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Zen4´s official unveiling is today

I corrected that a few hours ago.
AMD today confirmed that the IGP in these Zen4 CPUs are still RDNA2.
Well, it's still a massive upgrade from GCN 5th gen chips
Would I be setting myself up for disappointment by hoping the PS5 Pro will have a Zen 4?
If PS5/PS5 Pro has an abstraction layer that allows such processor changes, it might even have a Zen 5, (or better) by the time it launches.

Then it'll either run the games with the architectural gains that the new processor allows, or devise a baseline PS5 mode, that matches it for compatibility reasons. Exactly what PS5 is doing with PS4/PS4 Pro games.

What will dictate such a change is probably price and availability, if zen5 is cheaper at any point against keeping the existing cpu design, you can bet they'll upgrade it.
 

M1chl

Currently Gif and Meme Champion
I am more interested in price of MOBOs, because that will be decide if I upgrade or not. Last time I payed more for ASUS X570-E than for CPU...
 

winjer

Gold Member
I’m on a 5600X right now, but it’s for these reasons that I’m really curious to see Intel’s 5nm which is said to be more dense than TSMC’s

It’s unbelievable they kept their head above water with their 14nm+++++++++++++ node, they have some amazing engineers to stay afloat with their foundry problems.

Intel still doesn't have a 5nm process node. And they probably never will, simply because they plan to call their next node as Intel 4.
They have a 10nm node. Which they improved 10-15% and called Intel 7.
This is what Intel is using for Alder Lake and Raptor Lake.
Truth be told, Intel could call Intel 7 node, as 10nm++

1q4t7K7.jpg
 
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I’m on a 5600X right now, but it’s for these reasons that I’m really curious to see Intel’s 5nm which is said to be more dense than TSMC’s
Intel always goes for transistor density with their nodes, but they're behind schedule now, 7nm intel will match/beat TSMC's 5nm, but it'll only be out by late 2023, when TSMC is launching 3nm's in early 2023, running it over completely.

Nodes are reaching the end of the line anyway, and when they do every manufacturer will focus on density. Intel is behind.
It’s unbelievable they kept their head above water with their 14nm+++++++++++++ node, they have some amazing engineers to stay afloat with their foundry problems.
their 14nm process was really good at withstanding heat and the density wasn't far from TSMC's 10nm. Meaning for quite a few years it was a way better process for them than their 10 nm node. Intel 10 nm node at first was really bad with heat, super bad yields.
 

OZ9000

Banned
Best time to buy AM5 will be into its second generation IMO (similar to when AMD launched the Ryzen 2000)

I don't see any reason to upgrade beyond my 5700X. My CPU is already way more powerful than what's in the PS5 and Xbox.
 

DonkeyPunchJr

World’s Biggest Weeb
Real talk for “PS5 Pro” CPU, I expect that size, cost, and power consumption will be prioritized over performance upgrades.

PS5’s CPU is already pretty damn good (something that wasn’t true of the prior generations). Makes more sense to spend all their transistor/power budget on the GPU.
 

Trogdor1123

Gold Member
AMD did show a tease of RDNA3, during the livestream.
So here is the first official photo of RDNA3 GPU.

yPbAh1X.png
I mean for the igpu. The 7600g, 7700g and 7800g. Assuming those actually happen now but with ddr5 feeding the igp it could get some awesome performance for an igpu.
 
Real talk for “PS5 Pro” CPU, I expect that size, cost, and power consumption will be prioritized over performance upgrades.

PS5’s CPU is already pretty damn good (something that wasn’t true of the prior generations). Makes more sense to spend all their transistor/power budget on the GPU.

Good point. I imagine it would be best to focus the budget on a better GPU like with ps4 Pro

Let's alter my previous post. Would I be setting myself up for disappointment by hoping for an RDNA3 gpu?
 
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I mean for the igpu. The 7600g, 7700g and 7800g. Assuming those actually happen now
4800g/5800g never existed, I wouldn't count of 7800g being a thing, sadly.
Let's alter my previous post. Would I be setting myself up for disappointment by hoping for an RDNA3 gpu?
It's possible but they'll never drop a vanilla RDNA3 gpu in there after all the customization they did on the original one, RDNA3 or 4 would have to be customized with "compatibility blocks" so it's able to run unpatched code for the baseline PS5 most likely making the fact it is RDNA3 way less relevant than otherwise. They can't do away with the Geometry Engine and Tempest Engine customizations/headroom and RDNA's VRR and mesh shading blocks probably won't be relevant still unless they're there only for games enhanced for the PS5 Pro.

Here looking at what they did with PS4 and PS4 Pro is good for predicting what they might do. So, PS4 was GCN 2nd gen based with 18 CU's, PS4 pro was GCN 4th gen with 36 CU's. Double the CU's meant a compatibility mode with base PS4 was easier as they could use only half the GPU (18 CU's out of 36 CU's). Architecture was similar enough that they could actually update the generation the GPU was based on, but PS4 feature set had less customization than PS5 has. AFAIK, the main change on PS4 was how CU's and the cache serving them (1 cache block for each 4 CU's) was organized and increased to allow for better GPGPU task performance and I understand these were changes that AMD own GPU development department introduced into their architecture later on (for the same reasons).

I'd say they either go with 54 CU's (36+18CU's) or 72 CU's (36+36 CU's). Doubling the GPU would easily net them 20 TFlops instead of 10 (a bit more than that would be a given), half doubling could get them close if they increased clocks a bit but probably not past 18 Tflops. If at that point the hardware had something similar to DLSS on top it would be quite the upgrade regardless.

Also worth to note, Radeon RX 6800 XT has 72 CU's (and Radeon RX 6700 has 36 CU's and 11 TFlops) so theoretically, Sony could make a PS5 Pro today if they backported their customizations into the RX 6800 XT blueprint.

But I'm unsure they'll have a pro spec this generation, demand would have to drop before it makes any sense.
 
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DonkeyPunchJr

World’s Biggest Weeb
4800g/5800g never existed, I wouldn't count of 7800g being a thing, sadly.

It's possible but they'll never drop a vanilla RDNA3 gpu in there after all the customization they did on the original one, RDNA3 or 4 would have to be customized with "compatibility blocks" so it's able to run unpatched code for the baseline PS5 most likely making the fact it is RDNA3 way less relevant than otherwise.

Here looking at what they did with PS4 and PS4 Pro is good for predicting what they might do. So, PS4 was GCN 2nd gen based with 18 CU's, PS4 pro was GCN 4th gen with 36 CU's. Double the CU's meant a compatibility mode with base PS4 was easier as they could use only half the GPU (18 CU's out of 36 CU's). Architecture was similar enough that they could actually update the architecture, but PS4 feature set had less customization than PS5.

I'd say they either go with 54 CU's (36+18CU's) or 72 CU's (36+36 CU's). Doubling the GPU would easily net them 20 TFlops instead of 10, half doubling could get them close if they increased clocks a bit.

But I'm unsure they'll have a pro spec this generation, demand would have to drop before it makes any sense.
I agree, wider version of their current GPU architecture is IMO more likely than switching to a new architecture.
 

DonkeyPunchJr

World’s Biggest Weeb
Best time to buy AM5 will be into its second generation IMO (similar to when AMD launched the Ryzen 2000)

I don't see any reason to upgrade beyond my 5700X. My CPU is already way more powerful than what's in the PS5 and Xbox.
I mean… if you have a high end CPU from the last few years then of course you don’t have a (gaming) reason to upgrade.

If you are in the market for a new CPU/motherboard, however, then I wouldn’t hesitate. My B350 motherboard from freaking early 2017 got Ryzen 5000 (including 5800X3D) support.

A good AM5 motherboard + 32 GB of good low-latency DDR5 will last you for many years of gaming. Just wait a month or two for the early adopter issues to be identified/fixed.
 

OZ9000

Banned
I mean… if you have a high end CPU from the last few years then of course you don’t have a (gaming) reason to upgrade.

If you are in the market for a new CPU/motherboard, however, then I wouldn’t hesitate. My B350 motherboard from freaking early 2017 got Ryzen 5000 (including 5800X3D) support.

A good AM5 motherboard + 32 GB of good low-latency DDR5 will last you for many years of gaming. Just wait a month or two for the early adopter issues to be identified/fixed.
Depends on the price.

But AMD's mobo prices have been ridiculous lately. My B550 motherboard cost me £200.
 
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winjer

Gold Member
I wonder how they are going to separate the b650, b650e, x670, and x670e price wise?

Is the pci5 change that big of a deal?

Even now, the difference in performance between PCIe 16X gen3 and gen4 is very small.
I think Spider-man remaster is the one game where there is a significant difference.
So the difference between Gen4 and Gen5 will be next to none.
The question is how long will you want to keep your motherboard. Because 4 years from now, there are sure to be GPUs that will take advantage of PCIe Gen5.
 

RoboFu

One of the green rats
I wish there was a big game coming out that warranted a new build for me this year. Maybe next year. 🤷‍♂️

What I think is super cool is that all the MBs have 2.5gb lan. I means it’s no 10 but it’s a lot better than 1.
 

LiquidMetal14

hide your water-based mammals
I wish there was a big game coming out that warranted a new build for me this year. Maybe next year. 🤷‍♂️

What I think is super cool is that all the MBs have 2.5gb lan. I means it’s no 10 but it’s a lot better than 1.
That's more major than let on.
 

Ironbunny

Member
Wonder how much of a difference there will be with cooling 5900x vs 7900x. :S I'm running mine as a stock with NZXT Kraken Z73 cooling it but it is as loud as would ever want it to be. Hopefully the realworld differences in cooling will be negligible.
 

winjer

Gold Member

3BXrW7W.jpg


A Cinebench R23 picture of AMD's recently announce Ryzen 9 7950X CPU having been put through its paces have appeared online via a post on Baidu, which has been taken down since the picture was posted. However, courtesy of @harukaze5719 it lives on, on Twitter and gives us a first glimpse into the Cinebench R23 performance of the upcoming CPU. The CPU is said to have been air cooled, so it's possible that we'll see even higher benchmark numbers with better cooling, so take these numbers with a pinch of sodium chloride, just to be on the safe side. The test system was also using Windows 10, so there's the potential of some extra performance by changing to Windows 11 here as well.

In the single score test, the Ryzen 9 7950X scores 2,205 points, which is in line with Cinebench R23 leaks for Intel's upcoming Core i9-13900K CPU, if a smidgen slower. The multi-core score is obviously not going to compete with Intel's Core i9-13900K due to the overall lower core count, but at 29,649, but it's ahead of the Core i9-12900K by a decent margin. It'll be interesting to see how AMD positions the 7000-series of CPUs, as although it seems like the company has done a good job in improving the overall performance compared to the 5000-series, it's not quite enough to take the performance crown this time around, if these early benchmark leaks from both sides are anything to go by.
 
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winjer

Gold Member
We already knew Zen4 was selling bellow expectations, and now comes the price drop. Which is always welcome for consumers.

 
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This is welcome, but motherboards and RAM price were the real problem in my book.

If they're taking these measures it sadly seems like those two "real issues" will take a while to fix. Perhaps a full year.

7950x at that price sure seems like a good deal though. Should help.
 
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Celcius

°Temp. member

We already knew Zen4 was selling bellow expectations, and now comes the price drop. Which is always welcome for consumers.

Good.
They need to do the same thing in the US and other regions too though. Now potentials customers are just going to wait for the price drop to be available locally, if they weren't already waiting for X3D chips.
 

Crayon

Member
The price is a bit high but if you are a professional it's not outrageous.

The other big problem is that for gaming you have much cheaper setups that crush shit at 60fps.
 
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