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Austria bans the burqa
- Thread starter Lime
- Start date
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More stupid.
ShironRedshift
Member
What nonsense. All that will do is make them feel unwanted and disrespected, making integration more difficult, not less so. And if someone is being forced to wear it against their will, now that they're not allowed to wear it, they'll just be forced to stay home and now allowed to go out at all, further isolating them and thus making things worse for them if anything. There's no benefit to this other than people being terrified and losing their minds over a piece of cloth (which, while it can and indeed is used to oppress, is only a symptom of that oppression and thus removing it changes nothing and doesn't actually benefit those women's lives in any way--all it changes is that people don't have to see it in public anymore, but the oppression itself remains unabated) not having to look at it anymore I guess. But for the women themselves, there is no gain. Absolutely none.
O.v.e.rlord
Banned
Shit is getting weird.
Nope.
psychowave
Member
As I mentioned in another thread where this subject came up, I'm against the use of the burqa as I believe it is oppressive to women, but I don't think foreign countries banning it is the way to liberate these women.
Bjoern the Smexy
Member
Better in what regard?
That's a statement you have to make carefully, may piss people off hardcore.
Audioboxer
Member
A disgrace to women. I would however, be interested to know how much effort was first put into trying to re-educate and integrate. As a liberal thinker, I often think discussion and education are best to try first, before things such as bans.
Do you have a link for that, as that isn't necessary at all.
To be fair, i'm much more mad about the fact that - along with this - they are also planning to ban women in certain jobs (teachers, as a prime example) from wearing a hijab / headscarf.
There's certain arguments to be made about the burqa.
The issue will be that women who were previously wearing a burqa in public, will go on to live as shut ins, not going outside anymore. It's not like they'll throw their burqa into the trash yelling "Finally, i'm free!".
Someone is still making them wear the burqa, be it their husband / family or their belief.
I disagree with any kind of clothing ban - out of principle - when it's targeting a religion and i feel these measures are counterproductive to integration, especially the (edit: proposed, incoming) hijab ban for teachers.
we just inaugurated a green party president over a right-winger. So let's just wait and see how you do on May 7th
There's certain arguments to be made about the burqa.
The issue will be that women who were previously wearing a burqa in public, will go on to live as shut ins, not going outside anymore. It's not like they'll throw their burqa into the trash yelling "Finally, i'm free!".
Someone is still making them wear the burqa, be it their husband / family or their belief.
I disagree with any kind of clothing ban - out of principle - when it's targeting a religion and i feel these measures are counterproductive to integration, especially the (edit: proposed, incoming) hijab ban for teachers.
we just inaugurated a green party president over a right-winger. So let's just wait and see how you do on May 7th
John Kowalski
Banned
The article suggests that other symbols have been banned too, what are they?
soxinthebox
Member
Yeah agreed, burqas are ridiculous.
Found the trump voter.
How dare you.
All tbh.
Sorry to all my Austrian GAFfers.
I think it's really dumb just because banning it isn't the way to go about it. That's not the best way to make people assimilate and doesn't help anyone.
kruis
Exposing the sinister cartel of retailers who allow companies to pay for advertising space.
Fucking stupid?? A burqua is the epitome of religious misogyny. I applaud the bans. Burquas should never be acceptable in any society.
Funky Papa
FUNK-Y-PPA-4
Found the trump voter.
Don't do that.
You don't need to support Trump to be against the burqa. This is an extremely complex topic that transcends political camps and usually gets muddled by comments like yours.
WhateverItTakes
Banned
Then ban that instead of a specific article of clothing. This targets a specific part of a single religion. I don't particularly like the Burqa, but there's a lot of stuff I don't like in religions, but it doesn't mean I should stop people from practicing what they want.
Horse Detective
Why the long case?
What a confusing topic
Chuck Norris
Banned
Breathed a sigh of relief when it was Austria not Australia
It's not about being better or worse, but doing the right thing. The burqa is a symbol of the political Islam and therefore has no place in our society.
Wearing a Hijab for prosecutors and teachers.
the ban of the headscarf for civil workers is being drafted, afaik, has not been implemented yet. But it's part of the package
i'd have plenty of reputable Austrian / German resources, no idea what consitutes a good english speaking source about Austrian politics.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...n-burka-far-right-freedom-party-a7554151.html
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...dscarf-not-christian-crucifixes-a7513316.html
Lovely Salsa
Banned
Why? This shit should be banned worldwide
LookAtMeGo
Member
Im all about freedom of religious practices but when it deals with treating women as inferior then I'm not so keen on it. I'll admit I am not even too familiar with why the burqa is even a thing so I am mixed on the matter. I dont know if outright banning something like this makes things better or worse. I feel like there has to be less aggressive ways of dealing with this.
Freeza Under The Shower
Member
The real question is whether a ban adversely affects political views, particular when it's really just symbol-politic, but the effects of incidents are real.
I doubt anyone has bothered to actually research that in France and Belgium, both countries that were attacked by radicalized extremists. Because you know, why bother basing your symbols on how they affect people. Silly scientists, pfff.
I doubt anyone has bothered to actually research that in France and Belgium, both countries that were attacked by radicalized extremists. Because you know, why bother basing your symbols on how they affect people. Silly scientists, pfff.
Yeah. Not to say it isn't, but banning them sees really weird to me.
ThePrequelsSuck
Banned
Now that's something I haven't seen in four years
It seems the MLP fad kinda died out after 2013.
soxinthebox
Member
Yeah, the only issues I imagine would stem from people who confuse a hijab with a burqa.
Audioboxer
Member
I don't support that passing.
ElBoxyBrown
Banned
If a women voluntarily of her free will wants to wear a burqa it shouldn't be a man's opinion to tell her "no". In the meantime we can try to improve this situation through education but we always must tread lightly on topics like this.
Note that an investigative workgroup has already found that this would also have to include christian symbols to be legal.
then you haven't been to the Neogaf MLP Community Thread!
It hasn't been used there in four years :/
Except it's getting a seventh season and a theatrical movie
This is my stance.
But I will say that it's a very tricky and weird subject. I don't know how to appropriately approach, but nonetheless, I feel like an outright weird is wrong and weird for progression/humanitarian reasons.
Absolutely, but other than the Burqa and Niqab i can't think of other pieces of religious clothing that cover up your face almost completely
Correct me if i'm wrong, i'm not too invested in religions as a whole
TatteredHat
Member
Yeah I'm okay with this, your religious rights end where the rights of others begin.
Audioboxer
Member
I don't deny it's complex, but I would test anyone on the notion that even 50% of these women choose to wear a burqa of "free will". It'll either be husbands/family forcing them, or oppression based within scripture. The burqa itself has also been used, or I should say forced violently on women by terrorist organisations. So on the one hand we read an article like this and celebrate for the women, but on the next hand we say "who are we to judge the burqa?" ~ http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...eing-freed-from-isis-manbij-sdf-a7173671.html
It's one of these hard calls you need to make when it comes to what you want your own society and country to represent.
Theonik
Member
Nazgûl? Honestly I don't know where I stand with this. I feel being an inclusive society also entails tolerance of aspects of an immigrant's culture.
At the same time some of these are definitely aimed at the expense of women which conflicts with western values of gender equality which cannot be tolerated.
(we should tolerate to the extent that it does not conflict with our legal framework)
ClosingADoor
Member
Seems this is going to be the default in Europe and other countries, and I have no problems with that. Even Islamic countries like Morocco and Egypt, and other African countries are pushing back against the burqa and niqab.
Spaced Harrier
Member
Indeed.
There's basically no good position to take on this.
Anything along the lines of "only 150 women" "part of their culture/religion" "you'd have to be racist" "it's their choice" throws women under the bus. Something a significant portion of the "left" are always keen to do.
And bans and the like throw fundamental liberties under the bus.
#FuckingBus
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