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[TheFLYINGManga_Ka]

I posted this in the Wii U thread, but thought I make a topic out of it. Seeing pictures of the Wii U tablet makes me wonder if Nintendo is not only doing something different with home consoles but also experimenting for a 3DS' successor.

Having a Vita, it kind of feels like a tablet with buttons + two analog sticks. As for the 3DS, I realize that other than playing my collection of old DS games, the bottom touch screen really isn't needed anymore.

I think Nintendo's next handheld will be a high-res tablet with buttons. Knowing Nintendo it'll probably be behind the current tech, but by that time I'm sure it'll still be powerful maybe more powerful than the Vita. I think it's a no-brainer that this is the direction Nintendo will be going. Although I'm worried about backwards compatibility with 3DS games, I just don't see Nintendo making another dual screen handheld for their next one.

Also, I think it'll happen much sooner than we think. I don't think the 3DS will have the same life cycle as the DS had.

 

[mandiller]

That sounds super portable.

 

[whalleywhat]

I don't think the 3DS will have the same life cycle as the DS had.

Clearly.

 

[Log4Girlz]

Will fit right into my pockets.

 

[GhostTrick]

I'd like a rotative screen. You know, like this:

You could have games that use the big screen, or games that use a double screen scheme. Also, it would be backward compatible with 3DS and DS.

 

[Thoraxes]

I think stylus input on Nintendo handhelds is here to stay.

Whether or not that means a second screen, I have no idea, but honestly the advantages the second screen brings is still really nice.

Nice enough to the point that we've all adapted to it really. It's been fantastic for tons of games from moving huds and maps to having gameplay span both screens.

 

[jump_button]

Will fit right into my pockets.

dont think anyone care about that any more

 

[guek]

No. It goes totally contrary to nintendo portable philosophy which is centered around catered to japanese audiences. The 3DS successor will be designed around being as portable as possible. just like all of nintendo's handhelds before it. It'll probably feature something like haptic feedback and some other bizarre additions.

Now the Wii U successor, I could see that being a high powered tablet that's streamable to the TV, but that also runs the risk of cutting into their portable market so maybe not.

 

[Medalion]

The last thing Nintendo needs to do is keep making products that are too reminiscent as the other that confuses customers

 

[jonno394]

The 3DS will be printing money for a long time to come.....

 

[Jocchan]

Also, I think it'll happen much sooner than we think. I don't think the 3DS will have the same life cycle as the DS had.

Out of curiosity, why would that happen?

 

[Foffy]

I think it'll happen much sooner than we think. I don't think the 3DS will have the same life cycle as the DS had.

Why is this? The 3DS is beating the records the DS made in its first year. Or does the weak launch still make you feel the whole thing is ruined?

 

[zoukka]

Console developers are wiser than trying to even remotely step into the ring with the ipad, mark my words. They can't even begin to compete with iOS usability and content.

Differentiating is the only way for handhelds to progress.

 

[Mael]

Why is this? The 3DS is beating the records the DS made in its first year. Or does the weak launch still make you feel the whole thing is ruined?

The DS didn't explode out of the gate, actually it was a rather slow start.
3DS beating it is at this point is certainly expected.
Unless you meant DSl and I don't think that 3DS > DSl for their 1rst year.

 

[jakershaker]

Console developers are wiser than trying to even remotely step into the ring with the ipad, mark my words. They can't even begin to compete with iOS usability and content.

Differentiating is the only way for handhelds to progress.

At least they have games and control schemes that isn't complete shit?

 

[Sapphire Dreams]

Too soon to judge son.

 

[zoukka]

At least they have games and control schemes that isn't complete shit?

I have no idea what you mean by this? Current handhelds or the proposed pseudo tablet?

 

[Mael]

I have no idea what you mean by this? Current handhelds or the proposed pseudo tablet?

IDK, if you ask me he means arcarde boards and pcs...

 

[zoukka]

IDK, if you ask me he means arcarde boards and pcs...

I was thinking wooden chess pieces myself.

 

[JosephManderley]

Like it or not, the 3DS is going to be around (albeit with probably 1-2 revisions) for at least another 4-5 years - Maybe longer.

Who knows what the market will look like then?

 

[slidewinder]

Apple should just add some dpads and buttons and CRUSH NINTENDO FOREVER.

 

[IrishNinja]

dont think anyone care about that any more

things brings up the central point i have with arguments of this sort, though: if we throw portability out the window (apple markets ipads and imacs, but the saes of the former eat into the latter, don't they? GAF/etc keeps telling me tablets are eating PC's and laptops), we're leaning towards the "nintendo will be the first to merge console/handheld into a hybrid", an argument which seems to bear merit based on a) nintendo's focus on japanese sales (although i think iwata is clearly looking worldwide as well), and the growing market for portable devices and b) diminishing console sales. however, the best counter argument ive seen here on GAF was pretty simple: assuming WU does good #'s (let's say not quite wii numbers, but better than the competition), why sell 1 product where you can sell 2?

i get that business is about targeting venues with room for growth, but even with its current slump, the wii put up very respectable #'s overall, certainly great compared to its competition (and their costs). id have to see even a nintedo console's sales fall the fuck off to buy into this scenario.

perhaps im reaidng too much into the OP. ritualistically, i'm downing whiskey with a yakuza title, as all great men should.

Apple should just add some dpads and buttons and CRUSH NINTENDO FOREVER.

if only the market had room for the offerings of both corporations, and then some.
if only.

Out of curiosity, why would that happen?

because pachter said nintendo was the new sega and sega had a long-standing tradition of pulling the plug on hardware while it was still selling, or you know, nanomachines

 

[Oddduck]

dont think anyone care about that any more

I agree.

Personally, I think the portable gaming device market is going to disappear unless you're a smartphone, and Nintendo will merge the home console market and the portable market into one device. You can plug in the tablet controller to your television, and then take the tablet controller with you portably.

 

[Mael]

Apple should just add some dpads and buttons and CRUSH NINTENDO FOREVER.

Hey you're right!
Less competition is AWESOME!
I, too, hate having choice.

 

[SmokyDave]

Hey you're right!
Less competition is AWESOME!
I, too, hate having choice.

Well, it seems like more competition is really upsetting people around here. Perhaps everything should stay exactly as it is, forever and ever. Someone resurrect Sega.

 

[IrishNinja]

I agree.

Personally, I think the portable gaming device market is going to disappear unless you're a smartphone, and Nintendo will merge the home console market and the portable market into one device. You can plug in the tablet controller to your television, and then take the tablet controller with you portably.

addressing my last post:
a) how can you/others see this with 3DS currently breaking sales records
b) at what point do you foresee this merge given the fact nintendo can clearly sell both a console and a handheld and have little incentive to kill one of their very sold revenue streams

Well, it seems like more competition is really upsetting people around here. Perhaps everything should stay exactly as it is, forever and ever. Someone resurrect Sega.

you know dave, i was just about to echo my point that the market has room for these varying models, but then you went and made that last sentence that, sarcastically or not, i'm contractually obligated to agree with.

 

[Mael]

Well, it seems like more competition is really upsetting people around here. Perhaps everything should stay exactly as it is, forever and ever. Someone resurrect Sega.

They're morons if they have a problem with free market, really.
I'm also for resurrecting Sega.

As a recent owner of a new smartphone (and you can thank Free mobile for that), that is on Android if you must know, I can tell that there's no way I'm ever going to play the same way on my psp or gb/gba/ds/3ds.
I still need games like Tactics Ogre but I'm fairly confident that stuffs like puzzle bobble will never be purchased again.
And publishers made a really good job of making me not care anymore about the situation of the gaming market anymore.

 

[Log4Girlz]

I suspect the next handheld will be a sort of slider with buttons, circle sliders and a touch pad on the slide out portion and a large, high res (possibly 3D) screen. Game can focus on just touch control and you never have to slide the additional controls out or you can whip them out in more intensive games.

 

[Oddduck]

addressing my last post:
a) how can you/others see this with 3DS currently breaking sales records
b) at what point do you foresee this merge given the fact nintendo can clearly sell both a console and a handheld and have little incentive to kill one of their very sold revenue streams

I don't think Nintendo would do it in the near future. Not with the 3DS breaking sales records. But I don't see things being sunshine and rainbows for dedicated gaming handhelds in the future. I see things getting gloomier in the future for Sony and Nintendo handhelds.

And I think Nintendo will adapt to this by creating a device that is both portable and can connect to your HD television to play games at home. I could see a merge like this 20 years from now. The handheld after 3DS will be Nintendo's last handheld.

Nintendo has no incentive to kill off one of their revenue streams. You're right. But that's not Nintendo's decision. It's the decision of whether consumers want to keep shelling out money for a Nintendo handheld when smartphones become more and more advanced with better graphics technology for gaming over the next 10 years.

 

[DrWong]

Nintendo has no incentive to kill off one of their revenue streams. You're right. But that's not Nintendo's decision. It's the decision of whether consumers want to keep shelling out money for a Nintendo handheld when smartphones become more and more advanced with better graphics technology for gaming over the next 10 years.

It sound like the same logic used to say a few month ago that 3DS was doomed. And look now... Nothing new here.

 

[Mael]

It sound like the same logic used to say a few month ago that 3DS was doomed. And look now... Nothing new here.

That doesn't make it wrong, actually it's quite the contrary.
It showed that the customers were willing to part with their money for the device.

 

[kami_sama]

I agree.

Personally, I think the portable gaming device market is going to disappear unless you're a smartphone, and Nintendo will merge the home console market and the portable market into one device. You can plug in the tablet controller to your television, and then take the tablet controller with you portably.

Then, they will cannibalize their own market. Think about all the games that are coming out for the 3ds and add to it a lot of games more. The system will become overpopulated and only Nintendo's own franchises will come out on top of all the games, 3rd party support will be minimum.

And also, if they do it, they won't sell as many systems, decreasing their profit.

 

[IrishNinja]

And I think Nintendo will adapt to this by creating a device that is both portable and can connect to your HD television to play games at home. I could see a merge like this 20 years from now. The handheld after 3DS will be Nintendo's last handheld.

man, i feel uncomfortable enough calling things a year down the line - on that kind've timeline, yeah, what we've got going right now feels like that's inevitable. It strikes me a safe money bet - i'd be okay with going in on something like that.

the devil's advocate, of course, is the sort've PS9 kinda argument - there's prolly points in the 90s or so when VR, or hyper-realistic single player experiences, etc felt inevitable too. i know it seems really weird to say it from where we are now, but...hypothetically, what if apple/etc hit a cap, as far as ios (and likewise with android) gaming potential? right now, it doesnt cost them much to address the service, and they've both got seemingly infinite room for growth - but let's say dedicated handhelds die out, and the specs are there for phones/tablets etc to eat that market, but battery life, lack of buttons, and likewise factors missing point to the need for something more specialized later? grabbing at straws here, granted, but since we're kinda extrapolating, i guess my point is: from here, i'd agree with you, sure. but a 2032 prediction in 2012 feels overall about as safe as predicting where we are now from 1992: i don't think i can name a single source that called anything close to what we ended up with..unless you stretch say Sushi-X saying "one day, gameboy will be in COLOR"! far enough, haha.

 

[Gravijah]

neogeo x is going to resurrect the decaying handheld gaming scene. gonna be tight.

 

[blu]

Apple should just add some dpads and buttons and CRUSH NINTENDO FOREVER.

Ignoring the sarcasm, I think that even if apple did that, they'd have about as much chance at crushing <insert-handheld-console-vendor> as PC vendors had at crushing the home consoles over the past decades. There's a tad more to dedicated gaming platforms than tactile control interfaces.

 

[Kafel]

What about those screens you can bend?

Only one screen, the tablet/portable stays as big at the 3DS when closed.

 

[IrishNinja]

What about those screens you can bend?

Only one screen, the tablet/portable stays as big at the 3DS when closed.

wait...can you post an example? i don't think i've seen one of those.

 

[Oddduck]

man, i feel uncomfortable enough calling things a year down the line - on that kind've timeline, yeah, what we've got going right now feels like that's inevitable. It strikes me a safe money bet - i'd be okay with going in on something like that.

the devil's advocate, of course, is the sort've PS9 kinda argument - there's prolly points in the 90s or so when VR, or hyper-realistic single player experiences, etc felt inevitable too. i know it seems really weird to say it from where we are now, but...hypothetically, what if apple/etc hit a cap, as far as ios (and likewise with android) gaming potential? right now, it doesnt cost them much to address the service, and they've both got seemingly infinite room for growth - but let's say dedicated handhelds die out, and the specs are there for phones/tablets etc to eat that market, but battery life, lack of buttons, and likewise factors missing point to the need for something more specialized later? grabbing at straws here, granted, but since we're kinda extrapolating, i guess my point is: from here, i'd agree with you, sure. but a 2032 prediction in 2012 feels overall about as safe as predicting where we are now from 1992: i don't think i can name a single source that called anything close to what we ended up with..unless you stretch say Sushi-X saying "one day, gameboy will be in COLOR"! far enough, haha.

Yeah I know predicting things that far ahead seems ridiculous.

My only question about Nintendo handhelds is this: Will it ever get to a point where Nintendo franchises aren't enough to keep a Nintendo handheld safe from failure? Will it ever get to a point where consumers demand more from portable gaming machines?

The general consensus is "If we throw Mario, Zelda, and Pokemon on a Nintendo handheld, then it will print money." Can we assume that this strategy will continue to work years from now? I mean GameCube had tons of Nintendo franchises too, and it landed in 3rd place.

The only thing holding back portables right now is battery life. If there is one thing that will limit a portable device's performance, it will probably be battery life.

So yeah, predicting things that far ahead is weird. But here are the 2 main things to think about for future Nintendo handhelds.

1) Can Nintendo continue to keep their franchises popular in the next 10-20 years? I hear people already saying their getting bored of Mario, Zelda, and Pokemon. Will Nintendo franchises ALWAYS be enough to sell a Nintendo handheld? Nintendo's biggest fans are growing up with families and kids. Will the new generations of gamers be accepting to Nintendo franchises like kids who were born in the 80's? Or is the new generation of gamers going to be a bunch of Call of Duty kids?

2) Will it ever get to a point where there isn't a strong enough battery to charge super powerful portable gadgets in the future? The smaller a gadget is, the more limited you are on what type of battery it can use. That's why a tablet might come in more handy for more powerful graphics.

 

[iamaustrian]

it bothers the hell out of me that it is always(or at least that is what most ppl come up with) about graphix and price.
fuck that. buttonless devices can't compete at all with "real" handhelds. gameplaywise I mean and that's all I care for.
also the day I have to replace my Nintendo AAA games (Mario Land 3D etc) with shitty 5$ "appstore" games(I know that not all are bad; puzzlers i.e.) to play them on a touchscreen-only device is the day I quit gaming.

again: I enjoy a quick session on smartphones and co but they are a completly difference expierence and by no means comparable with "real"(I hate that term, sorry)games on "real" handhelds.
I also have no problem to lay down 40$/€ for a great portable game.

/bitter old man

 

[DrWong]

That doesn't make it wrong, actually it's quite the contrary.
It showed that the customers were willing to part with their money for the device.

Sure but that doesn't make it right regarding sales datas. My point was: future of Nintendo handeld is not only related to power. What if Nintendo come with a new disruptive feature? I don't know, an holographic user interface or something else ? I just wanted to highlight that there's nothing new in this logic.

 

[nincompoop]

Ignoring the sarcasm, I think that even if apple did that, they'd have about as much chance at crushing <insert-handheld-console-vendor> as PC vendors had at crushing the home consoles over the past decades. There's a tad more to dedicated gaming platforms than tactile control interfaces.

Maybe they wouldn't crush Nintendo, but I don't see why apple doesn't release a gaming device with buttons. There are lots of gamers like me who are holding out on app store gaming until the games can be played with halfway decent controls.

 

[Foffy]

The general consensus is "If we throw Mario, Zelda, and Pokemon on a Nintendo handheld, then it will print money." Can we assume that this strategy will continue to work years from now? I mean GameCube had tons of Nintendo franchises too, and it landed in 3rd place.

The only thing that matters to Nintendo or any game company is if they can make money. Despite the fact Nintendo was in last with the GameCube, they didn't bleed any money. That's worked for Nintendo until the 3DS.

 

[m.i.s.]

Nintendo's next handheld will be a high-res tablet with buttons.

Handhelds are Nintendo's bread and butter. It, along with pokemon and merchandising, arguably kept the company afloat during the fallow GCN years. I don't really see Nintendo tampering with a market in which it has seen an unbroken record of dominance and, in particular, the vanquishing of Sony with it's PSP challenger.

If anything, I could see Nintendo developing a self contained tablet (ie no separate console) in the future with HDMI out for TV connectivity if the tablet concept with physical controls takes off. In that sense, I do see the Wii U as a sort of experiment and an evolutionary step to a full self contained gaming tablet at some point in the future. But I would see this theoretical tablet gaming device co-existing with Nintendo's existing handheld market.

 

[IrishNinja]

Maybe they wouldn't crush Nintendo, but I don't see why apple doesn't release a gaming device with buttons. There are lots of gamers like me who are holding out on app store gaming until the games can be played with halfway decent controls.

reasons why apple can't/won't design a device with buttons right now, according to random shit i read on GAF & half-drunk IrishNinja:

1) ergonomics - especially given the multi-use nature of the device, # of potential consumers who won't use them/find it cumbersome - don't make any sense.
if you wanna debate an off-shoot model/variation with them (gamer edition), then you're splitting the potential customer base for devs, and not in favor of the larger #. even the prospect of making games for both platforms begs for tacked-on touch-screen schemes and defeats the purpose of minimizing risk via the greatest current strength of the platform: low dev costs/highest possible clientele = minimized risk.

2) apple's making a killing by staying out of the gaming business, specifically via dedicated hardware - a model that currently has seldom success stories and way more that operate at losses/hemorrhage money and bank on future success with few revenue streams. There is literally zero reason for apple to change their position from one of perhaps the safest/most enviable business models (in terms of risk/revenue/rate of growth) to the costly venture of entering what, presumably from market research, strikes them as a niche market which has for generations been dominated by a rival company.

3) the kind've games you/I might be looking for again hinge on better battery life, meaning until we refine cold fusion/stark-tech you're adding both production cost and unaesthetic bulk to an apple device, both of which strike me as anathema to their design philosophy.

as ever, i could be totally wrong on all 3, but that strikes me as a lot've hurdles to jump and not a lotta reason to leave the bank and go running in the first place.

 

[SmokyDave]

Maybe they wouldn't crush Nintendo, but I don't see why apple doesn't release a gaming device with buttons. There are lots of gamers like me who are holding out on app store gaming until the games can be played with halfway decent controls.

It's like a game of chicken only Apple won't swerve, gamers will.

 

[Refreshment.01]

Having a Vita, it kind of feels like a tablet with buttons + two analog sticks. As for the 3DS, I realize that other than playing my collection of old DS games, the bottom touch screen really isn't needed anymore.

I think Nintendo's next handheld will be a high-res tablet with buttons. Knowing Nintendo it'll probably be behind the current tech, but by that time I'm sure it'll still be powerful maybe more powerful than the Vita. I think it's a no-brainer that this is the direction Nintendo will be going. Although I'm worried about backwards compatibility with 3DS games, I just don't see Nintendo making another dual screen handheld for their next one.

Also, I think it'll happen much sooner than we think. I don't think the 3DS will have the same life cycle as the DS had.

OP would be more interesting if he considered that after the WiiU and 3DS, the next Nintendo system will be an unified system. One that both serves portable and home use.

reasons why apple can't/won't design a device with buttons right now, according to random shit i read on GAF & half-drunk IrishNinja:

Screens that simulate buttons in it's surface are in prototype form, that's probably the direction Apple is going, so eventually buttons will be present in one of these devices.

 

[IrishNinja]

It's like a game of chicken only Apple won't swerve, gamers will.

by the way, dave: fuck you for being so much more succinct.

OP would be more interesting if he considered that after the WiiU and 3DS, the next Nintendo system will be an unified system. One that both serves portable and home use.

again: until the market for consoles bottoms out, why?

Screens that simulate buttons in it's surface are in prototype form, that's probably the direction Apple is going, so eventually buttons will be present in one of these devices.

you lost me - you're saying what we have now with on-screen buttons, only the panel's tech will make them better at some point?

 

[Krev]

Handhelds are Nintendo's bread and butter. It, along with pokemon and merchandising, arguably kept the company afloat during the fallow GCN years. I don't really see Nintendo tampering with a market in which it has seen an unbroken record of dominance and, in particular, the vanquishing of Sony with it's PSP challenger.

If anything, I could see Nintendo developing a self contained tablet (ie no separate console) in the future with HDMI out for TV connectivity if the tablet concept with physical controls takes off. In that sense, I do see the Wii U as a sort of experiment and an evolutionary step to a full self contained gaming tablet at some point in the future. But I would see this theoretical tablet gaming device co-existing with Nintendo's existing handheld market.

Yep. They're more likely to replace their console line with a tablet than to stop producing truly portable handhelds.

OP would be more interesting if he considered that after the WiiU and 3DS, the next Nintendo system will be an unified system. One that both serves portable and home use.

It's a possible scenario with how they're making their user base accustomed to less powerful hardware in consoles. But if you can make money off two different lines of systems, why release only one?

 

[SmokyDave]

by the way, dave: fuck you for being so much more succinct.

My pleasure, sir

 

[slidewinder]

But everybody knows there's no way things go on much longer without Apple and Nintendo butting heads in a serious way right?