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Should Halo 6 keep or remove sprinting?

V

veloxStrix

Banned
I think Halo 5 was a step in the right direction for the series. The game feels great and it plays great. It's one of the most balanced multiplayer games that have released in years.

But the maps suck. They aren't memorable or interesting and many of them - to me - aren't even fun. I'm not sure if removing sprint will improve that, but I say go for it.
 
YoshiMax

YoshiMax

Member
HateGames said:
the problem with sprint is it causes maps to become bigger therefore you find yourself having to sprint to move around and of course u cant sprint and gun which means the classic halo formula is gone.

h5 is fun for what it is but it isnt really halo. the maps are crap, sprint should be removed and smaller maps should return, best comprise would be as the user above says to disable it in certain playlists and design maps for that
Click to expand...

Wow. Just wow. I wonder how small these maps should be?
 
J

Jack The Nipper

Banned
You never needed it to make a good game. That was always a silly excuse from gamers

Halo won't be as good as it once was, I've come to terms with this.

343 is too afraid to make halo like two and three so I won't expect it.
 
S

shoreu

Member
Jack The Nipper said:
You never needed it to make a good game. That was always a silly excuse from gamers

Halo won't be as good as it once was, I've come to terms with this.

343 is too afraid to make halo like two and three so I won't expect it.
Click to expand...

afraid isn't the word. No one wants that anymore. The series will never go backwards in that direction and for good reason
 
F

ForkNetwork

Banned
Keep it and focus on the real problems Halo 5 multiplayer had, like:
-Mediocre maps (some were good)
-Lack of modes
-Ranks not going down, so if someones Oynx and they keep losing they wont lose their rank until the next season
 
K

kobu

Member
At this point hoping for them to remove sprint and ads is pointless. The multiplayer in halo 5 was not bad so I've decided to let that shit go.
 
J

Jack The Nipper

Banned
shoreu said:
No, one at 343 wants that.

They aren't "scared" to do anything as you say they don't want that for their game.
Click to expand...
They have lost a decent percentage of the fan base. So let them continue down this path. Halo isn't about sprint or clamber.

Nothing will change and I agree with that. We have had this conversation a million times and people say you can't make halo halo again.

Its obvious that you play a game for what is there and to say it can't work without sprint is ridiculous.

The horse has been dead for years in this though and if someone doesn't get that a game can work and be competitive for the sum of its parts then so be it.

Siege has sprint but isn't used much, maybe not the best example but it's a fun game.

I'd also say sprint in siege isn't air faster than some of halos non sprint. With cod finally failing a bit on its standards maybe we will finally get original and unique fps games again. The cod influence was too much. Glad they took a chance with siege.

Not much else there like halo 3, so why not make halo halo again. I do think they are afraid, afraid the cod crowd and gamers won't buy it. I think they are wrong

In should thank them, halo three gave me the biggest back log in ever had. Played it almost daily for years
 
O

OldRoutes

Member
Jack The Nipper said:
They have lost a decent percentage of the fan base. So let them continue down this path. Halo isn't about sprint or clamber.

Nothing will change and I agree with that. We have had this conversation a million times and people say you can't make halo halo again.

Its obvious that you play a game for what is there and to say it can't work without sprint is ridiculous.

The horse has been dead for years in this though and if someone doesn't get that a game can work and be competitive for the sum of its parts then so be it.

Siege has sprint but isn't used much, maybe not the best example but it's a fun game.

I'd also say sprint in siege isn't air faster than some of halos non sprint. With cod finally failing a bit on its standards maybe we will finally get original and unique fps games again. The cod influence was too much. Glad they took a chance with siege.

Not much else there like halo 3, so why not make halo halo again. I do think they are afraid, afraid the cod crowd and gamers won't buy it. I think they are wrong.c
Click to expand...

Older Halo games still exist, you know?
 
J

Jack The Nipper

Banned
OldRoutes said:
Older Halo games still exist, you know?
Click to expand...
Poor excuse, we like new games with sugar parts, new maps weapons etc

I know your answer sounds good and I partly agree but nothing wrong with wanting a new game to be an extension of the ones you liked? Please don't tell me that's wrong. Like turning gt to sim risge racer

Halo 5 is too different from the core
 
O

OldRoutes

Member
Jack The Nipper said:
Halo 5 is too different from the core
Click to expand...

I think you just have to understand that this 'core' is a concept that eludes me... games are constantly evolving.

To take your GT analogy, you're essentially saying that the handling model of the next Gran Turismo should be the same as the original? It's not like Halo was a tactical shooter turned into an Arcade shooter...
 
S

Samurai G0SU

Member
Mp engagements happen within 10 seconds from spawn....

Ppl are saying they need to sprint around to find someone? You have no map position knowledge then fam...
 
S

Samurai G0SU

Member
Iamcorrupt said:
If we move faster as a base move speed. sprint is kind of moot so

GOTTA
GO
FAST
Click to expand...

But.. sprint is an enabler of other movement abilities.

And you cant shoot nor does your sheild recharge. Plus you cant move your direction as easily. Gotta go fast doh!!!!!!

Base speed would just have us move faster not enable other risk/reward decisions.

Do i sprint to maximum speed and then slide under this opening to flank the guy on the other side or do i try running at him around the corner to use a spartan charge to take down his shields? Or do i go around the corner and perform a slide jump and thrust to juke his aim and req? Idk who cares. Sprint should go away right?

Nah i just gotta go fast!!!
 
SpartanN92

SpartanN92

Banned
OldRoutes said:
Older Halo games still exist, you know?
Click to expand...

Yeah you go load up a game of MCC what with that thriving community... oh wait :p


And before you say if that's what the gamers wanted then there would be a healthy population... that's bullshit. The horrid state MCC shipped in absolutely destroyed the dream.
If MCC worked right to begin with I wouldn't care about the state of Halo 5,6,7 etc... because I'd always have my core Halo to fall back on except we don't.
 
RSB

RSB

Banned
Madness said:
Remove it. Sprinting and ADS brought no CoD viewers and games like Battlefront, Doom and Overwatch showed you can dominate without having to give ads guns or sprint. Make base speed faster, remove spartan charge and sprint, keep clamber and thrust and slide, maybe get rid of ground pound, remove the useless ADS sights and we gucci. Look how much better the magnum or even tactical magnum aiming looks compared to the base pistol with it's image blocking holographic overlay. I try and use H2 BR or classic BR whenever possible. That's just me though.
Click to expand...
Yeah, the zoom on the H2 BR feels amazing. Super fast and no useless visual clutter on the screen at all. Classic zoom >>>> ADS

Going back to the OP question, I never liked sprint in Halo, and even its best implementation (Halo 5) only manages to make it somewhat tolerable. As I've always said, they should increase the base movement speed and remove sprint.

No sprint would also greatly benefit map design. So yeah, definitely remove it.
 
T

Triscuitable

Member
ITT: people who didn't actually play Halo 5 or stick with it past the first month.

Halo 5 is the first Halo game since Combat Evolved to incorporate a third pillar to the standard on-foot and in-vehicle combat that works. Halo 2 added dual-wielding; it sucked. Halo 3 tried to build on that and also added equipment; that sucked, too. Halo Reach added armor abilities; they dominated the gameplay too much and destroyed the game's carefully-designed maps with jetpacks. Halo 4 tried to tone down armor abilities and made them negligible.

Then Halo 5 added spartan abilities. And they fit the scope of the game so organically that it's jarring to go back and play earlier games like 3, pick up a bubble shield, and fiddle around with my controller trying to figure out which button deploys it. Sprinting, clambering, sliding, dodging... the only power that I don't think adds much is stabilizers, and they feel so artificial that there's actually an option to disable their automatic activation when you aim in midair (they're only good for pro jumps, if you ask me).
 
W

Wedzi

Banned
Ok so there was this mindset that Halo needed sprint to keep up with the Joneses, CoD and Battlefield, if you will. At the time of Halo 4, Blops 2 and Battlefield 3 were the biggest shooters around. So naturally 343 felt Halo needed to have sprint. But now that Doom and Overwatch exist, wouldn't a return to form be the right call?
 
F

Fabtacular

Member
veloxStrix said:
I think Halo 5 was a step in the right direction for the series. The game feels great and it plays great. It's one of the most balanced multiplayer games that have released in years.

But the maps suck. They aren't memorable or interesting and many of them - to me - aren't even fun. I'm not sure if removing sprint will improve that, but I say go for it.
Click to expand...

Disagree on removing sprint, but agree on everything else.

Halo is really in a tough place. It's hard for them to innovate on map design without making huge changes to movement/abilities, such that it wouldn't resemble Halo any longer.

If I was them, I'd look into what I could do in terms of making the SP campaign into something of a FPS cover shooter. You'd probably have to ibtroduce some combination of limited X-ray vision and a peek mechanic. Combine that with the dash and clamber abilities and you could have an SP campaign that feels claustrophobic and reactive and dynamic in a way that's exciting and rewarding.

For the multiplayer, I think I'd take those mechanics discussed above and implement them in breakout-style maps. Not sure the super-short TTK is desireable, but it would be nice to make it something more A vs B and directed than the running in circles shooting each other in the back that characterizes current multiplayer.

That's really the best I can come up with without completely blowing everything up.
 
F

Fabtacular

Member
Wedzi said:
Ok so there was this mindset that Halo needed sprint to keep up with the Joneses, CoD and Battlefield, if you will. At the time of Halo 4, Blops 2 and Battlefield 3 were the biggest shooters around. So naturally 343 felt Halo needed to have sprint. But now that Doom and Overwatch exist, wouldn't a return to form be the right call?
Click to expand...

Doom is constant sprint. (And has horrendous multiplayer.)

Overwatch has blink-dashing and flying and teleporting and ghosting and turning invisible and grappling hooks and climbing up walls.

Not sure how the success of either of those games serves as an argument that Halo should be slower or have fewer movement options.

Halo needs to do something different and/or take something that's working now and push it forward. "Blander than the rest" isn't a great selling point.
 
Hardvlade

Hardvlade

Member
I've played Halo since CE, I was not a fan of Reach/4 and I would've said get rid of it, but honestly after playing Halo 5. I hope 6 keeps it as fluid as 5.

Movement in 5 made you feel like an actual Spartan. I still love some Halo 2/3, but keep it on 6.

I wouldn't mind if they removed it in Arena, but Warzone/Firefight MUST keep it, maps are pretty big and jogging to the objectives wouldn't be fun :-/
 
Pop

Pop

Member
Bryan Newman said:
Yeah you go load up a game of MCC what with that thriving community... oh wait :p


And before you say if that's what the gamers wanted then there would be a healthy population... that's bullshit. The horrid state MCC shipped in absolutely destroyed the dream.
If MCC worked right to begin with I wouldn't care about the state of Halo 5,6,7 etc... because I'd always have my core Halo to fall back on except we don't.
Click to expand...

Still makes me sad. I bought and sold my X1 because of that mess.

Sprint was never needed for Halo. Increase base speed and shrink the arena maps back down.
 
W

Wedzi

Banned
Fabtacular said:
Doom is constant sprint. (And has horrendous multiplayer.)

Overwatch has blink-dashing and flying and teleporting and ghosting and turning invisible and grappling hooks and climbing up walls.

Not sure how the success of either of those games serves as an argument that Halo should be slower or have fewer movement options.

Halo needs to do something different and/or take something that's working now and push it forward. "Blander than the rest" isn't a great selling point.
Click to expand...

I was more just insinuating the return of the more traditional arena shooter. Besides those games I mentioned, seeing LawBreakers, Quake Champions, and new Unreal Tournament start to gain steam I just wonder if Halo should look back to the past to move forward a little.

But sprint shouldn't be the big debate for Halo 6. Lots of Halo fans fell off the wagon with the crazy story and Halo just not being "exciting" anymore. If Halo is to return to main stream popularity again it needs to be ahead of the curve. It needs to feel, look and play like something new, exiting and accessible.
 
godhandiscen

godhandiscen

There are millions of whiny 5-year olds on Earth, and I AM THEIR KING.
Keep. I thing it is implemented well with the shield penalty.
 
T

Triscuitable

Member
What Halo 6 needs is more responsive aiming that doesn't feel like I'm fighting the analog sticks. Plenty of major console shooters (Gears of War, Call of Duty, Battlefield) have minimal input lag, but I feel like I'm fighting the controls half the time in Halo 5.

In other shooters, I can get pulled in and really enjoy the game without having to fuss over the controls. But in Halo 5, I always feel the controller because the input lag involved in aiming is so distracting. It's way heavier than any other console shooter I've played in ages.
 
B

Banderdash

Member
Halo 5's movement is just about perfect.

My only issue with 5 is about how quickly breakout seemed to die in the arse as a game type.

Leave the moveset, and abilities as is.

Make a new campaign that gets rid of the squad management... the cast largely play the same anyway. Make it about John, give him Locke as an AI partner (that you can't give instruction to, like the Arbiter in 3) then he can be the co-op stand in.
Either get rid of the effing cards, or make it so that we can opt to only get the cosmetic ones... and, as was suggested on the Giant Bomb game of the year podcasts, make it so that you can't receive the same card twice.
 
F

Fahzgoolin

Banned
Triscuitable said:
What Halo 6 needs is more responsive aiming that doesn't feel like I'm fighting the analog sticks. Plenty of major console shooters (Gears of War, Call of Duty, Battlefield) have minimal input lag, but I feel like I'm fighting the controls half the time in Halo 5.

In other shooters, I can get pulled in and really enjoy the game without having to fuss over the controls. But in Halo 5, I always feel the controller because the input lag involved in aiming is so distracting. It's way heavier than any other console shooter I've played in ages.
Click to expand...

Put your deadzones to 0% in the game options. It feels unresponsive because of the default deadzones.
 
X

XAL

Member
The mobility in halo 5 is the best of the series.

Sprinting can stay.

They already balanced it by making it so that you can't regen shield while you're doing it.

Taking it away would ruin the amazing gameflow they've created.
 
JimiNutz

JimiNutz

Banned
The Spartan movement and abilities in Halo 5 are by far and away the best mechanics the series has ever had and are the best thing about the franchise currently.

I would go so far as to say that I may not play Halo 6 at all if they removed sprint or altered the movement systems in any significant way.

Only way I could accept removal of sprint is if they make the base movement speed the current sprinting speed (or close to it). Don't slow Halo back down again! The old games felt like I was running in mud when I go back and play them.

The only other change I would be open to is some kind of counter/reversal to Spartan Charges from the front. Hate Spartan Charge (unless it's from behind, which seems more fair).

No more 30FPS Halo either. 60FPS was the correct decision (locked if possible).
 
T

Triscuitable

Member
Fahzgoolin said:
Put your deadzones to 0% in the game options. It feels unresponsive because of the default deadzones.
Click to expand...

I did. It's something else, not the deadzones. The moment I saw how awful those were when the update came out last year, I brought them down.

XAL said:
The mobility in halo 5 is the best of the series.

Sprinting can stay.

They already balanced it by making it so that you can't regen shield while you're doing it.

Taking it away would ruin the amazing gameflow they've created.
Click to expand...

Taking away the Spartan Charge wouldn't hurt the gameflow at all, though.
 
L

Lucifon

Junior Member
People comparing overwatch to halo... Most characters in that game have some form of movement ability or adjusted run speeds to compensate for it unless they're large tanky characters. It's not remotely a suitable comparison.

5 nailed the movement, I see no reason to change that.
 
T

Triscuitable

Member
Lucifon said:
People comparing overwatch to halo... Most characters in that game have some form of movement ability or adjusted run speeds to compensate for it unless they're large tanky characters. It's not remotely a suitable comparison.

5 nailed the movement, I see no reason to change that.
Click to expand...

Yep.

Genji has the dash and callclimbs, McCree has a roll, Pharah can fly, Reaper teleports, Soldier sprints (heeeyyyy), Tracer ports all over the place, and Sombra can translocate or cloak-sprint. Defense characters are considerably less mobile, but Mei can go up with an ice wall, Junkrat can bomb jump, and Widowmaker can grapple. In Tanks, D. Va can fly, Reinhardt can charge, and Winston can boost jump. In support, Lucio wallruns and can passively boost teammates, and Mercy flies to allies.

This means out of the game's 23 heroes, 15 out of 8 have means of navigating maps that extend beyond basic lateral movement (some more extreme than others).
 
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