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[Japan] As Switch comes after PS4, Sony should be worried

Tadaima

Member
For the last twenty years, Sony has dominated the mindshare of Japanese third parties. PS1 and PS2 were enormous, which led to strong support for PS3 also.

Nintendo has had mixed success with third parties on home consoles since the release of Nintendo 64. Although Wii was a huge success, third parties had already made the transition to "next-gen," and little other than low-budget titles were released for the platform before its decline.

The Japanese home console market has been rapidly shrinking for more than half a decade. PS4 would be considered a "dead system", if it were sat alongside Wii or PS2. Even Nintendo 64 is giving PS4 a run for its money, and its LTD tops Wii U's by just 450k. And yet, PS4 is single-handedly holding up the home console market.

Sadly, as the home console market declines, developing PS4 games targeted at the domestic market just isn't enough. It really is a case of "pick your poison" – as a developer, you've either got to risk alienating the domestic audience by making your games more western-friendly; reduce the fidelity of your gaming experiences by creating handheld games; or risk it all by shifting resources to mobile.

However, there is one thing in Japan that can be guaranteed: the consistent, unprecedented success of Nintendo's handheld platforms.

Since 1989, Nintendo has shipped the following handheld platforms:
1989: Game Boy: 32mm
2001: Game Boy Advance: 17mm
2004: Nintendo DS: 33mm
2011: Nintendo 3DS: 21+mm

In comparison, PS2 sold 23mm units, and Wii sold 12.77 units. PS4 sits at 3.7mm units.

As did the PlayStation line, the Game Boy and *DS lines have produced repeated mega-successes for third parties. However, there has always been a clear distinction between handheld and home console titles, as each is suited to a very different type of experience – and therefore, a different platform.

There is no doubt that a title such as Dragon Quest or Monster Hunter would sell more units if it were released on a single platform with 30mm units, rather than one with 20mm. This is one limitation of conventional platforms.

Nintendo has stated that Switch is a "home console", but the writing is on the wall: Wii U severely underperformed, and 3DS is desperately awaiting its successor. Nintendo Switch is very clearly the great grandchild of the Game Boy. It is the successor to the 3DS, just as the "third pillar" DS was to the Game Boy Advance. Nintendo Switch is a Game Boy-style handheld which packs a mightier punch than the company's current flagship home console.

The difference is that when the user arrives home, this handheld becomes their home console.

Developers will continue to create portable mega-successes and bring them to Nintendo's platform, as they have done since the late 80s. And Nintendo will undoubtedly continue to report huge sales numbers success as a result.

But now, developers can bring their home console experiences to a system that will likely achieve PS2-like (or, if you prefer, 3DS-like) numbers, without making enormous sacrifices to fidelity or taking high risks on mobile or unfamiliar/alienating markets.

When the user gets home, these home console experiences await.

Final Fantasy XV just opened at its series-lowest since FFV, released exactly 24 years ago. We are still waiting for the first PS4 game to crack 750k.

There is little doubt that PS5 will be released in the coming years. After all, PS4 is a beast overseas. But looking at the numbers, it is obvious where the home console market is headed in Japan. The domestic market will either have to take a back-seat, or the Japanese-targeted titles will have to move to other platforms.

Switch gives Japanese developers a chance to continue doing everything they already do and know, all in one place, on a platform which is an extremely safe bet. Few sacrifices will need to be made to fidelity, if any, and developers will likely make bank in doing so.

For those who have worked in Japan, you will know that Japan is a risk-averse, insular economy which actively seeks and enjoys familiarity. Switch speaks to business desire in a way that no other home console since PS2 has.

Switch is a platform where the biggest-selling handheld titles – Monster Hunter, Pokémon, Yokai Watch, Dragon Quest, Animal Crossing, and more – have a chance to meet the biggest-selling home console titles. Whichever titles will join them, and have a chance of their level of success, is up to third parties.

It seems doubtful that Sony will pivot and follow Nintendo's lead just to retain a single market: an "unconventional" PS5 risks the western markets – the markets in which Sony performs exceptionally. Unless PS4 stumbles overseas, PS5 will be a conventional PlayStation. In the same way that PS4, PS3, and PS2 were.

A conventional PlayStation will not save the Japanese home console market. A "third time lucky" PSP isn't completely off the cards, but it is quite apparently that Sony abandoned the handheld market long ago.

With few hugely-popular first-party titles in their domestic market, Sony is about to be left with very little leverage.

For this reason, Sony should be worried.



What are your thoughts? Outside of the promise of access to international markets, what can Sony do to entice and retain Japanese third parties?
 

McDougles

Member
As Switch comes after PS4, Sony and Nintendo should be worried about Japan because most of their efforts lie in console sales in a market where consoles are dying, if not mostly dead.
 

night814

Member
This echoes my thoughts a lot. Switch could help the Japanese game market quite a bit, especially if they have a nice blend of Japanese and western games.
 

kunonabi

Member
Nintendo might pick up some of the vita's support but I don't see it getting the same kind of support that the ps4 is getting.
 
Sony's very good relation with third party devs isn't going to dissolve because of Switch. If anything, devs will just work on PS4 and Switch. Exclusive franchises will become multiplat and what not. Japan isn't in a state where it can pick and choose.

Honestly, I think these notions are what people want to see happen more than anything else.
 

kadotsu

Banned
Being worried about the switch in Japan while mobile exists is like being worried about stepping in a puddle in a typhoon.
 

georly

Member
Sony is fine, Nintendo should be more concerned with expanding their user base after the Wii U fiasco.

In the west.

Did you read the OP?

Unless maybe your definition of 'fine' is 'continually trending downward in japan.'

Edit: That said, I'm not convinced switch will impact ps4 sales as much as just general market trends toward portable/mobile have.
 

GHG

Member
Does anyone genuinely care about selling home consoles in Japan anymore?

Serious question.

I ask because it seems to me like everyone's putting more effort in to catering to international markets since that's where there's higher potential in terms of sales volume.
 

Gator86

Member
Yup, the manufacturer who is on track to have their third 100m selling console should be terrified of the follow-up to the WiiU.

Also, who gives a shit about console sales in Japan? It's a dead market. Who is fighting to be king of the sewer? Switch might do well there, but I'm not sure it will be meaningful outside of message boards and Japanese homes.
 

phanphare

Banned
Sony should be worried about Japan specifically but world wide they're doing just fine which seems to be their main focus these days
 

Glix

Member
Some hardcore non-OP reading shitposts in here, geez.

The basic premise of the article, that Switch will be the most attractive platform to develop on for Japanese devs looking for success in Japan, is very correct.
 

cw_sasuke

If all DLC came tied to $13 figurines, I'd consider all DLC to be free
Sony would benefit from Switch doing well since japanese 3rdPartys wil have an easier time justifying their games if they can sell them on Switch (and Steam) as well.
 
I'd imagine that console sales have tapered off in japan enough that sony already mostly views any PS4s sold there as a nice bonus that they can't count on.
 
Given what we know * so far* about Switch, the amalgamation of console and handheld development, the portability factor, the types of games certain to appear( Monster Hunter, Dragon Quest, Pokemon) , I can't see the Switch not being a huge hit in Japan.

I will say, this is the most excited I've been for a full console reveal in years. I think it's going too far to say Sony should be shaking in their boots, but I do feel Nintendo is poised to rebound nicely coming off Wii U.
 
These echo the thoughts I've had for awhile. Sony's international approach with PlayStation 4 was an incredibly smart strategy for them, as I think they're going to massively struggle in Japan moving forward. Nintendo may as well, but they're setting themselves up for much greater success in that region.

Nintendo has a lot to prove to the rest of the world though, that's for sure.
 

Meesh

Member
I understand the OP, but I don't think Sony should be worried at all, It's Nintendo that's got some proving to do. I think things may become clearer after the Switch official unveiling in January...
 

Elios83

Member
You're in for a rude awakening imo.
The Switch is far from being a japanese friendly product.
As a handheld it is too big and without the exclusive features that previous Nintendo dedicated handhelds enjoyed like dual screens and 3D.
As a home console it has weak hardware without major third party support.
Switch won't save anything, it will be lucky to be more successful than Wii U and reach a GC level success IMO.
 

killroy87

Member
Haha I can't imagine Sony is losing much sleep over it. By the time Switch catches up, the next Sony platform will be on the horizon.
 

HyperHip

Member
Please don't jinx this system, similar things were said when Wii U was close to launch and look how that turned out!
 
Some hardcore non-OP reading shitposts in here, geez.

The basic premise of the article, that Switch will be the most attractive platform to develop on for Japanese devs looking for success in Japan, is very correct.

second last line of the post

For this reason, Sony should be worried.

No, they really shouldn't be worried about the Switch in Japan, because Japan is pretty much dead for home consoles already. Sony should be worried about Japan, for sure, but that has absolutely nothing to do with the Switch.

Console makers should be worried about mobile, both are. That's why both are making mobile games now and they're making bank on them in Japan.
 

Lady Gaia

Member
As Switch comes after PS4, Sony and Nintendo should be worried about Japan because most of their efforts lie in console sales in a market where consoles are dying, if not mostly dead.

Particularly since Switch doesn't look like a convenient enough device for on-the-go gaming to compete with smartphones and tablets. If anything, I wonder if Nintendo shouldn't be worried about losing their faithful handheld audience with this move.
 

maxcriden

Member
Great OT. You might even say that if Nintendo has a successful return to the market, they might just be able to put up an ad saying ",ただいま!" ^^
 
Japan on its own doesn't matter anymore. We've already seen the push to localize more games and have worldwide releases for the most part. Worst case is the Switch replaces the Vita and 3DS, and Japanese devs port those games to the PS4 globally.
 

PlayerOne

Banned
I just think a lot of Japanese gamers do not "get" how gaming has become. Looking at TGS, they still see video games as arcade-like, or gameplay-driven. I do not think they care about lore, plot, the experience, ambiance, etc. and more of goal-oriented, challenge-focused, mechanics-driven.
 

phanphare

Banned
Some hardcore non-OP reading shitposts in here, geez.

The basic premise of the article, that Switch will be the most attractive platform to develop on for Japanese devs looking for success in Japan, is very correct.

isn't that the point though? that sony has shifted their focus to a more-western oriented audience with the PS4 so even though they're struggling in japan it's not something to worry too much about because that's how they've positioned their console business in the first place.
 
But now, developers can bring their home console experiences without making enormous sacrifices to fidelity

I'll believe it when I see it.

What are your thoughts? Outside of the promise of access to international markets, what can Sony do to entice and retain Japanese third parties?
If we are going with the assumption that all is fine in the west than Sony doesn't have to do much at all. Since those developers will want a piece of that western market anyway.
 

El Topo

Member
Please don't jinx this system, similar things were said when Wii U was close to launch and look how that turned out!

Did anyone still say that after the E3 showing?

Edit:
Some did. No idea anymore what my opinion was at the time to be honest. Whatever it was, I was probably wrong. :D
 

georly

Member
Also, who gives a shit about console sales in Japan? It's a dead market. Who is fighting to be king of the sewer? Switch might do well there, but I'm not sure it will be meaningful outside of message boards and Japanese homes.

People who enjoy japanese style games and worry they'll go away with the decline of the japanese market. I know this isn't you, but people like me will miss them dearly if they're gone.
 
unprecedented success of Nintendo's handheld platforms

Really?

ChVAiFIW0AEA-SB.jpg
 
Sony is more worried about the mobile dominance and are attempting a foothold worth their latest intiative
That is not to say that the console market won't handily taken by the switch it more than likely will get the support of Japanese console game makers


But in the grand scheme of things mobile is an ocean while you're prefacing a concern of a river

Or who knows maybe Nintendo will reinvigorate the console market to some degree
 

aBarreras

Member
You're in for a rude awakening imo.
The Switch is far from being a japanese friendly product.
As a handheld it is too big and without the exclusive features that previous Nintendo dedicated handhelds enjoyed like dual screens and 3D.
As a home console it has weak hardware without major third party support.
Switch won't save anything, it will be lucky to be more successful than Wii U and reach a GC level success IMO.

you cant be serious right?
 
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