PCPER discussion @ https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=Pze0QbfLpD8#t=1976
Apparently K12 is a much 'fatter' core compared to A57, given how AMD pack 2x K12 (14nm) vs 4x A57 (20nm) in the same SDP (God, I hate this metric).
(a cross-post from the other similar thread)
It's perfectly logical to me : )I think it's the same way as Nvidia Denver or Apple Cyclone. Bigger cores, customised but based on ARMv8.
It's interesting to note that AMD gave up on x86 in the ultra low power segment.
I'm wondering if we could see Amur in the next nintendo handheld.
It's perfectly logical to me : )
Can someone please explain me the benefits of building CPU's in smaler nm sizes? Thanks
Can someone please explain me the benefits of building CPU's in smaler nm sizes? Thanks
Lowers production cost and reduces power usage of the chip.
Putting it simply, smaller transistors means you can either pack more of them in the same area or the same amount of transistors take up less space. It also leads to lower power draw and/or higher performance.
We're slowly heading towards an age where the methods to shrink nodes become increasingly more expensive and harder to pull off. This is why companies who can't afford these new bleeding edge nodes are sticking to older ones; they're a lot cheaper even when your chips end up faster/smaller. At these small scales quantum mechanics are starting to become a problem too. Electrons are harder to contain to make clear on or off states (0 or 1). Seriously, transistors are becoming so small you can almost count the individual atoms.
In reality this stuff is extremely complicated and it even boggles my mind. If you, or anyone else, wants to read up a bit more about how these things get designed and produced, read this TechReport article.
As for Zen, if AMD can come close to mainstream platform Skylake (probably Cannonlake by then) at a good price, they did well in my book. Skylake was my original plan to consider upgrading, but I might as well just wait to see what Zen does before I retire my 2500k.
Everytime I see one of these charts from either AMD or Nvidia, I just say to myself - "don't buy....anything."
Its crazy. Its like they're advertising how out of date their tech is going to be before we even have a chance to buy it in the first place.
Some games are mandating 4 cores, and since the i3 has 4 threads that's a non-issue for it. Far Cry 4 and DA:I had no issues. Only the Pentium's were affected by that.
Source? I was under the impression that it would not be faked out by hyperthreading.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JxUPJdcChzE
They needed 4 threads, not 4 physical cores. So it can be 2 core 4 threads (i3) or 4 core 4 threads (i5).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JxUPJdcChzE
They needed 4 threads, not 4 physical cores. So it can be 2 core 4 threads (i3) or 4 core 4 threads (i5).
Source? I was under the impression that it would not be faked out by hyperthreading.
Now AMD is claiming these slides are faked.
We'll see on May 6th or whatever the date on the slide was.
That's a bummer...
Makes sense. I plan on replacing my 2500K next year and I would love a competitive market.I'm really hoping AMD bring their A game and learned from the mistakes on their current CPUs.Could just be PR control, nobody likes to have their big reveal stolen from under them.
On topic:
Please please please please have IPC that rivals sandy bridge, that is all I ask for amd...
It would save the cpu market for consumers...
Oh pretty please
The proper core talk and the 'high IPC gains' make me hopeful.
None of this is true if you play games
the fx cpus have the same ipc than the phenom II
I have a phenom II, a friend of mine has an fx 8350
We both bitch to eachother about the cpus being guttertrash for certain games
fx8350 friend gets 30-40 fps in dirty bomb with megastuttering, which is the same I get with my 100 euro 3 core phenom II from 2009.
Every game that puts most of the load on one core (still quite a lot of games) and that is cpu demanding will run like trash on these things.
Also in the low end market the pentium anniversary and the i3 beat the pants off the amd variants in the same price bracket
Only thing amd beats intel at is integrated gpu performance, both are still shit.
I think the devs checked the various HW surveys, saw a good enough installed base of 4-core/thread users, decided to use it as base spec.Does this have anything to do with the way console versions are designed? I remember reading a post about this somewhere a while ago. The person mentioned that some PC ports straight up don't work on anything that has less than four cores/threads because they're designed to run off of core 3 (core 0 and 1 being reserved for the OS). I don't know if that's the reason, but it would explain why recent games require four cores/threads. Obviously four cores will give you more performance if the game takes advantage of them, but that seems like such an oversight.
I don't know an awful lot about the software side of things, which is why I'm asking.
Makes sense. I plan on replacing my 2500K next year and I would love a competitive market. I'm really hoping AMD bring their A game and learned from the mistakes on their current CPUs.
I think you're a tad optimistic. Intel's current similar offerings run north of $300. AMD pulling that at that price would be a small revolution, and I'd personally buy a handful of those to upgrade all my home stations. Alas.So what does everyone think AMD have to deliver to become relevant to gamers and enthusiasts again?
For me it would be:
$125
4C/8T
Ivy Bridge level IPC
Unlocked multiplier and easy 4GHz+ clocks
$125
4C/8T
Ivy Bridge level IPC
Unlocked multiplier and easy 4GHz+ clocks
.
So what does that mean in terms of perceived fluidity? That could all be from one frame of stutter. It is even less clear with gsync/freesync, which is designed to smooth out uneven frametimes.What are these odd 'fps' metrics that are being thrown around? Are they rendering films or playing games?
Down to 10nm they can carry on with the existing FinFET tech. Beyond that come some exotic elements/alloys like Germanium and InGaAs offering high electron mobility. Then comes the Graphene hypothesis, Cthulhu rituals, etc.Holy crap
14 nm
We are getting close to the atomic limit here guys. Whats their next step afterwards?
So what does that mean in terms of perceived fluidity? That could all be from one frame of stutter. It is even less clear with gsync/freesync, which is designed to smooth out uneven frametimes.
If games like Ryse are representative of future game CPU performance then all you will need is 8 halfway decent cores.
Holy crap
14 nm
We are getting close to the atomic limit here guys. Whats their next step afterwards?
https://www.planet3dnow.de/cms/14846-angebliche-amd-folie-zeigt-erste-details-von-zen/Update 1. Mai 2015: Wir wurden von AMD mit der Bitte kontaktiert, die Folie zu entfernen. Laut AMD seien die darauf präsentierten Informationen völlig falsch und würden AMD falsch darstellen.
Oooooh. Sounds great to me. Huge IPC gains? CPU vs APU on desktop?Confirmed 40% IPC increase vs. Excavator.
Focus on FX CPUs first (transistors spent on cores not integrated graphics so a mainstream 8C/16T CPU looks likely) and APUs second. There's some real potential for serious competition now if AMD can comfortably hit mid 3ghz clocks at stock (and 4ghz+ overclocked).
http://www.anandtech.com/show/9231/amds-20162017-x86-roadmap-zen-is-in
Confirmed 40% IPC increase vs. Excavator.
Focus on FX CPUs first (transistors spent on cores not integrated graphics so a mainstream 8C/16T CPU looks likely) and APUs second. There's some real potential for serious competition now if AMD can comfortably hit mid 3ghz clocks at stock (and 4ghz+ overclocked).
http://www.anandtech.com/show/9231/amds-20162017-x86-roadmap-zen-is-in
That's a fucking huge jump. I would love it if AMD became a rational CPU choice again. Wonder where this would put them vs Intel. IB levels of IPC?
Could be above IB and close to Haswell. Excavator is 20% faster then piledriver, which puts it on par with Nehalem. If Zen is 40% faster then excavator/Nehalem that's around Haswell-e single core performance.
That makes me almost giddy. Haswell like IPC would put it in spitting range of Skylake.
Bumped for news.
It seems Samsung and Global Foundries will both produce AMD's Arctic Islands family, including the flagship GPU; Greenland, on their joint 14nm FinFET LPP process, starting in Q2 2016.
http://hexus.net/business/news/components/89078-samsung-produce-greenland-gpus-amd-starting-q2-2016/
http://english.etnews.com/20151222200002
http://wccftech.com/amd-greenland-14nm-production-q2-2016/
http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer...reportedly-start-making-chips-for-amd-in-2016
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-samsung-elec-amd-chips-idUSKBN0U500P20151222
Seems like this should provide a pretty sizable leap in perf/watt.
Is it just me or do AMD chips always look pretty good on paper every year a thread like this rolls around yet always just ends up getting it's ass tore up in real world benchmarks?
I admit that I don't really pay too much attention to CPU benchmarks. I do video and audio rendering/encoding and have always just grabbed the fastest unlocked non extreme i7 at the time and just assumed that it would obliterate anything AMD had to offer me.
Is there any indication of this changing with this new leaked stuff or is it basically just going to continue to be the i7 cleaning house and the "Fast" AMD chips trading blows with the middle of the road i5?
I just want AMD to give me a chip that doesn't have any focus on gaming but rather something like a powerful multithreading Xeon 6 or 8 core equivalent that I can run a couple of virtual servers with or do CPU intense rendering with that doesn't cost an arm and a leg like the consumer octa core Intels.
For the most part the FX series was just this.I just want AMD to give me a chip that doesn't have any focus on gaming but rather something like a powerful multithreading Xeon 6 or 8 core equivalent that I can run a couple of virtual servers with or do CPU intense rendering with that doesn't cost an arm and a leg like the consumer octa core Intels.
Please let it be inside Nintendo NX.