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Large Youtubers Hide Ownership of CSGO Lottery Site

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Do you think gambling with casino tokens isn't gambling?

Casino token is fixated with a single value writen right on it, making it effectively a currency.
You buy a 5$ casino token with 5$. It's the symbol of 5$.
Mean while 3rd-party goods are not like that. The value is as much as the community dictates it to be.
 
I haven't read the whole thread, but I'm confused.

In that 'win $13,000' video, is he using real money to buy crates that contain in-game money? Or is he winning real money?

He's gambling skins and then winning skins of a higher value which could then be sold outside of the steam ecosystem for real world money.
 

BowieZ

Banned
HonorTheCall's Youtube subs have tripled since I first learned of this. Good shit. H3 getting all the credit but Honor's work seems not to be going entirely unnoticed. :)
Yep. Thanks for reminding me that he deserves a sub too.

Anyone know exactly how many subs TmarTn and Syndicate had prior to this breaking?
 
Lol seriously? You believe this is what's happening here? We are all winning stuffed bear and these guys are cheering for stuffed bear?

LOL. Stuffed bear.

Those guys are cheering for winning digital goods, which can be sold for money.
But again, you can win a stuffed bear and sell it for money.
 

U2NUMB

Member
Tmartn's response video you can practically see him seething for getting caught doing illegal shit.

Also not sure I would have walked around my obviously expensive as hell house explaining that no matter how obvious I am not corrupt was the best thing to do.

I am totally new to any of this.. never knew about gambling or these 2 but holy shit this needs to be looked into at a police level and if it is all true something has to be done.
 

Hektor

Member
Valve really should be held responsible for letting this go this far, they are just as shady as these fucking scammers.

I have seen this beeing brought up nigh a hundred times in this thread and still don't understand why Valve should ever be responsible for what people do with their own stuff.

What's valve "letting go this far"? Ownership? because they actually let you own cosmetics with all ups and downs ownership involves rather than just giving you the rights to use them?

If anyone should be held responsible it's the people using freely tradable goods for gambling purposes, not the provier of the goods.
 
I have seen this beeing brought up nigh a hundred times in this thread and still don't understand why Valve should ever be responsible for what people do with their own stuff.

What's valve "letting go this far"? Ownership? because they actually let you own cosmetics with all ups and downs ownership involves rather than just giving you the rights to use them?

If anyone should be held responsible it's the people using freely tradable goods for gambling purposes, not the provier of the goods.

Freedom has it's price.
Some people just doesn't want freedom for some reasons.
Don't blame Valve for what other people's doing with their stuff.
 

Dennis

Banned
That montage at the end with TMartn almost made me barf. Yes, how DOES he live with doing something like that?

That really is the most baffling thing.

Tmartn going through his mansion recording himself being a lying sanctimonious hypocrite is a whole new level of delusion.

"How do you live with yourself?"
 
I have seen this beeing brought up nigh a hundred times in this thread and still don't understand why Valve should ever be responsible for what people do with their own stuff.

What's valve "letting go this far"? Ownership? because they actually let you own cosmetics with all ups and downs ownership involves rather than just giving you the rights to use them?

If anyone should be held responsible it's the people using freely tradable goods for gambling purposes, not the provier of the goods.

Freedom has it's price.
Some people just doesn't want freedom for some reasons.
Don't blame Valve for what other people's doing with their stuff.
Valve literally controls the economy within which these grey market gambling sites function. If anything happens using their systems with their ecosystem, they are responsible for regulating it.

This shit has nothing to do with "freedom" lmfao
 
I will add honor the truth to the OP to give him the credit he deserves. My apologies for not mentioning him.

Good shit man. No need to apologize, you put up likely what you first knew of it. I'm just making sure that this "little guy attacking the big guy and trying to bring him down" (paraphrased from tmartn's 1st response, fuck that guy and his condescending ass) gets his credit.
 

Zemm

Member
You know what PewDiePie, you're alright.

yeah definitely, his videos aren't for me at all but at a time where so many big name Youtubers are proving themselves as very large shit stains, pewdiepie seems to be squeaky clean and I can respect that.
 

Dennis

Banned
This appears to be a gambling loophole.

That it services underage kids makes it that much more of a big deal.

How sure can we be that the coin flip element of the gambling isn't rigged?

The owners are literally posting videos of the themselves gambling on sites they themselves own. AND WINNING BIG

Seems like a great way to launder (drug) money too.

I will be curious to see how hard the law eventually decides to come down on this.
 
Valve literally controls the economy within which these grey market gambling sites function. If anything happens using their systems with their ecosystem, they are responsible for regulating it.

This shit has nothing to do with "freedom" lmfao

How are they controlling them actually?
Do you have evidence that they works with those site?
The reason why these things are possible was because it's easy to use steam's trade system. If you want to cut it off by shifting the blame to Valve, chance is that trade system won't exist anymore.
 
yeah definitely, his videos aren't for me at all but at a time where so many big name Youtubers are proving themselves as very large shit stains, pewdiepie seems to be squeaky clean and I can respect that.

I wouldnt say squeaky clean, but certainly not in the realm in which these scumbags operate.
 

OCD Guy

Member
yeah definitely, his videos aren't for me at all but at a time where so many big name Youtubers are proving themselves as very large shit stains, pewdiepie seems to be squeaky clean and I can respect that.

He's not though, and he's been involved in a few "scandals" too.

But we are home to a generation with a 5 second attention span, hence why snapchat is so popular, so people forget things so quickly.
 

Blobbers

Member
"When I was a kid, I used to go out and rob. Boys and girls, it's your boy, Millbob"

" so little kids, little kids, little kids, little kids"
 

Magwik

Banned
This appears to be a gambling loophole.

That it services underage kids makes it that much more of a big deal.

How sure can we be that the coin flip element of the gambling isn't rigged?

The owners are literally posting videos of the themselves gambling on sites they themselves own. AND WINNING BIG

Seems like a great way to launder (drug) money too.

I will be curious to see how hard the law eventually decides to come down on this.
And yet there's still people in this thread defending them + Valve for enabling this shit.
 
Syndicate has done this sort of shit twice before too.

Tmartn must have done this with Homefront as no sane person would recommend that game.
 
Valve literally controls the economy within which these grey market gambling sites function. If anything happens using their systems with their ecosystem, they are responsible for regulating it.

This shit has nothing to do with "freedom" lmfao

So the way to solve it is to take down Steam Market and Steam Trading?
 
How are they controlling them actually?
Do you have evidence that they works with those site?
The reason why these things are possible was because it's easy to use steam's trade system. If you want to cut it off by shifting the blame to Valve, chance is that trade system won't exist anymore.
How are they controlling them? They have direct control over every single steam account. They can ban and manipulate accounts as they like. They can make skins tradeable or untradeable, flood the economy with them or make them rare, etc etc. Endless ways in which Valve controls the skin market that these sites abuse. It would be as simple as valve explicitly denying the use of bots for trades (since these sites rely on them, even a captcha to trade would be effective). Valve could also inhibit sites from accessing inventory information, or any number of other things.
So the way to solve it is to take down Steam Market and Steam Trading?
throwing the baby out with the bathwater with that strawman.
 
Can we please regulate/ban any kind of gambling with money in video games?
That includes any kind of gatcha/loot crate system. It's disgusting.
 

hamchan

Member
I get it now. I thought people were trying to say they deserved jail for not disclosing their relationship with the site.

Why are people just singling out these two guys though, there are dozens of CSGO betting sites out there that don't have age gates.

Well yeah, they deserve jail for that. Not properly declaring your conflicts of interest is a huge fucking deal.

Plus this isn't even an accident that they didn't declare, they purposely hid that their owned this betting website and made it seemed like they were just oh so fortunate to win thousands of dollars, so that they could get a bunch of kids into gambling on their site and rake in the cash.

It's shady as fuck and they could have easily rigged the system to give them the wins for their videos. It's fraud and very much looked upon as something extremely serious by most Western countries, with possible jail time on the table.
 

Hypereides

Gold Member

Okay, this should've been the biggest red flag to the Valve community, regarding a shift in Valve's priorities.


How are they controlling them actually?
Do you have evidence that they works with those site?
The reason why these things are possible was because it's easy to use steam's trade system. If you want to cut it off by shifting the blame to Valve, chance is that trade system won't exist anymore.

While its debateble, they are providing the means to do so. Aside, from, alledgedly, allowing users to link their steam accounts to these sites.
 

Tecnniqe

Banned
This seems illegal.

Running a site you promote and gamble on without disclosing it is a violation of at least that FTC ruling about promotional stuff being properly disclosed one would assume.
 

Iadien

Guarantee I'm going to screw up this post? Yeah.
It's funny watching them change profiles and descriptions and set their youtube videos that show their shady shit to private.
 

Nzyme32

Member
Okay, this should've been the biggest red flag to the Valve community, regarding a shift in Valve's priorities.

Not really. They had the economy develop before hiring him. The reason they hired him is in part due to the problems that came with having tradable virtual items and people themselves assigning value towards different things, starting off with the TF2 Apple Ear Buds iirc.

You can actually read exactly what and why it happened directly from the horse's mouth on Valve's old blog - http://blogs.valvesoftware.com/economics/it-all-began-with-a-strange-email/

I believe the developers of Eve were the first to take the approach of hiring an economist to work through the issues such a system brings
 
How are they controlling them? They have direct control over every single steam account. They can ban and manipulate accounts as they like. They can make skins tradeable or untradeable, flood the economy with them or make them rare, etc etc. Endless ways in which Valve controls the skin market that these sites abuse. It would be as simple as valve explicitly denying the use of bots for trades (since these sites rely on them, even a captcha to trade would be effective). Valve could also inhibit sites from accessing inventory information, or any number of other things.
They can do that, but how about false positives? Can they filter out who's legit and who's not? There are non gambling sites which operates solely on bots too like tf2scraps, should they ban them? Laws are absolute, there is no "exception", if you apply a rule which would shutdown both illegal and legal activities, would you do it?
Changing item's value won't change the gambling scene. Instead of gambling a gun which worth 100$, they will gamble 5 20$ guns instead.
Also rares don't actually worth a damn in CS or Dota. It's the unique, unusual or limited editions which worth a lot.
 

Atomski

Member
Theres nothing like people trying to lie and cover up things on the internet. Do people really think deleting or editing text covers shit up? Seems like it happens constantly.. even here on neogaf.
 

Nere

Member
Yeah they are scammers but what was valve thinking when they made those skins tradable for real money, like in dota 2. Didn't they thought someone is going to take advantage of it?
 

hamchan

Member
Yeah they are scammers but what was valve thinking when they made those skins tradable for real money, like in dota 2. Didn't they thought someone is going to take advantage of it?

They thought they would get rich and they have. I really don't think Valve cares about this gambling stuff while they get rich from the whole ecosystem too.
 
Yeah they are scammers but what was valve thinking when they made those skins tradable for real money, like in dota 2. Didn't they thought someone is going to take advantage of it?
Valve is only thinking $$$, and they will continue to look the other way as long as people keep spending.
 
Being a 30 something male, shouty Youtubers are well outside my circle of knowledge. But man, this is super fucked and super illegal. I hope these rat bastards get what's coming to them.
 

Atomski

Member
valve could easily combat this by removing third party site linking no ?

that has its negatives to though.. there are people out there using this for legit reasons.

Like there are game sharing websites where if you have a extra game you can trade it or give away to random people.. no money involved. Its nice and would be a shame if skin lottery takes that away.
 
The video is 4 times on the reddit front page, these guys are fucked.

What do you think is going to happen to them? Realistically?

I mean, we all want justice for this bullshit but I can't imagine a satisfying outcome. They'll probably get away with it.
 
The crackdown on this was inevitably going to happen, the CSGO section on twitch was so rampant with this kind of gambling. Twitch had to make some rule changes that basically said streamers can't stream more than 30 minutes of CSGO gambling at a time without any gameplay or you'll get a strike on your account.

I think the biggest bummer about this whole situation is that children and teenagers are being influenced by these types of people. Gambling is already a risky thing as a grown adult and now legions of young people are growing up with these kinds of promoters.
 
The video is 4 times on the reddit front page, these guys are fucked.

f418FW2.png

I love how r/Games is basically banning discussion of it though.

Reddit is such a joke sometimes
 

ar4757

Member
What do you think is going to happen to them? Realistically?

I mean, we all want justice for this bullshit but I can't imagine a satisfying outcome. They'll probably get away with it.

Well they've been busted for non disclosure before and this is a worse situation so at least something will happen law-wise
 
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