The engine hit 2 million people not that long ago, so it's more if you expect widespread indie support.
Seems indie games mostly use Unity or GameMaker, but I may be totally wrong about that.
The engine hit 2 million people not that long ago, so it's more if you expect widespread indie support.
It's more like making a PC version, except with only two graphics presets (low and high) and not having to account for a myriad of different setups. Definitely easier than making an iOS or Android port.
I knew I screwed up.
Everytime I try to be helpful I end up making it worse lol.
So usually in game. ini files 1 is low settings, 2 is medium, 3 is high and 4 is ultra.
And for AA and AF "1" is usually 2x AA or AF, "2" is 4x and so on and so forth.
Looks like docked mode will be 1080p medium settings on PC and handheld will be 720p low settings on PC.
This is a rough example. Just adds perspective.
The thing to keep in mind is that UE4 went free to download in early 2015, so we're only now getting into the giant wave of them.Seems indie games mostly use Unity or GameMaker, but I may be totally wrong about that.
I think nonnative resolutions on a mobile screen are noticeable. See vita. And this screen is even bigger than that one. It's native 720p or nonnative subhd upscale?
That's the general issue. moving to a full PC like scenario. Switch also doesn't have the leeway in its portable mode to just have the weakest mode upscale like PS4 to Pro, so having significant graphical changes like this essentially means far more of an effort needed on the devs part to change assets themselves between the same title. Something devs are very unwilling to do with the current nature of iterative hardware outside of actual remasters.
I liked it better under the assumption that the portable mode was the standard for development and all that was necessary was res boosts.
Wonder why they used Wolf instead of NX as a codename.
I think nonnative resolutions on a mobile screen are noticeable. See vita. And this screen is even bigger than that one. It's native 720p or nonnative subhd upscale?
The thing to keep in mind is that UE4 went free to download in early 2014, so we're only now getting into the giant wave of them.
I can post up a listing if you like when I get to my computer.
edit: math was off
I don't really expect many mulitplatform UE4 games on this thing anyway.
Even if that was good for screens I don't know that it'd be any good as example video since scaling down visual settings on the same hardware will jack up the frame rate.Would love to get a video of a game running typical PS4 presets + these switch docked presets + these switch handheld presets. I know it will vary from game to game, but it would be cool to get an idea of what it might be like.
Yeah, I really don't see Nintendo in a position to enforce this.Enduin said:Yeah I wonder if Nintendo can require devs to meet 720p on handheld mode. Probably not a great policy to have when you're trying to entice devs to make games for your platform when you have a history of poor dev support. But man it would be nice knowing devs are at least somewhat obligated and locked into delivering certain performance thresholds and minimums.
I can see there's a bunch of upcoming UE4 titles on the wikipedia page. We'll see if Switch gets some of them...
DQ XI, FF7 Remake, KH 3, Tekken 7, and Marvel v.s. Capcom Infinite would all seem to make sense.
Maybe throw in Ace Combat 7 & Dead Island 2.
Actually, if a dev targets handheld mode specifically, they do have a leeway to go from 720p to 1080p without changing any other graphics setting. What these settings show is that to go from console to handheld mode you need to more than simple drop the resolution. The other way around is a much easier road.
The difference between handheld mode and console mode is similar to the difference between the PS4 and PS4 Pro, the difference being that the Switch can change modes on the fly.
Even if that was good for screens I don't know that it'd be any good as example video since scaling down visual settings on the same hardware will jack up the frame rate.
Yeah, I really don't see Nintendo in a position to enforce this.
S-E: Hey, we were thinking about bringing FF VII remake to Switch.
N: Great!
S-E: To make it work we might only be able to reach 720p in docked mode.
N: Get lost.
But the disparity between the two modes means in many cases that such huge sacrifices will be neccesary.
Again, i think first party devs will just code for handheld mode and increase internal res as necceary. But third parties will try and get cute with their ambition and cause problems for handheld mode, which i don't think Nintendo should allow.
The 3DS to New 3DS issues in Xenoblade allowing exclsive games to even run despite being the same hardware and the cutbacks needed for Hyrule warriors doesn't have me trust third parties to do the right thing
I don't think they'll have a problem with 720p in docked mode. It's sub-720p in handheld mode that can be a problem.
Eh, sub 720p wouldn't be so bad on a small screen, would it?
Eh, sub 720p wouldn't be so bad on a small screen, would it?
I guess paradoxically the smaller the resolution you're working with the more noticable dropping below that resolution becomes.
That's the general issue. moving to a full PC like scenario. Switch also doesn't have the leeway in its portable mode to just have the weakest mode upscale like PS4 to Pro, so having significant graphical changes like this essentially means far more of an effort needed on the devs part to change assets themselves between the same title. Something devs are very unwilling to do with the current nature of iterative hardware outside of actual remasters.
I liked it better under the assumption that the portable mode was the standard for development and all that was necessary was res boosts.
Satoru Iwata said:Still, I am not sure if the form factor (the size and configuration of the hardware) will be integrated. In contrast, the number of form factors might increase. Currently, we can only provide two form factors because if we had three or four different architectures, we would face serious shortages of software on every platform. To cite a specific case, Apple is able to release smart devices with various form factors one after another because there is one way of programming adopted by all platforms. Apple has a common platform called iOS. Another example is Android. Though there are various models, Android does not face software shortages because there is one common way of programming on the Android platform that works with various models. The point is, Nintendo platforms should be like those two examples.
Yeah good luck running those games on the Switch hardware.
Yeah good luck running those games on the Switch hardware.
Some people are way more sensitive to that than others, but it always looks terrible in screenshots (see sub-native Vita games).
That is true. I was testing UE4 on a Shield Tablet (1920x1200) and it took me a while to notice the game was actually running at 720p.
Maybe because they had previously announced to the whole world their next platform was codenamed NX? I assume that stuff didn't suddenly end up in UE4 in October.
Eh, sub 720p wouldn't be so bad on a small screen, would it?
I can see there's a bunch of upcoming UE4 titles on the wikipedia page. We'll see if Switch gets some of them...
It doesn't really add perspective. Or maybe it does, but it's not a perspective that really helps people understand the implications (or, more apt in this case, lack thereof).
I think hardcastlemccormick's post on the first page does a better job at providing perspective.
Could anyone render some demo at highest settings and then render it at the Switch settings?
Its a Youtube video bound to get many many views
Pretty please....
I think what I should have asked is 540p on a 720p screen can't possibly look worse than the 3DS screen, can it?
Tekken 6 was ported to PSP and 3DS so I wouldn't doubt the Tekken team. You're probably right about the others though.
Even if that was good for screens I don't know that it'd be any good as example video since scaling down visual settings on the same hardware will jack up the frame rate.
Yeah, I really don't see Nintendo in a position to enforce this.
S-E: Hey, we were thinking about bringing FF VII remake to Switch.
N: Great!
S-E: To make it work we might only be able to reach 720p in docked mode.
N: Get lost.
I don't think they'll have a problem with 720p in docked mode. It's sub-720p in handheld mode that can be a problem.
Looking at them, I can tell a few things already:
- The Switch seems to be using the full blown UE4 deferred renderer path, not the "mobile" renderer
- UE4 defaults to use "faster FXAA" in handheld and "FXAA" in console mode.
Scaling up 50% and scaling right back down seems like it would be pretty bad on top of wasteful. Trying something similar with a bit of SNES,M3d10n said:There would be an 720p->1080p->720p upscale-dowscale process going on, but I just tested it on a 5.5" 720p phone and it's not really noticeable (actually, it makes the jaggies a bit less pronounced).
You'd be surprised
Had a look at the Switch docked profile against the UE4 reference guide and I've listed the settings I could find, with each setting and bolded the one Switch uses.
I'm no software developer so hopefully I haven't mixed anything up
Low = 0
Medium = 1
High = 2
Epic = 3
Shadow Quality:-
sg.ShadowQuality 0
r.LightFunctionQuality=0
r.ShadowQuality=0
r.Shadow.CSM.MaxCascades=1
r.Shadow.MaxResolution=512
r.Shadow.RadiusThreshold=0.06
r.Shadow.DistanceScale=0.6
r.Shadow.CSM.TransitionScale=0
sg.ShadowQuality 1
r.LightFunctionQuality=1
r.ShadowQuality=2
r.Shadow.CSM.MaxCascades=1
r.Shadow.MaxResolution=1024
r.Shadow.RadiusThreshold=0.05
r.Shadow.DistanceScale=0.7
r.Shadow.CSM.TransitionScale=0.25
sg.ShadowQuality 2
r.LightFunctionQuality=1
r.ShadowQuality=5
r.Shadow.CSM.MaxCascades=2
r.Shadow.MaxResolution=1024
r.Shadow.RadiusThreshold=0.04
r.Shadow.DistanceScale=0.85
r.Shadow.CSM.TransitionScale=0.8
sg.ShadowQuality 3
r.LightFunctionQuality=1
r.ShadowQuality=5
r.Shadow.CSM.MaxCascades=4
r.Shadow.MaxResolution=1024
r.Shadow.RadiusThreshold=0.03
r.Shadow.DistanceScale=1.0
r.Shadow.CSM.TransitionScale=1.0
Post Processing Quality:-
sg.PostProcessQuality 0
r.MotionBlurQuality=0
r.BlurGBuffer=0
r.AmbientOcclusionLevels=0
r.AmbientOcclusionRadiusScale=1.7
r.DepthOfFieldQuality=0
r.RenderTargetPoolMin=300
r.LensFlareQuality=0
r.SceneColorFringeQuality=0
r.EyeAdaptationQuality=0
r.BloomQuality=4
r.FastBlurThreshold=0
r.Upscale.Quality=1
r.Tonemapper.GrainQuantization=0
sg.PostProcessQuality 1
r.MotionBlurQuality=3
r.BlurGBuffer=0
r.AmbientOcclusionLevels=1
r.AmbientOcclusionRadiusScale=1.7
r.DepthOfFieldQuality=1
r.RenderTargetPoolMin=350
r.LensFlareQuality=0
r.SceneColorFringeQuality=0
r.EyeAdaptationQuality=0
r.BloomQuality=4
r.FastBlurThreshold=2
r.Upscale.Quality=2
r.Tonemapper.GrainQuantization=0
sg.PostProcessQuality 2
r.MotionBlurQuality=3
r.BlurGBuffer=-1
r.AmbientOcclusionLevels=2
r.AmbientOcclusionRadiusScale=1.5
r.DepthOfFieldQuality=2
r.RenderTargetPoolMin=400
r.LensFlareQuality=2
r.SceneColorFringeQuality=1
r.EyeAdaptationQuality=2
r.BloomQuality=5
r.FastBlurThreshold=3
r.Upscale.Quality=2
r.Tonemapper.GrainQuantization=1
sg.PostProcessQuality 3
r.MotionBlurQuality=4
r.BlurGBuffer=-1
r.AmbientOcclusionLevels=3
r.AmbientOcclusionRadiusScale=1.0
r.DepthOfFieldQuality=2
r.RenderTargetPoolMin=400
r.LensFlareQuality=2
r.SceneColorFringeQuality=1
r.EyeAdaptationQuality=2
r.BloomQuality=5
r.FastBlurThreshold=7
r.Upscale.Quality=3
r.Tonemapper.GrainQuantization=1
Texture Quality:-
sg.TextureQuality 0
r.Streaming.MipBias=2.5
r.MaxAnisotropy=0
r.Streaming.PoolSize=200
sg.TextureQuality 1
r.Streaming.MipBias=1
r.MaxAnisotropy=2
r.Streaming.PoolSize=400
sg.TextureQuality 2
r.Streaming.MipBias=0
r.MaxAnisotropy=4
r.Streaming.PoolSize=700
sg.TextureQuality 3
r.Streaming.MipBias=0
r.MaxAnisotropy=8
r.Streaming.PoolSize=1000
Effects Quality
sg.EffectsQuality 0
r.TranslucencyLightingVolumeDim=24
r.RefractionQuality=0
r.SSR=0
r.SceneColorFormat=3
r.DetailMode=0
r.TranslucencyVolumeBlur=0
r.MaterialQualityLevel=0
sg.EffectsQuality 1
r.TranslucencyLightingVolumeDim=32
r.RefractionQuality=0
r.SSR=0
r.SceneColorFormat=3
r.DetailMode=1
r.TranslucencyVolumeBlur=0
r.MaterialQualityLevel=1
sg.EffectsQuality 2
r.TranslucencyLightingVolumeDim=48
r.RefractionQuality=2
r.SSR=0
r.SceneColorFormat=3
r.DetailMode=1
r.TranslucencyVolumeBlur=1
r.MaterialQualityLevel=1
sg.EffectsQuality 3
r.TranslucencyLightingVolumeDim=64
r.RefractionQuality=2
r.SSR=1
r.SceneColorFormat=4
r.DetailMode=2
r.TranslucencyVolumeBlur=1
r.MaterialQualityLevel=1
Are we assuming 1080p for docked when ps4 barely gets there and X1 still has a few games at 720P. Maybe I missed it but the settings don't look like they mention a resolution just a ratio.
Scaling up 50% and scaling right back down seems like it would be pretty bad on top of wasteful. Trying something similar with a bit of SNES,
though it would differ based on how the scaling is done.
Even if that was good for screens I don't know that it'd be any good as example video since scaling down visual settings on the same hardware will jack up the frame rate.
Thanks for this. So does Switch default to the "high" grouping for each category in both docked and undocked modes, and the only difference when going undocked is the switch (ha...ha) to fast FXAA?
[SwitchHandheld DeviceProfile]
DeviceType=Switch
BaseProfileName=Switch
+CVars=sg.ViewDistanceQuality=1
+CVars=sg.AntiAliasingQuality=1
+CVars=sg.ShadowQuality=1
+CVars=sg.PostProcessQuality=1
+CVars=sg.TextureQuality=1
+CVars=sg.EffectsQuality=1
+CVars=r.ScreenPercentage=66
Do you know something we dont?
It's 720p.
Actually, the need to use the UE4 screenPercentage setting makes me think the actual framebuffer is always 1080p, even in handheld mode (this would make the transition between console and handheld modes easier for devs). What UE4 does is simply reduce it's internal rendering resolution from 100% (1080p) to 66% (720p).
There would be an 720p->1080p->720p upscale-dowscale process going on, but I just tested it on a 5.5" 720p phone and it's not really noticeable (actually, it makes the jaggies a bit less pronounced).
Actually, if a dev targets handheld mode specifically, they do have a leeway to go from 720p to 1080p without changing any other graphics setting. What these settings show is that to go from console to handheld mode you need to more than simple drop the resolution. The other way around is a much easier road.
The difference between handheld mode and console mode is similar to the difference between the PS4 and PS4 Pro, the difference being that the Switch can change modes on the fly.
Tekken 6 was ported to PSP and 3DS so I wouldn't doubt the Tekken team. You're probably right about the others though.
I think the main possibilities I would be looking at would be the relatively straightforward, singleplayer indie titles (especialy less horror focused ones) that might scrounge up a low five digit number like:
- Abzu
- What Remains of Edith Finch
- Obduction
- Bloodstained
- Shattered
- We Happy Few
- Submerged
- Adr1ft
- Sea of Solitude
- Little Nightmares
- You could go on for a while...
Then there's also a lot of developers who switched off of Unity and GameMaker that might be good fits for a Nintendo system. Heart Machine (Hyper Light Drifter) is making their next game in Unreal Engine 4 for example.
I certainly agree that it's good. I disagree on the "news" partI think people expecting every UE4 game to run at high settings are in for a bad surprise, but the fact that the console supports the full version should still be good news. I also can see why base settings not being low (0) can sound somewhat encouraging, even if it doesn't necessarily mean anything.
Thanks for this. So does Switch default to the "high" grouping for each category in both docked and undocked modes, and the only difference when going undocked is the switch (ha...ha) to fast FXAA?
Wonder why they used Wolf instead of NX as a codename.