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[Shao Kahn Brewing a Stew]

You don't have to pay 5.000 workers every month, commercials, packaging, R&D, estates, etc.

The world is not black & white.

I never said it is. I'm just calculating cost of IGN's "Project Cafe" console and upgrading it a bit to currently available products. This doesn't include heatsink, casing, tablet, optical drive, and more. I agree with that.

 

[Meelow]

]I guess Nintendo's only goal was to surpass the Wii's power. [/B]Its disappointing for people who expecting multiplat games for whatever reasons but it makes sense given the thing Nintendo has been saying since the Wii came out. By the time the next consoles come out the Wii U will probably be the lowest priced console on the market so they will try to use that to their advantage and the overall sales of the console will probably decide what the console after the Wii U is like.

Well...If Nintendo's only goal was to surpass the Wii they would of just made it an overclock Wii.

 

[Why would you do that?]

EvilLore's post is pretty funny considering he OP'd that system wars thread with the "keep it civil blah..".

Until he stops explaining his positions ans starts with the nintendrone name calling, I'd say he's keeping it civil.

I disagree with him, especially with the resistive screen comment (people who used them a lot on DS generally agree that they're much better for gaming), but nothing wrong with what he said.

 

[Kosma]

Uuuuh GPU can't make up for a super shit CPU.

In 2006 you could get away with a budget CPU cause devs where still struggling to even use dual cores/quads normally and there was little optimisation but by now having a shit CPU is just a huge bottleneck.

 

[TheGreatMightyPoo]

I care more about what Retro Studios "thinks" than some dude named marcan/armchair neogaf developers.

Obviously there is more to this than the hyperbole screams but even if Nintendo's new system was noticeably more capable, third partys would use another excuse in their laundry list of why they don't want to make games for a Nintendo system.

 

[Kazuma Kiryu]

No worries, though. I'm sure soccer moms worldwide, with their iPads and Nexus 7s sitting on the coffee table, will be enthralled by the unique selling point of a living room tethered, two hour battery life, PDA-era resistive touch screen tablet controller.

this can't be stressed enough. the tech on that thing is so cheap it's not even funny.

 

[Shion]

Wow, I guess that rumor of three Broadway's clocked at 1.24GHz wasn't far off. I hope to god the rumours of the GPU being a GPGPU are true or else next gen ports are gonna suck on the Wii U.

Having a GPGPU means nothing if the performance just isn't there.
Drinky Crow posted a link about 4650 a few pages back, if that's the GPU inside Wii U you shouldn't expect much.

 

[Gorillaz]

Well....there is always super smash bros 4?

 

[HAL_Laboratory]

Only nerds care about the hardware specs. 90% of consumers are focused more on the experience/software/interface, and rightly so. All of you digging for numbers are just setting yourselves up for disappointment and missing the point.

 

[Ponn]

EvilLore's post is pretty funny considering he OP'd that system wars thread with the "keep it civil blah..".

There is only so much pandering sane people can do to the cognitive dissonance and spinning on display in these threads.

FFS we still have people in this very thread believing there will be PS4/720 ports.

 

[apana]

I care more about what Retro Studios "thinks" than some dude named marcan.

Obviously there is more to this than the hyperbole screams but even if Nintendo's new system was noticeably more capable, third partys would use another excuse in their laundry list of why they don't want to make games for a Nintendo system.

Well if they hated it how would you ever know?

 

[Neuromancer]

350 = premium price? Come on now ...

When the Xbox 360 retailed for $400, 7 years ago? I would consider $350 a premium.

(I know the Wii U and the Xbox 360 are not exactly analogous but they're in the same ballpark, it seems. Especially considering the gulf of time between.)

 

[dwu8991]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AB3a9G7F8nc

This video explain the Wii U GPU E6760 HD Embedded AMD Radeon
Thanks to Nintengen.com

 

[LeleSocho]

We're experiencing flat out shameful, incompetent design. Decade-old hardware in a primarily $350 box is not necessary or even particularly beneficial in order to secure an aggressive profit margin, and having power trade-offs with the 360/PS3 architectures ensures bad press and unhappy port-buyers from the beginning, when upgraded current gen ports were very much part of the launch strategy. Fils-Aime has to run laughably dishonest damage control on a daily basis as part of this catastrophic failure to produce a technologically viable system -- again, at such a premium price point.

No worries, though. I'm sure soccer moms worldwide, with their iPads and Nexus 7s sitting on the coffee table, will be enthralled by the unique selling point of a living room tethered, two hour battery life, PDA-era resistive touch screen tablet controller.

Against?

 

[Sandfox]

Well...If Nintendo's only goal was to surpass the Wii they would of just made it an overclock Wii.

But that wouldn't sell lol. That's why they decided to add the pad as a way to get people interested in it.

 

[TheGreatMightyPoo]

Well if they hated it how would you ever know?

In quotes because they won't have to say anything, their game will do that for them.

 

[DragonSworne]

There is only so much pandering sane people can do to the cognitive dissonance and spinning on display in these threads.

FFS we still have people in this very thread believing there will be PS4/720 ports.

Why not?

 

[smurfx]

wonder how much of the cpu's the os is taking up. don't think nintendo is really good at making os's. it even took sony a long time to make their os much more efficient.

 

[FyreWulff]

Also, as an aside, I think it's somewhat amusing how the XBox360's CPU clock speed is taken as some sort of golden standard. The XBox360 was released right at the very height of clock-speed chasing by CPUs. And I mean literally: The XBox360 was released in NA on the 16th November 2005. Just two days before that, on the 14th of November, Intel released the Pentium 4 HT 672, with a clock speed of 3.8GHz. They haven't released a CPU clocked that high in the 7 years since.

I wouldn't be surprised if the 720 and PS4 CPUs are clocked lower than the 360/PS3. That 3GHz wall is a bitch. There's a reason everything started to become THROW MOAR COARZ

It's all in what it's during per cycle, raw hertz is pointless if one process has a meh IPC and is in-order while the other one has a better GPU, out of order execution, and better IPC.

 

[Kosma]

Having a GPGPU means nothing if the performance just isn't there.
Drinky Crow posted a link about 4650 a few pages back, if that's the GPU inside Wii U you shouldn't expect much.

Exactly. The GPU can't even make up for much cause its super bad too. I mean I have a better GPU in my year old laptop then the 4650.

 

[Cosmozone]

FFS we still have people in this very thread believing there will be PS4/720 ports.

? You can port everything everywhere. How it looks like is another question. In the end the decision is not power related. More having to do with the publisher believing it will sell or not.

 

[vitacola]

I love how everybody is an expert and knows exactly what the hardware does internally.

 

[HAL_Laboratory]

When the Xbox 360 retailed for $400, 7 years ago? I would consider $350 a premium.

Yep, $400 and it came with a regular ass controller that played games the same way as all the generations before it. What a deal.

 

[-Pyromaniac-]

We're experiencing flat out shameful, incompetent design. Decade-old hardware in a primarily $350 box is not necessary or even particularly beneficial in order to secure an aggressive profit margin, and having power trade-offs with the 360/PS3 architectures ensures bad press and unhappy port-buyers from the beginning, when upgraded current gen ports were very much part of the launch strategy. Fils-Aime has to run laughably dishonest damage control on a daily basis as part of this catastrophic failure to produce a technologically viable system -- again, at such a premium price point.

No worries, though. I'm sure soccer moms worldwide, with their iPads and Nexus 7s sitting on the coffee table, will be enthralled by the unique selling point of a living room tethered, two hour battery life, PDA-era resistive touch screen tablet controller.

I done read some ether in my time but lawwwddd.

Anyway what bugs me most is Nintendo is obviously choosing to play a different game than the other 2, but also a different game than apple and all that. But they're doing that by trying to be everything. I feel like this is the gen they tried to have their cake and eat it too and I don't know, there's a decent chance it could backfire. Nintendo fans better hope it flops because if it does.....Nintendo will go into panic mode and start BEASTING out the games. Panic mode nintendo is the best.

 

[Captain Smoker]

Exactly. The GPU can't even make up for much cause its super bad too. I mean I have a better GPU in my year old laptop then the 4650.

So, just theoretically, would you say that the Wii U CPU is (far) worse than PS360s CPUs because of the clockspeed?

 

[Mastperf]

I care more about what Retro Studios "thinks" than some dude named marcan/armchair neogaf developers.

Obviously there is more to this than the hyperbole screams but even if Nintendo's new system was noticeably more capable, third partys would use another excuse in their laundry list of why they don't want to make games for a Nintendo system.

You'll never hear what they really thing so why bother? You might as well ask Nintendo what they think of the WiiU.
I'm really only interested in hearing what Carmack has to say about the system. He's always honest and was one of the only people saying the 360 and ps3 were on par even after Sony's E305 bullshit festival.

 

[EloquentM]

I think drinky is broken.

 

[shinobi602]

I guess a good way to look at all this is...it's still a significant leap from the Wii....

 

[Ponn]

? You can port everything everywhere. How it looks like is another question. In the end the decision is not power related. More having to do with the publisher believing it will sell or not.

How did that work out for the Wii and third parties?

The only way you are not going to see a repeat of last gen (Wii/360/ps3) is if PS4/720 flop real hard and developers go back to just developing multiplatforms for 360/ps3/Wii-U. I honestly feel there is a chance for that happening depending on developer costs for next gen and the pricing of the next gen consoles and games. We will have to see on that one.

 

[Lancehead]

EvilLore's post is pretty funny considering he OP'd that system wars thread with the "keep it civil blah..".

That post was nowhere near not-civil.

 

[Mastperf]

In quotes because they won't have to say anything, their game will do that for them.

Games built to avoid hardware weaknesses do nothing to disprove those weaknesses.
Like Naughty Dog, they'll deliver regardless of the platform.

 

[blackflag]

I only got the WiiU for first party and exclusive games, while also realizing that it won't actually get much use overall so I don't think these specs really matter to me...thankfully.

 

[Fourth Storm]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AB3a9G7F8nc

This video explain the Wii U GPU E6760 HD Embedded AMD Radeon
Thanks to Nintengen.com

Fake, my friend. Fake.

 

[Why would you do that?]

I care more about what Retro Studios "thinks" than some dude named marcan/armchair neogaf developers.

marcan isn't just "some dude" - he's a hacker of many systems, reverse-engineer...er, and tech enthusiast, who likely knows more about the ins and outs of hardware than most programmers. He's also less biased than Retro Studios, in that he's not under NDAs and isn't tied to any specific company.

 

[Pimpbaa]

The guy says "to not compare it clock for clock with the 360 and claim it's much worse, it isn't", but people do it anyway.

 

[ThoughtsOfSpeaking]

Haven't read the whole thread, but considering what ive read on the last page, i can understand why the "system warz" sticky exists.

anyway, does this suggest that that homebrew channel has a good chance of being ported?

 

[CambriaRising]

Yep, $400 and it came with a regular ass controller that played games the same way as all the generations before it. What a deal.

And a remote for the system, A headset, A 20gb(13gb) hard drive(And even that was small at the time), Hexic HD, and a month of Xbox live. Not to mention the Xbox Live Diamond promotion which got you discounts at subway.

Edit: It was also substantially more powerful than the Xbox, Gamecube, and Ps2. While using a multi-core processor before they became the norm on Pcs.

And AV cables, a power supply with cables included, a cardboard box, plastic wrap, manuals, and the always important fresh console smell

Great post. Substantive.

But you did remind me that the component cables that it came with had an optical port on the back..

 

[HAL_Laboratory]

You'll never hear what they really thing so why bother? You might as well ask Nintendo what they think of the WiiU.
I'm really only interested in hearing what Carmack has to say about the system. He's always honest and was one of the only people saying the 360 and ps3 were on par even after Sony's E305 bullshit festival.

I actually know exactly what Retro Studios thinks about it, and it's all positive.

 

[TheGreatMightyPoo]

Games built to avoid hardware weaknesses do nothing to disprove those weaknesses.
Like Naughty Dog

No one will care about specs when the big boppers come out.

At least not people that play the actual games.

 

[DragonSworne]

And a remote for the system, A headset, A 20gb(13gb) hard drive(And even that was small at the time), Hexic HD, and a month of Xbox live. Not to mention the Xbox Live Diamond promotion which got you discounts at subway.

And AV cables, a power supply with cables included, a cardboard box, plastic wrap, manuals, and the always important fresh console smell

 

[phosphor112]

We're experiencing flat out shameful, incompetent design. Decade-old hardware in a primarily $350 box is not necessary or even particularly beneficial in order to secure an aggressive profit margin, and having power trade-offs with the 360/PS3 architectures ensures bad press and unhappy port-buyers from the beginning, when upgraded current gen ports were very much part of the launch strategy. Fils-Aime has to run laughably dishonest damage control on a daily basis as part of this catastrophic failure to produce a technologically viable system -- again, at such a premium price point.

No worries, though. I'm sure soccer moms worldwide, with their iPads and Nexus 7s sitting on the coffee table, will be enthralled by the unique selling point of a living room tethered, two hour battery life, PDA-era resistive touch screen tablet controller.

Post of the Year.

 

[H_Prestige]

No one will care about specs when the big boppers come out.

At least not people that play the actual games.

If no one cares about specs then why were there a billion of those speculation threads where all people did was talk about rumored/imagined specs?

 

[Freezie KO]

No worries, though. I'm sure soccer moms worldwide, with their iPads and Nexus 7s sitting on the coffee table, will be enthralled by the unique selling point of a living room tethered, two hour battery life, PDA-era resistive touch screen tablet controller.

They probably won't, but Miiverse art says that the PDA-era resistive touch screen was the right choice.

 

[TheGreatMightyPoo]

marcan isn't just "some dude" - he's a hacker of many systems, reverse-engineer...er, and tech enthusiast, who likely knows more about the ins and outs of hardware than most programmers. He's also less biased than Retro Studios, in that he's not under NDAs and isn't tied to any specific company.

I could give a shit what he is or what he does(no offense to him), he doesn't make games for the system.

Once again, I put thinks in """""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" because actions/games will speak louder than words.

 

[gregor7777]

Not sure what the Soccer Mom comment is about; but ack well.

I'm constantly amazed by gaf's general ignorance when it comes to the vast majority of Nintendo's primary audience and the people who buy the consoles for them. No offense, grim.

 

[LeleSocho]

Yep, $400 and it came with a regular ass controller that played games the same way as all the generations before it. What a deal.

oh god ahahahahah
i think you are putting yourself to shame here

 

[TheContact]

I've been an early adopter for every console since Sega Saturn. Granted, when I got one system my brother got the other one, but we both got to experience the consoles. It wasn't until this generation I had enough money to buy them all myself--no complaints. I even waited outside Best Buy to get a Wii on day1.

Nothing about the Wii U gave me the excitement the other consoles did in the past. I knew the Wii U wouldn't be as powerful as the PS4 or the Xbox720, but I was hoping it would have been a lot better than it actually is.

I'm still going to buy a Wii U, down the road sometime when there's a good bundle, new colors, price cut etc... to play exclusive games, because I am and always will be a gamer, but I'm disappointed that a lot of the features that sparked my interest in the Wii (being able to play games on the Tablet instead of the TV) aren't in effect yet or are extremely limited in design. Can't play Virtual Consoles on it? Why not?? Well, when it gets more established I think the Wii U will do alright. It's certainty not going to do as well as the Wii, but it won't be a complete failure like the Virtual Boy.

 

[Fourth Storm]

I actually know exactly what Retro Studios thinks about it, and it's all positive.

Doesn't surprise me. We heard reports of the CPU being "just as good" as Xenon from some devs. It all depends on what kind of game and what kind of code you're running on it. Obviously, for SIMD, yeah it's a fail. But for branchy stuff, it should get the job done. Everyone wants to speak in absolutes when it's much more complicated than that.

 

[Osiris]

If no one cares about specs then why were there a billion of those speculation threads where all people did was talk about rumored/imagined specs?

Specs mattered when they thought it was a powerhouse, now it isn't, so they don't. It's called having your cake and eating it.

 

[DragonSworne]

I could give a shit what he is or what he does(no offense to him), he doesn't make games for the system.

Once again, I put thinks in """""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" because actions/games will speak louder than words.

But Marcan has basically confirmed that the CPU is on par with Xenon.

That means with better RAM and a better GPU, games will look better than current gen.

Not sure why people are convinced otherwise