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[Neuromancer]

More hUMA than human...

Are you referencing Blade Runner or Rob Zombie?

 

[EagleEyes]

This is, actually, wrong.
Killzone: Shadow Fall is currently the best looking launch game.
Just look at the multiplayer footage. It looks as good as the single-player part. Amazing!

How could you possibly compare something like Forza 5 and Killzone: Shadow Fall graphically? I would love to know the formula?

 

[Hana-Bi]

The xbox one SOC will be discussed at next weeks hot chips conference. A 30 min presentation will be given on it. We'll likely learn much more about it then, and will hopefully get some specifics regarding cpu, gpu, huma, etc.
http://www.hotchips.org/

Nice find. New thread worthy?

Should be really interesting. Hopefully we'll hear from that conference.

 

[badcrumble]

Time and politics.

That didn't make all games equal this past generation. Why would it do it in the future?

 

[wildfire]

I know. My point is that the AMD guy did not specifically say that. The OP is misleading.

You're the one who is lying. Anyone who can read english can see through you.

 

[ElTorro]

The move engines aren't the only way to handle memory on the Xbox One. They are just one way to handle memory while using notably less resources. Also, the PS4 itself likely has similar hardware, except they're likely just called plain old DMA as opposed to Move Engines, and Microsoft apparently decided to put more DMA units in the Xbox One with certain fixed function capabilities. So to say that hUMA can't be integrated into this architecture when the PS4 likely shares similar DMA components seems pretty contradictory.

I fail to know any leaked document that said that. Can you quote one? The XB1's units apparently have a much extended feature set over plain DMA units.

The XB1 isn't forced to use the Move Engines for its data management, as it can handle memory in a more traditional way using shaders.

Shaders don't handle memory management. They are just programs that issue requests of certain memory addresses to the actual memory management hardware. The mechanisms employed are transparent to them.

I don't really know the details, but the Xbox One's memory system shows very clear and obvious coherency as described in HUMA between the GPU memory sub-system and the CPU. Isn't hUMA all about data coherency between the GPU and CPU?

Cache coherency can be guaranteed between any of clients of a certain memory pool, for instance the caches of both Jaguar CPU modules are cache coherent. That does, however, not imply cache coherency between the CPU and the GPU as far as main memory is concerned. There might be cache coherency between CPU/GPU and ESRAM without there being cache coherency between CPU/GPU and main memory. However, from reading the Durango specs I would also rather infer that CPU/GPU are cache coherent with respect to main memory.

Nevertheless, I don't know which minimum feature set constitutes a hUMA architecuture, but, for starters, apparently the XB1's system does not support volatile tags:

As the GPU is I/O coherent, data in the GPU caches must be flushed before that data is visible to other components of the system.

http://www.vgleaks.com/durango-memory-system-overview/

 

[timlot]

Link? I didn't know this was proven yet!


Oh well. I will just continue to read the long explanations of how AMD doesn't know what they are talking about and the author of this article is wrong. It has been entertaining.

Yes, we should all believe our lying eyes.

 

[GodofWine]

General PC sales are down.

Gaming PC sales are up.

http://www.techpowerup.com/188572/g...re-sales-shrug-off-pc-market-decline-jpr.html

I appreciate an actual useful response to my slightly wrong assumptions...unlike whats his face provided...

But:

Would a better 10 yr plan for a chip maker be;

a. capture a share of gaming pc hardware sales
b. capture all console sales and grow mobile sales

Its not in a companys interest to sell sexy things, it is in their interest to make money. Im assuming option b would make more money, but I really dont know for sure.

 

[Ishida]

Interesting, considering Forza 5 and Ryse look better graphically than any PS4 game.

Some weird wet dreams you are having there.

 

[Jonm1010]

Yes, we should all believe our lying eyes.

Interesting, considering Forza 5 and Ryse look better graphically than any PS4 game.

Whether subjectively people find Ryse better looking then Second Son or Killzone doesn't erase the fact that ps4 has a superior GPU, superior ram and apparently a superior architecture. Which WILL(or already has if developer rumors are to be believed) lead to superior graphics.

How big will the gap be? Only time will tell but a gap will exist. It's undeniable at this point.

 

[Pwn]

Interesting, considering Forza 5 and Ryse look better graphically than any PS4 game.

Yup, BULLSHOTS are so beautiful my eyes get hurt.

 

[timlot]

Some weird wet dreams you are having there.

 

[RSTEIN]

I appreciate an actual useful response to my slightly wrong assumptions...unlike whats his face provided...

But:

Would a better 10 yr plan for a chip maker be;

a. capture a share of gaming pc hardware sales
b. capture all console sales and grow mobile sales

Its not in a companys interest to sell sexy things, it is in their interest to make money. Im assuming option b would make more money, but I really dont know for sure.

Well, when talking about stuff that requires massive R&D, fab facilities, global logistics, etc., it's not so simple. You just can't press a button and build a custom console solution. They looked at the gaming market, the margins available on potential console business and probably just concluded that they have other priorities right now and it just didn't fit with their roadmap. The bottom line is that both PCs and consoles are in secular decline. They are clearly not the future. So right now Nvidia is focusing on Tegra and high end enterprise solutions while still trying to milk the enthusiast PC market.

 

[Coulomb_Barrier]

Killzone: SF looks better visually than anything so far, you gotta look at them screens again.

 

[WeAreStarStuff]

Strange angle to the play the game.

 

[ElTorro]

It's fascinating how messages spread.

IGN Italy is reporting on this issue.

http://it.ign.com/news/8051/ps4-con-huma-xbox-one-senza-3d-migliore-#.UhUIFhvAm7k.twitter

Apparently they got their news from PSU.com, which got them from GAF. However, they fail to refer to the original German article.

Quality Journalism.

 

[AngryBird]

Information overload ugh.,..

 

[cebri.one]

And Forza uses prebaked lighting, pretty much a last gen feature.

 

[TheTwelve]

Interesting, considering Forza 5 and Ryse look better graphically than any PS4 game.

Ahhh hahaha.

Anyway, I'm really trying to keep the hype down. The graphical gap between the PS4 and X1 on paper is looking tremendous. Everyone knows that Sony will excel in hardware far above the software-focused Microsoft, but did Sony really go THIS balls-to-the-wall this gen? I felt Sony had to be come out with all guns ablazin' this time around, but...really this much?

I'm just having a hard time seeing how Microsoft could let this happen. In this world of leaks and such, how can they undershoot Sony so badly? I just don't get it.

I don't think anything looks as good as Second Son right now, but still...should I allow myself to give into this hype?

...nah, I'm going to just wait and see and let myself be impressed. And hope.

 

[Andronicus]

theres a lot of statements in here by people about hardware MS hasn't commented on going against what someone from the hardware developer has stated...but continue

 

[lowhighkang_LHK]

And Forza uses prebaked lighting, pretty much a last gen feature.

Prebaked? Your kidding right? Horribad if true.

 

[syko de4d]

Forza5... DriveClub....

Project Cars looks better than both and comes to Next Gen too. This will be the game to shows which console can create the better looking racer

 

[Dr. Kaos]

I didn't say otherwise; I said that the gap is not close to Xbox vs Dreamcast.

To put my point another way, the Xbox had around 7 GFLOPS of computing power, the Dreamcast 1.5 GFLOPS. If you think that hUMA will turn the 50% computational improvement of the PS4 over the Xbone into a ~450% improvement, you're probably buying into the same 'secret sauce' wet dreams that some of our Xbox system warriors seem to believe in.

Wasn't the xbox rushed and unoptimized compared to the Dreamcast? The 7 vs 1.5 gflops measure is highly imprecise.

PS4 games will probably look 50% better than xbone games on average.

 

[Krakn3Dfx]

Prebaked? Your kidding right? Horribad if true.

Yes, this has been known for awhile.

 

[jsnepo]

I never thought that visuals between a racing game and an FPS can be compared but this thread proved me wrong.

 

[SenjutsuSage]

And Forza uses prebaked lighting, pretty much a last gen feature.

You are kidding yourself if you think plenty of PS4 and XB1 games won't take advantage of prebaked lighting this gen. Just because you have more power this time around doesn't mean that there is no longer a need or a desire to fake certain things. If it makes the game look better devs will fake things where necessary.

 

[RedAssedApe]

Forza/Gran Tourismo garage/replay shots don't really count. That's like saying those loading screens with the faces in Heavy Rain are equivalent to the character model quality you actually seen during gameplay sequences.

Are there good in-game shots available?

 

[Tallshortman]

In what alternate reality does this happen?

In the one he wants to live in.

 

[AngryBird]

Why they are just renders, not even bullshots....

 

[TheRealTalker]

lol I thought it said Hummus for a sec... funny especially after the whole Onion Buses, Garlic Buses, and the Special/Secret Sauce

 

[Manmademan]

Since this tech is specifically for their integrated GPU with CPUs for the next year or 2 there is no advantage to be had unless you are buying a laptop under $600.

keep in mind that as you say this, nvidia and amd together control less than 40 percent of the gpu market.

the other 60 odd percent are Intel integrated graphics, and intels market share gets bigger every year.

AMD likely isn't concerned with competing with nvidia at the high end of the market with their gpu/cpu devices. they're going after the much larger percentage of the market that thinks current (or next)gen console graphics are "good enough" and buying Intel right now.

right now they have zero percent of that market. next gen games being programmed exclusively on their hardware will make ports to these integrated devices dead simple as well as give them a decent amount of name recognition for the advantages of proprietary stuff like hUMA. look at this thread. page 1 is wtf is hUMA, page 9 everybody is an expert.

again, this isn't rocket science, follow the money. AMD and Nvidia are losing share to Intel. desktops are becoming a niche market.

 

[Can Crusher]

Show me where in the recent response from AMD where they state that PS4 has hUMA.

Show me where they state it doesn't. This word game you are playing is too easy.

Yep. I think Sony have implementation of something similar to hUMA. And so has MS.

You seem to have no problems making leaps in logic. It's actually getting funny now. And If the email is actually fake then it's going to be even funnier!!!

 

[madmackem]

Time and politics.

Time wont be any sort of factor, do you think these ports are done by the same people?.

 

[JCreasy]

Interesting, considering Forza 5 and Ryse look better graphically than any PS4 game.

 

[mintylurb]

That didn't make all games equal this past generation. Why would it do it in the future?

That's then. Now it's different because of time and politics.

 

[pushBAK]

This is huge, game changing huge. I'm going to assume MS had to take this feature out to make room for the eSRAM on the die. Meanwhile, Sony took the higher latency hit of the of using GDDR5 but are making it up via tools such as this. A great article on how Sony overcame bottlenecks on the PS4 can be found here;

http://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/191007/inside_the_playstation_4_with_mark_.php?page=3

 

[madmackem]

Ahhh hahaha.

Anyway, I'm really trying to keep the hype down. The graphical gap between the PS4 and X1 on paper is looking tremendous. Everyone knows that Sony will excel in hardware far above the software-focused Microsoft, but did Sony really go THIS balls-to-the-wall this gen? I felt Sony had to be come out with all guns ablazin' this time around, but...really this much?

I'm just having a hard time seeing how Microsoft could let this happen. In this world of leaks and such, how can they undershoot Sony so badly? I just don't get it.

I don't think anything looks as good as Second Son right now, but still...should I allow myself to give into this hype?

...nah, I'm going to just wait and see and let myself be impressed. And hope.

Ms said themselves they didnt go all out power wise as a choice.

 

[Bringer Of Bacon]

This is huge, game changing huge. I'm going to assume MS had to take this feature out to make room for the eSRAM on the die. Meanwhile, Sony took the higher latency hit of the of using GDDR5 but are making it up via tools such as this. A great article on how Sony overcame bottlenecks on the PS4 can be found here;

http://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/191007/inside_the_playstation_4_with_mark_.php?page=3

#gamechanger

 

[Chobel]

Interesting, considering Forza 5 and Ryse look better graphically than any PS4 game.

They're not even better than The Division which is multipat.

 

[Manmademan]

This is huge, game changing huge. I'm going to assume MS had to take this feature out to make room for the eSRAM on the die. Meanwhile, Sony took the higher latency hit of the of using GDDR5 but are making it up via tools such as this. A great article on how Sony overcame bottlenecks on the PS4 can be found here;

http://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/191007/inside_the_playstation_4_with_mark_.php?page=3

ugh. God. no. reading this post is painful.

hUMA isn't a device you need to "make room for" on the die. Esram is PROBABLY at fault but without it the xbone has abysmal bandwidth.

there is no latency hit with gddr5. whoever told you so is misinformed.

 

[BruceLeeRoy]

I strongly disagree, but to each his own.

Did you watch the MP trailer? It looks a lot better than the E3 footage. I think it's easily the best looking launch game now with Forza right behind it.

 

[Xcellere]

hUMA After All.

 

[Pwn]

I just wonder how long will it take T10 to get rid of the old ass prebaked lighting system and implement the day-night transition feature which GT5 already has since day one.

IMO it's the most important feature in racing games.

 

[Manmademan]

Ms said themselves they didnt go all out power wise as a choice.

just add that one to the pile of bad choices MS seems to be regretting lately

 

[marvin83]

You are kidding yourself if you think plenty of PS4 and XB1 games won't take advantage of prebaked lighting this gen. Just because you have more power this time around doesn't mean that there is no longer a need or a desire to fake certain things. If it makes the game look better devs will fake things where necessary.

Panties in a bunch much? I like how you speak as if you're MSFT themselves. QQ some more.

 

[BladeoftheImmortal]

Mmmmmmm....yung humas back
Gonna smack Xbox on the ass.

 

[bigboss370]

This is going to be HUGE if they lock down the Dragonlance IP.

* sorry, somewhat obscure reference.

well done sir, well done

 

[badcrumble]

You are kidding yourself if you think plenty of PS4 and XB1 games won't take advantage of prebaked lighting this gen. Just because you have more power this time around doesn't mean that there is no longer a need or a desire to fake certain things. If it makes the game look better devs will fake things where necessary.

Prebaked lighting slows development down and is pretty much terrible for the development process. Developers have only really used it in the past because they were using consoles on which real-time lighting would look shitty. It doesn't inherently look better than realtime lighting.

 

[Doc Evils]

cyberheater
PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 hUMA PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 XBOX PS4 PS4
(Today, 07:06 PM)

 

[driver116]

Interesting, considering Forza 5 and Ryse look better graphically than any PS4 game.

Sour, very sour.