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[bitbydeath]

Er.. two of those three are remasters and one is a remake that uses the exact same voice, audio and mocap data from the 2013 original.

They've released zero new games this gen, so far.

Agreed, but that wasn't the argument.
They haven't been working on one title all gen long. They work on one game at a time.

 

[bitbydeath]

Yeah The Last of Us 1 and 2 again....

Come on let's get serious here

Do we count GTA V as well???

ND didn't make it.
The other was the Uncharted Collection.

 

[adamsapple]

Agreed, but that wasn't the argument.
They haven't been working on one title all gen long. They work on one game at a time.

They have studios like nixxess and iron Galaxy help co develop those remasters.

The closest thing they had to a new game this gen got canceled and their next big game doesn't even have a release year assigned to it.

 

[Gaiff]

E33 and Bananza should be up there with GOY and DS2, the others probably not.

Hades won BAFTA GOTY in 2020 and was nominated at TGA, and this one is reportedly just as good, so I'm not sure why you're saying GOY or DS2 should get the nod over it. Silksong was also received with much more fanfare than either GOY and DS2.

I would argue they even have a better chance than Bananza. The one slam dunk is E33.

 

[bitbydeath]

They have studios like nixxess and iron Galaxy help co develop those remasters.

The closest thing they had to a new game this gen got canceled and their next big game doesn't even have a release year assigned to it.

Again though, not the argument.
We can all disagree with where they spent their time but to state they've released nothing on PS5 is false.

 

[adamsapple]

Again though, not the argument.
We can all disagree with where they spent their time but to state they've released nothing on PS5 is false.

The poster who made the original argument also later asked if you count GTA V's re-releases as new games from Rockstar too ? So, their argument is kinda obvious.

They're not counting re-releases or remasters as new games from a studio, which kind of checks out as ND didn't solely develop those, they had multiple developers assist with the remasters.

If it makes it easier to digest, we can say that ND hasn't made any new games for the PS5 yet and we're about to enter year 6. They had 3 Uncharted and one Last of Us out in a similar timeframe on the PS3.

 

[MisterXDTV]

Again though, not the argument.
We can all disagree with where they spent their time but to state they've released nothing on PS5 is false.

They released upgrades for existing games that they made for PS3 and PS4

You are just using semantics to deny a very simple fact

 

[bitbydeath]

Hades won BAFTA GOTY in 2020 and was nominated at TGA, and this one is reportedly just as good, so I'm not sure why you're saying GOY or DS2 should get the nod over it. Silksong was also received with much more fanfare than either GOY and DS2.

I would argue they even have a better chance than Bananza. The one slam dunk is E33.

Nobody is talking about Hades 2, it released last month and the OT is two pages long.

Silksong was talked about a lot but did get a mixed reception so a lot of that talk was controversial. I'd put the others ahead of it.

 

[kevboard]

ND has released three games so far this gen and cancelled one. Their fourth, Intergalactic, will likely release early 2027.

they have released 0 games.


they made 1 remaster

 

[Senua]

Nobody is talking about Hades 2, it released last month and the OT is two pages long.

Silksong was talked about a lot but did get a mixed reception so a lot of that talk was controversial. I'd put the others ahead of it.

 

[adamsapple]

The only reason Death Stranding 2 might get a GoTY nomination at The Game Awards is cause Keighley wants to give an unsimulated performance with Kojima on-stage.

Other than that, that game is thoroughly mediocre. Doesn't deserve any nominations other than PS centric only websites. I'd give Yotei 10 nominations before giving DS2 a single one.

 

[bitbydeath]

The poster who made the original argument also later asked if you count GTA V's re-releases as new games from Rockstar too ? So, their argument is kinda obvious.

They're not counting re-releases or remasters as new games from a studio, which kind of checks out as ND didn't solely develop those, they had multiple developers assist with the remasters.

If it makes it easier to digest, we can say that ND hasn't made any new games for the PS5 yet and we're about to enter year 6. They had 3 Uncharted and one Last of Us out in a similar timeframe on the PS3.

It'd be like arguing BluePoint not having released a new game since 2006 since they've only put out remasters/remakes since.

That's ignoring the almost 20 years they were still working on developing them.

Should ND have spent most of this gen on remasters? Probably not, but let's not pretend they're struggling to get one game out in a generation.

 

[adamsapple]

It'd be like arguing BluePoint not having released a new game since 2006 since they've only put out remasters/remakes since.

That's ignoring the almost 20 years they were still working on developing them.

Should ND have spent most of this gen on remasters? Probably not, but let's not pretend they're struggling to get one game out in a generation.

But that's exactly what's happening and what pretty much every other poster besides you is saying here, lol.

No one's accusing BP of not releasing any new games, they've built up their reputation on making quality remasters. That's the point.

Naughty Dog is not a port/remaster studio.

You're clearly not arguing in good faith and just using semantics to weasel out of the issue pretty much everyone else can see, sorry.

 

[bitbydeath]

They released upgrades for existing games that they made for PS3 and PS4

You are just using semantics to deny a very simple fact

See post above, no point repeating.

 

[bitbydeath]

they have released 0 games.


they made 1 remaster

3 remasters.
Uncharted Collection
TLOU1
TLOU2

 

[simpatico]

Naughty Dog had their A-team do the remasters? Skipping the gen is unacceptable for a publicly traded company. Sony needs to tighten the reigns on these guys. It's a huge part of what sunk Xbox. Buy all these studios and then let them do whatever they want on whatever timeline they want.

 

[Apollo Helios]

Still, I don't get exactly how lanching a new console in 2027 when Naughty Dog hasn't released a single game for PS5 helps Sony here

AAA games are taking a decade to be made, consoles launches have to adjust accordingly

And that's the reason why Sony started to make mid-gen consoles

That's changing with reverting back to their past cadence, they pushed GaaS to no avail and great blunders and they won't be pushing their tentpole SP studios to make those games anymore.

 

[bitbydeath]

But that's exactly what's happening and what pretty much every other poster besides you is saying here, lol.

No one's accusing BP of not releasing any new games, they've built up their reputation on making quality remasters. That's the point.

Naughty Dog is not a port/remaster studio.

You're clearly not arguing in good faith and just using semantics to weasel out of the issue pretty much everyone else can see, sorry.

They didn't work on the ports, just the remasters. Are you arguing they didn't?

 

[bitbydeath]

Naughty Dog had their A-team do the remasters? Skipping the gen is unacceptable for a publicly traded company. Sony needs to tighten the reigns on these guys. It's a huge part of what sunk Xbox. Buy all these studios and then let them do whatever they want on whatever timeline they want.

They only have one team, they tried multiple with the online game but it didn't work out.

 

[adamsapple]

They didn't work on the ports, just the remasters. Are you arguing they didn't?

No, I'm 'arguing' that they had multiple other studios like Nixxess and Iron Galaxy co-develop those remasters with them. ND was not the sole developer. Nor does a remaster of an existing game require the full brunt of a studio's workforce.

You can count those remasters as 'new' ND releases for the PS5, others aren't.

 

[Apollo Helios]

As an owner of the PS1-5, I can confidently say that PS6 would be the first launch that makes no sense. The value proposition, for me personally, is no longer there. The advantages which consoles once had over PC have dried up.

I don't buy these devices for multiplatform games. Given the current state of AAA development and Sony's first party output, it's going to be a hard pass from me.

Dude there's still at least 2 years (if not 3) for the next gen to come, you just don't know what you don't know, you can not pre decide this early for a generation that hasn't even revealed yet. This kind of being hasty in judgment is just so funny to me like a petulant child throwing ultimatums to their parents in a temoer tantrum when they don't get what they ask for lol

 

[nial]

You've yet to tell me how the PS6 isn't going to suffer through the same problems as the PS5 when a lot of the conditions are the same or what even the benefits are.

What are those problems that you're talking about?

How is it easier to get people over from a PS4 (and now PS5) to an even more expensive console ($600 with tariffs my ass) with a lot of games just starting to come out now to this system?

"Just starting", the console launched 5 years ago, my man. Spider-Man 2 will be the best-selling first-party game on the system. Your average person doesn't think like your GAF bubble screaming over no games.
As for the people moving over from PS4, the console isn't really likely to have any substantial (we're talking sub 3M) userbase once the PS6 launches. It's a pretty natural cycle when you have two consoles selling at a very similar pace. The PS6 doesn't need to have the vast majority of the PS5 userbase to move on early on, it's a ridiculous expectation.
And please understand this, the console is not going to cost $700.

Why wouldn't Sony want to wait after all this tariff nonsense to launch with a lower price when their revenue is good now?

That's November 2029, 9 years after the PS5 launched. That would mean that the PS5 would have 22 consecutive quarters after its peak period of hardware unit sales. Given that Sony is expecting a decrease of around 19% of hardware unit sales between FY24 (18.5M) and FY25 (projected 15M), which was itself a sharper decrease compare to the one between FY23 (20.9M) and FY24 (18.5M), which was of around just 12%. Going by a consistent 7% decline YoY, FY26 sales potentially look like around 11M, maybe just a bit more thanks to GTA6 (which, again, isn't going to completely counter the decline). FY27 sales, though, will likely be around 8M-10M, and that's close to dead console territory. Pushing it to 8 more quarters is going to make matters worse.

Why is it bad to not reach the peak again as all consoles do while they continue to move units regardless?

I never said it's bad, I'm just telling you the way it correlates with the planning of a new console.

Who cares?

Sony, perhaps?

Nintendo didn't just yank the Switch 2 because it peaked.

The Switch 2 was released four FYs after the peak period of Switch 1 sales, just like the PS6 is being released four FYs after the peak period of PS5 sales.

Waiting on the other hand gives them time to stock up games for a bigger launch

Maybe, maybe not. We don't know much of what they're cooking for release around that time (except for the likes of Gran Turismo 8 or Venom which are perfect for a PS6 launch in 2027, btw). Pointless to bring up.

wait on better market conditions both tariffs and overall economy

The fastest-selling console in history is releasing in these same conditions.

and have better tech in the consoles itself to better justify an upgrade. It just makes more sense.

The console is already design complete and taping out this year. It's also pretty funny that you bring this up when you're so concerned over the price of the console.

 

[kevboard]

3 remasters.
Uncharted Collection
TLOU1
TLOU2

sweetie, those are called ports... there's literally less visual upgrades in those than GTA3 had when it was ported from PS2 to the Xbox

 

[bitbydeath]

No, I'm 'arguing' that they had multiple other studios like Nixxess and Iron Galaxy co-develop those remasters with them. ND was not the sole developer. Nor does a remaster of an existing game require the full brunt of a studio's workforce.

You can count those remasters as 'new' ND releases for the PS5, others aren't.

Every game has multiple external studios working alongside the core team, that is nothing new. ND was the core team for the remasters and they aren't big enough to work on new games at the same time.

 

[bitbydeath]

sweetie, those are called ports... there's literally less visual upgrades in those than GTA3 had when it was ported from PS2 to the Xbox

Call them what you want, those and the cancelled online game is where they spent their time.

 

[adamsapple]

Call them what you want, those and the cancelled online game is where they spent their time.

So you agree then, when M MisterXDTV said ND hasn't put out a game this gen. They've only re-released their old ones.

See, now we're all on the same page.

 

[bitbydeath]

So you agree then, when M MisterXDTV said ND hasn't put out a game this gen. They've only re-released their old ones.

See, now we're all on the same page.

That was my argument from the beginning.

Here's what you were backing.

Naughty Dog hasn't released a single game for PS5

 

[adamsapple]

That was my argument from the beginning.

Here's what you were backing.

Ok.

You're diving head-first into semantics. Most other users understood what that post was talking about, it's really that simple.

I'll edit the argument on Mister's behalf, ND hasn't released a new game this gen. One got canceled and the other doesn't have a date yet.

 

[kevboard]

Call them what you want, those and the cancelled online game is where they spent their time.

I call them what they are. ports. they only released a single "new" pice of software, and that was TLOU Part 1. and even that used a ton of the original code

 

[bitbydeath]

Ok.

You're diving head-first into semantics. Most other users understood what that post was talking about, it's really that simple.

I'll edit the argument on Mister's behalf, ND hasn't released a new game this gen. One got canceled and the other doesn't have a date yet.

If that was semantics then why did everyone try so desperately to prove it wrong? You're only understanding they exist now.

 

[bitbydeath]

I call them what they are. ports. they only released a single "new" pice of software, and that was TLOU Part 1. and even that used a ton of the original code

I don't care about what people call them, the fact is they exist and ND made them.

 

[MisterXDTV]

That was my argument from the beginning.

Here's what you were backing.

I'm sorry buddy, they still haven't made a game for PS5 yet

Deal with it

Their last game is The Last of Part 2 that was released Day 1 on PS4 only

Bye

 

[bitbydeath]

I'm sorry buddy, they still haven't made a game for PS5 yet

Deal with it

Their last game is The Last of Part 2 that was released Day 1 on PS4 only

Bye

See adamsapple this is what you've been supporting.

 

[MisterXDTV]

See adamsapple this is what you've been supporting.

I have adam Xbot on ignore so I can't read him...

 

[Apollo Helios]

Wait, didn't Naughty Dog release 2 proper games last generation, Uncharted 4 and TLoU Part 2?
So they have already gone down in number of games they've released in each generation (from PS3's 4 games - Uncharted 1-3 and TLoU), from 4 to 2 already.

So, if they have released the cancelled GaaS title along with their upcoming Intergalactic, then that would make 2 and equal to PS4 generation? All I'm saying is this whole 'they only make remasters now' feel completely disingenuous to me. Yes the GaaS title was a big misstep, but all we have missed from them this generation was only one other game to Intergalactic in truth.

I'd love to play another completely new game from them but let's not kid ourselves, they could NEVER crank out 3 or 4 games per generation in the scope, and benchmark quality we come to expect out of ND, right? The game development costs and time have ballooned past what they were in two generations ago, so much so that they could only make 2 full games last generation. Imo all the remasters combined would take around what they've spent (money+time) for their smaller standalone titles Left Behind and Lost Legacy. So in my book I'm missing only one proper game from them this generation on top of Intergalactic. I'm ready to give them the benefit of doubt, perhaps they fix their pipeline issue and give us 3 games next generation after lessons learned in this one.

 

[Apollo Helios]

I'm sorry buddy, they still haven't made a game for PS5 yet

Deal with it

Their last game is The Last of Part 2 that was released Day 1 on PS4 only

Bye

But you're willfully being obtuse as if Intergalactic isn't coming.

 

[MisterXDTV]

But you're willfully being obtuse as if Intergalactic isn't coming.

I know it's coming, but do we have a release date or YEAR for that matter?

No, it's all up in the air as of today

 

[Apollo Helios]

I know it's coming, but do we have a release date or YEAR for that matter?

No, it's all up in the air as of today

OK shhhhhhh ok it's going to be alright kid, everything is going to be alright.

 

[kevboard]

I don't care about what people call them, the fact is they exist and ND made them.

they were completely useless for the most part lol. especially TLOU2. Doom Eternal got a free patch that improved visuals to a much higher degree

 

[Baemono]

Please stop arguing, you're all wrong.

Last of Us Part 1 is a remake, stop calling it a remaster, they already remastered Last of Us for PS4

 

[adamsapple]

If that was semantics then why did everyone try so desperately to prove it wrong? You're only understanding they exist now.

eh? No, I understand those remasters and re-releases exist, I also understand that ND hasn't put anything out other than that in the last 5 years.

That's the same thing 'everyone' else has been telling you as well. You're the only one giving them a pass for it by justifying those re-releases as new content.

 

[bitbydeath]

other than that

This part is key in my argument, c'mon, you can get there!

 

[adamsapple]

This part is key in my argument, c'mon, you can get there!

Nah man, I understand.

 

[envyzeal]

All I want is Witcher 4 launching on PS6 first year with all the new tech and capabilities

 

[MisterXDTV]

Please stop arguing, you're all wrong.

Last of Us Part 1 is a remake, stop calling it a remaster, they already remastered Last of Us for PS4

Yes, it's a remake because it's a game from 2 generations ago....

That's the point.... That doesn't make it made for PS5

People bought GTA V on THREE generations of consoles + PC.

Does it make a new game each time?

 

[Fake]

PS5 first party was pretty shit this entire generation. The things that are doing PS5 the heavy lifting are the third party games and PS4 BC. Not even PS1/PS2 emulation is decent, is total basic crap while PC emulators are doing amazing stuff in the emulation departament.

I give some points to PS5 hardware, but software was a total trash. But again, fanboys are fanboys no matter the generation. They just ignore the Playstation GaaS flop and all good in their bubble.

 

[Baemono]

Yes, it's a remake because it's a game from 2 generations ago....

No, it's a remake cause it's a remake

GTA V is the same game every time

 

[reinking]

Keep fighting the good fight for PlayStation. This gen has been terrible for them.

It has not been the greatest for any of the three but I have found plenty to play.

 

[TheMule1983]

It has not been the greatest for any of the three but I have found plenty to play.

Quantity doesn't equal quality. Thankfully Nintendo seems to be catering the hardcore console crowd with actual exclusives instead of being a watered down PC. For now at least.

 

[lughnasadh123]

What are those problems that you're talking about?

Already talked about - notably the cadence of their first party titles being crossgen, increased price, less people upgrading, etc.

"Just starting", the console launched 5 years ago, my man. Spider-Man 2 will be the best-selling first-party game on the system. Your average person doesn't think like your GAF bubble screaming over no games.
As for the people moving over from PS4, the console isn't really likely to have any substantial (we're talking sub 3M) userbase once the PS6 launches. It's a pretty natural cycle when you have two consoles selling at a very similar pace. The PS6 doesn't need to have the vast majority of the PS5 userbase to move on early on, it's a ridiculous expectation.
And please understand this, the console is not going to cost $700.

lol, come on, clearly it's a combination of the difficult of even getting one, the delays in games, and the games themselves pushing the hardware beyond what it is. And I don't really care what first party is the best selling game when even the next ones are still pushing sales. Yes, we're getting whales and early adopters as we always do with new hardware and would even with later release date.

As for the price I just don't see it making sense to have to subsidize a system that more powerful with an extra tariff cost just to get it to the still not-so-low price of 600 bucks. Cheaper than the Pro now? I just don't see how that happens.

That's November 2029, 9 years after the PS5 launched. That would mean that the PS5 would have 22 consecutive quarters after its peak period of hardware unit sales. Given that Sony is expecting a decrease of around 19% of hardware unit sales between FY24 (18.5M) and FY25 (projected 15M), which was itself a sharper decrease compare to the one between FY23 (20.9M) and FY24 (18.5M), which was of around just 12%. Going by a consistent 7% decline YoY, FY26 sales potentially look like around 11M, maybe just a bit more thanks to GTA6 (which, again, isn't going to completely counter the decline). FY27 sales, though, will likely be around 8M-10M, and that's close to dead console territory. Pushing it to 8 more quarters is going to make matters worse.

Thing is at this point we won't know till those games, notably GTA 6 comes out. We'll have to wait and find out.

I never said it's bad, I'm just telling you the way it correlates with the planning of a new console.

Traditionally? Sure, but what's been traditional about any aspect of PS5 this gen? I've no doubt there's a lot of factors of when the best time to release new hardware but tariffs have to a pretty big factor that wasn't there before where perhaps now a few more years of obviously declining sales makes more sense.

Sony, perhaps?

Not if it's not affecting them in the negative way you seem to think it is.

The Switch 2 was released four FYs after the peak period of Switch 1 sales, just like the PS6 is being released four FYs after the peak period of PS5 sales.

I'd argue it was more imperative hardware wise to do so that's less relevant to the PS5/Pro. Oh plus that whole tariff thing. Without getting too much into politics, I really doubt whoever gets in is going to continue down that route.

The fastest-selling console in history is releasing in these same conditions.

So you think the PS6 would be the new fastest selling console in history? Because I know you're implying that just because Nintendo does it, others can too.

The console is already design complete and taping out this year. It's also pretty funny that you bring this up when you're so concerned over the price of the console.

I'm not the one that needs to be concerned with the price of this. Sony is.