Sub_Level
wants to fuck an Asian grill.
Vita is into that kinky stuff.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Sony: climate "not healthy" for PlayStation Vita successor
- Thread starter chadskin
- Start date
Vita is into that kinky stuff.
Neff
Member
Sony never believed in Vita as a marketable handheld. They mainly threw it out so that Nintendo wouldn't have the whole market to themselves for a generation and close the lid on it once more. Their thinking was 'If it works, great. If it doesn't, hey no sweat, we can try again next time, because we'll still be a participant in the market', although they probably didn't forsee the handheld market shrinking as drastically as it did, hence no successor.
The memory cards was the big thorn for the Vita. I just bought a 32GB microsd card for my n3ds for $12 shipped. Those card prices kept a lot of people away.
I've learned to use my Vita as an (mostly) indie machine and I love it so much for that reason. I know that a successor is about as likely as a new Suikoden game for consoles but I can hope right?
I've learned to use my Vita as an (mostly) indie machine and I love it so much for that reason. I know that a successor is about as likely as a new Suikoden game for consoles but I can hope right?
Bolivar687
Banned
As a commuter, I can tell you people have no problem at all carrying around their E Readers, tablets and even laptops in addition to their smart phone.
It's more likely that this audience is not interested in playing immersive high fidelity games. On the other hand, Sony failed to build a library for console gamers that might have been interested. The system needed Gran Turismo, Metal Gear, GTA, and Final Fantasy. Not Resistance, Little Deviants and a bizarre, half-baked Call of Duty.
The price of the 3DS, historically, have been quite high when compared to Nintendo's other handhelds.
While it is fairly obvious that lacking first party support is not the only reason, it does send a message if none of your major developer studios would develop for it, and one of the launch supporters(Liverpool) gets killed of 7 months after the fact.
Theonik
Member
SCEE and SCEA never really put faith on the Vita but SCEJ did and they enjoyed moderate success. If these two had anything to do with it the Vita would never have existed.
This is not exactly true. The truth is a vast majority of people don't care about games on the go altogether, rather they view them as momentary distractions between meetings, while commuting etc. It isn't so much that people do not care about the issue, they aren't really relevant to the way they use their phones. Nor to the way they play games on the go.
If games drained people's phones people would care very strongly and there is a big market for battery extensions on phones that never really took off on portables with less battery than any phone now has, that is exactly because most people care very much about their phones going down but it is not something that affects them for their usage and at the end of the day for popping a round of solitaire on the train, a phone is more convenient.
Game portables are in a weird spot right now because mobiles have very clearly dominated what seems to be the main paradigm of playing games on the go as far as the mainstream is concerned, while their market for games isn't healthy enough to fully replace portables. (there are many cases where you cannot sell a game for less than $50 but the mobile market will not accept pricing like this.)
I think they will do it but not in this kind of in between generation where a portable is not powerful enough to run a game like GTA 5 but also not affordable or accessible enough like Android or iOS games are.
So, I think once they can make a portable console where you can run late Ps3 or even ps4 games like Metal Gear Solid V, the market will definitely be there. Until then they should not release another portable.
So, I think once they can make a portable console where you can run late Ps3 or even ps4 games like Metal Gear Solid V, the market will definitely be there. Until then they should not release another portable.
Nintendo DS was a outlier. Gameboy Advance did around half the numbers and the competition was fucking Wonderswan.
Not doubting that smartphones took a huge part, but it was more than that that made the decline possible.
charlequin
Banned
So as part of a small group making up less than 5% of working Americans, and who collectively are essentially irrelevant to the success or failure of an individual product. It's precisely the fact that transit commuters are not a meaningful demo in the US that makes handhelds so irrelevant when another device can substitute for them.
Even putting that aside, the devices you mention are all much more convenient to carry (e-readers) or much more useful (laptops) than a handheld gaming system, or in the case of a tablet, both.
This is a joke about how all this stuff came out on PSP and it did nothing to make the system actually successful long-term in the West, right?
It is not just predictable, but more or less definitional, that games which rely on graphical prowess, expansiveness of scope, etc. for their appeal will not be desirable on a handheld device, because the version on a TV-connected home device is always going to be more impressive.
What are you talking about? ¥9,411, which converts to $78 USD.
Infernal Monkey
Member
SCEE has actually been pretty good with the system. Stuff like Football Manager, the Tales of Hearts R localisation and a tonne of indie games (original titles and ports) wouldn't have happened without them.
It's just that they eventually ended up trying to push Vita in a different direction to what most people would have liked. As a kids handheld, with brightly coloured 'mega pack' hardware bundles and weird low budget retail releases like Muppets Movie Adventure, Looney Tunes Galactic Sports and LBP: Marvel Superhero Edition.
... A really, reeeeaaally expensive kids handheld.
the-pi-guy
Member
Nintendo is also convinced that because of the Wii U not selling as well as it should means that no one wants home consoles any more.
*glances at PS4*
.....
Sony keeps saying that their poorly marketed 200$ device that requires an expensive memory card with no mainstream games isn't selling well because the climate isn't healthy.
Meanwhile 3DS is selling vastly more, and really the 3DS is in the same predicament just to a lesser extent. 3DS is fairly expensive, I feel that most of the notable 3DS games are losing precedence. I suspect without any new major IPs, a 3DS successor would do worse than the 3DS. Or it could do well with some brand new features.
The most mainstream games Vita has is a very very poorly received CoD game, a good Uncharted game and a good Assassin's Creed spin off.
I think the argument that mobile gaming is not the best argument. It is better than saying facebook is killing home consoles with their access to free games, but it is not as much better as it should be.
*glances at PS4*
.....
Sony keeps saying that their poorly marketed 200$ device that requires an expensive memory card with no mainstream games isn't selling well because the climate isn't healthy.
Meanwhile 3DS is selling vastly more, and really the 3DS is in the same predicament just to a lesser extent. 3DS is fairly expensive, I feel that most of the notable 3DS games are losing precedence. I suspect without any new major IPs, a 3DS successor would do worse than the 3DS. Or it could do well with some brand new features.
The most mainstream games Vita has is a very very poorly received CoD game, a good Uncharted game and a good Assassin's Creed spin off.
I think the argument that mobile gaming is not the best argument. It is better than saying facebook is killing home consoles with their access to free games, but it is not as much better as it should be.
pizzapizza64
Member
Seriously, I love it. It's the PR speak that gets to me and turns me off from a company.
Hero of Legend
Member
I mean by estimate and if Sony did release them in the west that'd likely be their MSRP.
Also what you linked might just be a sale (just guessing). Video Games Plus was selling them for $120 in Canada (that's where I got mine).
Theonik
Member
That depends on your expectations I suppose. Some SCEE regions did well for PSP as well and SCEE pushed it to those regions. They also tried more than can be said for SCEA. However the last bit is exactly what was wrong with SCEE's approach. They did the EXACT same thing with the PSP as well with regards to trying to push it as a colourful child's toy with similar success.
wild wild rice
Member
Good move. Vita's library is garbage tier.
James Scott
Banned
...when did Nintendo say that? They're making a new console
CharminUltra
Member
Vita's probably my least favorite console ever. Can't say I'll be too sad if we never get a Vita 2.
the-pi-guy
Member
They never ever said that.
I'm making up an example of something to show how silly I think this comment is.
hodayathink
Member
If there's one thing that I've noticed about Yoshida, it's that he doesn't really force studios to make games or necessarily stay on the same IP until it's dead. He'll reject ideas, and making studios go back to the drawing board on them, but he doesn't sit there and say "You have to work on this sequel" or things like that. ND gets to make TLOU even though Uncharted is still successful, Guerilla gets to move on to Horizon while Killzone isn't doing badly commercially, Media Molecule gets to make Tearaway and Dreams while Little Big Planet is still a thing, and so on. Naughty Dog didn't make a Vita game because they didn't want to. Same with Santa Monica (remember, Ready at Dawn made the PSP God Of War games, and what were they working on during the development of the Vita? Oh yeah, The Order: 1886). Sony Bend did, and got to take a crack at Uncharted. Sucker Punch? They kind of insinuated about an inFamous game/port, but it doesn't seem like they wanted to either. Basically, none of their major Western studios save Media Molecule wanted to make a Vita game, and that's why they didn't make one. You can say Yoshida should have forced them to, but what type of game would we really have gotten from that type of effort?
I think the climate isn't healthy for any kind of dedicated portable gaming device, and that if Nintendo releases another handheld that is essentially a gamepad with a touchscreen that they are completely misreading the current western marketplace. Then again I also feel that if Nintendo did manage to put together a product with very wide appeal that it wouldn't necessarily be what Nintendo fans actually want. Nintendo wasn't afraid to alienate some die hard Nintendo fans with the Wii, so who knows they may have it in them again.
James Scott
Banned
Vita is a bit of a weird situation. Fans love it because of the quality of the hardware, but the software never seemed to match. Dangan Ronpa and Persona 4 are amazing, but few others had mainstream appeal while not having a console counterpart (or a 3DS counterpart like MH clones).
it started life with high end games at a high end price. But then when it failed to take off it went for smaller games but still a high end price. The focus on digital also hurt it removing basically all retail presence for the system. And I'm not sure how a digital system with expensive memory cards works. I'm honestly surprised at the amount of love and supportive Vita has gotten when Sony hasn't done the same. Likely more than it should've gotten so in that way I can see why fans are happy with it.
it started life with high end games at a high end price. But then when it failed to take off it went for smaller games but still a high end price. The focus on digital also hurt it removing basically all retail presence for the system. And I'm not sure how a digital system with expensive memory cards works. I'm honestly surprised at the amount of love and supportive Vita has gotten when Sony hasn't done the same. Likely more than it should've gotten so in that way I can see why fans are happy with it.
That seems incredibly unlikely this late. Wouldn't have much use outside of remote play
Elitist1945
Member
I still think they should've kept the PSP looking like this:
More on topic...I really would've liked another handheld from Sony. Oh well.
More on topic...I really would've liked another handheld from Sony. Oh well
.XenogearsX
Banned
I'm just glad we have the Vita. It's my favorite hand held currently. Not of all time, but I love playing PS games on it
Bolivar687
Banned
I don't want to derail the thread but I was only speaking as someone who regularly sees how false your misconception is on a daily basis. You can't get around that those are extra devices that have more or less thrived in a post-smartphone market. I don't know what e-readers you're thinking of but my kindle takes up more space than the pockets and pouches my 3DS/Vita fit in. And your distinction for laptops, that they're more useful, is irrelevant, as well as incompatible with your original point.
I think you're moving goalposts here. We're talking about viability in general, not "long-term" success, nor just in the West, or any vague ways you might be trying to calibrate the two in order to undermine what is otherwise common knowledge. The PSP was a moderate success. It should be axiomatic that its library of spinoffs, while many were underwhelming, nevertheless played at least a material role in that.
We're actually on the same page, believe it or not. I don't think the Vita's concept has mainstream appeal or even significant traction amongst gamers. But the fact that it did a few million despite mistakes on every front makes me inclined to believe a semi-worthwhile library would have helped to at least get it off the ground, if only for the duration of a Wright brothers' plane.
Not Spaceghost
Spaceghost
Awwww I liked knowing that there was at least some one else with a horse in the race for a dedicated video game handheld.
I felt the Vita was a very good counter part to the 3DS, it was almost a complimentary device.
They each had very different libraries, and they were both at opposite ends of the technical spectrum.
It was cool seeing how one with the large library did vs the one that had great hardware.
I felt the Vita was a very good counter part to the 3DS, it was almost a complimentary device.
They each had very different libraries, and they were both at opposite ends of the technical spectrum.
It was cool seeing how one with the large library did vs the one that had great hardware.
Not surprising but it sucks to hear nonetheless. For me though the Vita is the reason I invested into the PS ecosystem over Microsoft's this gen. If there's no PS handheld next gen the PS5 will be on the backburner for me save an un-missable exclusive early into the cycle (highly doubtful).
Just like your post quality huh.
I kind of wonder what would have happened if Sony didn't lose MH to Nintendo what would have happened. I think that losing that was a really big deal.
Just like your post quality huh.
I kind of wonder what would have happened if Sony didn't lose MH to Nintendo what would have happened. I think that losing that was a really big deal.
Lurgan1337
Banned
damn it, I love my Vita and I want another great handheld in the future.
I don't wanna play shit-tier games on shit-tier phones.
and my cell is 20$ Nokia, so it's not like I can just jump in lol
I don't wanna play shit-tier games on shit-tier phones.
and my cell is 20$ Nokia, so it's not like I can just jump in lol
There is also a tendency to see the past as some great thing when the reality is gaming just keeps getting better. Moreover, Gaf is awash in nostalgia and business nostrodamii. There is alot of money in games: mbile, pc, and console are all viable--I slot handheld into the mobile category; anyone wanting a piece of that pie will need to compete in a bloody, red ocean.
What does the future hold? Well, the only certainty is that all things die. So yeah, taken far enough consoles, phones, you, and me are all on a death train. But today, and for the near term, we are all doing fine.
Hades Hotgun
Banned
So, can we start using the phrase "Climate Deniers" to refer to people who blame Sony for the Vita's lack of sales prowess?
Acrylic7
Member
No climate is healthy for a device with an imaginary install base. lol, honestly who didn't see the Vita's future coming besides Sony?
-Just call the next handheld the PSP2; ya know, handheld that was wildly successful. I never understood the name change.
-Don't fuck up the initial buyers by trying to force people to buy absurdly priced memory cards that are required to run software.
-Stop focusing on ports for games that people have most likely played on their home console.
-Stop making spinoffs of console games that barely sell enough units on consoles.
-Stop making $40 games and fix your prices. I'm not paying $40 for 90% off what I see on any handheld.
-Don't confuse potential buyers by introducing 2nd models like 3G & Wifi vs Wifi. Its like they want to battle themselves or some shit.
-Just support it with rpg's and other things that actually work on handhelds.
= success?
The vita was riddled with flaws and the market or "climate" wasn't the problem.
-Just call the next handheld the PSP2; ya know, handheld that was wildly successful. I never understood the name change.
-Don't fuck up the initial buyers by trying to force people to buy absurdly priced memory cards that are required to run software.
-Stop focusing on ports for games that people have most likely played on their home console.
-Stop making spinoffs of console games that barely sell enough units on consoles.
-Stop making $40 games and fix your prices. I'm not paying $40 for 90% off what I see on any handheld.
-Don't confuse potential buyers by introducing 2nd models like 3G & Wifi vs Wifi. Its like they want to battle themselves or some shit.
-Just support it with rpg's and other things that actually work on handhelds.
= success?
The vita was riddled with flaws and the market or "climate" wasn't the problem.
The Abominable Snowman
Member
You know, I wouldn't mind Sony spinning the Vita into an Android high-powered yet budget tablet with a controller and exclusive games. Rename it Playstation Tab, give it enough juice to play current Android titles, give it a subscription system to PS1, PSP, and PS2 emulated titles, and still let it catch the trickle of Vita games and downports along with exclusive features like Remote Play. Bundle it with a Minecraft and a Terraria and let it sell itself.
I think yes and no. Yes because that was a system mover for the Vita, but no because MH is a far bigger deal in Japan then anywhere else and the Vita is already doing well over there.
I think losing Monster Hunter hurt but it is far from one of the bigger problems.
charlequin
Banned
I... don't see how that's true? Laptops, like all computers, have declined in sales since the smartphone and tablet markets took off. Global ereader shipments are like a third of what they were at peak -- much like a dedicated gaming device, a dedicated book-reading device is simply not as useful to many people who are happy to use a single multi-purpose device instead.
Again, not sure where you're going with this. The PSP was a pretty middling performer -- a success in blowing past expectations for a Nintendo competitor, and for its impressive second wind in Japan, but a failure in other global territories where sales fell off quickly and never recovered, and in creating a market position that its successor could take advantage of.
The kind of title you're citing was never successful once the novelty from launch wore off, and the lion's share of the PSP's most successful period in its most successful market was driven by teenager-oriented local-co-op games, not console-style titles. That particular market has been partially siphoned off by Nintendo, and there isn't even a hint of an opening for high-production-value, console-esque titles to succeed in other markets. Most of that has very little to do with Sony mishandling the device they did make and much more to do with them creating a device that couldn't really be handled well.
thiscoldblack
Unconfirmed Member
If Vita had 32GB or 64GB of internal storage, plus microSD card, we would be singing in a different tune right now.
diablos991
Can’t stump the diablos
This makes me sad. I liked the hardware and some of the games. Sucks to see it go like this.
Now Nintendo won't have much motivation to improve on the 3ds. We will be stuck with terrible specced handhelds for the next few years.
Now Nintendo won't have much motivation to improve on the 3ds. We will be stuck with terrible specced handhelds for the next few years.
hodayathink
Member
No, we wouldn't.
I love the Vita hardware and its OS but I have neglected it so much solely because of the memory card prices. When your software library is primarily indie titles I can find and play on other consoles and PC it really makes me not want to play on the Vita.
I loved Hotline Miami on Vita but I bought 2 on the PC because I didn't want to deal with the fridge cleaning on Vita. I was holding out on Luftrausers (which I know I would enjoy playing on the Vita) but eventually bought it on PC when it went on sale because again, I didn't want to deal with the memory card.
One day though, when I get extra cash, I will buy a bigger memory card so I can play a bunch of PS1 games on it because I've already retired my PS3.
I loved Hotline Miami on Vita but I bought 2 on the PC because I didn't want to deal with the fridge cleaning on Vita. I was holding out on Luftrausers (which I know I would enjoy playing on the Vita) but eventually bought it on PC when it went on sale because again, I didn't want to deal with the memory card.
One day though, when I get extra cash, I will buy a bigger memory card so I can play a bunch of PS1 games on it because I've already retired my PS3.
Micro SD cards would've helped tremendously but throwing a decent size internal storage would've jacked up the price of the handheld even more.
Astral Dog
Member
As the Wii U, im still confused by the name PS Vita, its awful
Agreed. PS Hasta la Vista sounds much better.
Similar threads
- Poll