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[RedSwirl]

That's a statement of fact, it's not a reason why this strategy wouldn't work for Nintendo. GTA5 still sold 30 million in a couple of months despite having a smartphone presence for the older titles.

I don't see why this would be impossible for say...Metroid or The Legend of Zelda. Not the 30 million bit, but maintaining a strong interest for new releases despite pandering to the crowd who wants older titles on the go for cheap. The VC is doing nothing to sell their current hardware. Why not get these 20 year old games on as much hardware as possible?

Because Nintendo is still trying to sell its own hardware, and Iwata basically thinks current mobile game prices are bullshit.

And most people believe Nintendo games would be nearly unplayable without requiring a controller.

I definitely think something needs to change with VC. Nintendo probably needs to advertise it more, because most people I know who buy Wii and Wii U are totally unaware of VC. When I told my brother he could download Mario, Star Fox 64, and Contra III on his Wii he was all over it.

It would be nice if prices on VC games came down by 30-50%, and if Nintendo released them much more quickly. Both would probably require Nintendo to abandon its current process of putting each VC game in an individual wrapper and just throwing them all into general emulators for each old console.

But before all that Nintendo just needs to have hardware that doesn't sell like shit. I can guarantee you Nintendo will wait until its hardware burns to the ground before it releases even its old software on mobile.

Thanks for the great opening post Aquamarine!



Agree. Nintendo needs to set the example if they want third party developers and publishers to feel that their games will sell to the audience that buys a Nintendo home console. The thing is that Nintendo has done this in the past as you have said. With the N64 and GameCube.

However that was a different Nintendo then the one that exist now. The Nintendo that did that had a Nintendo of America that was empowered to make deals with developers, publishers, and license holders that focused on their western market. A NoA that grabbed the Star Wars license. That had their own major league baseball titles that leveraged the very baseball team Nintendo owned and still owns. A Nintendo in general that when they weren't getting the fighting games grabbed wrestling games instead. A sport/entertainment that is powerful in both Japan and outside of it!

If Nintendo is going to turn things around they need to go back to some of that. They need to realize and accept they have to cater to the western market a LOT more then they are now. It's okay if some games don't do well in Japan as long as they do well outside of Japan where people clearly want what Sony and Microsoft are offering and helping to maintain. Hell those games might do well in Japan as taste there might have changed some.

The variety has to be there. There is really none and the little that there is Nintendo doesn't seem to give a damn about it. Why would they have something like Wonderful 101 made and not do a damn thing to really make sure it sells. That's really something I would hope is brought up by investors. Nintendo's lack of advertising overall when it comes to marketing of actual products, the Wii U especially for an entire year, and marketing of the actual brand. Shaping it proactively instead of allowing the media to shape it with bad news.

I think people on GAF look back at N64 and Gamecube with rose-tinted glasses, not remembering those western second-party games didn't help Nintendo's hardware sales at all. That's probably why Iwata got rid of all that, because circa 1999 everyone (except Microsoft) believed Japan was still the main battleground.

That said, it probably wouldn't hurt to revert back to that strategy today. Part of the problem seems to be that Nintendo can't handle the idea of a game that is successful in the west but not Japan -- they need to let that go. That kind of thinking is what led to Metroid Other M.

Similar to how they sat down with Platinum, Nintendo needs to at least try to sit down with companies like Insomniac, Crytek, or Epic -- at least try to talk to them about publishing agreements. Maybe even some of the Eastern European guys. Maybe even some of the smaller groups (read: larger indie developers) -- it'd e great if Nintendo had another studio like WayForward under its wing.

 

[Father_Brain]

I think people on GAF look back at N64 and Gamecube with rose-tinted glasses, not remembering those western second-party games didn't help Nintendo's hardware sales at all. That's probably why Iwata got rid of all that, because circa 1999 everyone (except Microsoft) believed Japan was still the main battleground.

What leads you to conclude that? N64 and GC sold a much higher percentage of worldwide LTD in NA than Nintendo's other consoles.

 

[RedSwirl]

What leads you to conclude that? N64 and GC sold a much higher percentage of worldwide LTD in NA than Nintendo's other consoles.

In the US as a percentage of worldwide sales? Fine. But in every other aspect the N64 still sold under the SNES and got trounced by PlayStation. And almost all the games that made PlayStation what it was at the time were Japanese. The climate today is, of course, much different.

 

[Log4Girlz]

Yeah, except it's not valid when no one agrees on what definition B means. Some people would have called the 3DS a "next-gen" portable when it launched. By definition A they would be right, but definition B would be debatable. It certainly had higher preformance than its predecessor, but not much more than the PSP. Yet it also offered features its competitors didnt (3D). Most "Master Race" PC enthusiasts would probably set their bar for Next-gen higher than Ouya enthusiasts when using definition B. That kinda waters down what it means and leads to people talking about levels of "nextgenyness". The term has very little utility at that point. If you use definition A in a vaccum, each system is next gen compared to its predecessor. The tech to build the PS4 was around during last gen, but as you say it was prohibitively expensive. That means that it isn't nextgen at all compared to a high end rig 3-4 years ago.
The Wii U is nextgen compared to the Wii, considering that the price of the components (esp the gamepad) was not available at a competitive price during the Wii's lifetime. Plus the Wii U is designed differently than it's competitors so direct comparison becomes difficult. Obviously the CPU/GPU are significantly behind the new PS/XB iterations, but they also don't have the equivalent tech to control 6 controllers, two of which stream SD 60fps video with mics and cameras. It's not a level field for comparison and people should stop distorting either definition to push an agenda. And remember, now that all three are out, they are all officially current-gen.

You can remain ignorant all you wish. Developers see the PS4 and XBone as a completely different generation of performance from the Wii U. The term "next gen" will be used countless times to describe technology which runs on that level of technology. Look for instance at what Ubi has stated about AC 5 vs. AC 4

 

[tinfoilhatman]

I would love nothing more to give Nintendo my money but the console hardware just kills it for me, give me traditional N games at 1080p....they don't have to rival PS4\PC graphics but they can't look like they are 2 generations behind everyone else.

 

[fredrancour]

I would love nothing more to give Nintendo my money but the console hardware just kills it for me, give me traditional N games at 1080p....they don't have to rival PS4\PC graphics but they can't look like they are 2 generations behind everyone else.

2 gens? You realize the wiiu is a thing right? It's definitely 1 gen. HD resolutions and such.

 

[Oddduck]

I think people on GAF look back at N64 and Gamecube with rose-tinted glasses, not remembering those western second-party games didn't help Nintendo's hardware sales at all. That's probably why Iwata got rid of all that, because circa 1999 everyone (except Microsoft) believed Japan was still the main battleground.

In the west, the N64 sold almost as well as the SNES because of that western support. Go back and look at the western sales for N64 and SNES. It was Japan where Nintendo fucked up N64. The Nintendo 64 would have done GameCube sales in the United States without Rareware, the Turok series, THQ WWF wrestling games, exclusive Nintendo Sports titles, or the LucasArts Star Wars games.

 

[RedSwirl]

In the west, the N64 sold almost as well as the SNES because of that western support. Go back and look at the western sales for N64 and SNES. It was Japan where Nintendo fucked up N64. The Nintendo 64 would have done GameCube sales in the United States without Rareware, the Turok series, THQ WWF wrestling games, exclusive Nintendo Sports titles, or the LucasArts Star Wars games.

But what was the difference between N64 and PlayStation in the US? Those numbers are proving a little bit tough for me to track down.

I know PS1 shipped something like 3x the N64 worldwide, and it did this mostly on the back of Japanese games. It's hard to say how much of that was NA, but I'd wager it was still much more than the N64. Again, that was the climate back then. The collection of western games on the N64 probably did stop it from being a total disaster and maybe even got it close to SNES sales there, but that still didn't make it anywhere near a match for the PS1's extensive Japanese 3rd party support. For that and probably other reasons, nobody expected western game development to be the main driving force of consoles until the mid 00's.

 

[Aquamarine]

But what was the difference between N64 and PlayStation in the US? Those numbers are proving a little bit tough for me to track down.

Production Shipments:
PS1 - 40.78 million to The Americas as of March 2005

Unit Sales to Retailers:
N64 - 20.63 million to The Americas as of March 2003


Sell-through to USA consumers:

N64 died in USA retail after 2002
PS1 died in USA retail after 2004


By the end of 2002 (N64's effective USA retail life):

PS1 - Roughly 26 million units sold to consumers
N64 - Roughly 17.8 million units sold to consumers


By the end of 2004 (PS1's effective USA retail life):

PS1 - Roughly 30.2 million units sold to consumers
N64 - Roughly 18 million units sold to consumers

 

[Durask]

What I got from initial post is the usual depressing

"Short term profits NOWNOWNOWNOWNOWNOWNOW".

WiiU was a misfire but it will not be fixed by wasting Mario franchise on iOs and Android.

 

[Shikamaru Ninja]

I think people on GAF look back at N64 and Gamecube with rose-tinted glasses, not remembering those western second-party games didn't help Nintendo's hardware sales at all. That's probably why Iwata got rid of all that, because circa 1999 everyone (except Microsoft) believed Japan was still the main battleground.

It's a really moot point or discombobulated assessment to pair the N64 and GameCube together. The GameCube is the very result of Iwata pulling pack from western first party productions. The only remnant that leaked was Eterrnal Darkness, which really spent more than half it's life as a Nintendo 64 product. Other than that you had a few western Nintendo developers working as subjugates to
Japanese producers on older established Japanese IPs.

The Nintendo 64 may not have been the market leader, but it was a notable and profitable coupling of hardware and software for Nintendo. The GameCube and Wii U could only dream to reach that echelon.

 

[Griss]

Aqua where do you get your numbers from? Is there a public site, or old Nintendo financial Neogaf threads, or do you have a private source?

I'd love to read up on some of these historical figures myself.

As for Nintendo, I really do believe that they will end up going 3rd party in the home console space and concentrate most of their attention on both hardware and software in the portable market. I don't think they'll ever go to mobile or social gaming, and I don't think that they should. However the 3rd party change won't happen anytime soon if it happens at all - probably not within the next five years at least.

 

[jcm]

Production Shipments:
PS1 - 40.78 million to The Americas as of March 2005

By the end of 2004 (PS1's effective USA retail life):
PS1 - Roughly 30.2 million units sold to consumers

What happened to the other 10m PS1s?

 

[AppleBlade]

2 gens? You realize the wiiu is a thing right? It's definitely 1 gen. HD resolutions and such.

People love to do that. I remember people saying the Wii had Dreamcast (and even N64) graphics. They distort reality. I mean, Assassin's Creed 3 & 4, Deus Ex: Human Revolution, Mass Effect 3, Darksiders 2, Batman: Arkham City and Batman: Origins are PS2 games according to that guy's assumptions.

 

[Vinci]

So long as they let me trade in my Wii U for a 3DS and some credit towards games for it, I would be fine if Nintendo went whole-hog into the portable space for the remainder of this generation.

Enjoy the system but it's clear they have no clue how to fix it, and being stuck with a dead console is an awful situation to be in.

That said, people not buying it for Super Mario 3D World and its other exclusives are crazy as hell.

 

[Aquamarine]

What happened to the other 10m PS1s?

More PS1 consoles were sold in The Americas / there were greater amounts of unsold PSone inventory / NPD wasn't as comprehensive 15 years ago as it is today.

 

[bishopcruz]

More PS1 consoles were sold in The Americas / there were greater amounts of unsold PSone inventory / NPD wasn't as comprehensive 15 years ago as it is today.

Does the Americas include South and Central America? That could explain some of it.

A 10 million shipped/sold difference seems hard to explain otherwise.

 

[Uncle Rupee]

For anyone asking why Nintendo doesn't release their games on iOS, why would Nintendo give up ~30% off the top of every sale to Apple when they have their own hardware to release games on?

 

[Cheerilee]

For anyone asking why Nintendo doesn't release their games on iOS, why would Nintendo give up ~30% off the top of every sale to Apple when they have their own hardware to release games on?

Because getting to keep 100% of nothing is still nothing, and getting to keep 70% of something is still something?

I'm not sure it's the best move for Nintendo, but I think that Nintendo should seriously consider it. Handhelds and consoles are similar but different markets, and Nintendo thinks it's absolutely worthwhile to be in both of them. Cell phones are similar but different. Why shouldn't Nintendo be in that market? Is it because they don't own the platform? Can Nintendo not go third party when it makes sense to do so? Nintendo spent a lifetime taking ~30% from their peers, what's wrong with them having to pay that fee for a change? That they would refuse to even consider such a thing just reeks of arrogance.

 

[Graphics Horse]

For anyone asking why Nintendo doesn't release their games on iOS, why would Nintendo give up ~30% off the top of every sale to Apple when they have their own hardware to release games on?

What if they made an ergonomic controller with its own high powered SOC inside? You could snap it to a phone and it would connect to a Nintendo App using your device's display, or connect it to a TV. You could do all the purchases through the controller system and bypass other stores, but have some cool free games as part of the Nintendo App used to promote the idea of the controller.
Nintendo could make an integrated tablet controller based on the same principle, with dual mode Android/Controller processors.
Given the price people are charging for mobile controllers it doesn't seem too crazy.

 

[RedSwirl]

I still think one thing Nintendo should consider for its next handheld is, essentially a small tablet with physical buttons. I'm not saying Nintendo should make a straight-up Kindle or iPad knockoff, but do something kinda similar to what the Kindle Fire is trying to be -- a general purpose device that's really good at one specific task. The Kindle Fire is a general tablet that's specifically made for reading books. Now I don't know what it's sales have been like but people seem to like the thing from what I see, and more importantly, Amazon makes sure to advertise how it's better than the iPad when it comes to reading eBooks.

The same approach but for gaming might not be a bad idea for Nintendo. It's honestly what the Vita should have been (and still could be if it got the right software). One reason is because no one has really nailed the "gaming tablet" yet. iOS is trying to do controllers but the efforts available right now kinda suck. Android doesn't have as much of a feeling of "unity" in its platform. Tablet platforms in general have been "just good enough" to sub-par when it comes to controls and game discoverability. Imagine if Nintendo made something oriented kinda like the original GBA but bigger (or like a Wii U GamePad but smaller) with a single large, high-quality touch screen (big enough to display old 3DS and DS games). Then, just do commercials showing how much better the gaming experience on it is compared to an iPad or Android device.

Gaming developer support in that area woudln't be that much of a problem. Indies are already warming up to Nintendo, many of them looking at it as a platform for people who actually care about buying and playing games. Japanese developers big and small would likely still support the thing, giving it something tablets don't have. Then you'd have Virtual Console and Nintendo's games. Most uniquely of all, Nintendo would likely try to prevent its system from being taken over by $0.99 games, putting its own software up as a standard and likely limiting the release pipeline just a tad.

The only real X factor (and it's a big one) would be Nintendo's ability to create an environment that would attract any kind of software development outside gaming, and thus the device's usefulness for general-purpose tablet stuff. Right now I don't see anyone breaking into that area which has been taken over by Android and iOS. The 3DS has media apps but that's about it. Nintendo would have to make some kind of dev kit solution for this platform far more available than probably any of its dev kits up to this point. I'm not sure the Nintendo of today could do it. It could very easily end up in the position Windows 8 phones and tablets are in now.

 

[Fourth Storm]

I still think one thing Nintendo should consider for its next handheld is, essentially a small tablet with physical buttons. I'm not saying Nintendo should make a straight-up Kindle or iPad knockoff, but do something kinda similar to what the Kindle Fire is trying to be -- a general purpose device that's really good at one specific task. The Kindle Fire is a general tablet that's specifically made for reading books. Now I don't know what it's sales have been like but people seem to like the thing from what I see, and more importantly, Amazon makes sure to advertise how it's better than the iPad when it comes to reading eBooks.

I have been having the same thoughts lately, and agree with you on this. There is no way Nintendo can compete with the sheer amount of apps and features of Android/iOS, so why not concentrate on doing just a few things well? A picture viewer and video player, PDF viewer, web browser, ebook reader, and maybe a few other productivity apps with Nintendo's style could help enhance the perceived value of such a device as long as it's sold for under $200 and Nintendo delivers the goods when it comes to gaming. Run an add campaign where they talk about the high quality of games available on the eShop vs the mess that is the Play store. Something like, "Tired of knockoffs? Play all the classics as well as all new adventures the way they were meant to be played."

 

[Scum]

Redswirl, that's not a bad idea. Add in a prominent online as well. Improve on what they have. They could do with it. I would like to see:

Online infrastructure -> Organised under Nintendo NetworkMiiVerse
Everything becomes MiiVerse ___ once you're logged in e.g. MiiVerse Plaza, MiiVerse eShop.
MiiVerse VC - All the back catalogue of NES/Gameboy to Wii/DS games released thus far under a Spotify style service.
Tvii MiiVerseTV/MiiVerse Entertainment - TV shows like the entire seasons of Pokemon for a start, video games music and film deals with Disney. Again, Spotify it.

I'm on my phone so apologies if it makes little sense, but you get idea. 😊

 

[RedSwirl]

I have been having the same thoughts lately, and agree with you on this. There is no way Nintendo can compete with the sheer amount of apps and features of Android/iOS, so why not concentrate on doing just a few things well? A picture viewer and video player, PDF viewer, web browser, ebook reader, and maybe a few other productivity apps with Nintendo's style could help enhance the perceived value of such a device as long as it's sold for under $200 and Nintendo delivers the goods when it comes to gaming. Run an add campaign where they talk about the high quality of games available on the eShop vs the mess that is the Play store. Something like, "Tired of knockoffs? Play all the classics as well as all new adventures the way they were meant to be played."

I don't know if I'd trust Nintendo to be able to do all those productivity apps and such, at least not with the quality people expect. At that point Nintendo's software development is branching out of its element. They don't have the kind of broad software expertise Apple and Google have. I was thinking Nintendo would encourage other companies to develop their apps for Nintendo's platform by making that platform's API widely available. Adobe reader, Photoshop Express (or Mario Paint), the Kindle App, Google Docs, Chrome (Nintendo would probably pack Opera on the thing), etc. Maybe bring back PictoChat as the main IM service.

Redswirl, that's not a bad idea. Add in a prominent online as well. Improve on what they have. They could do with it. I would like to see:

Online infrastructure -> Organised under Nintendo NetworkMiiVerse
Everything becomes MiiVerse ___ once you're logged in e.g. MiiVerse Plaza, MiiVerse eShop.
MiiVerse VC - All the back catalogue of NES/Gameboy to Wii/DS games released thus far under a Spotify style service.
Tvii MiiVerseTV/MiiVerse Entertainment - TV shows like the entire seasons of Pokemon for a start, video games music and film deals with Disney. Again, Spotify it.

I'm on my phone so apologies if it makes little sense, but you get idea. 😊

Leveraging Pokemon media would be a good idea, but I think in the area of cheap games Nintendo should just be more aggressive with its current Virtual Console system. For starters, stop worrying about putting the ROM dumps in their own individual wrappers and just do broad emulators like Sony has done for its PS1 games. Then just advertise marquee releases like SMB1, Mega Man, and Sonic (while hopefully honoring the licenses of people who bought those games on the current eShop). That alone though would probably require a gradual change in Nintendo's thought process.

 

[LocalE]

I don't know a single person who was hyped for the Wii U and still plays it.

Allow me to introduce myself...

officially? Like made official by the UN or something?

Officially, like because they are all released and available for consumers to buy and use. Made official by reality, if you will.


Anyways, I certainly expect to see adjustments made at Nintendo over the next years. I'm just glad they seem to be taking their time and not rushing into idiotic changes such as developing titles for mobile platforms or putting the VC all on mobile. Or going into full moron mode and going third party.
I happen to like the way Nintendo software is not propped up by DLC and riddled with microtransaction bullshit. And it is generally quite polished and not in need of extensive patching to render it playable.
I'd prefer Nintendo continue to be conservative and patient and not jump on the bandwagons being ridden by today's AAAA obsessed publishers and developers. Keep at it, serve their niche with quality products as they have done, and watch for their next opportunity to make billions and billions of dollars.

 

[meanspartan]

It is probably too late for the Wii U to move 75 million. Hell, it is probably too late for 50. But I don't think it is too late to save it from the embarrassing failure it is on track for now. If Nintendo makes the right moves, drops the price even more, and keeps a consistent flow of solid first party games coming to it, I think it can still be a 30-40 million seller.

 

[EatinOlives]

I wonder what will be the investors' breaking point in Nintendo's mantra of exclusively selling their software through their hardware. We're reaching the point with games like Mario 3D World where the software's sales are being hampered by the company's inability to move the hardware. If the WiiU continues to sell this disastrously, what do they do? Will Nintendo continue to churn out quality/expensive titles for a system they know will handicap the game's sales?

 

[Sneds]

What I got from initial post is the usual depressing

"Short term profits NOWNOWNOWNOWNOWNOWNOW".

WiiU was a misfire but it will not be fixed by wasting Mario franchise on iOs and Android.

Waste? Are there a finite number of Mario games?

Some of the games in the NES remix would work perfectly well on mobile. One of the mini games is a Mario runner.

 

[DesertFox]

I feel like the Wii U would be much more successful if they hadn't used the Wii name. Most people still don't know that it's a standalone system. If they had released it with a different name it probably would have gathered more mind share. Most people hear Wii U and think that you're talking about the system released in 2006.

 

[Ivan el Trolazo]

official nintendo controller for iphone, with VC crossbuy support

 

[Dryk]

For anyone asking why Nintendo doesn't release their games on iOS, why would Nintendo give up ~30% off the top of every sale to Apple when they have their own hardware to release games on?

Because most people that would never buy a 3DS for the non-existent VC are all over free GBA emulators for their smart-phone. At least most people I know that grew up with Nintendo games.

That's a market segment that Nintendo are just letting have their content for free and they need to start going after them with versions of their games that actually cost money.

 

[Sneds]

I feel like the Wii U would be much more successful if they hadn't used the Wii name. Most people still don't know that it's a standalone system. If they had released it with a different name it probably would have gathered more mind share. Most people hear Wii U and think that you're talking about the system released in 2006.

This is really anecdotal but I brought my Wii to my parents house for Xmas. My parents and sister who don't normally play games really enjoyed it. My mum liked Wii Sports so much that she decided to buy her own Wii. She asked me about the Wii U. I explained that it was a new console and told her about the second screen. Her response was that the motion controls was what made the Wii different and interesting. She didn't see the point in he Wii U. I know that the Wii U still uses motion controls but the emphasis isn't on them. If the Wii U had been a backwards comparable Wii 2 with emphasis on motion again she probably would have got one. Obviously a sample size of one can't tell us anything about general opinion but I wonder if other people would feel similarly.

 

[meanspartan]

I feel like the Wii U would be much more successful if they hadn't used the Wii name. Most people still don't know that it's a standalone system. If they had released it with a different name it probably would have gathered more mind share. Most people hear Wii U and think that you're talking about the system released in 2006.

Yea their naming has been atrocious.

"Oh hey I want to get my son this game but it says 3ds and he only has a 2ds."

"Oh that's ok, 3ds games work on a 2ds!"

"Wonderful! Well I am also going to buy him this new Mario game, he also has a Wii"

"Oh sorry no, that is only for Wii U. Does he have a Wii U?"

"....."

 

[The Power Of Snap]

Duck hunt on ios

 

[zeldablue]

Didn't Iwata say 2014 would have a "hardcore" lineup?

Will an epic Zelda announcement shift sales?

 

[meanspartan]

Didn't Iwata say 2014 would have a "hardcore" lineup?

Will an epic Zelda announcement shift sales?

I doubt it. I think each of the tentpole franchise releases will sell Wii Us sure, but nowhere near enough to bring it even close to what Wii did.

Just look at the new Mario. Excellent reviews and GOTY contender for some. We have indeed seen a bump- from "WE ARE DEAD, WE ARE ALL DEAD" to Dreamcast numbers.

They need something more to save the system than just the predictable iterations.

 

[Trevelyan9999]

Yes indeed the name is one of the big problems. PlayStation, PlayStation 2, PlayStation U.....what is that, like an add-on to the PS2? Silly that people can't understand that it's a new console from the name? Not really, the name just fucks the perception up right away sadly and takes a hit to generating momentum to the public mind set.

Then you have the Gamepad, while awesome and does a lot of cool things, doesn't do that one thing that stands out to make people take notice. Sad because I love the Wii U and wish people could easily see why the system is worth getting but it is just not really possible without trying it first. Wii U is also better suited for single player games which is the exact opposite of the first Wii. This system is a really hard sell.

 

[zeldablue]

I doubt it. I think each of the tentpole franchise releases will sell Wii Us sure, but nowhere near enough to bring it even close to what Wii did.

Just look at the new Mario. Excellent reviews and GOTY contender for some. We have indeed seen a bump- from "WE ARE DEAD, WE ARE ALL DEAD" to Dreamcast numbers.

They need something more to save the system than just the predictable iterations.

Oh, yeah for sure. I just meant could this year at least stay in line with the Gamecube...

The only way I could see Wii U getting Wii numbers is if it makes another huge risk and tries to make virtual reality into a mainstream thing before the competitors do. They'll continue to make poor sales with only the dedicated Nintendo fans buying it otherwise.

 

[Tricky I Shadow]

We all know the Wii U is clearly beyond saving...but the thing is I'm not even sure if another Nintendo home console can survive because of the damage the Wii U has done. Nintendo are in a hole and I don't think they'll be able to get out of it unless they have another 'fluke'. Microsoft, Sony and even Nintendo have squeezed themselves out of the competition over the last few years and I don't think they can really do anything to squeeze themselves back into relevancy with home consoles. So much damage has been done and they're just getting left so far behind the competition. Will they release another home console? Yeah probably. Will it be successful? I highly doubt it.

 

[Trevelyan9999]

We all know the Wii U is clearly beyond saving....but the thing is I'm not even sure if another Nintendo home console can survive because of the damage the Wii U has done. Nintendo are in hole and I don't think they'll be able to get out of it unless they have another fluke. Microsoft, Sony and even Nintendo have squeezed themselves out of the competition over the last few years and I don't think they can really do anything to squeeze themselves back into relevancy with home consoles. So much damage has been done and they're just getting left so far behind the competition. Will they release another home console? Yeah probably. Will it be successful? I highly doubt it.

Nah, it is easy to feel that way but all it takes is some new true innovation from Nintendo like they have in the past to make their next system an easy to understand must have. New management might be part of the answer but ultimately it will be Nintendo's innovation that will win out in the future. Nintendo is not a company that just copies the other guys.

 

[Freezie KO]

Nintendo is not a company that just copies the other guys.

Not even the stuff that works.

 

[Cheerilee]

Oh, yeah for sure. I just meant could this year at least stay in line with the Gamecube...

The only way I could see Wii U getting Wii numbers is if it makes another huge risk and tries to make virtual reality into a mainstream thing before the competitors do. They'll continue to make poor sales with only the dedicated Nintendo fans buying it otherwise.

N64 sold 9.4 million units in it's second year.

In GameCube's second year, Nintendo said "Surely we can at least sell 9 million GameCubes..." They sold 5.76 million.

For the Wii U, Nintendo was again sure that they could sell 9 million in the second year (despite first-year trends showing that Nintendo is going steadily downhill, and that Wii was an exception). People seem to be resigned by this point to the fact that it won't sell 9 million, but "Surely things can't get any worse than GameCube, can they?" Yeah, it can always get worse.

In the first six months of year two, Wii U sold 500k worldwide. The system is dead in Europe. Nintendo theorized that the PS4/Xbone launches and Black Friday might energize the Wii U, but it got killed on Black Friday in America, selling only 200k units. In Japan, during the Christmas rush, and without any competition from PS4 (it hasn't launched there yet), Nintendo was able to celebrate two whole weeks of 100k unit sales. Nintendo has cobbled together around a million units in year two, not nine or even five million. We're still waiting for December NPD, but it would take a minor miracle for Wii U to reach GameCube levels at this point.

 

[Dryk]

Yea their naming has been atrocious.

"Oh hey I want to get my son this game but it says 3ds and he only has a 2ds."

"Oh that's ok, 3ds games work on a 2ds!"

"Wonderful! Well I am also going to buy him this new Mario game, he also has a Wii"

"Oh sorry no, that is only for Wii U. Does he have a Wii U?"

"....."

"So the Wii U is a new console but I can use all my old controllers?"
"Are they Wii Remote Plus?"
"...."

 

[metalslimer]

Nah, it is easy to feel that way but all it takes is some new true innovation from Nintendo like they have in the past to make their next system an easy to understand must have. New management might be part of the answer but ultimately it will be Nintendo's innovation that will win out in the future. Nintendo is not a company that just copies the other guys.

What true innovation can they possibly have that won't be in some other electronic device and done better within months. This is the problem with designing your system around a singular gimmick now. The electronics industry moves as a blazing pace with new additions added extremely quickly. The PSP was the most powerful portable device that size for years while Vita was surpassed not even a year into its lifespan. No one used the 3D screen, but that was because no one cares about it. Nintendo could try the virtual reality route, but virtual reality is not something that really benefits Nintendo's family audience. It's more focused on the immersive single player experience. If Nintendo is to truly have a breakthrough, I think it will have to be a software breakthrough like Ocarina of Time and Super Mario 64.

 

[Tricky I Shadow]

Nah, it is easy to feel that way but all it takes is some new true innovation from Nintendo like they have in the past to make their next system an easy to understand must have. New management might be part of the answer but ultimately it will be Nintendo's innovation that will win out in the future. Nintendo is not a company that just copies the other guys.

New true innovation? I don't even think Nintendo knows what that is anymore.

 

[I-hate-u]

Wasn't Nintendo profitable with the GC despite being not the weakest hardware and having the lowest MSRP of any console at the time?

Why not replicate that by ditching the Gamepad and rebranding the console to at least salvage what's left?

 

[18-Volt]

It's funny how Nintendo's past strategies were always changed after success and failure of past consoles:

SNES: NES was incredibly successful, let's not fix what's not broken and release a console with same formula with NES. Same name, same controls, more powerful. Also we should try to attract arcade gamers.

N64: SNES was more successful in US than Japan, so let's focus on western, particularly North American market. More western developed games, less Mario. Control stick and rumble pack are sure to attract them.

GC: Well, PSOne won previous round because it was a cute, small and compact system that everybody would love, in contrast our ugly and ancient looking N64. And it had got tons of Japanese games, turns out Japanese support is more essential. Let's make a cute little console with more support from our home country. Of course it will be more powerful, people need to play with THE POWER!

Wii: Well it turns out people don't really need to play with power. The last gen had three consoles which are TOO similiar, we need to go another route. as of now PS2 still sells almost double of Xbox 360 so graphics really don't matter. What we really need to do is attract more than true gamers. Let's create something nobody had ever done before, something that everybody want to experience at least once.

Wii U: Wii sold 100 million, so again, we should repeat the success with making similiar console. Wii beat other powerful two, so it proved graphics didn't matter at all. But Wii sales slowed down lately, we need to another different experience to keep being relevant. Maybe we should go after tablet gamers?

So, what can they say about Wii U after its catastrophe?
- Last 2 gens we completely ignored game support for consoles, we seriously need to go after 3rd parties before we losing them completely.
- Home console business is really dying in Japan, we should shift our focus entirely to western market.
- Graphics DO matter to some extent. We should think about that.
- Our internal studios are old and not familiar with today's tech. We need more studios and young manpower.
- Expanded audience isn't reliable, our main focus must always be true gamers and teenagers.
- More [quality] games always mean more sales, last gen proved this.

 

[TheWraith]

No one used the 3D screen, but that was because no one cares about it.

C'mon now, I really hope you're not serious.

 

[Effect]

I'm looking forward to Iwata addressing the fact that the PS4 will have outsold the Wii U in just 2 to 3 months without a full worldwide release. I want him called on the handling of the Wii U overall but especially on wasting more then an entire year and the failure regarding third parties putting product on the system. I really hope whatever translation get is detailed.

 

[zeldablue]

N64 sold 9.4 million units in it's second year.

In GameCube's second year, Nintendo said "Surely we can at least sell 9 million GameCubes..." They sold 5.76 million.

For the Wii U, Nintendo was again sure that they could sell 9 million in the second year (despite first-year trends showing that Nintendo is going steadily downhill, and that Wii was an exception). People seem to be resigned by this point to the fact that it won't sell 9 million, but "Surely things can't get any worse than GameCube, can they?" Yeah, it can always get worse.

In the first six months of year two, Wii U sold 500k worldwide. The system is dead in Europe. Nintendo theorized that the PS4/Xbone launches and Black Friday might energize the Wii U, but it got killed on Black Friday in America, selling only 200k units. In Japan, during the Christmas rush, and without any competition from PS4 (it hasn't launched there yet), Nintendo was able to celebrate two whole weeks of 100k unit sales. Nintendo has cobbled together around a million units in year two, not nine or even five million. We're still waiting for December NPD, but it would take a minor miracle for Wii U to reach GameCube levels at this point.

I see...sounds very rough.

So a crazy lineup of awesome 1st party titles may be irrelevant then. I just assumed the Wii U would sell like crap until the major titles came out.

I really hope they switch up soon, because they've majorly screwed up for this gen.