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NYT gets Trump's 1995 tax documents, might have avoided taxes for two decades

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"nothing compared to the billions of taxpayer dollars obummer gives to gay muslim abortion spiders as ransom payments every year"

pretty much.

"ok i lost a billion dollars and didn't pay taxes for X amount of years but crooked hillary just gave iran SEVENTY BILLION DOLLARS! right out of your pocket! sad!"

doesn't really matter how this goes over with his hardcore supporters, there is nothing trump can do to lose them but the fringe voters are where this has a good chance to make a difference
 

Oblivion

Fetishing muscular manly men in skintight hosery
Uh oh. i don't see this appearing in my FB feed.

NTY stays failing

womp womp
 
You done fucked up Trump!

full
 

Monster Zero

Junior Member
He lost a bil in 1995 and is still rich, I'm not sure what the problem is other than his severe reluctance to release his tax forms
 

pigeon

Banned
He lost a bil in 1995 and is still rich, I'm not sure what the problem is other than his severe reluctance to release his tax forms

Inasmuch as Trump is wealthy, he's wealthy because he's scamming the United States government.

Whether or not you think that's fine because it's legal, what would he do as president? There is nobody for us to scam to make the United States richer.
 

HTupolev

Member
He lost a bil in 1995 and is still rich, I'm not sure what the problem is other than his severe reluctance to release his tax forms
If it turns out that he has in fact been using the loss to nullify his taxes for the last twenty years, that would imply that his capital gains haven't recovered the loss, and thus he likely isn't actually as rich as he portrays himself.
 
He lost a bil in 1995 and is still rich, I'm not sure what the problem is other than his severe reluctance to release his tax forms

When your whole platform is "I'm the only one who can fix the country because I'm such a good business man.", and it comes out you're actually not......its kind of a big deal.
 

Piecake

Member
It's reserved for everybody not paying federal income taxes. And like I said, the US spends more than it taxes over time. People still make contributions to the US in support of schools, veterans, and so on without paying federal income taxes.

This should be obvious, but the difference between a poor person not paying income tax and a billionaire not paying federal income tax is that the poor person simply doesnt make enough money. No one is going to think it is fair that a billionaire is paying no income tax even if it is legal. We have a progressive taxation system for a reason. We have decided that it is morally right for richer people to pay a greater share of their money in taxes and people who do not even earn enough to pay income taxes should not be burdened with that.

Moreover, a poor person who does not pay income taxes will pay a lot more of his/her total wealth to taxation by different taxes than a billionaire who doesn't pay income taxes.
 

bender

What time is it?
Sort of aligns with the homeless man story as told by Ivanka that was floating around a few month back.

https://youtu.be/8o46HH-TfNY?t=2665

If his current net worth is what he claims it is (doubtful) this isn't much of a story and would easily be resolved by releasing his tax returns. This isn't really surprising or all that damning, image aside, when you line it up to the laundry list of other shitty things he said and done.
 
Reads like parody lmao

This election is the most absurd thing I've ever seen for quite some time

Oh, so he knows the loopholes and used them for years to his advantage because he knew that in the future he would run for president and show America how easy it is to loose a billion dollars, for example, and get away with 20 years of not paying taxes so that he could then fix this loophole that helped him out in the past. I'm convinced Donald is a time traveler.
 

iamblades

Member
This should be obvious, but the difference between a poor person not paying income tax and a billionaire not paying federal income tax is that the poor person simply doesnt make enough money. No one is going to think it is fair that a billionaire is paying no income tax even if it is legal. We have a progressive taxation system for a reason. We have decided that it is morally right for richer people to pay a greater share of their money in taxes and people who do not even earn enough to pay income taxes should not be burdened with that.

Moreover, a poor person who does not pay income taxes will pay a lot more of his/her total wealth to taxation by different taxes than a billionaire who doesn't pay income taxes.

Well Trump would still be paying income taxes on his earned income, presumably whatever salary he made off the apprentice, if he draws a salary from any of his companies, dividend income, etc.

You can only use a cap gains loss to offset $3000 of tax on earned income per year, but you can use it to offset cap gains at a 1:1 rate.

So Trump does pay income tax, and likely quite a large amount relatively speaking, just not the amount someone worth $8 billion dollars would have to pay(and likely an embarassingly low marginal tax rate given such an enormous write off), which is why he doesn't want to release his returns.
 
Right but do you think people that pay income tax are ONLY paying income tax? Is that what's going on here? You think taxes are either/or?

Not all. I'm saying virtually all Americans contribute to the US even when they don't pay federal income taxes. The US obviously will still support schools, roads, veterans, seniors without a significant portion of the population paying that particular tax. For various reasons, we've decided to give credits, deductions, and allow negative liability. That's happening in 2016 with a $590 billion deficit, $19 trillion treasuries, and Trump allegedly not paying taxes for nearly 20 years. It'll occur in 2036 with a $4 trillion deficit, $40 trillion treasuries, and Ivanka Trump not paying federal income taxes for nearly 20 years. So what.
 
Well Trump would still be paying income taxes on his earned income, presumably whatever salary he made off the apprentice, if he draws a salary from any of his companies, dividend income, etc.

You can only use a cap gains loss to offset $3000 of tax on earned income per year, but you can use it to offset cap gains at a 1:1 rate.

So Trump does pay income tax, and likely quite a large amount relatively speaking, just not the amount someone worth $8 billion dollars would have to pay(and likely an embarassingly low marginal tax rate given such an enormous write off), which is why he doesn't want to release his returns.

From the article:

Although Mr. Trump’s taxable income in subsequent years is as yet unknown, a $916 million loss in 1995 would have been large enough to wipe out more than $50 million a year in taxable income over 18 years.

The $916 million loss certainly could have eliminated any federal income taxes Mr. Trump otherwise would have owed on the $50,000 to $100,000 he was paid for each episode of “The Apprentice,” or the roughly $45 million he was paid between 1995 and 2009 when he was chairman or chief executive of the publicly traded company he created to assume ownership of his troubled Atlantic City casinos. Ordinary investors in the new company, meanwhile, saw the value of their shares plunge to 17 cents from $35.50, while scores of contractors went unpaid for work on Mr. Trump’s casinos and casino bondholders received pennies on the dollar.
 

Piecake

Member
Well Trump would still be paying income taxes on his earned income, presumably whatever salary he made off the apprentice, if he draws a salary from any of his companies, dividend income, etc.

You can only use a cap gains loss to offset $3000 of tax on earned income, but you can use it to offset cap gains(of the same type, ie. short term or long term) at a 1:1 rate.

So Trump does pay income tax, and likely quite a large amount relatively speaking, just not the amount someone worth $8 billion dollars would have to pay(and likely an embarassingly low marginal tax rate given such an enormous write off), which is why he doesn't want to release his returns.

This isn't a capital gains loss

The $916 million loss certainly could have eliminated any federal income taxes Mr. Trump otherwise would have owed on the $50,000 to $100,000 he was paid for each episode of “The Apprentice,” or the roughly $45 million he was paid between 1995 and 2009 when he was chairman or chief executive of the publicly traded company he created to assume ownership of his troubled Atlantic City casinos. Ordinary investors in the new company, meanwhile, saw the value of their shares plunge to 17 cents from $35.50, while scores of contractors went unpaid for work on Mr. Trump’s casinos and casino bondholders received pennies on the dollar.

The provision, known as net operating loss, or N.O.L., allows a dizzying array of deductions, business expenses, real estate depreciation, losses from the sale of business assets and even operating losses to flow from the balance sheets of those partnerships, limited liability companies and S corporations onto the personal tax returns of men like Mr. Trump. In turn, those losses can be used to cancel out an equivalent amount of taxable income from, say, book royalties or branding deals.

Better still, if the losses are big enough, they can cancel out taxable income earned in other years. Under I.R.S. rules in 1995, net operating losses could be used to wipe out taxable income earned in the three years before and the 15 years after the loss. (The effect of net operating losses on state income taxes varies, depending on each state’s tax regime.)
 

Aselith

Member
Not all. I'm saying virtually all Americans contribute to the US even when they don't pay federal income taxes. The US obviously will still support schools, roads, veterans, seniors without a significant portion of the population paying that particular tax. For various reasons, we've decided to give credits, deductions, and allow negative liability. That's happening in 2016 with a $590 billion deficit, $19 trillion treasuries, and Trump allegedly not paying taxes for nearly 20 years. It'll occur in 2036 with a $4 trillion deficit, $40 trillion treasuries, and Ivanka Trump not paying federal income taxes for nearly 20 years. So what.

Well the so what is Donald Trump has chosen to deride Americans that don't pay income tax while he doesn't pay income tax but tried to hide his hypocrisy by hiding his tax returns. If it's so what why did he try to bury it.
 

DogDude

Member
Is the story here he lost 950 million in 1 year or that this allowed him to not pay taxes? I feel like it's the latter and unfortunately that would only help him. The former is what should be pushed but looking around, it's not.
 

royalan

Member
Is the story here he lost 950 million in 1 year or that this allowed him to not pay taxes? I feel like it's the latter and unfortunately that would only help him. The former is what should be pushed but looking around, it's not.

How does this help him with middle-class, blue collar households that aren't already voting for him?
 

Damaniel

Banned
Is the story here he lost 950 million in 1 year or that this allowed him to not pay taxes? I feel like it's the latter and unfortunately that would only help him. The former is what should be pushed but looking around, it's not.

Hillary's campaign is pushing the former, and that's the part that I think is the bigger deal. Tax avoidance is legal and the ability to carry losses forward is legal, but the idea that one guy can lose nearly $1B in just a single year (and who knows how much of that money was actually his?) really tarnishes his claims of *tremendous* business acumen. Who knows how much more he lost during the 90s, a time which was pretty damn good from an economic standpoint...
 
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