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PLAYSTATION 6: Potential Innovations, Features, Business Strategies & More (Speculation)

What THREE things are YOU looking most forward to from a PS6 in 10th Gen?

  • Large visual fidelity jump over PS5 & PS5 Pro

    Votes: 101 61.2%
  • Big 1P superhero games (Spiderman, X-Men etc.)

    Votes: 10 6.1%
  • New 1P AAA and AA original IP

    Votes: 79 47.9%
  • Return of 1P classic/legacy IP

    Votes: 43 26.1%
  • Immersive innovation in UI (user interface)

    Votes: 25 15.2%
  • Immersive innovation & standardization in I/O (VR/AR, controller etc.)

    Votes: 51 30.9%
  • Innovative technologies (AI, PNM/PIM, chiplets scalability etc.)

    Votes: 87 52.7%
  • Expanded user experience (console, mobile, cloud/streaming, PC)

    Votes: 20 12.1%

  • Total voters
    165
  • Poll closed .

PeteBull

Member
A lot of things line up pretty well for 2028. Plus I expect as always there'll be a few interesting curveballs we didn't think of.
Most crucial will be avaiability of top process node, ps5 was on 7nm, lets see what we gonna get ps5pr0 on, likely 5nm or improved 5nm, while for example iphones are already on 3nm(smaller die and more energy cost effective chips), i bet if we could get ps5pr0 on 3nm instead of that improved 5nm it would be much stronger than 60-70% over ps5 which leaks are telling us, simply console form factor doesnt allow more than actual 250W power draw(i remember DF measured ps5 version of miles morales, so launch game at over 200W powerdraw already).
timestamped ofc
 
One thing is for sure there won’t be a psvr3 😣 maybe for ps7

You can bet your last $ that VR isn’t going to be part of it.

NGL this is one of the genuinely depressing likelihoods of next-gen. Just a dead-end for major VR market growth (in part because SIE doesn't do much in the space).

I hope there will be, PSVR2 was a great HW update at a contained price. It is worth iterating again as the market is improving.

I think PSVR3 would not make the mistake of losing PSVR2 compatibility and so hope they find a way to sort out PSVR BC too.

Sony/SIE need to find a way to make the headset tech scalable at good granularity.

I don't see any reason why something about around PSVR1's specs but somewhat better resolution and DOF, some modern eye-tracking & haptics feedback etc. couldn't be possible as an entry headset by 2028 between $100 - $149. It seems like it'd be "good enough" for the majority, as long as there are modern QoL features in there.
 

PeteBull

Member
I don't see any reason why something about around PSVR1's specs but somewhat better resolution and DOF, some modern eye-tracking & haptics feedback etc. couldn't be possible as an entry headset by 2028 between $100 - $149. It seems like it'd be "good enough" for the majority, as long as there are modern QoL features in there.
Sony doesnt have enough dev studios to move them to produce vr games, simply, without pletora of high quality games u can forget about vr set taking off.

Think of why nintendo doesnt have stationary console anymore, its all about devteams games output, they couldnt afford to divide their games production power between console and handheld lines.

Same way sony cant afford to divide their devteams between vr(which is and will be niche aka non profitable even for AA games) and their standard non vr games, AAA quality ones.
 
For comparision, ps1 to ps2 was around 100x jump, not 4-5x.
When jump between hardware power is tiny then ppl always complain about "next gen games" looking avg/mid, back in ps2 days we got TTT at launch, and jump was crazy big from tekken 3 coz it was much better looking version from even system12- famous arcade one.

Just look at proper power jump, so ps3 to ps5, and how good same game, aka demons souls remaster can look, provided ofc high quality very competetent devteam and big jump in hardware power.



And on top of all that we got stable 60fps instead of dips below 15(in blighttown) that we had to suffer tru on ps3.


What's holding visual fidelity back these days is not the general power of these consoles. At least, not PS5 & Series X. It's the increased costs for AAA development in terms of time, manpower and budgets. Keep in mind systems like the PS4 can run gorgeous games like HFW and RDR2, or TLOU2 as another example.

Powerwise will be around real 50 tflops. I would say a little bit better than a 4090(42tflops) if it is 2028.

But Sony needs to figure out how to delivery at least 3 aaa per year. They need more studios and focus what they do best = single player only games

Tentpole AAA yeah, definitely. And they need more non-GAAS as well.

They already are releasing at least 3 AAA per year. Every year the revenue from selling games, both in PS and in general keeps decreasing and being replaced by revenue from selling addons. Most best selling and most played games are GaaS/MP and their market share keep growing.

Yes but the GAAS AAA titles are PC Day 1 which reduces their value proposition for the PlayStation console. Even PS console owners, many would prefer to buy it on PC at that point due to cheaper price, free online and higher performance options (mods may be yet another reason).

They can't be limited to SP non-GaaS games, and even less limited to their console. Because if market continues evolving as did in the last decade or so in the long term to be limited to single console non-GaaS SP AAA games won't be sustainable. Specially considering that every new generation the AAA budgets skyrocket compared to the previous one.

No one is saying they should be limited to non-GAAS. The issue is that they haven't found a good balance in GAAS to non-GAAS, which is highlighted by the fact that GAAS titles have more incentives for hardcore/core gamers to buy them on PC (via Steam) versus a PlayStation.

So while Sony may still be getting a software sale, they will probably lose a hardware sale along the way and that has further ramifications WRT subscriptions, 3P sales, MTX/add-on content revenue, peripherals and even influencing some casual & mainstream gamers in buying PlayStations later down the line.

Sony doesnt have enough dev studios to move them to produce vr games, simply, without pletora of high quality games u can forget about vr set taking off.

Think of why nintendo doesnt have stationary console anymore, its all about devteams games output, they couldnt afford to divide their games production power between console and handheld lines.

Same way sony cant afford to divide their devteams between vr(which is and will be niche aka non profitable even for AA games) and their standard non vr games, AAA quality ones.

My thing is, Sony could've at least had their studios prioritize adding VR modes to their traditional games more frequently. Games like HFW, Spiderman 2 etc. could've had unique VR modes added to them at launch or later on. The same way games like RE Village have done.

That way no dev needs to take away resources on a traditional game to make a VR-only game.
 
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PeteBull

Member
Just look how low resolution we got on ff16, especially 60fps mode, that was dynamic res so dropped horribly, and it still didnt hold stable 60 at all.
Hardware performance is crucial, we all know it when we look at switch games, that in middle of 2024 look half way from ps3 to ps4 graphics wise and performance wise too.
 
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Audiophile

Member
I’d be surprised to see a jump like that, considering the relative small jump from PS4 to PS5.
I don't think it'll be too much of a stretch:

PS4 | GDDR5 @ 5.5Gbps via 256-Bit Bus for 176GB/s
PS4 Pro | GDDR5 6.8Gbps via 256-Bit Bus for 218GB/s

PS5 | GDDR6 @ 14Gbps via 256-Bit Bus for 448GB/s
PS5 Pro | GDDR6 @ 18Gbps via 256-Bit Bus for 576GB/s (rumoured, but very likely)

If they retain a the standard 256-Bit Bus and used the slowest GDDR7 @ 28Gbps you'd get 896GB/s.

28Gbps GDDR7 is coming out this year and 30/32Gbps will probably be common place in 2026, with 34/36/37Gbps being available from 2027 onwards (though these 'll probably be more for high end GPUs).

30Gbps would net 960GB/s and 32Gbps would get you to 1024GB/s, or "1TB/s".

2.0-2.6x seems to be the rule so far with these consoles; though I would be conservative and ere towards the lower end of that. I don't think any of these outside of the original PS4 had anywhere near ideal bandwidth and are probably quite starved relative to the compute power. But with RAM chips being one of the easiest things to switch out last minute during design, they're probably the first line of cost cutting before production.

With RT and ML workloads I think bandwidth is going to be a major focus point, just as the SSD was last gen. It'd also be really nice to finally see good off-angle texture filtering and higher precision DoF, Bloom, Transparencies & Post Processing rather then the ugly ghosting look even some of the best games suffer from (one of the last few things that really breaks visuals for me).
 
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4 mores years of dev experience, software development and hardware development in ML/AI & RT/PT (just think how far we've come on these in the last 5yrs in the PC space).

No widespread increase in target display resolution (4K) which means half the frame budget will no longer getting thrown away just on pixels, in fact with advanced, mature ML upscaling/frame-gen we'll probably be rendering less pixels and getting better IQ.

Engines which over the next 4yrs will better integrate Mesh Shaders and/or Virtualised Microgeometry, the aforementioned ML/AI & RT/PT; as well as better utilise the SSD-I/O functionality.

Cheap stackable cache and additional cache dies, GDDR7 chips that'll be much more mature than GDDR6 was for PS5, N2/N2P/A16 will be 18-24mths old by mid 2028 and backside power delivery (BPDN) may be a prospect (preliminary tests show 10% higher clocks and 30% more power efficient as a baseline) and finally multi-GCD chiplet SoCs; which will likely be much more common by then and could cut cost by 30% or so. Frankly I'm not sure if it's even possible to make an APU with an adequate boost even taking into account all the prospective efficiency gains available. I think Chiplets may be a necessity.

Chiplets would be a big part of the solution simply for the scalability they offer. For example if the PS6-based portable rumors end up being true, it'd be much smarter to have a scalable chiplet design that could fit both the regular PS6 and a PS6-based portable, if it has great granularity.

Why dedicated separate wafers for two wholly different products (APU size-wise) when you can streamline shared wafers for as many components as possible and save the separate production pipeline stuff for later in the product assembly stage?

There's a lot of areas to cut costs too. RAM likely won't need to go up that much and GDDR7 will offer a lot more flexible configuration options to dial in the sweetspot. The SSD could just do a straight doubling to 2TB @ 11-13GB/s via 8Ch on PCIe5 which will be old tech by then and be cheap. I doubt more than 11-13GB/s RAW will be of any use. The optical drive can be offloaded to a readily available $50 add-on for all SKUs and the console could put the extra into better core hardware. They can settle for Wi-Fi6e rather than 7, Bluetooth 5.2 will be perfectly adequate, USB4 will be mature and HDMI2.1b @ 48Gbps will likely suffice.

Yeah, things like the SSD I don't see getting a massive boost in performance in terms of raw bandwidth for 10th-gen, there is no real reason to. So a drive that's internal m.2-based with maybe 16 channels (I think more parallel channels would probably be beneficial for I/O performance) at 12 GB/s could do just fine. It's data decompression that would see the bigger improvements, not just for the SSD but also on the GPU for graphics data.

That way like you said, there wouldn't be as much a need for a big increase in RAM capacity or even bandwidth, particularly if they could move processing closer to the processors with cache & near-processing buffers (like PNM). 32 GB @ 768 GB/s would be a good target. Maybe a bit more bandwidth if they pushed for 26 Gbps chips, but my assumption is that they'd want to stick to 256-bit and would probably also like to keep the number of modules to a minimum while increasing capacity.

For those reasons I could see them using GDDR6W instead of GDDR7, and just pushing the clock for the GDDR6W memory a bit higher to hit say 832 GB/s (which would almost 2x the PS5's bandwidth)

Infinity Fanout Links mentioned a few times previously could allow for two small GPU GCDs on an advanced node like A16 with BPDN, then savings could be made on a 16C Zen 7C made on N2P with a once-again cut down FPU, SMT-logic deleted, a relatively small L3 cache on-die with more stacked on top, clocks in the 4.2-4.5GHz range; likely providing 2.5-3x the base PS5's Zen2 capability per core. Old node N5/N4 MCDs could be used for the SoC/GPU L3 caches and for offloading memory buses, perhaps better facilitating different memory bus setups alongside G7 memory chips with 2GB, 3GB or 4GB capacities and I'm pretty sure at least 4GB will be dedicated to the OS, so they could use low bin, slow chips for that much.

A lot of things line up pretty well for 2028. Plus I expect as always there'll be a few interesting curveballs we didn't think of.

I just hope SIE have plans to leverage that power in meaningful ways from early on, and without relying on other platforms (even PS5) to do so. Hardware performance isn't necessarily my concern with PS6; it's the possibility of very few games genuinely leveraging the technology in transformative ways, even among SIE's internally developed titles.

6-7 high-tier AAA games over the course of a generation isn't going to be enough and I say that because I don't think the GAAS titles would necessarily prioritize targeting the hardware the way non-GAAS would (especially if they're also targeting PC Day 1 for those games). The possibility of fewer 3P exclusives means even more of the onus would fall on internal 1P teams to show the capabilities of the hardware.

I think these type of things would heavily inform what in fact the hardware specs target. Is there much a point in developing an uber-graphically pushing & focused machine if you're going to get experiences like TLOU2 or HFW you can count on one hand over the course of 7-8 years? Or do you prioritize the hardware to support what would be the majority of your software output? The latter seems more sensible to me and I need to see what software SIE actually prioritize in the longer-term going forward (and in what ways) to feel assured they take PS6 in one direction vs. another specs-wise.

I mean I'm already down about the likelihood VR will not be a focus at all for them next-gen in any serious capacity; I do question how much simply having yet a more powerful console is going to appeal to younger customers/gamers as a priority. SIE are probably considering the same things.

I think we'll see 38-40TF Single-Issue FP32 but a significant bolstering of RT/PT throughput, very capable ML/AI hardware and the rest is going to be all efficiencies. 24GB dedicated just to GAME will probs be enough and a 12GB/s SSD could fill it out in 2s. But after that it's gonna be all about system bandwidth/throughput. ~1TB/s on the RAM and a well balanced distribution of L0/L1/L2/L3 cache to further reduce the load.

This gen has been a massive half measure with terrible timing; all this cool stuff likely gets to fly next gen.

Most of that sounds good & reasonable. 24 GB RAM for the framebuffer might be adequate if GPU decompression is better, and if I/O decompression is also boosted. Data optimization will always be improving anyhow; CPU/audio RAM would probably benefit still sticking with the same memory type though so 320-bit bus could be possible.

PSSR will bring the resolution upscaling benefits freeing up processing for other things like RT/PT, but SIE will probably have additional tech in the system specifically targeting that stuff as well.
 
Just look how low resolution we got on ff16, especially 60fps mode, that was dynamic res so dropped horribly, and it still didnt hold stable 60 at all.
Hardware performance is crucial, we all know it when we look at switch games, that in middle of 2024 look half way from ps3 to ps4 graphics wise and performance wise too.

TBF, advances of upscaling tech like PSSR and AI-accelerated silicon to target certain performance metrics will be much more beneficial and sustainable long-term vs. just throwing a ton of more memory, bandwidth and floating-point compute at system designs.

I don't think it'll be too much of a stretch:

PS4 | GDDR5 @ 5.5Gbps via 256-Bit Bus for 176GB/s
PS4 Pro | GDDR5 6.8Gbps via 256-Bit Bus for 218GB/s

PS5 | GDDR6 @ 14Gbps via 256-Bit Bus for 448GB/s
PS5 Pro | GDDR6 @ 18Gbps via 256-Bit Bus for 576GB/s (rumoured, but very likely)

If they retain a the standard 256-Bit Bus and used the slowest GDDR7 @ 28Gbps you'd get 896GB/s.

28Gbps GDDR7 is coming out this year and 30/32Gbps will probably be common place in 2026, with 34/36/37Gbps being available from 2027 onwards (though these 'll probably be more for high end GPUs).

30Gbps would net 960GB/s and 32Gbps would get you to 1024GB/s, or "1TB/s".

2.0-2.6x seems to be the rule so far with these consoles; though I would be conservative and ere towards the lower end of that. I don't think any of these outside of the original PS4 had anywhere near ideal bandwidth and are probably quite starved relative to the compute power. But with RAM chips being one of the easiest things to switch out last minute during design, they're probably the first line of cost cutting before production.

With RT and ML workloads I think bandwidth is going to be a major focus point, just as the SSD was last gen. It'd also be really nice to finally see good off-angle texture filtering and higher precision DoF, Bloom, Transparencies & Post Processing rather then the ugly ghosting look even some of the best games suffer from (one of the last few things that really breaks visuals for me).

If SIE were to prioritize on-chip and near-chip cache & cache buffers, I think that would be better than going for the highest-speed GDDR7 available at the time. Especially if shader capacity can be kept lower thanks to technologies like PSSR integrated into the design (preferably a chiplet package).

Having more processing near memory would also cut down on the amount of energy the system'd use since most energy is done when moving data across the memory bus. Compared to that, actual computational work is pretty "free" in terms of energy costs, although it's always dependent on some factors. And with less data needing to be moved across the bus, the less bandwidth the memory bus would need.
 
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