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[Kacho]

Can I just say this thread is going to go down in the GAF history books, so relish being a part of it now.

Yup. This thread is almost legendary. Just need one good twist.

 

[OmegaX0]

I'd like to think that after a long time of unclear statements and frustration, people finally find each other in game and it turns out every player character is Sean Murray making this face.

 

[Silent_Ocarina]

I don't think UncleSporky really believes those things; he's just trying to see exactly what people defending Sean believe the case to be.

 

[AcademicSaucer]

 

[Dr.Acula]

Sean's idea of "finding" each other means they've found each other's planets and discoveries. They can see the things another player found and named. And that's what the game's "multiplayer" has always been. Seeing an avatar of another player isn't the only definition of multiplayer.

Has he ever confirmed you could physically see another player if you find them?

From an interview Gameinformer did with Sean Murray in 2014:

GI: It will be so surreal to see another person walking around on a planet.
SM: We keep talking about Jack's dad from Lost, basically just to see them in the distance. Like, “Did I? What?”

GI:The player characters look different than anything else you'll see?
SM:Yeah.

GI: Will that be the first time you have any idea what you'd look like?
SM: Yeah.

GI: Do you have that model built out?
SM: Yes.

 

[Seiniyta]

Pretty much.

The game needs to send some location data at some point, it can't only start doing it if two people are "near" because it needs to know if people "get near" in the first place.

It's also pretty wild how many people are discovering planets other players have encountered on reddit. It's like the birthday problem. Either that or the game is much smaller than has been let on. Look forward to three days from now when some random power gamer has reached the centre of the universe.

Considering how the density of the galaxy pre-patch and the post-patch seems to be the same, but the distance is 10x the size. I think it's just pure random luck people are finding each other. Maybe people are 'close' enough to each other where it's very rare, but it'll eventually happen. Some just got it earlier then others. That's my view on it.

 

[shandy706]

Yup. This thread is almost legendary. Just need one good twist.

Two people actually seeing each other would be the best twist

 

[thecouncil]

I just don't get why Sean would lie to us. There's gotta be another explanation because it doesn't make sense. It's just not who he is.

 

[105.Will]

What is your actual, official belief on the state of multiplayer and this game, laid out plain and simple?

Like let me just try to lay it out and you can correct me if I'm wrong.

- Sean said there was multiplayer in the past many times, despite it not being a focus
- "Multiplayer" in the context of this game means naming discoveries, and being able to see other players online, though this would be extremely rare
- No real interaction with others, just literally look at them, you can both move around and see the movements each other are making, you can't attack each other or chat or anything
- The box art lacking the online icon and saying 1 player and Steam saying 1 player are erroneous or otherwise simply downplaying the multiplayer since it's such a mild form of it
- The Wireshark packet scan showing no transmitted location data is erroneous because local instances are only spun up when two players get really close, so someone doing the test by themselves won't see anything
- The two players not being able to meet despite both being online at once are due to launch networking difficulties, and/or being in different real world locations, and/or not being in the same local instance
- In other words, in the future, maybe tomorrow for all we know, two people will actually see each other and move around near each other and see that movement and be like "whoa neat"
- Therefore Sean never lied, everything he said in the past is actually true, you never see what you look like until you see another real player etc. etc.

Is that about right?

Anyone else who can safely say this is their viewpoint?

This should be in the OP. My thoughts exactly

 

[King_Moc]

Pretty much.

The game needs to send some location data at some point, it can't only start doing it if two people are "near" because it needs to know if people "get near" in the first place.

It's also pretty wild how many people are discovering planets other players have encountered on reddit. It's like the birthday problem. Either that or the game is much smaller than has been let on. Look forward to three days from now when some random power gamer has reached the centre of the universe.

It would probably only need to know that two players are in the same system to do it, rather than a specific location within the system - that seems to resource intensive to do for millions of people that are probably not going to see anyone.

 

[DataGhost]

A planned patch that adds the feature

Coming up with an answer to that is really easy, haha.

Lol, but it's still not possible without sending location data.

What it could do is when 2 players discover a planet in very close proximity of each other and then spun up a lobby and put those two players together and try to sync it up without them noticing. That's one way to go about it.

Then tell me, is the planet information not location information that would need to be sent to the server so that the server can compare the two locations. After all, how do you know they're in close proximity

I'm on your side, man. I think denying all of that stuff is really a big stretch at this point, but the people who really believe that need to say so in no uncertain terms.

Although TBH if they're supporting Sean so strongly with the kind of statements he's been making, they learned from the best.

That's fine. I don't mind which side you're on, but the points that you brought up that came up do lend to my question about how instances would even be generated when people are nearby. I'm asking those who might some insight and still strongly believe that the location data is meaningless how they would even generate an instance for strangers to even see each other

 

[valkyre]

I dont get how people never question the notion that "the chance of players meeting is close to zero", moreso when the actual goal of all players is to go to the center of the galaxy. I mean, surely, the chance to meet SOMEONE close to the center of the galaxy where most people will be converging should be higher than "close to zero". Also by then, most people would have some crazy upgrades on their ships and would be able to just arrange a damn meeting on a spwcific planet, easily...

Based on all this, i think it was always intended not to be able to see other players. Why wasnt Sean 100% clear about it? I think -sadly- it was so that people who dreamed of some kind of multiplayer, could keep dreaming... Misleading ofc and it seems its going to backfire, but the whole "meeting chance close to zero" thing, never made much sense to me. Towards the end game everyone will have the means to somehow meet someone else in a specific location. It surely wouldnt be as hard... we are all going towards the same damn place no matter how large it is.

 

[clemenx]

I don't want to see the whole thread but has there been a variation of the "Just shot themselves in the foot" post? Those are my favorites in GAF.

 

[User Name Here]

I feel they believed it would be rare and that is what would "buy them some time" till they get the functionality in game.

I thought about that too. It would explain why they were so vague about multiplayer. Although, It would've still been better to say outright that they were still working on multiplayer and that they're a small team and can only get so much done. Which is pretty much what they've said about VR support.

 

[Elitist1945]

I don't want to see the whole thread but has there been a variation of the "Just shot themselves in the foot" post? Those are my favorites in GAF.

You know it, champ.

 

[Loudninja]

I feel they believed it would be rare and that is what would "buy them some time" till they get the functionality in game.

They patch in a way to make it easier to find so yeah that makes no sense.

 

[FunkyLounge]

I don't want to see the whole thread but has there been a variation of the "Just shot themselves in the foot" post? Those are my favorites in GAF.

Actually you may want to see the whole thread. There's stuff in here. Great stuff.

 

[Otnopolit]

He did mention actually seeing each other, knowing how yourself look like by seeing the other. So he did mention physicality.

Well, shit. This seems pretty open/shut then after knowing that. It was a feature and now it's not, and Sean appears to be doing damage control/deflecting. Because it's that or he's completely oblivious to why this is a big deal to the community. And I don't think that's the case.

 

[stalker]

I don't want to see the whole thread but has there been a variation of the "Just shot themselves in the foot" post? Those are my favorites in GAF.

Yes indeed.

 

[Peltz]

Did Peter Molyneux work on NMS?

Just curious.

 

[Dr.Acula]

It would probably only need to know that two players are in the same system to do it, rather than a specific location within the system - that seems to resource intensive to do for millions of people that are probably not going to see anyone.

If someone shows a wireshark log of the game sending the server data to which system they're in, then cool.

 

[Leafhopper]

I feel they believed it would be rare and that is what would "buy them some time" till they get the functionality in game.

They were better off just saying "Online, in that sense may be down the line."

Otherwise it just comes off as a challenge.

 

[T.O.P]

gege

 

[105.Will]

I don't want to see the whole thread but has there been a variation of the "Just shot themselves in the foot" post? Those are my favorites in GAF.

If there's been 84 pages and someone hasn't made that joke we have a way bigger problem than seeing people in NMS

 

[thomasmahler]

I always wonder how other developers in the studio feel about a situation like that... Has everyone there be briefed to just shut the fuck up? How hard is it for anyone in the studio to clarify this mess?

You just have to be honest and sincere with the people who just put 60 bucks on the table to play your game. All of Hello Games ignoring all their customers is just utterly insane to me.

 

[OdysseusVA]

Did Peter Molyneux work on NMS?

Just curious.

No one saw him but they felt his presence

 

[old manatee]

Did Peter Molyneux work on NMS?

Just curious.

just as creative consultant

 

[Pif]

From an interview Gameinformer did with Sean Murray in 2014:

GI: It will be so surreal to see another person walking around on a planet.
SM: We keep talking about Jack's dad from Lost, basically just to see them in the distance. Like, “Did I? What?”

GI:The player characters look different than anything else you'll see?
SM:Yeah.

GI: Will that be the first time you have any idea what you'd look like?
SM: Yeah.

GI: Do you have that model built out?
SM: Yes.

Quoting for those who insist Sean never said such a thing.

 

[Kagoshima_Luke]

This turns my stomach. Just flat out the most offensive game I've ever seen.

I can name family members that died trying to find each other in No Mans Sky, wept at the pictures and accounts of the dead and maimed that experienced this hell, was taught all the horrors of it from twitch streams, it's only ever been a symbol of the folly of discovery, the worst, most black and shameful era of British and European development history. I've been to the actual battlefields and invisible mass graves across planets, held the minutes silence without fail every day since launch, for as long as I could understand the true meaning of it all, the true meaning of Sean's filthy lies.

There was no glory in this online war, No thrilling action or daring do, no heroes and villains, this was mass murder, a scar on the history of our species, and every single person involved in it was a victim.

This discussion, the entire concept of this game and the lies and fighting those lies have caused, makes me feel physically sick, and just so fucking angry.

How fucking dare anyone make a game like this about space and not include the ability for me to grief someone with a penis shaped land sculpture

I don't know what's worse, the sick fucking emotionless, greedy cunts that would seriously exploit this horror of a nonexistent online massacre, or the ignorant, soulless bastards that will give them money and enjoy it.

Anyone involved in this, or seriously think of buying this, should be ashamed of themselves.

1/10

 

[Gestault]

Sure, if it is confirmed he lied. As of right now we have no idea, yet everyone is perfectly willing to crucify him before we even know the truth.

I'd say we have some idea. For the record, I'm not in the "crucify" camp. I haven't seen many who are. I'm in the "mild annoyance with some sincere confusion" camp. I've seen outright contradictory pieces of information, and responses that seem structured to be vague. What information would be reasonable to confirm that the promotion overplayed a multiplayer aspect that Murray now said isn't part of the game? Because I feel we reached that point.

A big part of why I feel this way is because it would be so simple to answer with any of the reasonable theories: "the servers are causing problems, but you should normally be able to interact with other players," or "we wanted to launch in a stable form, and interactions will be patched in at a later date," or simply "community features layer over a single-player game to give players a sense of the wider efforts, but there aren't direct interactions." My dream scenario? There's a world event that's triggered by player action that explains the vague responses down the line. That would be incredible.

 

[JCH!]

This is definitely my favourite thread of the summer so far.

 

[letmetrythisname]

Did Peter Molyneux work on NMS?

Just curious.

He mentored Sean in PR.

 

[Gator86]

So watching Psytokat and this dude barely knows how to hold a controller. And you all want to base "no mp" off of this guy?

I'm glad we've reached the stage where people are trying to break down footage of critics interacting with a product to prove the fault lies with them and not the product. Flashing back to the Quantum Break review thread with people going damn near frame by frame to "demonstrate" that Jeff sucks at games and does not have a valid opinion despite having a long career in the industry.

 

[Alebrije]

No one saw him but they felt his presence

Peter and Sean were both at the same room developing but they can't see each other ...

 

[brau]

Peter and Sean were both at the same room developing but they can't see each other ...

HAHAHAHAHA

 

[PdotMichael]

Well, from a technical point it doesn't really surprise me. They need a way more complex and expensive server structure to provide real time online action.

It's just sad how they were plain lying about it, though the defensive fanbase makes it quite funny again.

 

[Seiniyta]

Then tell me, is the planet information not location information that would need to be sent to the server so that the server can compare the two locations. After all, how do you know they're in close proximity

I'm not quite sure what you mean here. The idea is that Player Y is at solar system '10,10,3' and Player X is at Solar System '10,10,4'. Both players discover a planet in their respective solar system.

It sends the discoveries to the server and the server is like "2 unique players discovering 2 unique solar systems in close proximity, spin up the lobby" And that's when it would start try to connect the two players (if both are online) and send location data for each player.

Now, IF that is the case it's definitely not working. (server overloading etc, bug etc). Of course it's also simply possible they haven't put any of this in, and hoped nobody would meet up (this soon). Or never planned to it. Then of course it's a straight up lie.

But, I'm giving Sean the benefit of the doubt for now. Though his messaging is unexcuseable vague as fuck.

 

[Tecnniqe]

This turns my stomach. Just flat out the most offensive game I've ever seen.

I can name family members that died trying to find each other in No Mans Sky, wept at the pictures and accounts of the dead and maimed that experienced this hell, was taught all the horrors of it from twitch streams, it's only ever been a symbol of the folly of discovery, the worst, most black and shameful era of British and European development history. I've been to the actual battlefields and invisible mass graves across planets, held the minutes silence without fail every day since launch, for as long as I could understand the true meaning of it all, the true meaning of Sean's filthy lies.

There was no glory in this online war, No thrilling action or daring do, no heroes and villains, this was mass murder, a scar on the history of our species, and every single person involved in it was a victim.

This discussion, the entire concept of this game and the lies and fighting those lies have caused, makes me feel physically sick, and just so fucking angry.

How fucking dare anyone make a game like this about space and not include the ability for me to grief someone with a penis shaped land sculpture

I don't know what's worse, the sick fucking emotionless, greedy cunts that would seriously exploit this horror of a nonexistent online massacre, or the ignorant, soulless bastards that will give them money and enjoy it.

Anyone involved in this, or seriously think of buying this, should be ashamed of themselves.

I'm so happy I'm actually capable of enjoying video games. That I can just order something from the steam store and just enjoy it for what it is, instead of complaining that it's not what some AAA studio who witnessed THQ's execution and makes their own engine says to be the only correct way to make games. It must be so disappointing to not being able to enjoy mediocre online interactions.


--
I bet Sean is just sleeping for 3 days now so he probably wont respond =3

 

[Shadow_Lord]

This turns my stomach. Just flat out the most offensive game I've ever seen.

I can name family members that died trying to find each other in No Mans Sky, wept at the pictures and accounts of the dead and maimed that experienced this hell, was taught all the horrors of it from twitch streams, it's only ever been a symbol of the folly of discovery, the worst, most black and shameful era of British and European development history. I've been to the actual battlefields and invisible mass graves across planets, held the minutes silence without fail every day since launch, for as long as I could understand the true meaning of it all, the true meaning of Sean's filthy lies.

There was no glory in this online war, No thrilling action or daring do, no heroes and villains, this was mass murder, a scar on the history of our species, and every single person involved in it was a victim.

This discussion, the entire concept of this game and the lies and fighting those lies have caused, makes me feel physically sick, and just so fucking angry.

How fucking dare anyone make a game like this about space and not include the ability for me to grief someone with a penis shaped land sculpture

I don't know what's worse, the sick fucking emotionless, greedy cunts that would seriously exploit this horror of a nonexistent online massacre, or the ignorant, soulless bastards that will give them money and enjoy it.

Anyone involved in this, or seriously think of buying this, should be ashamed of themselves.

 

[old manatee]

We'll always have The Last Guardian.

 

[AcademicSaucer]

No one saw him but they felt his presence

Was Todd Howard there too?

 

[Mikey Jr.]

Sean's idea of "finding" each other means they've found each other's planets and discoveries. They can see the things another player found and named. And that's what the game's "multiplayer" has always been. Seeing an avatar of another player isn't the only definition of multiplayer.

Has he ever confirmed you could physically see another player if you find them?

Colbert straight up asked him "can you see what your character looks like?" and Sean is like "no, but you can see what another character looks like".

Whats he talking about here?

 

[BackFromThePast]

Genius.

 

[DeepEnigma]

So the other player is actually Peter Molyneux?

 

[PdotMichael]

Colbert straight up asked him "can you see what your character looks like?" and Sean is like "no, but you can see what another character looks like".

Whats he talking about here?

Facebook profiles.

 

[aeolist]

I'm so happy I'm actually capable of enjoying video games. That I can just order something from the steam store and just enjoy it for what it is, instead of complaining that it's not what some AAA studio who witnessed THQ's execution and makes their own engine says to be the only correct way to make games. It must be so disappointing to not being able to enjoy mediocre online interactions.

are you just incapable of understanding that liking the game or not is entirely separate from whether sean murray lied about a feature in NMS?

 

[Kagoshima_Luke]

I would take credit for it but unfortunately it's not an original work, as brilliant as it is.

Admittedly, I didn't get the reference.

 

[Tecnniqe]

are you just incapable of understanding that liking the game or not is entirely separate from whether sean murray lied about a feature in NMS?

:3 it was a joke...

 

[Leafhopper]

Was Todd Howard there too?

Was too busy caught on some wonky geometry to make it.

 

[MegaSackman]

How many people are interested in this topic? It seems like something that matters to people that do not care much about the game anyway.

It really feels like the Dumb and Dumber scene in which this girl tells Lloyd he has a chance in a million to be with her but then he finds that she's married and gets mad at her: "you said there was a chance!".

I've never seen a more fitting case to that scene than this.