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It's going to be a new era of America after the 8th

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I think its important to remember this election cycle has been pretty aggressive and stirred up some nasty shit, but essentially we are looking at the next President being fairly similar on a lot of issues to our current one. Obama and Clinton's presidencies are likely not to be hugely different unless something crazy comes up.

There wasn't as much vitriol stirred up, but the change from the Bush administration to everything Obama was running on was a TOTAL change of pace. That was something much more likely to cause a "major shakeup" than going from Obama to Clinton. And at the end of the day we really didn't see crazy huge changes due to the checks and balances system (though obviously Obama was much better.)

I honestly think 6 months after Clinton is in, you may see some complaining on Facebook from Rednecks but anyone thinking this will be some crazy turmoil, I highly highly doubt it.
 

TAJ

Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.
You know a few months after Obama got into office the economy went into freefall, the banking crisis hit, the housing market collapsed, jobs vanished, etc.

Your timeline is way off.
 

sphagnum

Banned
I really hate this term "alt-right". These are just Internet lurking Anarchist wankers who want to burn the system to the ground and have everyone else pick up the pieces

It's a legitimate term to describe people who belong to a certain subculture on the far right that disagree with movement conservatism fundamentally. They are not liberals (in the classical sense) like your traditional GOP members. They're fascists and followers of neoractionary ideologies like the Dark Enlightenment.
 

Rentahamster

Rodent Whores
All I can really do at this point is just take a mental note of everyone that has supported Trump, and then simply shun them to the best of my ability.

While that might feel good to you, I would advise that forming a bubble around yourself is not the best way to enrich your own mental development. It also cuts you off from an important goal: being able to convince them of the rightness of your point of view.

As an example, if I had done that in my own personal life, there would be a lot more people running around in the world who don't believe in climate change, think vaccinations are bad, think being gay is morally wrong, think we need religion to be moral, think GMOs are inherently bad for you, etc.
 
If Clinton wins AND Dems take the Senate, we're going to be treated to two whole years of a moderately functional democracy. Then midterms happen, the GOP takes it back, and we're back to where we are now. Rinse and fucking repeat in six years.

But at least we're able to appoint a liberal Supreme Court, and long term progress is made at that level. For awhile, at least.
 
While that might feel good to you, I would advise that forming a bubble around yourself is not the best way to enrich your own mental development. It also cuts you off from an important goal: being able to convince them of the rightness of your point of view.
.

Good head on your shoulders. Its one of the reasons I have never, and will never use the block button on NeoGaf regardless of how much I disagree with someone. Reading opinions, even those I disagree with, will keep me informed to other points of views and keep my own mental processing and thinking sharp.
 

Klocker

Member
WTF ever happened to common decency.

People are moving from their narcissistic trolling on the internet to mainstream.
 

nomis

Member
WTF ever happened to common decency.

People are moving from their narcissistic trolling on the internet to mainstream.

Yeah somehow the level of trolling and contempt that was previously reserved for internet anonymity made the dimensional transition to IRL this year
 

Malfunky

Member
I think you're right to say tat we're entering a new era and I think that means we're in a heap of shit.

Clinton is not winning on the policy front. At this point in the election, policy has become background noise. What has been catching headlines and spreading through popular consciousness is spectacle and pageantry. Clinton is winning because her opponent is a clown.

We're entering a new era of proto-fascism and the Democratic party's favored candidate was a person who is immensely disliked by massive segments of the electorate. The Republican party already contained the Trump sentiment, and it'll persist without him. So what happens when someone serious comes along? What happens when a horribly right wing populist comes along with a respectable face?
 

Machina

Banned
I think you're right to say tat we're entering a new era and I think that means we're in a heap of shit.

Clinton is not winning on the policy front. At this point in the election, policy has become background noise. What has been catching headlines and spreading through popular consciousness is spectacle and pageantry. Clinton is winning because her opponent is a clown.

We're entering a new era of proto-fascism and the Democratic party's favored candidate was a person who is immensely disliked by massive segments of the electorate. The Republican party already contained the Trump sentiment, and it'll persist without him. So what happens when someone serious comes along? What happens when a horribly right wing populist comes along with a respectable face?

They've already told you.

hhht1.png
 

depths20XX

Member
All I can really do at this point is just take a mental note of everyone that has supported Trump, and then simply shun them to the best of my ability. Their actions have consequences, and I'm not going to just sit here and excuse it away as "Oh, Trump supporters have feelings too!"

What a terrible way to exist as a person. If I adopted your views I would disown my parents, several co-workers, and friends. You've adopted a dogmatic ideology akin to a radical religious person. Maybe try to communicate with people and understand that not everyone is a piece of shit for not agreeing with your political beliefs.
 

Monocle

Member
While that might feel good to you, I would advise that forming a bubble around yourself is not the best way to enrich your own mental development. It also cuts you off from an important goal: being able to convince them of the rightness of your point of view.

As an example, if I had done that in my own personal life, there would be a lot more people running around in the world who don't believe in climate change, think vaccinations are bad, think being gay is morally wrong, think we need religion to be moral, think GMOs are inherently bad for you, etc.
I wish I was capable of this, but I just can't get through. My brain locks up when I'm confronted with people's misinformed opinions and incurious attitudes.
 

nomis

Member
So what happens when someone serious comes along? What happens when a horribly right wing populist comes along with a respectable face?

Hopefully the non millennial non college educated white male demographic continues it's inexorable decline to obscurity by then
 

LotusHD

Banned
While that might feel good to you, I would advise that forming a bubble around yourself is not the best way to enrich your own mental development. It also cuts you off from an important goal: being able to convince them of the rightness of your point of view.

As an example, if I had done that in my own personal life, there would be a lot more people running around in the world who don't believe in climate change, think vaccinations are bad, think being gay is morally wrong, think we need religion to be moral, think GMOs are inherently bad for you, etc.

It's not good for my mental health to continue engaging with people like that, especially after all he's put us through. I've done it before multiple times, never turns out well. It's whatever. They've had around a year to see what a vile man Trump is; I can't be bothered anymore. All I know is that I generally don't want anything to do with a person if they admit they supported him. I'm not the type to get violent or go out of my way to call them out on it. They just simply can expect for me to never warm up to them in any capacity.

I'm ordinarily the type of person that loves to argue, that feels that I have to make people understand that I'm right and they're wrong (Only in scenarios when I truly know I am 100% right anyways) But you know, I had to learn the hard way that sometimes it's actually just not worth the effort. Someone else can pick up the slack, barring some magical far-fetched scenario where a Trump supporter just comes up to me legitimately wanting me to explain why Trump is a bad person.
 

Illucio

Banned
I dunno, slavery was pretty bad.
But yes, in modern times, I'm actually appalled that someone so blatantly stupid and evil actually got this close to becoming our president.

I wouldn't go as far to dehumanize Trump and call him evil. Nor would I call Hitler evil, I think the scarier picture we can tell our kids that these men were people and not monsters, but people who were capable of doing tremendous acts of evil.
 

Veelk

Banned
As far as Hillary's popularity goes, I think she will gain some steam during her presidency. That's how her career has basically worked. Her rating skyrocket the moment she actually does her job. It was like that with her as a senator. It was like that with her as secretary as state. Everyone likes the job she does, they just hate that she wants to do it.

Plus, while they are similar on policy, I still feel that Hillary has a skillset that Obama doesn't have. She can actually get people to work with her across the aisle. Granted, the divide has never been THIS great. But still, this is something she might manage to do better than Obama.

I can't say how well she'll be liked once she dares to run for re-election, but I'm optimistic about her actual presidency.
 
Nope.

It's going to be the same old America... Maybe slightly wiser and more weary of the world...but still the same old slow to the take America.
 

LotusHD

Banned
What a terrible way to exist as a person. If I adopted your views I would disown my parents, several co-workers, and friends. You've adopted a dogmatic ideology akin to a radical religious person. Maybe try to communicate with people and understand that not everyone is a piece of shit for not agreeing with your political beliefs.

It's not a matter of political beliefs though; just simply don't want to engage with people that to this day consider Trump to be worthy of the presidency. I can certainly co-exist with a Republican, or any other political ideology. You do you. I have several friends, acquaintances, family members, etc. that have different views, mindsets, and so on that differ from my own.
 

Almighty

Member
This man is correct. The padlock is off the cage now, and the rabid wolves are at the door. The sociopath with a nice smile, greased back haircut and expensive suit has his window to the white house.

He's out there somewhere. The "sane" Trump.

I think that window is pretty much an illusion. Being a racist bigot might be a path to winning the Republican nomination, but if the 8th turns out like most are hoping, it pretty much means winning the white house will be impossible.

If Hilary wins on the 8th it will be minorities that put her in the white house and just like Trump voters they are not going away either.
 
As far as Hillary's popularity goes, I think she will gain some steam during her presidency. That's how her career has basically worked. Her rating skyrocket the moment she actually does her job. It was like that with her as a senator. It was like that with her as secretary as state. Everyone likes the job she does, they just hate that she wants to do it.

Plus, while they are similar on policy, I still feel that Hillary has a skillset that Obama doesn't have. She can actually get people to work with her across the aisle. Granted, the divide has never been THIS great. But still, this is something she might manage to do better than Obama.

I can't say how well she'll be liked once she dares to run for re-election, but I'm optimistic about her actual presidency.
plus she is more progressive than Obama on many issues like healthcare, education, childcare, pay equality, paid leave.
 
I really hate this term "alt-right". These are just Internet lurking Anarchist wankers who want to burn the system to the ground and have everyone else pick up the pieces

they represent far too much of the voting electorate to just be Internet lurkers now. It's completely fractures the party. it wouldn't have done that if it was just fringe.
 
plus she is more progressive than Obama on many issues like healthcare, education, childcare, pay equality, paid leave.

On the flip side though, she seems more militarily aggressive than Obama was (at least when he was running for office)

By and large they are pretty similar.
 
I think it'll be the same thing we got for 8 years, GOP obstruction to the max. Better than having the GOP be in full control though.
 

Veelk

Banned
On the flip side though, she seems more militarily aggressive than Obama was (at least when he was running for office)

By and large they are pretty similar.

And she's pretty similar to Bernie Sanders, but try telling that to the Bernie or Busters.

I feel like democrats have different focus', but are mostly similar to one another.
 
And she's pretty similar to Bernie Sanders, but try telling that to the Bernie or Busters.

I feel like democrats have different focus', but are mostly similar to one another.

I'll try to find one, but they are really hard to find seeing as their numbers are so few they nearly don't exist.
 

Cronox

Banned
Speaking of "new eras," I was reminded of this quote I was made aware of recently on Dan Carlin's podcast Common Sense (Ep 110, 32 minutes in). Since the book it's from, Roosevelt to Reagan: A Reporter's Encounters with Nine Presidents isn't online in text form, I'll have to use the relevant transcript from the show:

Umm, let me read you a little of this Hedley Donovan, account from 1984. The reason why is because as you well know, what's wonderful about history is it gives us some context, right? It shows us that some of the problems we're dealing with today might in fact be a lot older than we think and it might be a lot more common and long lasting a situation than we think. Which is both, comforting in some ways, and discomforting in others. Donovan is writing this - and as I said he knew 9 Presidents personally, so he wrote a book about em, you know, sort of “my time with 9 Presidents” - and at the end he sort of wrote a summary of his thoughts on the whole issue and what not. So this is um, a section he wrote on the job specifications of the oval office, you know, based on the people that he'd known. He's writing this right after Ronald Reagan defeated former vice president Walter Mondale to get his second term in office, so bear in mind that's what um, the events in his recent history are, and he writes back in 1984:

“In 1984, as in 1976 and 1980, a good many Americans thought neither Presidential candidate was really equipped for the job. Few of the 37,000,000 people who voted for Walter Mondale, outside from his immediate family, did so with deep enthusiasm. His votes came from the hardest of hardcore democrats and/or people offended or frightened by Reagan. Among Reagan's 53,000,000 voters, there were plenty of fervent admirers, but also critics who thought he was merely the lesser evil. And among the other 83,000,000 voting age Americans who didn't bother with the election it must be assumed that a fair number didn't think either candidate was worth the trouble.”

He writes, QUOTE:

“How did the machinery for identifying potential Presidents, nominating candidates, and choosing winners come to be so seriously out of sync with what the electorate itself see's as the modern requirements of the office? From this literate, democratic society of some 236,000,000 people, compare the political we are now producing, with the leadership of the 13 colonies in the the late 18th century. For all its familiarity, the point is still a painful one. From 3,000,000 people living on the edge of a wilderness: Washington, Jefferson, Hamilton, Madison, Franklin, the Adams'”

END QUOTE

He continues talking about the Presidents he's known and he considers Franklin D Roosevelt to be the first of the modern Presidents as he calls them, and he writes QUOTE

“The modern Presidency begins with Franklin Roosevelt. And 9 men as of December 1984, have held the job. In the 28 years from 1933 to 1961, we had one great President, FDR. One very Good President, Dwight Eisenhower, and by my ranking one good, to very good President Harry Truman. None of the next 4 presidents could be put in any of those categories.”

He then goes down the list of presidents and then writes QUOTE

“It is not an inspiring roll call. William Luchtenburg of the University of North Carolina, author of a number of notable studies of Franklin D Roosevelt and the New Deal suggested in 1983 that the country might simply be in a fallow period of political thought.”

Now he's quoting professor Luchtenburg QUOTE

“ We cannot expect our presidents to rise very far above the level of thought in the political culture” END QUOTE

Needless to say, the quality of our candidates continues to be a problem.
 

x3sphere

Member
Biggest issue is with the Republican party itself. Trump is just a symptom of what it's turned into. I'm not sure if it will get better from here, I'd have hope if more Republican leaders denounced Trump but all things considered very few have, and for the ones that did they didn't do it soon enough.
 
Biggest issue is with the Republican party itself. Trump is just a symptom of what it's turned into. I'm not sure if it will get better from here, I'd have hope if more Republican leaders denounced Trump but all things considered very few have, and for the ones that did they didn't do it soon enough.

Honestly I'm somewhat out of the loop, did McCain call out his bullshit? He's one of the Republicans I actually respect
 

TwiztidElf

Member
These two paragraphs are dangerous ways of thinking. I know plenty of Trump supporters, and they aren't inherently bad people. To perpetuate that is akin to saying blacks naturally commit crime, or Asian people are naturally smarter. It's "othering," through and through. While yes, there are people that support Trump (or even Hillary) for reasons that are blindingly stupid, it's an expression of their opinions, their view points. It would be better for us to try and understand why someone takes an opposing view to us, rather than to challenge their views validity through vain comments and snarky remarks.

Edit: Remember, "Don't assume bad intentions over neglect and misunderstanding."
This is the most sensible thing I've read about anything to do with this election. Caring, tolerance and respect for fellow human beings, even if they're wrong. Kudos. I vote for more of that.
 

Forkball

Member
WTF ever happened to common decency.

People are moving from their narcissistic trolling on the internet to mainstream.
Remember when you saw an internet meme, or heard the word "meme" used in public for the first time and thought "Ugh"?

It's that times a million.
 

ModBot

Not a mod, just a bot.
Like gaming side, let's hold off on reaction threads until the thing actually happens.
 
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