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Nioh Thread: Defy Death

Lynx_7

Member
Muneshige, it's a straight up duel. It appears after beating Hinoenma on the world map.

Oh, I thought the other side mission would be just like the first one (a bunch of "common" mobs) so I didn't bother with it.
This guy is pretty insane. I'm being pretty much locked to death by a few of his attacks. With full health.
 

Gr1mLock

Passing metallic gas
Agreed, I found it difficult to get back in the grove after the Alpha. In fact, I thought they made the game more difficult. After some getting used to it, It felt easy again. Honestly, once you lean how to deal with multiple enemies and properly using R1 to recover your samurai spirit/stamina/whatever its called, the game becomes much easier.

Like in the Alpha, I tried going with a Scout set item build, for maximum stamina recovery. I found like only 2 Scout items. Also, the addition of the dual katanas, rifles, and cannons really increased my personal enjoyment.

Question, does the game have a elemental weakness system in it? I've wondered when I fought Tachibana if his Lightning Dog was weak against another one of the Spirits. I beat him using the Shark because I played most of the Alpha with that thing. Felt wrong not using him.

After beating him I used the puppy for a little bit, beat Twilight version of the Cave, and have closed the book on the Beta. Excited for the full release. Hopefully Mark of the Strong and Mark of the Conqueror unlock something useful in the final game.



I felt like this for a bit, It felt better once I got the DLC and started just to play it for fun. The drive to get the DLC made it annoying. Once I got it, and that wasn't hanging over my head, I started to enjoy it more because I wasn't focusing on that. Instead I was focusing on farming levels, getting used to the controls again, finding all the little shrine dudes etc etc.

Started off feeling weird about it, ended up loving it again.

I'm not sure how the elemental stuff works beyond how it applies to the player. I'm aware it exists lol, but beyond that I'm woefully uninformed. On a general note though, I had literally not a single good thing to say about the first alpha. I thoroughly disliked it. This build genuinely won me over. Despite my grievances I like where it's gotten and will definitely pick up the final game.
 
Ooookay......I wasn't having too much trouble with the beta, until Hino. Can anybody give me some tips? I am getting absolutely rekt.

Dual katana user, level 16.
 

Morrigan Stark

Arrogant Smirk
Ooookay......I wasn't having too much trouble with the beta, until Hino. Can anybody give me some tips? I am getting absolutely rekt.

Dual katana user, level 16.
Use the whirlwind kind of ability (L1 + triangle in high stance) to do some solid damage once she's open (which is after her combos), switch to low stance to dodge faster if you need to.
 
Use the whirlwind kind of ability (L1 + triangle in high stance) to do some solid damage once she's open (which is after her combos), switch to low stance to dodge faster if you need to.
I'll give it a try. My main issue right now is running out of Ki constantly. Maybe I just need to level up more? Heart is at like 10/11 I think.
 

Nose Master

Member
Twilight mode is amazing. Was not expecting
a mimic.
The reward is A+, also.

Ooookay......I wasn't having too much trouble with the beta, until Hino. Can anybody give me some tips? I am getting absolutely rekt.

Dual katana user, level 16.

Be ready to dodge the wave when she screams. Bait out her attacks / only attack after a third swing (if you really want to play it safe.) Guard her spin. Don't get too greedy with punishes, 1-2 attacks is plenty.
 

TheOasis

Member
Both main bosses of the Alpha and Beta I've beaten using the try and true Dark Souls technique of poke and run, than anything flashy from other character action games.

You can kill them 10x faster if you fight them using the character action game-like speed the combat mechanics can give to you when you use them optimally.

How are the enemies in this game any different from a Souls game?

They're quite similar with the main differences being their attack and movement speeds generally being faster as well as having less cool down time on their attacks. Obviously, this all makes sense considering how fast the actions of the player character can be.
 

Ogawa-san

Member
Wish there was a twilight duel...for more amrita.
Judging by the twilight stuff we've seen so far, I'm gonna assume Muneshige would summon 3 raikens at once, with their own attack timing so you can't escape that stupid slow debuff.

On top of the obligatory adds that is, undead archers and those asshole zombie things that are impossible to hit because they stay crouched all the time, just waiting to super armor grab you.
 
Judging by the twilight stuff we've seen so far, I'm gonna assume Muneshige would summon 3 raikens at once, with their own attack timing so you can't escape that stupid slow debuff.

On top of the obligatory adds that is, undead archers and those asshole zombie things that are impossible to hit because they stay crouched all the time, just waiting to super armor grab you.

Don't forget the dudes that will be on the cliffs throwing mega horuku-damas down on you.

Speaking of which, that ninja tool is fucking hilarious. That's one giant ass bomb that he throws.
 
You can kill them 10x faster if you fight them using the character action game-like speed the combat mechanics can give to you when you use them optimally.

I'm guessing its revolves around the stance changing?

But still, it means Souls strategies are still viable.

They're quite similar with the main differences being their attack and movement speeds generally being faster as well as having less cool down time on their attacks. Obviously, this all makes sense considering how fast the actions of the player character can be.

Which means things are even out.

I suppose there's an extra layer of depth involving the Ki bar and how enemies behave depending on it but I don't think that's what been giving Souls players a hard time...
 

Morrigan Stark

Arrogant Smirk
Yeah, I'm a Souls player and feel completely at home in this beta (not so much in the alpha, because of the bad camera and poor tracking on attacks due to the shitty lock-on). I don't know why so many Souls player are struggling this bad.

I mean I struggled too, but I still do OK. You gotta use the abilities they give you is all. Not just ki pulse and all the stances, but the combos, the finishers, the special abilities etc.
 

Lynx_7

Member
Ok, got the samurai guy finally, that shit was tough. The fact that I'm pretty much playing this like a greatsword user in Monster Hunter/Dark Souls (high stance, nail a few solid hits and keep your distance) probably didn't help against such a fast opponent. I know I should probably be trying to change stances for the extra ki regen and mixing up my fighting style but hey, if it's working then it's working. :p
 

Nose Master

Member
Yeah, I'm a Souls player and feel completely at home in this beta (not so much in the alpha, because of the bad camera and poor tracking on attacks due to the shitty lock-on). I don't know why so many Souls player are struggling this bad.

I mean I struggled too, but I still do OK. You gotta use the abilities they give you is all. Not just ki pulse and all the stances, but the combos, the finishers, the special abilities etc.

I don't use most of that and I'm doing fine. Finishers and the like have just led me open to attack, since no animations seem to have invul frames minus the dodge. The biggest change / hurdle for me was understanding just how ridiculous the penalty for running out of stamina is. You pretty much just lay down and take it when that happens.

Speaking of, any tips for Twilight Boss 2? As of now every time an add spawns I've just been diddling around waiting for a paralysis wave and then bopping the add during her recovery from it. She does so much damage, though.
 

Sayad

Member
I'll give it a try. My main issue right now is running out of Ki constantly. Maybe I just need to level up more? Heart is at like 10/11 I think.
Stay in low stance while not attacking her, low stance consume less ki on dodges, and if you have Mind Eye(dual swords) ability dodging in low stance make her spin aoe attack useless.
 
Ok, got the samurai guy finally, that shit was tough. The fact that I'm pretty much playing this like a greatsword user in Monster Hunter/Dark Souls (high stance, nail a few solid hits and keep your distance) probably didn't help against such a fast opponent. I know I should probably be trying to change stances for the extra ki regen and mixing up my fighting style but hey, if it's working then it's working. :p

I couldn't break through 25% of his health until I realized that I can punish his rapid slash.
 

Forceatowulf

G***n S**n*bi
This game really is Ninja Gaiden meets Dark Souls. I'm in love.

So much god damn style too. Ni Oh really is the perfect blend of substance and style.

I'm. In. Love.
 

Forceatowulf

G***n S**n*bi
I really hope the dlc, whatever it may be, is nice. Really though.. I'd be cool if they just let me keep my life recovery Katana. I had a katana with 40 more attack power + water element and I still couldn't let my baby go <3

Oh yeah and FUCK Tachibana. Haven't felt that good slaying an enemy in a minute.
 

Nerokis

Member
You can kill them 10x faster if you fight them using the character action game-like speed the combat mechanics can give to you when you use them optimally.

I want to see this. I did alright going through the two main stages, but so much of the game still feels really hazy, and I'm pretty sure I've barely scratched the surface of the gameplay.

On a random note, it's interesting to see this kind of game have a Diablo-esque loot system. It has the potential to be pretty cool if they can cut down on how tedious and unsatisfying it is to wade through everything. The amount of loot that drops + poor organization + ill-defined parameters (is level really the best way to communicate item power here, what's the improvement I'm looking at with this familiarity, etc.) = a pain. Also wouldn't mind them throwing some extra info on loot while it's still on the ground, like level or something along those lines, since right now I have no idea whether something I pick up will be useful at all. And seriously, if you're going to send a million stones my way, send them to some kind of storage so they aren't a complete waste! :p

And on a different note, I'm not sure how much I'm feeling the stat system. Maybe it's just me, but leveling up hasn't really felt satisfying, and I'm finding it hard to see what kind of builds you're intended to be coming up with in your head. Also feels like levels come a little too slowly.

Overall, though, my first impression is definitely very positive. I love the Souls games, and this is a refreshing and even exciting take on that formula. But there are times I find myself not really being sure what they're going for, and there's definitely still plenty of room for polish. Looking forward to checking out the final product as soon as it releases.
 

Baalzebup

Member
Controversial Theory:

Those with a pedigree in Devil May Cry / Ninja Gaiden do far better in this game than those with a Dark Souls "background."

I have seen way too many, "but, I platinumed Dark Souls 3 yet I can't beat the first boss in Nioh" posts.

Heh, definitely not so controversial as this was brought up before :)
Im only quoting you as an example so don't take this as me personally referring to you.

I've been seeing this statement a lot. Experienced Souls players being crushed by Nioh. I'm not going to say something edgy like Souls is actually easy but Souls never requires player to learn complex executions- You just need to learn to use 4 buttons - "Attack, Block, Dodge, Heal".

Nioh is part Souls, but it's also has the DNA of a Character Action game.... Particularly the hardest of the Character Action games lol.
Well, it certainly is true that where previous gaming experience is concerned, having played both Souls and something like DMC4 using Uncle Dante is a major boost in learning Nioh. Having only Souls under ones belt gives one only a part of the equation, and since one expects to do well because of the Souls-DNA in Nioh, the impact of still being curb-stomped will be all the greater. I think character-action gamers might have easier time adjusting to the Souls-DNA than the other way around.

I personally find Nioh very refreshing, as it is both new and familiar at the same time. Much like Bloodborne was in its own way, but even more so.

Having just Souls as previous experience is definitely not a negative thing itself, but it does seem to have a chance of leading one astray in that one may expect things to work a certain way and then fail to learn to adapt. The same goes with the movement comparisons, with some saying the movement in Nioh is somehow clunkier compated to that in Souls, which is, all things considered, very baffling to me. Only Bloodborne is even near the same as Nioh in movement. Nioh does require a somewhat greater degree of input mastery as well as learning the unique mechanics in it, but the gap isn't all that big if one accepts and learns the harsh lessons the game beats on your head.
 
Heh, definitely not so controversial as this was brought up before :)


Having just Souls as previous experience is definitely not a negative thing itself, but it does seem to have a chance of leading one astray in that one may expect things to work a certain way and then fail to learn to adapt. The same goes with the movement comparisons, with some saying the movement in Nioh is somehow clunkier compated to that in Souls, which is, all things considered, very baffling to me. Only Bloodborne is even near the same as Nioh in movement. Nioh does require a somewhat greater degree of input mastery as well as learning the unique mechanics in it, but the gap isn't all that big if one accepts and learns the harsh lessons the game beats on your head.

In my experience, every Souls game including Bloodborne I take a good hour or so readjusting to this strange 'sluggishiness' in the character movements every time I start a new game. I assume it's because of the one year Gap between each game. But for Nioh, Willaim controls and moves smoothly right off the bat so yeah it boggles my mind how Nioh can be clunky to some people.

But back to the topic, I initially thought the problem Souls fans might have is due to the higher expectations in execution and more button inputs, but the more I play the more I realise I've been using Soul strategy just fine. I rarely pull off anything fancy beyond stance switching.

The things that have changed are the parameters- faster movements for everyone, harsher stamina penalty for everyone, less invulnerability for everyone.

What's the problem then? I'm genuinely curious and intrigue by this. It's an interesting discussion imo
 

Gitaroo

Member
Is there anyway to send feedback? I don't like the hud at all need to be able to resize, and relocate it go the edge of the screen. Auto hide like DS2 too.
 

Switch Back 9

a lot of my threads involve me fucking up somehow. Perhaps I'm a moron?
By beating the game does it only mean beating the vampire lady? Or do you have to beat the samurai guy and the other side mission as well?

I got the Mark of the Warrior but not Conqueror.


Also Twilight mode is the real deal, I love it. It's like NG+ but way better because everything outside of the actual level layout changes.
 

Baalzebup

Member
Is there anyway to send feedback? I don't like the hud at all need to be able to resize, and relocate it go the edge of the screen. Auto hide like DS2 too.
The links to the feedback surveys are all in the OP
By beating the game does it only mean beating the vampire lady? Or do you have to beat the samurai guy and the other side mission as well?

I got the Mark of the Warrior but not Conqueror.

Also Twilight mode is the real deal, I love it. It's like NG+ but way better because everything outside of the actual level layout changes.

Mark of the Conqueror is available when you beat Onryoki, the boss of the 1st stage. You literally cannot have access to Mark of the Warrior without having access to Mark of the Conqueror. Beating the Twilight levels or Mugeshine is just extra, you don't get anything from them that carriers over to the main game beside whatever personal skill improvements you accrue while playing.
Got both of the marks today, finally. Has Team Ninja revealed what the bonuses will be for having the strong and conqueror marks?
No, and I'm guessing they haven't even locked in those bonuses as of yet.
 

Switch Back 9

a lot of my threads involve me fucking up somehow. Perhaps I'm a moron?
The links to the feedback surveys are all in the OP


Mark of the Conqueror is available when you beat Onryoki, the boss of the 1st stage. You literally cannot have access to Mark of the Warrior without having access to Mark of the Conqueror. Beating the Twilight levels or Mugeshine is just extra, you don't get anything from them that carriers over to the main game beside whatever personal skill improvements you accrue while playing.

No, and I'm guessing they haven't even locked in those bonuses as of yet.

Ahh, clearly I'm confused haha. So I'm good then it seems. Thanks :)
 
I just finished off the second main mission. This boss was quite hard until I started
using charged quick draw attacks, (R1+O) then she turned into a piece of cake. I just dodged out of range of her combo and hit her with a charge attack repeatedly.
You really need some range to handle this boss well.

My overall enjoyment of the game has gone quite a ways up over the course of the beta. I still think the aiming mechanics are bad, they just need to get rid of the deadzone on the stick at the very least. I think the game has a lot of potential. I also find the movement to be a bit clunk still, but I will explain that below.

Some things I discovered:

Red phantoms are very abusable with mid stance katanas and the stamina break skill (R1+Triangle). The phantoms attack almost non-stop, so you can guard until they run out of stamina and then do R1+Triangle and get a free grapple attack. Once that skill is unlocked they bocome trivial.

Dual tachi are very good against low defense enemies in low stance. those enemies tend to get stunlocked and you can mow them down in 10-15 quick strikes. It's very effective. the low stance is especially good because it hits the crawling enemies that other stances can miss. It is also good with Ki Pulse

Armor has stat requirements. I didn't realize this until the second mission. make sure you check your armor and build your stats accordingly. Those bonuses make a big difference.

guard OP: The guard mechanic in this game is central to success. This is not like bloodborne or Dark Souls where you can ignore blocking and still have optimal play. Some enemy attacks,perhaps most, are simply better dealt with by blocking. dodges are reserved for certain kinds of stamina-heavy attacks and for mobility.

elemental weapons are crazy: I got a lightning sword off of a red phantom and it was far superior to any weapon I had, including weapons 5 or 6 levels above it.

level your spirit for access to extra bonuses from your guardian.

The same goes with the movement comparisons, with some saying the movement in Nioh is somehow clunkier compated to that in Souls, which is, all things considered, very baffling to me. Only Bloodborne is even near the same as Nioh in movement. Nioh does require a somewhat greater degree of input mastery as well as learning the unique mechanics in it, but the gap isn't all that big if one accepts and learns the harsh lessons the game beats on your head.

I said that bloodborne and perhaps even DS3 were less clunky. That might be the wrong word though. I do think BB has the clearly superior movement and control, at least for my taste.

Nioh's dodges require a lot of precision, the windows are small and don't stay open for long. The difference is that Nioh's dodge mechanic is pretty reaction based and Souls is more anticipation based. Nioh requires a tighter timing. Dark Souls requires you to push the button earlier and sit through a longer animation. It think I prefer souls because souls is asking you to think really hard about position and space, Nioh is asking you concentrate and react properly. Nioh is a lot more like a fighting game crossed with souls, with time sensitive combos and button presses. It works well if thats what you like, but that's not the reason I'm playing Nioh. I don't really like fighting games that much. I'm playing Nioh for the reason I play souls, tactical, 3rd person combat with heavy strategic elements. The slowed down pace of dark souls suits a more cerebral approach to real time combat. Nioh's design rewards mastery and knowledge of button combinations. Nioh isn't entirely devoid of that kind of play, of course, Upper stance attacks have long windups. but the dodge happens very quickly, goes a short distance in a short time. What feels clunky to me about it is that a well-executed dodge may not take you out of range of the attack you are trying to avoid. When you try and go through an attack often the dodge will go literally straight forward and you will end up just impaling yourself on the enemy.

The movement in Nioh is a bit orbital too, I can't really explain it that well other than to say it feels a bit like the witcher 3 where you are on an invisbile grid. The better is light years better than the Alpha and they may well clean it up more yet.

EDIT: The other thing about Nioh is that its current build is bit hard for the sake of being hard. enemies consistently have more health than you and deal more damage than you (at least it feels that way). The game ends up being a bit grindy, as you die and then have to spend 5 minutes carefully killing easy enemies because they have a lot of health and don't die quickly. On the other hand that sensation was less intense as I played more, with the exception of the start of the second stage which is too grindy IMO. Of course those criticisms get lobbed at Dark Souls all the time too. I imagine the game will get figured out over time and seem less punishing.

The beta is way better than the alpha and I am expecting great things from this at launch. I hope there is PvP.
 
You guys fight running away from Hino?

Well, I find it much easier to keep it close. Like, keep her at a close enough distance that she starts her attacks and just go in for a strong attack with high stance for even more damage. I'm using a single katana and it works pretty well.

Once I got that strategy down I defeated her so easily, even in the night time version.

That's the same strategy I used, worked perfectly fine and I could evade any of her moves and follow up with a couple of good hits when she opened up. If it weren't for me messing up my timings a couple of times, I'd have beaten her far sooner.
 

IvorB

Member
Dude, nobody does this. I don't get it. Is it a Dark Souls thing? Where people mash the evade button and wonder how come I'm not insta winning?

Just hold X people, you can Sprint while locked on. Its the single most important thing to know next to ki pulse.

They really need to make that a separate tutorial prompt. Because again, nobody does this. Hinoemna becomes like 3000 times easier when you realize almost all of her attack cans be avoided if you just circle Sprint, not just circle strafe.

Well, this is the first I'm hearing about it to be honest. This is exactly the information I needed when I fought Hino, especially when she runs towards you. Hearing this I can say that I no longer have any issues with the lock on change.

I don't think I'm going to get any more time with this demo unfortunately. I was really digging the twighlight missions though. Maybe they will extend but otherwise I guess that's it for now *sigh*.
 

Dargor

Member
That's the same strategy I used, worked perfectly fine and I could evade any of her moves and follow up with a couple of good hits when she opened up. If it weren't for me messing up my timings a couple of times, I'd have beaten her far sooner.

I think the only problem I have with her fight is because of the damn way healing works.

Dunno why William puts his weapon away, but because of that, dodging changes and that can really throw you off when you try to dodge after healing.

They really should fix that, its just wrong.
 
Nioh's dodges require a lot of precision, the windows are small and don't stay open for long. The difference is that Nioh's dodge mechanic is pretty reaction based and Souls is more anticipation based. Nioh requires a tighter timing. Dark Souls requires you to push the button earlier and sit through a longer animation. It think I prefer souls because souls is asking you to think really hard about position and space, Nioh is asking you concentrate and react properly. Nioh is a lot more like a fighting game crossed with souls, with time sensitive combos and button presses. It works well if thats what you like, but that's not the reason I'm playing Nioh. I don't really like fighting games that much. I'm playing Nioh for the reason I play souls, tactical, 3rd person combat with heavy strategic elements. The slowed down pace of dark souls suits a more cerebral approach to real time combat. Nioh's design rewards mastery and knowledge of button combinations. Nioh isn't entirely devoid of that kind of play, of course, Upper stance attacks have long windups. but the dodge happens very quickly, goes a short distance in a short time. What feels clunky to me about it is that a well-executed dodge may not take you out of range of the attack you are trying to avoid. When you try and go through an attack often the dodge will go literally straight forward and you will end up just impaling yourself on the enemy.

But saying that Nioh requires precision and is faster pace is the opposite of clunky.

In fact if you describe Nioh as having that same pace as a fighting game, then it should absolutely not be clunky.

Is the increase in speed really the main reason for a lot of Souls players to be unable to cope properly though? Souls have fast enemy bosses as well.
 

WeskerXXI

Member
How do you activate the "Tempest" skill (don't know if that's the exact name in english, playing in spanish), the one where you clash swords with the opponent and push them into the ground.

Muneshige killed me with that skill once, not with follow up after pushing me but the actual push to the ground killed me.
 

Y2Kev

TLG Fan Caretaker Est. 2009
Finally got my mark of the conquerer. Such a good game! How do you recover ki while back rolling? I noticed sometimes I get it and sometimes I don't.
 

Kudo

Member
Finally got my mark of the conquerer. Such a good game! How do you recover ki while back rolling? I noticed sometimes I get it and sometimes I don't.

I think only High stance has Ki Pulse when dodging. There's also Mark of the Warrior from 2nd stage so don't miss that!
 

Steenbock

Neo Member
As with many others, I liked the first demo, but it didn't really hook me, while this version did. I'm not sure what the difference is (though I suspect a lot of it has to do with the removal of weapon durability), but I'm definitely having a blast this time. I've been investing a couple of hours every day working my way through the game.

However, I never bothered with the co-op aspect until I confronted the second boss last night. Knowing that the time on the demo is running out, I finally summoned help after dying a half dozen times in a row.

A few of the summons were less than useful; one wanted to run off and kill every grunt in the cave, one needed help more than I did, and one climbed down the ladder from the shrine and then decided to leave the game. Still, with help from a summoned character I was able to defeat the second boss; at which point the game crashed without saving my progress...

After that I decided to take a break, return to the main map and try help others for a couple of games. Over four hours later I finally went to bed. It was surprisingly enjoyable to help new players trying to get past a tough spot, or experienced players who are farming graves for gear.

If you haven't tried being the summoned character, I highly recommend it. It's very interesting to see how different people play the game; you may pick up some new tricks, or simply pass on lessons that you have learned.

I do wish it was easier/faster to communicate ideas to other players though. I've lost track of how many times my host died because they insisted on challenging Yokai in small/confined spaces instead of luring them out into the open... Or when they insist on going head-on through every enemy in their path instead of flanking them, taking them out from a distance, or just going around them.

Still, it's incredibly satisfying to help other players; _plus_ you get to earn Amrita with (as far as I can tell) zero risk. Really rewarding all the way around.

Well, time to work my way back through level 2 and hope that I can beat the boss and NOT have the game crash this time.
 

Ogawa-san

Member
I do wish it was easier/faster to communicate ideas to other players though. I've lost track of how many times my host died because they insisted on challenging Yokai in small/confined spaces instead of luring them out into the open... Or when they insist on going head-on through every enemy in their path instead of flanking them, taking them out from a distance, or just going around them.
Yup. Not sure what they can do without resorting to direct communication, but at least some extra gestures would help.

Trying to point someone towards that kodama they're obviously missing under the ledge on the roof in the first stage always makes me wish really hard for IT'S RIGHT HERE gesture, with a exasperated grunt and all.
 
I wonder, rather of adding more weapon classes, Team Ninja would instead add different weapons within existing classes with various attributes but similar move sets.

Like for swords you'll have your normal Katana, and then a Nodaichi- which have all the movesets for the Katana but slower, more range and more damage.

For dual wielding you can have dagger type weapons which are faster but shorter range and less damage. For Spears you'll have Naginata etc.

If they do add a new class it should be bare handed combat. And they already have the beginnings of it with kicking and punching and parries so it not like they'll have to start from scratch.
 
Finally got my mark of the conquerer. Such a good game! How do you recover ki while back rolling? I noticed sometimes I get it and sometimes I don't.

I've been wondering as well. Is it a timing thing?

This would be incredibly useful for really fast bosses/enemies.
 

Baalzebup

Member
I've been wondering as well. Is it a timing thing?

This would be incredibly useful for really fast bosses/enemies.

Like Kudo answered above, the Dodge Roll in High stance activates the Ki-Pulse. The timing is exactly the same as with regular Ki-Pulse methods, it just triggers from the dodge itself.
 

Deku Tree

Member
The main thing keeping me from playing more of the beta is that I don't want to feel burnt out on the game before it's even released. I want the retail release to be my main experience with the game.
 
I wonder, rather of adding more weapon classes, Team Ninja would instead add different weapons within existing classes with various attributes but similar move sets.
Eh, if I had to choose between let's say a pair of nunchucks vs a slightly different katana, I'd opt for the former every single time. Didn't care for that approach in Dark Souls - which is why I appreciated FROM's approach with Bloodborne - and I wouldn't care for it in Ni-oh when each weapon class brings a myriad of options to the table, especially with how tactile its systems are in unison.

I do wholly agree with there needing to be a fully developed barehanded stance, however. Missed opportunity right there.

I've been wondering as well. Is it a timing thing?

This would be incredibly useful for really fast bosses/enemies.
Nah, the Ki Pulse on heavy stance's roll is borderline useless. Swapping to low / medium stance (since R1 allows you to recover stamina by default) and then dodging is much more efficient against said quicker bosses once you have the muscle memory for it down, what with their respective dodges having lower recovery as well as covering more distance.
 

Nerokis

Member
I've been wondering as well. Is it a timing thing?

This would be incredibly useful for really fast bosses/enemies.

I feel the same way. All these missions later, I'm still not at all consistent with ki pulses during bosses (tbh, from enemy to enemy, either) and that's partly because I feel the need to prioritize dodging over them.

The main thing keeping me from playing more of the beta is that I don't want to feel burnt out on the game before it's even released. I want the retail release to be my main experience with the game.

Yeah, I'm usually the same way, but this is a case where I'm thinking familiarity with this unfinished slice will help me appreciate the final product more. It'll be nice being able to experience the real thing with a discerning and understanding eye, and by the time it releases, I'm pretty sure I'll be starving for more. :p

On another note, samurai dude was such an asshole, but became much more manageable after I switched from spear to dual katana. Had such a ridiculous moment where I had him down to not even a sliver of health, even had the most clutch Mind's Eye in the world save me from one of his lightning-infused attacks, and then somehow managed to die ~10 seconds later anyway. All I had to do was tap him. But that's okay, because he was done a few minutes later.

Also, dual katana > spear > katana (although I just started using katana, and it's growing on me).
 
But saying that Nioh requires precision and is faster pace is the opposite of clunky.

In fact if you describe Nioh as having that same pace as a fighting game, then it should absolutely not be clunky.

Is the increase in speed really the main reason for a lot of Souls players to be unable to cope properly though? Souls have fast enemy bosses as well.

I did say "clunky is not the right word" if you read my post.

Anyway, the game does rely on timing precision, but how and where you move does not quite seem smoothed out and that is what still feels off about it to me.
 
I feel the same way. All these missions later, I'm still not at all consistent with ki pulses during bosses (tbh, from enemy to enemy, either) and that's partly because I feel the need to prioritize dodging over them.

I found versus Hino that you cannot actually Ki Pulse that freely. You need to do a very quick attack combo, and even then, in the time it takes to get a full pulse off she will start attacking again. That fight is more souls-style stamina management than the other fight.


EDIT: Sorry double post.
 
Like Kudo answered above, the Dodge Roll in High stance activates the Ki-Pulse. The timing is exactly the same as with regular Ki-Pulse methods, it just triggers from the dodge itself.

Neat, guess that explains why I only see it sometimes, Dodging in high stance is terribly slow. Switching to low saves so much stamina and the dodge is so much quicker.

Nah, the Ki Pulse on heavy stance's roll is borderline useless. Swapping to low / medium stance (since R1 allows you to recover stamina by default) and then dodging is much more efficient against said quicker bosses once you have the muscle memory for it down, what with their respective dodges having lower recovery as well as covering more distance.

That's what I have been doing and how I've been playing. Fight with medium/heavy, dodge with low.

I ask because I thought it was a different mechanic, turns out it's just dodging in high stance, but why would you want to do that? Way too slow. The game becomes pretty easy (or at least more manageable) once you get use to switching stance mid combat. My favorite mechanic along with gathering Ki with R1.

If you recovered Ki even in low/medium via dodging the game would be broken. You would be able to create space, or stay with R1, while maintaining Ki. From a balance stand point makes sense that the heavy stance is the only one that recovers Ki when dodging. Since it uses so much Ki and the dodge is slow, you kinda need some intensive to use it if your not good at switching stance mid combat. It's a trade off, but it's also mitigated if you master the stance switching mechanic.
 

Zedark

Member
Played a couple of hours in the Alpha demo, and some hours into the Beta. I have to say, this game is much better than I remember it from the alpha! Really looking forward to the final product. I just hope they have an at least somewhat interesting story to go along with the awesome gameplay, that'd be absolutely great!
 
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