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Bikini Armor Battle Damage: Sexy Armor Hypocrisy (?) featuring (some of) NeoGAF
- Thread starter Dawg
- Start date
Dr. Kitty Muffins
Member
Probably. But it is clear that will backfire as they have alienated part of their male base. It better bring in a TON of new female fans to offset that.
MotionBlue
Member
No more than any other country. Why single them out?
Tumblr is the home of poor arguments, hypocrisy and terrible memes.
……forgetit
Member
This post reminds me of people who thinks anyone who brings up racism are the real racists.
GreenLiquid
Neo Member
Presumably because the cultural artifact we are talking about (the armor in FF XV) is from Japan. We could talk about problems in the West too, but that would belong in another thread where cultural artifacts of the West are being discussed.
I am aware that Tumblr often makes a poor case for itself but I am not sure why you are denigrating it here on the basis of SkeptiMism's comment.
SkeptiMism
Member
Going slightly off topic, but I'd argue Japan has a lot more problems with those things than any civilized western country at least. As a simple example, there was that story about the woman in their parliament, who was talking about motherhood and its cultural problems in Japan, and during her speech she got laughed at and told how could she talk about problems of motherhood culturally if she's not a mother herself, so she should become one.
The culture is fucked up in many ways, in completely different levels than many other countries are.
Anyway, the author didn't really single out them in the first place, but she responded to the argument that some people make about Japanese games to defend them.
Hell yeah Japan has an issue with female objectification and its actually worse because starting a conversation about it is perceived as " wrong", and the "its as bad as all countries" while refusing to talk about such countries, bringing examples and data is just a nice way of saying "Lets not talk about Japan".
This is just another variation of the " that loli girl is actually a 1000 year old sage" argument.
This is just another variation of the " that loli girl is actually a 1000 year old sage" argument.
...wat.
How are those things/justifications/explanations/whatever-you-want-to-call-them related at all?
It's true that culture should not be an end-all be-all, but culture definitely does have a place in an argument. What you consider as sexualized and objectifying can be viewed differently depending on where you're coming from. I wouldn't defend or justify some depiction of female characters, because they are in fact "fanservice," but there is a point where the depiction of femininity in media is accepted due to cultural and societal circumstance.
MotionBlue
Member
Extreme cases always exist. Remember the US politician that said the female body would shut down any pregnancy cause by "legitimate rape".
Its almost like they isolated themselves for thousands of years, then had nuclear bombs dropped on two civilian centers.
I understand that, I really do. They just use typical 'counter arguments' that have been discussed hundreds of times before, while adding nothing to the discussion but anger. I would be happy to see less hooker outfits in my fantasy media, but at the same time I can appreciate artistic choices. I don't hinge my enjoyment of an entire media, upon some inconsequential art asset.
You are using plot to excuse an obviously stereotypical aesthetic choice.
I think it is more uncomfortable to wear a metal vest and metal boots.He will still get raw from sunburn with his stupid vest. He should at least wear a shirt under it.
Well, I'm not, but now I at least understand what you were trying to get at.
Amongst loads of terrible comments we got a good one that wasn't posted:
Hahaha, that is what I said to myself when I saw it ;p
Ironic that the 2nd part wouldn't have happened if the first part had remained the same ;p
faceless007
Member
So you just went from "They're no more sexist than any other country" to "Here are the reasons why their culture is more sexist than others"? And I have no idea how that last thing could possibly serve as an explanation.
So are you saying it fits?
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
They're no more culturally sexist than any other country, and if they are, it's because they got nuked.
Is this really what you're saying, or am I misunderstanding? Because... that's really, really funny.
[Edit: beaten]
What the fuck
Also, the thing that ended their isolation was when the US forced the Convention of Kanagawa in 1855, almost a century before the atomic bomb was used.
blankempathy
Member
Most people don't walk around like that because depending on your skin you'll easily get burned. Plus on top of that too much sun exposure naturally damages the skin even if you're not getting burnt. You're best off clothes that are made of light material and still comfortable even when hot. Plus hes still wearing metal boots. His feet would sweat so much that he'd probably have gangrene
ScriptedReality
Member
The design just looks bad in general. Like the outfit itself
it's even worse high-res
oh god my eyes
whenever I see this pic I can hardly appreciate the fine details of the armor as the weapon always gets my undivided attention
It's totally a pizza slicer for the pizza he's delivering in his bag. He even brought some spare pizza pans on his arms.
BasilZero
Member
I dont know about you but I dont see any resemblance of a bikini on the OP pic.
"Sexy" imagery was not what came to my mind when I first saw this pic lol. People need to get their minds off the gutter.
Actually I think its pretty cool armor
.
However that sword I agree is awful, like what the hell...
"Sexy" imagery was not what came to my mind when I first saw this pic lol. People need to get their minds off the gutter.
Actually I think its pretty cool armor
.However that sword I agree is awful, like what the hell...
Shouta
Member
Japan has issues with gender equity. Sexuality though? Eh, not really. They're probably more sex positive than the US is and it's not treated as taboo. Certain issues do exist, of course, such as objectification, but it occurs for both men and women pretty often.
Banana Aeon
Member
It's supposed to be, but somewhere along the line, the artist dropped acid, and this is what we got in return.
SolidSnakex
Member
Was Itahana (Mevius' character designer) responsible for Kuja's design in FFIX?
I know he's listed with two others as the character designers for that game.
I know he's listed with two others as the character designers for that game.
Cidney is a shit design, whoever praised her look is bad and should feel bad.
Banana Aeon
Member
Was Itahana (Mevius' character designer) responsible for Kuja's design in FFIX?
I know he's listed with two others as the character designers for that game.
I don't know who that is, but...I'm intrigued...
But poofy sleeves, pls go. Do not work on dudes.
sensui-tomo
Member
Kuja from Final fantasy 9
He is the big bad
Now I can't tell if you are being sarcastic (which if you are COMPLETELY DISREGARD THIS) but if you actually mean that, are you saying the following "I don't like X, people who do like X are bad and should feel bad" aka Shaming someone for their taste (especially in art which is that to the beholder) which isn't seen as a good act towards their peers?
Banana Aeon
Member
captainpat
Member
No Kuja is Hideo Minaba
I think he's just using the meme and doesn't mean it literally.
http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/your-musics-bad-and-you-should-feel-bad
MotionBlue
Member
No. I'm addressing why they might have different cultural problems, and how their culture is so much more different in general.
Uh... yeah?
I think what he meant is that since they were isolated during for three centuries they may be more bound to their traditions that other western countries. Remember that since mid-XVI century to mid-XIX century they were isolated and after the politicians had to turn Japans from a feudal-like reign into a modern capitalist country in 3 or 4 decades.
He has probably exagerated the message.
Not that I agree (I don't know enough about Japan and its people to make judge them like that) but that's get I understood.
stump sock
Member
I disagree. These are boring (and everywhere):
This is lazy and uncreative:
These are cool-looking and badass:
I didn't really elaborate what I was thinking very well. In my mind what I was trying to say was "at a certain point, fuck trying to worry about practical armor and go the FFXV route and just have people running around in everyday clothes"
or whatever passes for "everyday clothes" in Nomura's weirdo mind I guess. but if you just decide the pull the trigger on ignoring armor, you could go wild with your choices. a powder blue tuxedo! why not!
Quite a few things happened in that time period, including the Russo-Japanese War, the first Sino-Japanese War, the second Sino-Japanese War, the invasion and occupation of Manchuria and Korea, and the entire Meiji Restoration.
It's a bit odd to go "Its almost like they isolated themselves for thousands of years, then had nuclear bombs dropped on two civilian centers." when there's quite a bit of stuff that happened in-between to shape the culture there.
MotionBlue
Member
While their brief period of imperialism, is important(and filled with all kinds of horrible things). The two events I listed are mostly unique to that specific country.
Yup. Dunno why people latched onto it.
Would you prefer a bingo sheet?
stump sock
Member
NeoGAF: your source for summing up two centuries of history and cultural sociology in a handful of sentences
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
Still has jack shit to do with what we're talking about, though. Non sequitur if I've ever seen one...
What a mess. If we are supposed to take the screenshot comments as representative, then the only dumb ones are the "is that supposed to be a man" and the "metrosexual" one. Where have those two been?
It's criticism of the perceived ridiculousness of the design, is what it looks like to me. We don't have reason to suppose there is subtext in enough posters that they are reflexively reacting to non-Straight Boys Club depictions of men (it must be so that essentially, men are cool, the women are cute/sexy/hot), though obviously since the forum is big enough and we get all sorts of posters here some people will think like that. I don't at all object that strongly to the design beyond it just looking unbelievable, not so much for contextual stuff like the differing treatment of the sexes. As the author briefly points out, Final Fantasy has been pretty friendly with pretty boys. If the world is internally consistent (other characters designed like that, MC is from a certain climate, etc) then whatever
It's criticism of the perceived ridiculousness of the design, is what it looks like to me. We don't have reason to suppose there is subtext in enough posters that they are reflexively reacting to non-Straight Boys Club depictions of men (it must be so that essentially, men are cool, the women are cute/sexy/hot), though obviously since the forum is big enough and we get all sorts of posters here some people will think like that. I don't at all object that strongly to the design beyond it just looking unbelievable, not so much for contextual stuff like the differing treatment of the sexes. As the author briefly points out, Final Fantasy has been pretty friendly with pretty boys. If the world is internally consistent (other characters designed like that, MC is from a certain climate, etc) then whatever
It was hardly brief; the first Sino-Japanese War was 50 years before the United States dropped the atomic bombs. And before that the nation was still undergoing a massive transformational period in politics and infrastructure. After the atomic bombs, Japan experienced one hell of an economic roller coaster.
Even Japan's isolation before 1853 was hardly consistent; seclusion policies were enacted in the 1600s, but the 1500s were full of trade between Japan and Europe.
Basically, history is complicated and so is the culture that springs from it.
Tye The Czar
Member
Pretty much this. Women's literature market is not the same as the video game market.
The romance novel comparison is asinine. 40 year old women have a specific niche genre aimed at them, so guess it's okay that pretty much every other popular medium caters to young men.
Romance Novels are comparable to say, games like Senran Kagura. They aren't comparable to the industry as a whole, which is where that image pops up in defense of nearly every time.
Romance Novels are comparable to say, games like Senran Kagura. They aren't comparable to the industry as a whole, which is where that image pops up in defense of nearly every time.