Hudo
Member
They've made and/or agreed to the deal. So they are sure as hell at fault as well.
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Merge of Discovery and Warner Bros. renders PlayStation licensing agreement worthless. (Up: new licensing agreement, shows will not be removed)
- Thread starter Thick Thighs Save Lives
- Start date
MALpractice311
Member
Wow. It's almost as though this is a very obvious possibility of an all digital future that physical media fans have been trying to warn you guys about for years.
Negotiator101
Member
Well I'd imagine it works like retail no? Sony being the distributor? What's going on in this case?
HerjansEagleFeeder
Member
You show 'em, pal. They will be angry at the money they already got from you.
What's going on in this case is that the copyright owner does not ask for money from consumers to download a product over a term, only to sell it for a fixed term. it's not like a subscription where it goes up for a fixed period and they need to renew to keep it on a paid subscription but in either case the copyright owner still retains the right to remove the license at any time.
The only reason you would remove something for sale or download is if you had some competing store/streaming agreement or goal in place which prevented it. Otherwise what exactly are you gaining as the copyright holder?
Ronin_7
Banned
No it ain't.
I mean it's mode to blame Sony or Microsoft these days but it won't make your life any better mate.
Be better, this is 100% merger entity fault.
Between stuff like this and the fact every publisher now has their own streaming service, I've happily gone back to pirating for most movies and tv-shows. Most large coorperations are a bunch of scumbags so I don't even feel sorry for 'em. The entire world turned into nickle and diming everything.
I have a Crunchyroll subscription because I wanna support anime but even then I've started a blu-ray collection for the stuff I really like. And I have everything I like also on an external harddrive just in case.
I have a Crunchyroll subscription because I wanna support anime but even then I've started a blu-ray collection for the stuff I really like. And I have everything I like also on an external harddrive just in case.
Thankfully I never brought a movie/show through an online store, always made sense to buy a physical copy. Though for more niche/reality shows, having a physical copy isn't really feasible.
I remember when this used to happen to online music stores when they lost the rights to an album, the official advice was to burn the purchased tracks to an audio CD, which will be your backup copy. Not sure how you can hook up a PS4 to a VHS/DVD recorder.
I remember when this used to happen to online music stores when they lost the rights to an album, the official advice was to burn the purchased tracks to an audio CD, which will be your backup copy. Not sure how you can hook up a PS4 to a VHS/DVD recorder.
NeoIkaruGAF
Gold Member
Nah, they’ll delete your TLOU2 digital copy on a yearly basis and you’ll be able to buy the yearly remaster for a measly $10.
Lunarorbit
Member
Yup. Hbo/discovery/timewarner have been sold so many times you can't trust people at these companies to give any shits about digital customers.
HBO used to mean quality but so much fuckery has happened in the last decade. At some point congress is going to pass legislation about digital rights for consumers.
ReBurn
Gold Member
Apparently it isn't yours to keep and it doesn't transfer, though. We're having a whole thread about it.
It matters where you buy digital content because licensing rights for film and TV are way too complicated to trust building libraries of it on platforms that do not outright own the rights. The fact that content someone bought and paid for can simply be taken away because of contract disputes completely unrelated to your purchase just puts a pin in it.
Tams
Member
"Own".
FunkMiller
Gold Member
All digital purchases should be regarded as rentals for an indefinite period of time.
There's actually only one way you can have something digitally, and be guaranteed that you own it for as long as you like, and that's called piracy.
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ReBurn
Gold Member
They really should. It's unfortunate, but you have to be ok with losing access digital content managed by a third party when you buy on their platform. Doesn't matter whether it's movies, music or games.
The only time I buy digital movies is when it's cheaper to buy it than it is to rent it and then I don't care if it goes away.Happens quite often on Amazon Prime where it's 3 bucks to buy a movie on sale but 4 or 5 to rent it.
I know that one day I'll lose access to digital game purchases I made, which is why I normally only buy digital games at deep discounts. If I paid 10 bucks and I had a good time then it's not a big deal if it were to go away. Games seem to be more stable at the moment than digital tv, movies or music, though. I currently still have access to all of the digital games I paid for from PS360 gen to now aside from a handful of small virtual console games I bought on the Wii shop. All of my Steam games are still there, too. I expect that one day Sony is going to pull the plug on being able to re-download my old PS3 digital games and I'll be annoyed. But I probably won't have anything working to play them on by that time, anyway.
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radewagon
Member
It's too early to tell, but I don't think it's quite that simple. I'd imagine that almost every contract a provider makes with a license-holder having to do with digital licensing has some sort of escape clause that's just standard boiler plate language like "reserves the right to blah blah blah." The contract we make with Sony when we buy digital content would have similar language as well. Those of us who are critical of the all-digital future are critical exactly for reasons like this. It's always been, basically, the honor system.
My guess is that Warner/Discovery is making use of bog-standard contract language that everyone in the business just assumes no one would be dumb enough to actually use. It's crazy to think that any license-holder would ever sign a contract ensuring that the content provider has an unlimited right to provide content that they do not own. Sony likely signed a perfectly normal and industry standard agreement that is being abused by a notoriously foolish and prudish company.
Seriously, Warner/Discovery killed a Batgirl Movie, Close Enough, and fricken' Mystery Train. Until there is evidence to the contrary, I will put all blame on them exclusively.
Omnipunctual Godot
Gold Member
Yes, I will take back what I purchased instead of spending money to buy it again, which is what they would want. Galaxy brain take.
Hudo
Member
I cannot even begin to describe how little I care about any of this. If it makes you (and other in this thread as well, it seems) feel any better: Yeah, 100% not Sony's fault.
Doesn't matter in the end because the consumer is fucked anyway. And Sony, as much as it must hurt some people to hear this, are at the tail end of this because they are the ones selling this shit on their platform. So they get the blame.
Edit: The real solution to all of this is for consumers to tell every company to fuck off with some digital service bullshit. But that won't happen.
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Negotiator101
Member
Right so what agreement would Sony have had with the copyright holder that has now changed? Isn't there a responsibility from whomever you've made the purchase from to safeguard your rights as a consumer? I mean people have spent their money and are now having that item taken away. I'm just curious how this works with say Steam? Or is that different in some way?
Shake Your Rump
Member
What they should do is disable DRM on all purchased content. It could be as simple as updating everything with a 99-year license.
It's the same for steam. If the copyright holder wishes they can have their copyrighted content removed from your library. It's not steams fault
Steam Removes Game 'Order Of War: Challenge' From User Libraries
The removal of a game from Steam user libraries raises important questions about digital ownership.
www.forbes.com
reinking
Gold Member
People seem to miss the fact that Sony does not own this content either. They have no more control over removing the content than we have over it being removed. It doesn't make me happy. Read almost any user agreement and it is clear that a digital content purchase is nothing more than a long-term rental. Even from your point of view, it is as much your fault as it is theirs because you knowingly (or should have known) that you were purchasing a license agreement that can be revoked at any time. This lies on either the content holder for using their advantage to make agreements temporary, or all of our fault, for going along with it.
..but I agree. I have been saying it for years, this all-digital future is going to be
when it comes to content access and people are jumping for joy that it is the future because of convenience.
Mobilemofo
Member
I warned about this shit time ago. It starts happening periodically, then, next thing you know, your licensed product, you bought, has "expired" / disappeared. Your purchases are essentially long term rentals. Companies need to be made to answer for this. Once we're fully digital, imma buy some quality lube, and start praying twice a day.
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Dorfdad
Gold Member
Never understood owning movies anymore in the digital age. I could buy a blu ray for 20+ dollars and watch it 3 times in a row than it could sit for years before I watch again.
Or I could rent it for 2.99 and watch it whenever I want and still be saving money over retail costs
Punished Miku
Gold Member
I explained it. I dont see 2.99 rentals. This is about the same price as a rental.
BennyBlanco
aka IMurRIVAL69
It's the same for steam. If the copyright holder wishes they can have their copyrighted content removed from your library. It's not steams fault
Steam Removes Game 'Order Of War: Challenge' From User Libraries
The removal of a game from Steam user libraries raises important questions about digital ownership.
Read the update, they only removed the multiplayer portion because the servers were dead.
Last Hearth
Member
The amount of sheer crap that is out there is truly astounding.
BennyBlanco
aka IMurRIVAL69
do we still not know what is gonna happen to people who bought this content on Apple TV and Amazon? That will tell the story on whos fault this is
ZoukGalaxy
Member
That's plain simple:
DIGITAL FUTURE = YOU OWN NOTHING
And if you trust big corporates to take care for you of "your ownership", just wait for it n
The only exception is service like GOG or BANDCAMP (musics) where you can download and re-install ANYTIME your content at your ease.
People praising digital are digging they own grave, plain and simple.
The sad thing is that preservation will be done by... pirates. Pretty hilarious.
DIGITAL FUTURE = YOU OWN NOTHING
And if you trust big corporates to take care for you of "your ownership", just wait for it n
The only exception is service like GOG or BANDCAMP (musics) where you can download and re-install ANYTIME your content at your ease.
People praising digital are digging they own grave, plain and simple.
The sad thing is that preservation will be done by... pirates. Pretty hilarious.
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Crispy Gamer
Member
“As of August 31, 2022, due to our evolving licensing agreements with content providers, you will no longer be able to view your previously purchased Studio Canal content and it will be removed from your video library,” the notices read. “We greatly appreciate your continued support.” .....The same bs happend last year in Germany & Austria at this point I'm not buying anything else digital I'm glad I started my 4k bluray collection again. I just don't see how Sony could escape without any culpability here the content providers are more at fault obviously but Sony has to take some responsibility they should at least going forward have bigger disclaimers when buying digital content
ChorizoPicozo
Member
Read the ToS 
Wizz-Art
Member
I own a significant physical collection of movies and tv shows, started collecting since the late '90s when DVD came out, via HD-DVD and Blu-Ray I buy UHD's now which to me is the definitive media and end of the line when it comes to physical. A shame some distributors like Disney/Fox and Sony started to push for the all digital future while totally abandoning regions like the Benelux.
I also started buying stuff digitally on the MS store (I earn quite a lot off MS rewards this way) which I don't feel the need to own on physical media, I simply buy only from the weekly sales for quite cheap $5 on average. Fortunately nothing has disappeared or so. Close to half of the titles are Movies Anywhere too and automatically ported over to the MA app once I bought them through the MS store.
Through the Movies and TV app on your Windows PC you are able to download all the titles you purchased if you wish to, but I'm not sure how the DRM works if you want to use it offline when downloaded.
Why does this affect only PS users, aren't Discovery selling their stuff on all the digital stores, so wouldn't every digital store have this licensing issue?
I also started buying stuff digitally on the MS store (I earn quite a lot off MS rewards this way) which I don't feel the need to own on physical media, I simply buy only from the weekly sales for quite cheap $5 on average. Fortunately nothing has disappeared or so. Close to half of the titles are Movies Anywhere too and automatically ported over to the MA app once I bought them through the MS store.
Through the Movies and TV app on your Windows PC you are able to download all the titles you purchased if you wish to, but I'm not sure how the DRM works if you want to use it offline when downloaded.
Why does this affect only PS users, aren't Discovery selling their stuff on all the digital stores, so wouldn't every digital store have this licensing issue?
TheInfamousKira
Reseterror Resettler
Real Housewife fans and Playstation gamers. A powerful venn diagram.
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
Apple is already not shy of taking things away from people's libraries.
So it'll be business as usual for them.
Duchess
Member
Amazon did this, too. They remotely deleted a book from people's Kindles that they hadn't been authorised to sell.
The book? 1984. I'm not joking.
CamHostage
Member
Not sure? It could be that this is happening elsewhere with WB Discovery content but notifications have not gone out, but if this is all ending Dec 31, you'd expect it to need to happen quickly.
(I believe Apple in the past has pulled content license from a user's library without warning, so maybe they just don't even bother telling you on other services?)
Sony was pretty early and pushy in the non-physical entertainment market and so their contracts may date back to less cemented times of content rights. (Albeit iTunes came way before PS3/PSP, and other DD services still exist or have been acquired/absorbed in that time which would have even older contract language; I'd also be surprised if new contract language is even less consumer-friendly, since media publishers now know the value of their library content and also have fewer outlets of monetizing their library now that streaming has funneled the market.)
Maybe also there might be some clause which WB Discovery can exploit in PlayStation being a multimedia device line primarily for gaming (or because it was for multiple device types, now with generations of hardware and a mix of home box and portable devices, plus big changes in the underlying PSN content management system over time,) that didn't lock down the movie/TV content strongly enough.
Or maybe WB Discovery just raised the rates insanely (or "insanely" from Sony's perspective, which is "reasonable" for every other company who cares that its customers feel their digital purchases are secured for the life of the account and so they paid up while Sony didn't.
Or WB saw Sony as technically a competitor for its streaming service (even though we're talking 15+ year old shows, and Sony doesn't have its own streaming subscription destination) and intentionally pulled the license where it made sense to cut out the paperwork funnel the user base. (The indicator here I would think would be something like FandangoNow/Vudu, although I think WB still owns a stake of Fandango with NBC Universal.)
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Zuzu
Member
4K blu ray should be the future for owning movies. Not only is the quality better but it’s yours forever if you take care of it. Digital is fine for streaming rented movies but you don’t truly own your purchased films.
Many more people have access now to 4k blu ray players now that the PS5 and Series X have them built in. I encourage everyone to buy their treasured and favourite films on 4k blu ray. The experience is better and you actually own and can watch it anytime with or without the internet. And none of these corporations can take it from you.
Many more people have access now to 4k blu ray players now that the PS5 and Series X have them built in. I encourage everyone to buy their treasured and favourite films on 4k blu ray. The experience is better and you actually own and can watch it anytime with or without the internet. And none of these corporations can take it from you.
I guess this is the standard for digital movies, but it shouldn't be. All store fronts should band together on this, though i guess that isn't realistic. A law seems the more likely solution.
Companies can and do avoid this kind of situation though. Microsoft for example buys a cheaper limited license for the cars in the Forza Horizon series to where you can't buy the game after a few years. You don't lose the game though, and can still re-download.
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
You know what? I think you're right.
Torrent of Pork
Banned
I'm against piracy generally, but if you bought a license then sail on.
Omnipunctual Godot
Gold Member
Louis Rossman put out a video on it.
Heimdall_Xtreme
Jim Ryan Fanclub's #1 Member
There are only 4 months until Jim Ryan leaves.
graywolf323
Member
man I know you have an extreme hatred of Jim Ryan but you honestly think this is his fault somehow? these agreements that are being terminated long long predate him being the head of SIE
