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Russia: we'll treat US-led coalition planes in Syria, W of the Euphrates, as targets.
- Thread starter Kolx
- Start date
MisterFalcon
Member
It's already been changed from 'targeted by SAM assets as targets' to 'escorted by Russian air and air defence aircraft as air assets'
https://twitter.com/airwars/status/876793527887429632
https://twitter.com/airwars/status/876793527887429632
Sho_Nuff82
Member
Dropping sanctions will fix this.
Tragicomedy
Member
Bring it on, Putin. We'll shoot down every fucking jet you try and engage us with.
I've said for years now the memorandum is a thinly veiled authorization for Russia and Syria to carry out a bombing campaign on Syrians.
There are no "good" answers here, but allowing an Aleppo to happen just because they check in on comms and follow ROEs...maybe those rules are fucked. You intentionally bomb a city, you get shot down. You intentionally target a UN convoy and kill dozens, you get shot down.
I've said for years now the memorandum is a thinly veiled authorization for Russia and Syria to carry out a bombing campaign on Syrians.
There are no "good" answers here, but allowing an Aleppo to happen just because they check in on comms and follow ROEs...maybe those rules are fucked. You intentionally bomb a city, you get shot down. You intentionally target a UN convoy and kill dozens, you get shot down.
ryutaro's mama
Member
Naw, with this Commander and Thief in charge, the best you will get is a bombed empty airfield, with the Russians notified in advance it was happening.
Yeah, I can't imagine that this is more than empty bluster from Putin. The US was flying F-22s there, and I don't think Russia wants any part of them.
HammerOfThor
Member
Yeah Russia's saying this because they know Trump is weak and won't jeopardize his busniness interests in Russia. Fucking pathetic.
Tal Shiar Agent
Member
We'll see a military coup before this happens. There are enough old Cold Warriors in positions of authority in the military to prevent this.
SwiftDeath
Member
God that must be terrifying for any pilot of those US planes
"Well at least they clarified their intent..."
KarneeKarnay
Member
I think we're all in agreement that this just posturing at best. At worst this is try and see what the US and NATO will do in response.
The US won't do crap, because Trump is in bed with Russia and if NATO do something independently, the US and NATO look weaker all the more.
The US won't do crap, because Trump is in bed with Russia and if NATO do something independently, the US and NATO look weaker all the more.
Lmao. Half of gaf thinks that Trump has power to make military decisions... pentagon has so many different scenarios and reactions, that they even have reprinted president speeches and notes for whoever the president is.
crimsondynamics
Member
Don't the Russians have the Su-35? There's no clear consensus on which is the superior fighter, and I think the US would be just as hesitant to take on Flanker-E aircraft.
It wasn't an entirely serious post
Aren't all F35's grounded for undefined period of time because oxygen systems keep failing so pilots don't get enough breathable air?
Tallshortman
Member
F-22 is far superior to the Su-35 at air superiority.
fastford58
Member
Things are getting a little froggy over there.
Escalation is the dumbest move you can do
Not sure if exciting is the right word for the possibility of scaling up the conflict and inflicting more deaths on every side.
ginger ninja
Banned
Wish a motherfucker would. Wish a motherfucker would.
Forerunner
Member
When it comes to a traditional dogfight, the Su-35 is actually the better fighter. It has better maneuverability and it can carry more missiles. However, the F-22 isn't supposed be be used like that. It destroys the other aircraft before they even know it's there. It ends a dogfight before it can even begin.
They're flying again with Restrictions.
To my knowledge this hasn't yet been reported with forward deployed F-35's in the Asia and European theaters but I haven't honestly checked yet.
Tragicomedy
Member
Crazy talk. Literally nobody in the USAF fighter community is worried about a Flanker variant. We don't enter some Iron Eagle dogfights. Our munitions advantage let's us knock them out of the sky from beyond visual range, max engagement profiles.
They pose a significant threat to our other airborne assets, but not our fighters. Against a 22? We wouldn't lose a single jet, period.
The only threat comes from the IADS they moved into Syria. We have the ability to neutralize those pretty damn quickly.
What's a better option? Allow free bombing campaigns and continued massacres? Leaving?
How is that working out so far? Sometimes the best way to face a blustery bully is to punch them in their fucking face. Russia is a sinking ship, unable to trade with most superpowers and on a downward financial slope. We aren't going to nukes over Syria, and we shouldn't fear them in conventional war.
FreedomFighter
Member
This is a response to US continuing to engage SAA positions.
The posts in here still thinking we're invincible are always entertaining. Russia and US have back channel communications but Russia's patience is wearing thin with these continued engagements (mind you, with absolutely no mandate).
The posts in here still thinking we're invincible are always entertaining. Russia and US have back channel communications but Russia's patience is wearing thin with these continued engagements (mind you, with absolutely no mandate).
Seems like a good idea after russia plastered s400 all over syria and iran.
mysocksarepink
Banned
any info on this anti air?
Dubbedinenglish
Banned
Syrian plane bombs US backed forces (possibly US forces embedded) and gets shot down. They have gotten close a few times and had to be chased off by US planes so it's not a new thing. The world is better off with at least one less of Assad's goons in the air.
Tragicomedy
Member
You think we haven't been mapping the precise location of every one of those? We know where every Russian system is in Syria. You don't engage an SAM head on. You kill it from a distance using precise munitions and TLAMs.
There are other options, but not for this forum. I'll just say the counter-IADS mission is exactly what we train for every day. Those systems wouldn't survive two days in war.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S-400_missile_system
They also have the older versions s-300 stationed in syria
I always love to see these "America, FUCK YEAH! We are untouchable!" posts
They're not even close to on par with F-22s. They "win" at airshow demonstrations and in 1940s style dogfights (a relic of the past), but in an actual conflict they would be shot down before they knew there was an F-22 nearby.
With that said, obviously if US and Russian planes start to target one another then it's a major problem that transcends how well different aircraft perform.
Yes i'm sure russians will just let you destory their AA batteries with TLAMS. It's not like they have a fleet and a military base there that could run electornic interference.
Going by your post you'd think russian tech is from stone age.
AcademicSaucer
Member
I hope that's still true after hundreds of russians are killed by US military assets.
Ghostmaster
Member
There is no reality in which destroying an entire SAM network doesn't result in nuclear war.
You could get away with a single station with the whole well maybe it was rebels/ whoopsie daisy. Otherwise it is an open declaration of war and nukes start flying.
Thaedolus
Gold Member
In terms of conventional warfare it's pretty much true. The problem is Russia has thousands of nukes pointed at us.
You think the Russians would decide to end the world over a number of SAM stations being destroyed? I doubt it, although I don't think that escalation with Russia is a good idea in any event.
Ghostmaster
Member
This is not a numbers thing it is their best and prime SAM system and to neutralize it effectively you would pretty much have to destroy most of it.
If they let it fall without doing anythig it would be seen as weakness that Putin can't afford to have with all the ex-KGB brass under him.
There is a reason why they chose that particular system for Syria.
One or two stations maybe, the entire system no chance.
...
I mean dudes, Israel regularly engages targets in Syria with non-stealth fighters and comes away unscathed. Just because you have a bunch of AA in place doesn't mean you can detect, acquire, track, and guide a missile home before the target has already fired, turned and run out of range. We (as in western militaries) are very good and experienced at this sort of shit, whereas almost none of these systems nor their operators have seen non-simulated action against modern air forces.
https://twitter.com/paulmcleary/status/876828341197844481
And now we hope RUS is just bluffing and wont follow through.
Yea. Kinda. The Syrian opposition has already lost. Isis has almost been defeated. Why should we get involved in a conventional war with Russia and Syria? We cannot save these people without full on invading Syria and that's not actually going to help anyway not to mention how fucking bad that would turn out.
We need to destroy isis as much as possible and then gtfo before a bunch more US citizens die. It's not worth it. Sometimes having morals is bad strategy
Sure, but literally ending the world and not doing anything are fairly far apart. I could see them trying to attack a US base in the area or sinking a ship or something in retaliation, but starting a nuclear war - I can't imagine that even someone as despicable as Putin would do that.
AcademicSaucer
Member
Personally I think this is going to de-escalate, the Syrian pilot was rescued and the clashes between US and Russian proxy forces in the area where the incident happened have stopped, they are gonna need to agree in operational areas going forward tho, it's in neither side interest for this to happen again.
I mean you assume Russian systems didn't detect and track e.g. Israeli planes whole time.
See my post above. US military already announced that they will do what ever they want where ever in Syria they want.
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