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Trump/Russia dossier author is former head of MI6's Russia desk + Russia specialist

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I've seen numbers in the 40 billions passed around but Putin is careful. He's been in power for a long time. I think if they could Agencies would have done so long ago.

I'm sure the agencies of the various Western allies have been trying to get dirt on Putin, but you'd think they'd try a little harder now with him deliberating undermining the democratic process in foreign countries. Specifically, I'd think Germany's Merkel might want to put as much pressure on Putin before he orchestrates her ousting (but that may be inevitable anyway).

But who will punish Putin, really? He basically has the government on lockdown from what I understand. Other countries could impose insane sanctions like we've never seen before, but he clearly doesn't give a shit, since he's spending the country into the ground with the amount of sanctions he has now.

The only ways I see Putin going down at this point is if there's a massive revolt from the people, or there's an unknown force within his government and military that is willing to take him down dirty style with this as the prime excuse.

There are plenty of quieted, dissident voices opposed to Putin in Russia. They just need some enormous scandal to help them. I think the embezzling story would be the best. If they can implicate Putin with embezzling billions while so many in Russia are in poverty, that could really turn the people against him.
 

Gutek

Member
He will.

If anything I see the Republicans use this to control him more while also getting through even more extreme laws.

Once he has outlived his usefulness or steps out of line too much they can drop the hammer.

Until then they can use Trump as the face of every voter rights stripping, anti LGBT, pro gun, anti science, anti environmental law they can think of.

Trump's a security liability, though.

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4906642,00.html
 

kiguel182

Member
Will we ever know if the report is true? It's crazy if it is.

This whole thing is bonkers.

Edit: the fact that we are discussing if the US has elected a possible traitor is crazy. I mean, Trump was always awful but this tops it all.
 

Akuun

Looking for meaning in GAF
Good read. Explains why a lot of people hold his work in high confidence.

Of course, some armchair asswad on 4chan or Reddit will think he knows better.
 

Whompa02

Member
Excited to see the possibility of Trump going down as the worst president in the history of the United States.

He's already polling at 37% approval rating. An all time low, especially before he even takes oath into the office.

This is bigger than Watergate. This is treason on the international level.
 
Why are people even mentioning 4chan? Just a bunch of 16 year olds trying to troll.

I think his credentials pretty much prove that Trump is guilty af. Lock him up
 

Kathian

Banned
Why are people even mentioning 4chan? Just a bunch of 16 year olds trying to troll.

I think his credentials pretty much prove that Trump is guilty af. Lock him up

One guy on 4chan claimed it. The fact this misinformation has spread so wide is why it's effective. Trumps Trumpettes sit and through shit between each other all day, all night - they then exagerrste and push anything that works in his favour.

The impact here is most people look around for info. So they comes across the 4chan bollocks. Maybe 1 in 20 believe it. That converts them to seeing some 'mainstream media conspiracy' and they are ultimately going to believe the sources that told them it was 4chan in the future.

People are still spewing the 4chan shit despite their being zero evidence and in fact it being validated where the information came from.
 
I don't really know what to make of all this. I mean, as I said in the other thread, Trump being influenced by the Russians and Putin is about as surprising as the sun rising with everything that's gone on, and Trump's ties and attitude toward Russia through his whole campaign. But faced with it...it's so surreal.

When you actually look at the cabinet picks through the eyes of Russian influence, it makes a startlingly amount of sense, doesn't it? All of the picks are either totally unqualified, against the very department they are coming into, and the highest foreign policy in the land is a man with no political experience who is a known friend of the Kremlin. Man, it all makes sense when you look at it as a way of destroying the US from within.

I hope I'm wrong and I'm just falling into hyberbole, but this feels like the end of the American Republic. The only real buffer to all this is the GOP, and I legit don't know if they even care enough about this country to try and stop it's demise via a foreign party. If anything, they may see it as a chance to rebuild the country completely in their image. I'm really scared right now.
 
I remember recently my Russian step-mother (she lives in the UK) praised Trump and that only Russian media had good things to say about him.

Gee... I wonder why.
 
Will we ever know if the report is true? It's crazy if it is.

This whole thing is bonkers.

Edit: the fact that we are discussing if the US has elected a possible traitor is crazy. I mean, Trump was always awful but this tops it all.

It is crazy, but as I discussed in another thread, Trump being in bed in some fashion with Russia isn't surprising at all. I don't know how much you followed our election, but Trump has had a very weird soft rhetoric towards Russia, plus has business ties there, had staff on his team with ties to Russia, and we know now that Russia influenced our election primarily to help Trump, he's expressed great dislike at the sanctions Obama put on Russia after the former came out, he's nominated a friend of the Kremlin as SoS, and probably most telling of all, his whole strongman persona just goes out the window when it comes to Putin and Russia. He boldly (and stupidly) takes on China, he's always vicious to anyone and everyone who dislikes or is dissenting, but when it comes to Russia and Putin, he won't say a real stern word about them. I mean, it's really all been out there for awhile. It's just crazy that it's not all some weird coincidence, that it very well could be a real thing.
 
There are plenty of quieted, dissident voices opposed to Putin in Russia. They just need some enormous scandal to help them. I think the embezzling story would be the best. If they can implicate Putin with embezzling billions while so many in Russia are in poverty, that could really turn the people against him.

I hope you're right, but I wouldn't put it past Putin to just send in the army and just kill massive amount of protestors to be honest. I really don't see any indication this guy cares at all.
 
That report is going to have some possibly inaccurate information but if you think an ex-MI6 agent, who is well respected by the US intelligence community and has worked with them in the past, is going to compile and submit a dossier to his clients that is 100% false, then you're wilfully putting your head in the sand.
This is my rational exactly but you can already see the pro-Trump audience jumping from 4Chan wind-up to IC global conspiracy.

Whilst I try to be as open minded as possible, based on what Trump has done and the established credibility of the source I can quite easily believe there is enough truth in the raw intelligence to condemn Trump with confidence.
 
This is my rational exactly but you can already see the pro-Trump audience jumping from 4Chan wind-up to IC global conspiracy.

Whilst I try to be as open minded as possible, based on what Trump has done and the established credibility of the source I can quite easily believe there is enough truth in the raw intelligence to condemn Trump with confidence.

The way in which the right has sealed themselves up in a bubble to me is so insane. It's like there's absolutely no reaching anyone who identities even softly as a conservative anymore.
 

Magwik

Banned
Putin's playing with house money. At this point, there is literally no outcome in which he does not benefit.
Putin either gets a puppet as president or permanently fucks the US political system due to the findings of his intervention. Dude was playing 4D Chess the entire time.
 
It's like there couldn't have been a more qualified person to write this report than this guy.
Exactly. It's becoming pretty unlikely that none of it is true, and given the number of damning things in there...

I don't get why the WSJ would leak the guy's identity as a favor to Murdoch, as his credentials cement the report's credibility (at great personal cost for the guy though).
 
He will.

If anything I see the Republicans use this to control him more while also getting through even more extreme laws.

Once he has outlived his usefulness or steps out of line too much they can drop the hammer.

Until then they can use Trump as the face of every voter rights stripping, anti LGBT, pro gun, anti science, anti environmental law they can think of.

Pence will rubber stamp everything they want. No need to keep Trump that long, too damaging. Remember, they finally had to turn on Nixon.
 

Aurongel

Member
4chan has zero proof and no method or avenue to prove accountability on their behalf. It's an unprovable source of information and should be treated with the same trust as a Stormfront piece on Jewish philosophy.
 
This "article" looks as if it were written by a publicist. Since when do we believe every word from intelligence agencies. Until properly vetted and confirmed this is still some oppo research and nothing more. Would everyone here take at face value of it were about Obama or Clinton?
 

andymcc

Banned
This "article" looks as if it were written by a publicist. Since when do we believe every word from intelligence agencies. Until properly vetted and confirmed this is still some oppo research and nothing more. Would everyone here take at face value of it were about Obama or Clinton?

Would you call it fake news, comrade?
 
Would you call it fake news, comrade?

I would call what we know so far unsubstantiated. Fake? Yeah, maybe it is. Or maybe it was released far too early by Buzzfeed. We are in for a long 8 years if people are breathlessly pinning their hopes on every unverified, uncorroborated story that comes along.
 
The Spy Who Wrote the Trump-Russia Memos: It Was "Hair-Raising" Stuff
When I broke the story in October, I spoke with him. Here's what he said.

The former spy told me that he had been retained in early June by a private research firm in the United States to look into Trump's activity in Europe and Russia. "It started off as a fairly general inquiry," he recalled. One question for him, he said, was, "Are there business ties in Russia?" The American firm was conducting a Trump opposition research project that was first financed by a Republican source until the funding switched to a Democratic one. The former spy said he was never told the identity of the client.

The former intelligence official went to work and contacted his network of sources in Russia and elsewhere. He soon received what he called "hair-raising" information. His sources told him, he said, that Trump had been "sexually compromised" by Russian intelligence in 2013 (when Trump was in Moscow for the Miss Universe contest) or earlier and that there was an "established exchange of information between the Trump campaign and the Kremlin of mutual benefit." He noted he was "shocked" by these allegations. By the end of June, he was sending reports of what he was finding to the American firm.

The former spy said he soon decided the information he was receiving was "sufficiently serious" for him to forward it to contacts he had at the FBI. He did this, he said, without permission from the American firm that had hired him. "This was an extraordinary situation," he remarked.

The response to the information from the FBI, he recalled, was "shock and horror." After a few weeks, the bureau asked him for information on his sources and their reliability and on how he had obtained his reports. He was also asked to continue to send copies of his subsequent reports to the bureau. These reports were not written, he noted, as finished work products; they were updates on what he was learning from his various sources. But he said, "My track record as a professional is second to no one."

The former spy told me that he was reluctant to be talking with a reporter. He pointed out this was not his common practice. "Someone like me stays in the shadows," he said. But he indicated that he believed this material was important, and he was unsure how the FBI was handling it. Certainly, there had been no public signs that the FBI was investigating these allegations. (The FBI at the time refused to tell me if it had received the memos or if it was examining the allegations.)

"This was something of huge significance, way above party politics," the former spy told me. "I think [Trump's] own party should be aware of this stuff as well." He noted that he believed Russian intelligence's efforts aimed at Trump were part of Vladimir Putin's campaign to "disrupt and divide and discredit the system in Western democracies."
http://www.motherjones.com/politics...-trump-russia-memos-it-was-hair-raising-stuff
 
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