybe it's quite delicious, Dave...
Sometimes you make me laugh.
Hyperactivity
Banned
It's not just the Wii's sales, or its influence.
Those sales would be meaningless without the huge amount of profit they brought in. Allow this to sink in; the Wii, at the beginning of its life, took $80 to manufacture. It started off at a $250 price point.
In terms of software, its software tie ratio was solid, and Nintendo had multiple multi-million sellers on it.
Even in terms of quality, there was a lot of really good games, that due to the "Wii is for casuals" and even "Nintendo consoles only have Nintendo games that are worth the price" mentality, commonly were ignored. The Wii had awesome 3rd part exclusives, and this mindset killed many of their chances, although some did sell well. See NMH, Red Steel 2, etc.
They may have failed to establish a brand, but even in terms of profitability, Nintendo hands down won. The PS3 and xbox360 might come close in sales in the end, but the 1st was being sold at a horrible loss and the 2nd bought exclusives and had the RROD disaster working against it.
I mean, if we were going by long term effects, you could even say the NES was a failure as its 3rd party restrictions were the reason Sega could come into the console market and steal such a large portion of it
But I have to agree with the sentiment that everyone won last gen, even Sony near the end. The small sales difference between the big 3 this gen is something that has only occurred with the SNES and Genesis, and even then, there were other random consoles and the GameGear doing bad.
Those sales would be meaningless without the huge amount of profit they brought in. Allow this to sink in; the Wii, at the beginning of its life, took $80 to manufacture. It started off at a $250 price point.
In terms of software, its software tie ratio was solid, and Nintendo had multiple multi-million sellers on it.
Even in terms of quality, there was a lot of really good games, that due to the "Wii is for casuals" and even "Nintendo consoles only have Nintendo games that are worth the price" mentality, commonly were ignored. The Wii had awesome 3rd part exclusives, and this mindset killed many of their chances, although some did sell well. See NMH, Red Steel 2, etc.
They may have failed to establish a brand, but even in terms of profitability, Nintendo hands down won. The PS3 and xbox360 might come close in sales in the end, but the 1st was being sold at a horrible loss and the 2nd bought exclusives and had the RROD disaster working against it.
I mean, if we were going by long term effects, you could even say the NES was a failure as its 3rd party restrictions were the reason Sega could come into the console market and steal such a large portion of it
But I have to agree with the sentiment that everyone won last gen, even Sony near the end. The small sales difference between the big 3 this gen is something that has only occurred with the SNES and Genesis, and even then, there were other random consoles and the GameGear doing bad.
It deserves it's place in history right next to Barry Bonds who 'won' the home run record by injecting his muscles with casual gamers and Wii Fit.
Cosmic Schwung
Member
For a moment I thought someone had bumped this old thread. Somehow this one seems to be moving even faster, probably because of that slightly more provocative title.
Doubt this is adding anything new to the discussion but I'll just say people think wii won last gen because they are looking at sales and overall profitability. Any other reasons are usually subjective.
Doubt this is adding anything new to the discussion but I'll just say people think wii won last gen because they are looking at sales and overall profitability. Any other reasons are usually subjective.
I love this post.
LiquidMetal14
hide your water-based mammals
Thanks for the correction. I definitely was being serious. That doesn't mean I think the WiiU doesn't have some great games but not even close enough to justify it as some winner.
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
You forgot "IMO."
And it's not like the Wii is the first platform with a lot of shovelware either. The ps2, DS and even ps1 had a lot of shovelware and that obviously doesn't make their libraries bad. For some reason it does for the Wii.
No one would argue that Wii sold the highest amount of units, but don't talk about winning. It had a couple of my favorite games last gen, Wii Sports and Mario Galaxy, but the hardware was a joke, developers, even Nintendo, didn't really want to make use of the controller even when Wii Remote Plus came out, the system died first and before it died not much was actually releasing for the system. People were begging to get Xenoblade released and Nintendo thought it was better to have nothing than that for a while. The system was a disaster and the reason i didn't buy a Wii U at launch, but it sold the most so winnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn.
This conversation hurts my brain.
How is it that we can say the NES, SNES, PS1, and PS2 won their generations but because of all the hate the Wii gets- we have to sit down and say "Now wait a minute- I'm not so sure about this."
We're not so sure about anything because all those systems that "won" had competition that also "won" because they all sold well. Every system had great games. But there was an obvious winner because everyone wanted or had one system each gen- and it happened to be the Wii this time around.
It doesn't matter how you feel about the console personally. If we have to have a winner each generation, the Wii won last and the PS4 looks to be winning the current.
How is it that we can say the NES, SNES, PS1, and PS2 won their generations but because of all the hate the Wii gets- we have to sit down and say "Now wait a minute- I'm not so sure about this."
We're not so sure about anything because all those systems that "won" had competition that also "won" because they all sold well. Every system had great games. But there was an obvious winner because everyone wanted or had one system each gen- and it happened to be the Wii this time around.
It doesn't matter how you feel about the console personally. If we have to have a winner each generation, the Wii won last and the PS4 looks to be winning the current.
Exactly, shovelware is indicative of a healthy install base. Which means the platform with the most shovelware wins. ...I think.
Hyperactivity
Banned
Shame on you Wii. Shame on you.
Wasn't even associated with Nintendo enough to be called the NINTENDO Wii.
Even in software tie ratios, I believe the Wii is a little behind the Xbox360 and ahead the PS3, although confirmation would be nice.
And then the majority of those games bought for it were Nintendo games, just adding more money.
The amount of goal shifting that occurs when it comes to the 7th generation "winner" is ridiculous. The Wii made the most money, and everyone else is past it and moving away from the generation in general.
EDIT:
Ok, I was wrong, but it was very close.
And the Wii isn't even a bad console. I mean, if you're on neogaf, it shouldn't be too hard to go out there and find all of the Wii Nintendo gems and hidden gems (seeing as that's how you can unfortunately divide the good games. And in this scenario, it was more of that annoying Nintendo consoles for Nintendo games mentality. Although some games actually did well, although not insane NSMBWii well or MKWii well. Came closest to TP sales well at maximum.)
Yes it sold the most so = Win.
Or should we change the definition of "win" to whatever sillymonkey321's subjective thoughts on stuff are?
We are talking Wii, not Wii U and we are talking about sales and profits, not how many great games it has.
I feel like I'm getting trolled right now.
Omegasquash
Member
It's subjective, that's why. Some folks liked the Wii more than anything else, and talk about the games, the numbers sold, etc. Others focus on what it didn't do, which is just as important, IMO.
I had fun with the Wii. Definitely a fun party system.
I had fun with the Wii. Definitely a fun party system.
Brawly Likes to Brawl
Member
Which is the exact same metric people have used for winners for every past console generation. And pretty much the only metric we can use since almost everything else is a matter of subjectivity on the side of the gamer.
Usually Right
Banned
The console war isn't real.
LiquidMetal14
hide your water-based mammals
I meant Wii. Early morning coffee mode here ><
Wii's the only system i can think of that sold the most yet is the worst i've owned. It was never an issue before so it was never argued. And as above, console wars is garbage and i don't really care, but Wii people were annoying in NPD threads when they'd celebrate console sales and evergreen titles selling every month while not really caring that nothing good was releasing each month.
captmcblack
Member
It sold the most hardware.
It generated the most profit.
The best-selling games of the gen, both first and third party, were on this machine.
It "won" by numbers, it "won" with great games, it just won (by whatever metric you want to choose for winning regarding stupid console schoolyard arguments).
It generated the most profit.
The best-selling games of the gen, both first and third party, were on this machine.
It "won" by numbers, it "won" with great games, it just won (by whatever metric you want to choose for winning regarding stupid console schoolyard arguments).
batman2million
Member
I remember when people were going crazy for the Wii, moms and dads would follow the UPS trucks to gamestop.
Here's to hoping we don't determine victory by units sold. That logic, in this industry mostly, doesn't work. All three systems last generation had amazing games, some more than others but to each their own.
Personally, I got a lot out of my Wii just with SSB: Brawl.
Here's to hoping we don't determine victory by units sold. That logic, in this industry mostly, doesn't work. All three systems last generation had amazing games, some more than others but to each their own.
Personally, I got a lot out of my Wii just with SSB: Brawl.
As of right now, the Wii has still won last gen. Infact, I would say its the hardware sales up to the release of all next gen consoles is the length of a previous gen. So Nintendo has won regardless. PS4/Xbone/WiiU are now out. The poll is closed. Nintendo won.
They arent winning this gen so you can relax and keep calm.
They arent winning this gen so you can relax and keep calm.
Usually Right
Banned
Not if your metric is "being a good console".
I mean I realise this is an "industry" forum but ultimately no consumer looked at Wii positively by the time it was done. If Wii won a war, it won it through questionable tactics that one could only hope the Geneva conventions could help prevent in the future.
But it never was subjective before. Before Wii nobody had problem with defining "console generations" and winners of said generations. Suddenly Wii comes out and half the console warriors started playing four-dimensional football with teleporting goalposts.
It was never an issue because "winner" and "your favorite" are not synonymous. The question is not "Do you like the Wii?"
It's cute that you say you don't really care. It's obvious to anyone reading that you care quite a bit.
You wouldn't be saying that if the Vita kicked you in the nads and stole your bag of chips.
Sorry lack of sleep!
Also I thought we all knew that Nintendo sucked at advertisements, figured I didn't need to repeat it and other obvious mistakes they do.
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
I can't tell what is farcical and what isn't anymore in this thread.
That isn't an objective metric. I thought the Wii was boring so I never owned one. But I thought the 360 was boring, too, and sold my console nearly as soon as I got it. What now? Am I a wrong, stupid doodoo head? There are people in this thread who have expressly stated that their favorite console last generation was the Wii. Are they wrong? By what measure?
Yes, the Wii was comparable to a crime against humanity. Clearly you're being objective here.
Brainiac 8
Member
It was the system that brought me back to Nintendo after they lost me with the N64.
I call it a win.
It is very real
But the battlefield is our bank accounts
The only way to win is not to play
I care for the reasons i listed in the post you quoted. I'm like the grinch who gets angry at the who's for being happy despite not having any presents. Wii had nothing releasing for months and yet Nintendo fans were singing, but my heart did not grow in size.
Being my favorite has little to do about it, i love the vita because of the screen/hardware, but I consider 3ds to be the definite winner for sales and a better game library.
Usually Right
Banned
The point is that you can look at things in terms of sales, in which case Wii "won". Or you can look at it as a consumer, in which case what won is based on your opinion. Personally I think all 3 consoles were pretty disappointing last gen. So it's like a race to see which disappointed me less. I understand from an industry discussion point of view, there's less subjectivity. Though Nintendo leaving themselves with nothing to build off does kind of undermine their war "victory".