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[WinterXL]

Done! Totally enjoyed "the Order: 1886." 8/10, would watch/play again. Caveat emptor, I also enjoyed the cinematics in MGS4, and Heavy Rain/Beyond Two Souls. Wouldn't want it all the time, but the occasional title like this is fun.

 

[sjack]

What Ready at Dawn have done is raise the bar, from a purely technical perspective, for videogame design, engineering and quality. The Order is a fucking technical marvel, and for that alone the game should have a place in video game history. The Order made nearly all other "next gen" games look like freshman year at Digipen.

 

[FranXico]

Clearly Sony did NOT pay for reviews to get a lower average for The Order, putting RAD in a weaker position when Sony wants to buy them. The reviewers were played like a fiddle by Shu.]

Honestly, sometimes I think that RAD wanted to be bought by Sony, and was counting on TO to do well critically to justify the purchase.

I doubt a sequel will happen unless SCE takes a risk and funds it. After the first title has been deemed mediocre by critics, and sales are impacted, I really doubt they would invest in a sequel.

 

[Betty]

What Ready at Dawn have done is raise the bar, from a purely technical perspective, for videogame design, engineering and quality. The Order is a fucking technical marvel, and for that alone the game should have a place in video game history. The Order made nearly all other "next gen" games look like freshman year at Digipen.

And just like that 'other' technical marvel Ryse, i'm sure it'll get the legacy it deserves.

 

[SatelliteMind]

Sad this one did not pan out as I had hoped. Hopefully they get down on the second try if there is one

 

[Bradach]

Just watched the GT review and I think I'll be picking this up down the road. RAD seem to have created an incredible world that I want to have a wander around.
The game lenght doesn't really bother me, at least I know I'll definately finish it!
Probably buy it a bit cheaper during summer.

 

[BouncyFrag]

As someone who usually sees the glass as half full, RaD could do some things in the short term to flesh out the game more such as adding higher difficulties, challenge maps, ng+, etc. In the long term they could offer a dlc expansion that addresses and alleviates some of the games problems similar to what Bioware did for Dragon Age 2's dlc. One of the worst things about Dragon Age 2 was having wave after wave of baddies falling out of thin air or climbing out of solid ground (I did have fun with those mobs tossing them about like rag dolls wielding force magic) and in the dlc Bioware removed this mechanic as well as addressing other issues as well. ND added a new difficulty mode to TLoU, so doing this is not without precedent. This would give RaD the opportunity to iron out some kinks as well as learn lessons they can incorporate into future games which I hope happens.

 

[Majmun]

I'm not interested in this game because it looks boring to me. But there are a lot of positive reviews out there.

But as usual, the negative reviews seem to affect us more.

 

[Neuro]

@Shining Sunshine "Miyamoto's ideals are archaic. Gaming has evolved past from just being fun. Current game developers are thinking of the total experience, and I love it."

Hahahaha...You got be trolling with this statement, Miyamoto San still knows his game much better than most in the industry...I'll take their games anyday than multiple iterations of Call of Duty...

 

[Withnail]

Honestly, sometimes I think that RAD wanted to be bought by Sony, and was counting on TO to do well critically to justify the purchase.

I doubt a sequel will happen unless SCE takes a risk and funds it. After the first title has been deemed mediocre by critics, and sales are impacted, I really doubt they would invest in a sequel.

Well there is literally no other way a sequel can happen and that was always the case.

As for RAD being acquired by Sony, Killzone (PS2) received a similar critical mauling and that didn't prevent Sony later acquiring Guerilla Games. The fact is that review scores are not the be-all and end-all, and there are many other considerations that would factor into a studio acquisition.

 

[clay_ghost]

What happened here?

I liked RAD psp games , hmm seems like i really have to wait for FF5 before i buy a PS4.

 

[AngryMoth]

I usually get fun out of entertainment. What's yours?

In fact, why don't I redirect you a synonym of "entertainment"?

Oh, look, what do we have here? Fun, play and game!

Well, well. Looks like Miyamoto isn't as "archaic" as you put it?

Well on this point I agree with him. You can be entertained by a dramatic or scary without necessarily having fun.

 

[Alej]

Well on this point I agree with him. You can be entertained by a dramatic or scary without necessarily having fun.

The whole point is "if you are entertained you are, indeed, having fun".

People trying to differentiate the two words are condescendingly trying to push their tastes above what the masses like.

 

[TGO]

Neither you nor the writer for The Verge make a good case for the game being "old school" though, perhaps it would help if you gave examples of games from the past which are similar. From the outside looking in, The Order is only "old school" if you started playing games when Sony entered the market.

The linear nature of the game is very PS2 era, even PS1 era structure of games in 3rd person genre it something I am fond of and probably why I like the old RE's over the new
I wouldn't say it's old school, but it's not how they make game's these day and it is reminiscent of that era of games, And Son I started playing games when they was black and white.

 

[Meccanical]

The linear nature of the game is very PS2 era,

By that logic it's very NES era too, because you can only go right in contra.

 

[gigantor21]

The whole point is "if you are entertained you are, indeed, having fun".

People trying to differentiate the two words are condescendingly trying to push their tastes above what the masses like.

Pretty much.

It is the height of shallow snobbery to put a wall between the two just to make one of them (and your own tastes) look better than the other. I can understand doing it to differentiate games that aren't "fun" in the tradition sense, but to say that those types of games are just inherently better all the time...really?

 

[Jito]

Having played through most of the game now (and not looking forward to the rest of the game), I've got to agree with all these 5/10 and just generally poor ratings. The game is pretty poor other than it's graphics, sound and atmosphere. Level design, enemy encounters and story pacing are all terrible.

I was most excited when this was announced that I'd fighting werewolves in interesting, Uncharted esque set pieces, but there's nothing of the sort, just gunning down bad dudes in corridors full of chest high walls and when you do fight werewolves it's just the same shit encounter repeated 3 times throughout the game.

Such a massive disappointment.

 

[TGO]

By that logic it's very NES era too, because you can only go right in contra.

by that logic? It's not logic it's how it is

 

[d00d3n]

As someone who rarely watches movies these days, and someone who usually has no patience with press button to win cinematic games, I am surprised how much I liked The Order in the end. A poster in the OT said that hardcore third-person shooter fans expecting an experience like Uncharted or Gears of War will probably be disappointed, while people expecting a cinematic experience like Beyond or Heavy Rain will probably get more out of the game. I tend to agree with that, but in my opinion the game has a broader appeal than those cinematic games.

The third-person shooter gameplay loop is very simplistic compared with other games in the genre due to restricted weapon choices, low enemy variety and level design emphasizing "shooting galleries" over "mini arenas". However, as a means to engage the player in a cinematic experience, the gameplay loop seems successful at doing just this. The game strikes a middle ground between third-person shooters and cinematic games, although heavily tilted towards the latter. If Beyond or Heavy Rain didn't engage you, The Order very well may.

The quality of the cinematic presentation is unlike anything I have seen before in a game. It is something about how the game obviously breaks new ground in real-time graphics and how this technical edge is used to showcase a visually striking and cohesive setting. Meanwhile, the main cast of characters is designed and voice acted distinctively and beautifully. The "plot" has some issues, especially when it is obviously cut short in the end, but the presentation, the characters and the setting keep you interested in the game.

From what I can see, the professional reviews have judged the game too harshly. It does not get credit as a cinematic game because the plot is too conventional and it does not get credit as a third-person shooter because the gameplay is too simplistic. However, a cinematic game does not need to have a complex plot to be a memorable experience. The Order does not have a plot of the same quality as say The Walking Dead (to name a cinematic game that was widely praised in professional reviews), but it was a better cinematic experience for me due to the superior cinematic presentation and the use of third person shooting gameplay to keep me engaged. It seems like the game may be a victim of an assembly line review process where a cinematic game with a conventional plot is discarded as "dysfunctional".

Personally, I can see The Order ending up on my GOTY list this year. I highly recommend it.

 

[Crossing Eden]

From what I can see, the professional reviews have judged the game too harshly. It does not get credit as a cinematic game because the plot is too conventional and it does not get credit as a third-person shooter because the gameplay is too simplistic. However, a cinematic game does not need to have a complex plot to be a memorable experience. The Order does not have a plot of the same quality as say The Walking Dead (to name a cinematic game that was widely praised in professional reviews), but it was a better cinematic experience for me due to the superior cinematic presentation and the use of third person shooting gameplay to keep me engaged. It seems like the game may be a victim of an assembly line review process where a cinematic game with a conventional plot is discarded as "dysfunctional".

Personally, I can see The Order ending up on my GOTY list this year. I highly recommend it.

The walking dead doesn't have nearly as many unexplained plot threads, it also has closure, and the characters most definitely to not have anywhere near as much depth, there are also plenty of legitimate reasons for the reviews, the short length being at the last of the list of issues, like the awful AI, the overly linear level design and lack of any kind of gameplay variety, the misleading advertising since we spend not even 5% of the fights fighting lycans, lack of any replay value, the awful instafail stealth where the guards can apparently easily overpower an ancient order of knights extremely easily until the story deems that it's not necessary anymore, the overabundance of cutscenes for every menial action, no way of tracking collectibles, no way to turn off tutorials with the game even somehow thinking that you forgot how to sprint at some points and teaching you the same mechanics over and over again, baffling design decisions like not being able to take cover while holding a lantern<---all of these are valid criticisms of the game. It's a long list of criticisms, and all of these are worse issues than the fact that the game is short.

 

[Three]

The whole point is "if you are entertained you are, indeed, having fun".

People trying to differentiate the two words are condescendingly trying to push their tastes above what the masses like.

Watching Body Shock or a documentary about concentration camps I consider entertainment but if somebody asked me how it was, the last word I would use to describe it is "fun".

Fun is lighthearted. It's from the word Funny (or rather the other way). Entertainment doesn't have to be.

 

[ShockingAlberto]

Hah! I think Miyamoto and Nintendo's games are boring now. "Fun" is no longer the only factor in a player's motivation to play a game.

I can't get through Nintendo games or anything similar without a strong narrative or an established goal to give me a reason to finish. Fun is not enough to make me want to play.

Miyamoto's ideals are archaic. Gaming has evolved past from just being fun. Current game developers are thinking of the total experience, and I love it.

 

[Z3M0G]

Wow they say "You and I aren't that different" twice in the game from two different people.

Jesus fuck.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=20B4Dvk_9cY

...i don't get it...

 

[BeeDog]

Posted my review in the official topic, but might as well share it here for the non-decided GAF'ers. One more opinion shouldn't hurt, I hope!

Just finished the game, so figure I can add some of my impressions. In short, it's an alright-to-good game let down by too many headscratchers.

Positives:

+ Best audiovisual experience so far by far. Barely anything to complain about, really. They nailed all the environments as well.
+ The core gameplay/gunplay is really fantastic. All weapons are fun to use, the controls are excellent with great deadzone/sensitivity, the feedback and ragdolls are top-notch and all is topped off with some excellent enemy damage modelling.
+ All the weapons are fun to use, especially the scientific weapons such as the thermite rifle.
+ Pretty much all the characters are good, especially Grayson. The strong voice acting certainly does wonders.
+ The cutscene direction is top-notch.

Negatives:

- The story goes absolutely nowhere, and there are too many dead-ends and unanswered questions which pissed me off. I don't mind game stories that are "in medias res", but I don't like it when many core questions are brushed off or left for sequels. While the final cutscene is badass, the game still manages to end with a whimper, not a bang. The characters, while well-acted and interesting, exist in a vacuum without any context as to why they behave as they do or what they have experienced.
- The balance between cutscenes/QTE's and actual gameplay is off; there are too many sections where control is taken away from the player when it shouldn't, and there are also too many sections where you're simply walking around without much happening, exploring dead-ends with nothing substantial etc.
- The lycan fights are complete bores; they simply act like dog enemies in other games, but with a short timeframe to QTE dodge them. (spoilers)

Spoiler

I didn't mind the elder QTE fights, but I didn't like the fact that the last fight was so similar to the previous one. On top of that, they also tease you with some badass Tesla weapon only for the game to revert back to a QTE.

- Following the previous point, while the game's core gameplay is great, the variation is lacking, especially when the universe should be able to allow for much more varying encounters. Additionally, the game restricts use of the more interesting weapons too much, mainly due to the low amount of combat sections in the game. (major spoilers)

Spoiler

Why the fuck didn't they incorporate the vampires at all? Sucks that you only burn them in their coffins.

- The game is completely content-starved, with no real reason to go back to it when finished aside from cleaning up trophies (which I've yet to do).
- The investigation aspect of the game is under-utilized and such a waste of opportunity to add in further gameplay elements (e.g. minor puzzles or proper investigation aspects).
- Too many minor and major design flaws that made me question what Ready at Dawn were thinking; no collectibles tracker, absurdly small subtitle font size, complete randomness to when you're allowed to sprint or not, no NG+'ish mode to allow you to experiment more with the combat (i.e. open up the use of the cooler weapons throughout), and so on.

I probably sound very negative, but it's mainly because the potential is there, but Ready at Dawn fucked them up and lost the opportunity to create one truly great game. If the game sells well and they get a second attempt, I truly hope they take all the criticism to heart and rectify the game's shortcomings in the sequel. Now that they have one hell of an engine ready, and tons of great assets, I pray that they can focus on refining the things that didn't work. Oh, and get a new story writer.

 

[phanphare]

...i don't get it...

cliches are generally frowned upon

 

[Gestault]

I cannot abide anyone denying the joy that Loco Roco brings even a hardened heart. Especially past the fifth level.

 

[Z3M0G]

cliches are generally frowned upon

This is a cliche? How else should it be written/used? Not at all?

 

[0ptimusPayne]

Just finished the game. Is it worth $60? depends on what you're looking for. I thoroughly enjoyed the game, and the acting, graphics, animations, and overall shooting were very well done. Im excited to see where the series heads next, and I know RAD will learn from the few flaws 1886 has. I would have to disagree with many of the reviews, and its not disgustingly bad like some people seem to see it as. It reminds me a lot of Uncharted 1, and thats a great thing. I can see them really going all out now, since the engine is finished and they can focus on other things for the sequel similar to the jump from UC1--->UC2.

The shooting in this game is so damn satisfying, its not even funny. Just give me MP in the sequel with the Dragoon Revolver and ill buy it day 1...

 

[phanphare]

This is a cliche? How else should it be written/used? Not at all?

without knowing the particular context I can't really say

 

[Toxi]

I think what happened is that reviewers finally caught on that people hated giving games bloated scores, but then overcorrected by giving this pretty good but flawed game scores that were far too harsh.

Or maybe they just didn't like the game.

What Ready at Dawn have done is raise the bar, from a purely technical perspective, for videogame design, engineering and quality. The Order is a fucking technical marvel, and for that alone the game should have a place in video game history. The Order made nearly all other "next gen" games look like freshman year at Digipen.

That's nice, now is it any fun to actually play?

This is a cliche? How else should it be written/used? Not at all?

It's a cliche. I love what Full Metal Alchemist had to say about it.

"It's funny. Every crook I meet wants to tell me how much I'm just like them."

That's not to say it can't be done well, but when The Order

Spoiler

does it twice and in the most predictable manner,

it's understandable why people find it silly.

 

[jim-jam bongs]

The linear nature of the game is very PS2 era, even PS1 era structure of games in 3rd person genre it something I am fond of and probably why I like the old RE's over the new
I wouldn't say it's old school, but it's not how they make game's these day and it is reminiscent of that era of games, And Son I started playing games when they was black and white.

You're still not making a particularly good case here, there are plenty of super linear 3rd-person games being released right now. The common comparison in this thread has been Max Payne 3, and it is actually quite similar in many other respects too. I'm not trying to give you a hard time, Dad, I just don't understand how The Order is a refreshing throwback to a brilliant time in gaming history.

edit: And another thing, classic Resident Evil games are the opposite of linear. You progress by exploring and backtracking to solve puzzles, the new Resident Evil games are actually more linear by a wide margin.

 

[Palocca]

That's nice, now is it any fun to actually play?

I had fun, so yes?

 

[d00d3n]

The walking dead doesn't have nearly as many unexplained plot threads, it also has closure, and the characters most definitely to not have anywhere near as much depth, there are also plenty of legitimate reasons for the reviews, the short length being at the last of the list of issues, like the awful AI, the overly linear level design and lack of any kind of gameplay variety, the misleading advertising since we spend not even 5% of the fights fighting lycans, lack of any replay value, the awful instafail stealth where the guards can apparently easily overpower an ancient order of knights extremely easily until the story deems that it's not necessary anymore, the overabundance of cutscenes for every menial action, no way of tracking collectibles, no way to turn off tutorials with the game even somehow thinking that you forgot how to sprint at some points and teaching you the same mechanics over and over again, baffling design decisions like not being able to take cover while holding a lantern<---all of these are valid criticisms of the game. It's a long list of criticisms, and all of these are worse issues than the fact that the game is short.

Well, the linearity, the relative lack of gameplay variety, the lack of replay value, the extensive use of cutscenes and the short length can all be traced back to the decision to make a particular type of cinematic game. I did not have as many issues with this as you did, I guess. The "awful AI" that you noticed mostly seems to be a reflection of the "shooting gallery" style level design (design decision). I agree with you regarding the stealth sections and the lantern sections, but they are a very minor part of the game. I fail to see how they can sour the whole experience for some people. Regarding the Lycan advertisements, I did not watch them, but it was the right decision to mostly cut Lycan encounters from the game considering how awful they were.

 

[EmptySpace]

one thing i wonder about the ign review...


should cover actually give you the impression that you are in cover?

this is one thing i have always thought about cover in third-person games. your character is in cover but your vision is not. i have always thought of that as a cheat.

i actually like that they do this in the order. they did it the way killzone 2 did where you have to peek in cover to be able to actually see as much as when you're not in cover.

 

[Toxi]

The linear nature of the game is very PS2 era, even PS1 era structure of games in 3rd person genre it something I am fond of and probably why I like the old RE's over the new
I wouldn't say it's old school, but it's not how they make game's these day and it is reminiscent of that era of games, And Son I started playing games when they was black and white.

Resident Evil took place in a single large area with tons of backtracking. How on Earth is the Order like that? If anything, it's closer to the new Resident Evils, especially Resident Evil 5 and 6. Not very retro at all.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

What Ready at Dawn have done is raise the bar, from a purely technical perspective, for videogame design, engineering and quality. The Order is a fucking technical marvel, and for that alone the game should have a place in video game history. The Order made nearly all other "next gen" games look like freshman year at Digipen.

They really did.

I've never seen a more visually consistent game. Other than a few minor graphical glitches (flickering, clipping) and a lack of character model reflections, it's just perfect. No fucking textures loading in front of your eyes or environmental object/LOD pop-in that just kills the experience. Also have to appreciate that the framerate is extremely consistent. No dips or tearing or anything of the like.

I do feel like the blur and other post processing effects are a little overdone, but that's the style they chose to go for and helps make it look like pre-rendered CG. I was also really impressed with the real time transformations of character models. Some very impressive stuff there that I've never seen in games before.

 

[Gestault]

i actually like that they do this in the order. they did it the way killzone 2 did where you have to peek in cover to be able to actually see as much as when you're not in cover.

I think the cover system in Killzone 2/3 was underrated. It has a lot in common with what they ended up with in Crysis, both of which were handled well. They didn't tailor the cover in the Order to that style though. This has the odd mix of not having visibility obscured, and also having the reticle visible in cover, but shifting when you stand up. There's also the occasional problem of aiming appear to have a clear path, but the shots hitting something in the foreground.

 

[Crossing Eden]

Well, the linearity, the relative lack of gameplay variety, the lack of replay value, the extensive use of cutscenes and the short length can all be traced back to the decision to make a particular type of cinematic game. I did not have as many issues with this as you did, I guess. The "awful AI" that you noticed mostly seems to be a reflection of the "shooting gallery" style level design (design decision). I agree with you regarding the stealth sections and the lantern sections, but they are a very minor part of the game. I fail to see how they can sour the whole experience for some people. Regarding the Lycan advertisements, I did not watch them, but it was the right decision to mostly cut Lycan encounters from the game considering how awful they were.

Linearity yes, but there are plenty of cinematic games that have much more gameplay variety than the order, and are longer, with less cutscenes yet still feeling more cinematic. And by awful, I mean that the AI is so simplistic and has no sense of self preservation for themselves or their comrades outside of scripted lines like "damn, shotgunner is down."

 

[MercuryLS]

What Ready at Dawn have done is raise the bar, from a purely technical perspective, for videogame design, engineering and quality. The Order is a fucking technical marvel, and for that alone the game should have a place in video game history. The Order made nearly all other "next gen" games look like freshman year at Digipen.

This is a hollow victory for RAD when the game itself sucks and is representative of everything wrong with modern game design.

 

[StudioTan]

Watching Body Shock or a documentary about concentration camps I consider entertainment but if somebody asked me how it was, the last word I would use to describe it is "fun".

Fun is lighthearted. It's from the word Funny (or rather the other way). Entertainment doesn't have to be.

You may find those kinds of things fascinating or engrossing but that's not entertainment. If you get entertainment out of those shows then you are having fun. Just finding something interesting enough to keep your attention is not entertainment.

 

[finalflame]

I'm glad to see a lot of positive impressions of the game in this thread. I honestly believe that, for what this game is, it seems to be a great experience. I will wait to pick it up when there's a PSN or bargain bin sale for < $20 though. Paying $60 for 3 hours of cutscenes and 3 hours of gameplay, many of which are button prompts, is just not my jam.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

This is a hollow victory for RAD when the game itself sucks and is representative of everything wrong with modern game design.

I'll agree with this, but I do hope whoever worked on this tech and art design gets another chance to work on a big budget game. They are amazingly talented.

 

[BokehKing]

The Order 1886 has impressive visuals, but nobody will talk about it the next few months. When better looking games come out, it will be nothing more than a litte footnote in video game history, see other good-looking-but-unimpressive-games like Aquanox and bunch of others.

What games are coming out that 'look' better? Certainly not Uncharted, visual wise

 

[Deleted member 17706]

What games are coming out that 'look' better? Certainly not Uncharted, visual wise

Maybe wait until Uncharted gets a little closer to launch before making that call?

 

[phanphare]

What games are coming out that 'look' better? Certainly not Uncharted, visual wise

well Uncharted hasn't actually released yet so you should probably wait until it does before jumping to conclusions

 

[KC Denton]

This is a cliche? How else should it be written/used? Not at all?

Probably best not used at all.

Spoiler

"I'm better than you because you're a genocidal maniac and I'm actually trying to save my kind"

would also be an improvement even though that's a different cliché.

 

[bananafactory]

I just finished the game, have to say while it's far from perfect it's hard to believe what some sites wrote about it.

I don't have as a big of a problem with the overall metascore as I do with what reviews said about it being unfun, but I supposed that's where the subjectivity comes in.

Maybe this game just doesn't appeal to the majority of gamers or critics, but I liked what I played.

 

[Beefy]

Anyone know how sales are going?

 

[James Scott]

Anyone know how sales are going?

It's way too soon to tell other than anecdotal evidence (which isn't worth much)
But i imagine it'll do well enough thanks mostly to Sony's marketing budget for it

 

[Colbert]

What was the maximum amount of comments in a thread?