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XBOX Scorpio: DX12 Built Directly Into GPU
- Thread starter Space_nut
- Start date
So everything is still saucy?
The Hamburglar
Banned
so the sauce turned out to be burnt after all? Unforgivable.
Metalingus5150
Member
Wouldn't Scorpio's Command Processor additional capability be due to it being polaris?
I posted those slides a couple pages back. They mentioned a little more than that.
We don't know. It could be Polaris or they did some further changes from Polaris. No one knows
Yes while PS4 ,Xbox One & some older AMD GPUs can be updated to also have HWS
"The HWS (Hardware Workgroup/Wavefront Schedulers) are essentially ACE pipelines that are configured without dispatch controllers. Their job is to offload the CPU by handling the scheduling of user/driver queues on the available hardware queue slots. They are microcode-programmable processors that can implement a variety of scheduling policies. We used them to implement the Quick Response Queue and CU Reservation features in Polaris, and we were able to port those changes to third-generation GCN products with driver updates."
Colbert
Banned
I never looked into the speaker notes. And even if I would have done that I never would have assumed the order of magnitude that is behind that statement.
Chobel
Member
The secret sauce part II
FunkyDealer
Banned
Joke post?
SeeNoWeevil
Member
If this thing is as efficient as they say it is, Nvidia are going to have to come up with some better £/perf to dissuade PC gamers from jumping ship, just like people did with the original Xbox. I'd happily jump ship if I thought for a minute we'd see 60fps across the board (not going to happen, obviously).
The secret sauce went out the window with the decision to recycle the ps4 pro GPU. The only secret sauce would been Vega and its TBR. It's a super charged pro. I be shocked if it has anything thing extra over the pro. I'll probably still get one but very disappointing using such old technology.
platina
Member
What? No....
Unable to make a thread
Major Nelson Podcast is up with Albert Penello Scorpio spec talk
https://majornelson.com/podcast/596-project-scorpio-update-with-albert-penello/
Major Nelson Podcast is up with Albert Penello Scorpio spec talk
https://majornelson.com/podcast/596-project-scorpio-update-with-albert-penello/
MisterXDTV
Member
This is just pure gold....
Yesterday DX12 into GPU was the "killer customization" of Scorpio
Today, we find out this thing was already in Xbox One/One S
Yesterday DX12 into GPU was the "killer customization" of Scorpio
Today, we find out this thing was already in Xbox One/One S
This is just pure gold....
Yesterday DX12 into GPU was the "killer customization" of Scorpio
Today, we find out this thing was already in Xbox One/One S
Except it's not. XB1 has a older very limited version compared to Polaris. Now how MS did it for Scorpio remains to be seen. New articles diving deeper will explain
MisterXDTV
Member
Yeah, right I heard this before, you know....
LukasTaves
Member
Yesterday they did say all custom processors in xbone were back into Scorpio but improved.This is just pure gold....
Yesterday DX12 into GPU was the "killer customization" of Scorpio
Today, we find out this thing was already in Xbox One/One S
And even if xbone already had it, they did say the Dx12 Scorpio one has more capability than what was on xbone.
The Salt Life
Banned
I'm listening now and waiting for them to slip up and use the real name by mistake. It's a good listen so far.
MisterXDTV
Member
Let's say you are right, how DX12 helped Xbox One games so far??? And why would it change in the future?
Lmao
Xbox One didn't have native dx12 features
dr_rus
Member
So this is basically just whatever evolution GCN got between GCN2 and GCN4/5 being used by Scorpio's API to its advantage. Basically nothing unique in h/w.
LukasTaves
Member
According to Ms with Dx12 games saw a 50% reduction in CPU time on xbone. It's right there in the article.
And according to themselves, on Scorpio this pretty much frees the CPU from the task. That info hasn't changed, just that it's not new but rather an improvement of what they had on xbone.
Dictator93
Member
If it ends up being that, than well... that is not very interesting at all. Does not make it worse than it is of course... but hardware customisations are fun to read about at least.
MisterXDTV
Member
I'm no expert but I find it very hard to trust them on these things, maybe I'm wrong, I know...
Head.spawn
Junior Member
So the basic gist is that this is pretty run of the mill, unless it's a DX12 game and even then its potentially (depending on the game) up to 50% more efficient?
Unless there's more to it than that we probably shouldn't be expecting much of a difference in the majority of games from the sound of it.
Unless there's more to it than that we probably shouldn't be expecting much of a difference in the majority of games from the sound of it.
Yer seems to need to be a dx12 game, I imagine there's only handful of dx12 games on XB1 and they are held back by the weaker bandwidth and graphics card, hopefully we'll see the benefit with Scorpio assuming devs use dx12 which they may not do if developing for PS4 and Xbox as well?
Nostremitus
Member
I think you're right, I mixed the 480's memory unlock with the 460's stream processor unlock. Most of the launch 4GB 480's could be flashed with the 8GB BIOS and they had the extra RAM on them, it had just been disabled.
longdi
Banned
Grade A fluff by the masters of hype. Im kinda disappointed DF didn't do enough digging about the specs. instead just reposting what MS tells them.
Remember how MS tried to secretise the 940M as some custom special sauce..every website at that moment were in overdrive mode talking about the 'discrete gpu'../rolleyes
Remember how MS tried to secretise the 940M as some custom special sauce..every website at that moment were in overdrive mode talking about the 'discrete gpu'../rolleyes
GankzyMcfly
Member
lol did Bill kill your dog or something?...
In Major Nelsons podcast the impression was given that they were uncertain as to what DF would say regarding the Scorpio. In-fact they liken it to waiting on a review for a game.
https://majornelson.com/podcast/596-project-scorpio-update-with-albert-penello/
Doesn't fit the narrative you've created unfortunately...but if you have some evidence to back up the shit you appear to have pulled from your ass, that would be appreciated.
wait. what? big if true! Where did you get that from? Would like to know more about that.
amstradcpc
Member
No.PS4 Pro GPU has Vega blocks, the scheduler and the double rate FP16 shaders.Plus the bespoke id buffer.
Oh you...
In 'cpu render time', which is an important specific. Or to be more specific again, cpu draw call overhead.
Nebulous in all this is what typical draw call cpu usage was like on XB1, at least after dx12 became available. If that was still substantial there might be something to talk about here. If it was already low or easily 'hidden' alongside other threads, we could be inflating something that's in the realm of micro-optimisation.
edit - Or, indeed, in the realm of future possible (micro-)optimisation. By their latest comment it sounds like it's something they're looking into for the future.
amstradcpc
Member
That or the journalist didnt get a clue about what he was told,and then he should have been more cautious,and not make such grandilocuent claims.
Hmm grandiloquent, thanks for adding new word to my vocabulary.
AirPowerFTW
Member
Lol, Penello is still allowed to talk about upcoming systems??
I would have thought all his pre-XBO release hyperbole would have been an instant gag-order this time around. Remember this chestnut before release?:
"People DO understand that Microsoft has some of the smartest graphics programmers IN THE WORLD. We CREATED DirectX, the standard APIs that everyone programs against. So while people laude Sony for their HW skills, do you really think we dont know how to build a system optimized for maximizing graphics for programmers? Seriously? There is no way were giving up a 30%+ advantage to Sony."
Tarin02543
Member
everybody seems to put a smokescreen in front of us by saying their hardware is "deeply" customized, but then it turns out it couldn't be more generic.
See the Switch.
See the Switch.
MisterX?
Your name is familiar to me...
longdi
Banned
What i meant was that DF could've done with more investigative journalism. Right now their whole piece reads like a PR reprint and not more questions were asked.
geordiemp
Member
The draw call time - you can read earlier posts about how on Ps4 it takes up a few percent of 1 core (variable) on many games and is 'not a concern', Also XB1 already has it...Have you noticed games running faster on Xb1 ?
If you think its going to release the Jaguar beast and improve frame rates over Xb1S and Ps4, then no IMO.
props on MS clarifying the mis-understanding though.
Popsickles
Member
So when MS say DX12 implementation is 50 percent more efficient, than what exactly DX11 ? Because it has not done the standard XBone much. I am sure Sony could throw around such numbers about their driver layers but it's meaningless Pr speak
longdi
Banned
How is this like a game review? How does DF know what to say about Scorpio hardware without MS input?
Oh yeah that's what Major Nelson told us in a podcast... Right.
ShadowRunner
Member
I thought they said they saved 50% on CPU Rendering time not overall CPU usage. If for example 20% cpu is used for graphics rendering related tasks and the rest general game code and AI etc then they are saving 10% overall CPU time. How much CPU time is trypically used for rendering tasks in an average game?