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Excluding Zelda, what game is worth buying a Switch at launch?
- Thread starter Movalpolos
- Start date
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Deleted member 752119
Unconfirmed Member
Of course. I was just pointing out that I was pretty sure the person you were responding to was talking about console sales.
Business wise, money is money of course. Market discussion wise is different as outside the hardcore that play both, the console and portable markets are largely separate.
Nintendo struggles in the console market as people who are playing console games on big screens mostly want top level, realistic graphics. A lot of those people also have no interest in squinting at console type games on a tiny screen--hence why Sony was misguided that people would en masse want stuff like Uncharted and Killzone on Vita. Most people who love those games and graphics only want to play on their big screen and surround sound set ups etc. as those games are as much about the graphics/spectacle/immersion as the gameplay.
Conversely, that's why Nintendo has remained strong in the portable realm as their cartoony art styles and gameplay focused titles don't lose as much going down to a tiny screen as something like Uncharted does. They also naturally don't appeal to those graphic whore types, so they don't have that aversion to deal with either.
I'm rambling, but my point being as a Nintendo fan and largely console only gamer I kind of get the "forced niche" point. I love their games, but am pretty sick of having to buy under powered hardware just for them, of having enjoyment leased because of games like Zelda looking like BOTW instead of like Horizon Zero Dawn etc. I grew up with Nintendo consoles starting with the NES, but they're a very secondary platform for me now and I very much have a love/hate relationship with Nintendo these days. I still waffle daily on whether to cancel my Switch preorder. I probably should as one should really only buy (especially at day on prices) things they're truly excited about and not things they're constantly trying to talk themselves into. But it is so hard to miss their games. On the other hand, I still have my Wii U and could play it there and maybe grab a Switch later when it has actual exclusives I want to play. And I'm guessing its very close to the Switch version which is probably why they haven't shown much of that version for not wanting to make the Switch look like a small upgrade.
AquaWateria
Member
Some juniors are on fire lately lol.
Mihael Mello Keehl
Banned
Aka fighting the good fight to teach companies lol
SinCityAssassin
Member
After that Bombergirl shit turned up, I'm buying two copies of Bomberman now.
LegendofLex
Member
You're right, of course.
But if you want to break out gaming into various segmented markets, neither console nor handheld gaming is "mainstream gaming" anymore. (That's mobile.)
Console and handheld gaming are both "niche gaming" in today's industry. And that's true regardless of which company's platforms you're talking about.
Nintendo isn't that successful in the home console space, but then they've also carved out success every single time in the portable space, something their competitors have never been able to do. And, as you said, that's a place where big AAA games just don't live, but it's a place where Nintendo's games can thrive.
But "gamers" buying products from the "industry" are hardly a monolithic group that love Sony and MS (and PC) and hate Nintendo platforms. That's not borne out by the evidence. And Nintendo's obviously publishing on a platform that isn't their "shitty performing consoles" - they're publishing on their perpetually winning handhelds.
This is a contender for the worst gaming-related post I've ever read on NeoGAF. I enjoy Nintendo games and Nintendo hardware more than anything else in this industry. I never feel "forced" to buy them.
Sir, that's the stockholm syndrome talking ;D
SinCityAssassin
Member
A'ight bud.
Reading this I feel like a black or mexican lectured by a Trump supporter. How can one be so offensed that we are different and like different things?
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Deleted member 752119
Unconfirmed Member
Agree 100%. Gaming is very segmented between Mobile, Console/PC and Portable. The types of games/experience on each are VERY different for the most part. And that's why there's only real overlap (in terms of people gaming in multiple segments) among the really hardcore.
The mobile only gamers don't have much interest in more complex portable or console/pc games. The console/pc gamer often doesn't have interest in simple mobile games, or the cartoony art styles and genres that excel on Nintendo/Portable. And a lot of the Nintendo/portable market absolutely hates the AAA experiences on other consoles/PC.
I think that's where a lot of the animosity comes from. A lot of people like me still like Nintendo franchises, but just hate that they never evolved into being modern AAA console experiences with their shift to underpowered hardware starting with the Wii, and moving to focusing on portability first with Switch. That's a far cry from the NES, SNES, N64 and GCN days where many of us were of us were diehard Nintendo fans and their platforms were very competitive, top notch console experiences.
In recent years to still enjoy their games we've been "forced" to buy portables when we don't like small screen gaming to get access to all their games, by an SD console in the HD era and put up with waggle many of us disliked, pay more for an under powered console for a tablet controller and off-tv play we didn't use, and now pay $300 for an under powered console due to having portability, waggle and other features we don't want.
I get Nintendo has no choice as they're simply not competitive in the console market and have said as much themselves. It just sucks for console gamers who still love Nintendo games.
Which is fine. But as above, there are those of us who love the games and hate having to buy hardware we dislike and find overpriced (since most of the features don't appeal to us) just to play the games. I put "forced" in quotes in my post above because of course we're not actually forced to buy anything. It just sucks that the market shifted in a way that has made it impossible to enjoy Nintendo games on a fully powered console with top level console graphics as that was the norm from NES-GCN.
It's frustrating because if they'd kept up with their trend of having games like Goldeneye and Perfect Dark to round out their library of stuff like Mario and Zelda they could have perhaps stayed more relevant in the console space. I think they misread the GC failure as them not being able to compete anymore, when really that was just a fluke as the PS2 was unstoppable and the GC lacking DVD playback probably hurt it far more than it's power level or software lineup.
Like how shooters such as CoD and Titan Fall unperformed last year and how AssCreed is on ice due to under performing as well? Let us completely disregard that most of the biggest games of all time are generally not that graphically intensive? Heck, even the most popular sports sim, FIFA, can run on Intel graphics BTW. You know what art style is similar to Nintendo's? It is mobile games. Guess what about mobile games? That market is a lot larger than home consoles.
A junior just ethered Nintendo fans.
The Third Heat
Neo Member
Am I terrible for only buying Zelda at launch? I'm fairly certain it's going to be my go-to game for the month of March, so I don't need much else. Coupled with my PS4/3DS backlog, I'm golden.
But if Stardew Valley were to shadow drop on March 3rd, I'll gladly take back the above paragraph...
But if Stardew Valley were to shadow drop on March 3rd, I'll gladly take back the above paragraph...
A fool can dream, right?
SinCityAssassin
Member
Nah, you're fine.
Jaded Alyx
Member
Ethered himself, to be fair.
IlGialloMondadori
Member
If spewing idiotic, rambling nonsense is ethering, then yeah, that guy delivered a huge bottle of anaesthetic.
that was more like meek mill trying to go at drake, let's be real
BlastProcessing
Member
All he did was spin a completely unsubstantiated story about poor abused Nintendo fans who are somehow forced to pay money for things they don't enjoy.
That's not ethering, that's just making shit up. Maybe you were confused because he did it in the most condescending way possible?
LegendofLex
Member
I'm *hoping* that standardizing on mobile technology now puts Nintendo in a good position to adapt quickly to boosts in processing power that bring mobile tech closer to par with the other platforms.
That's how low-end disruption is supposed to work, right? A new entrant appears competing on metrics that aren't important (and are actually perceived as bad) to high-end customers (in this case, old-school content + mobility + flexibility + accessibility), but the low-end product is able to improve at a much faster rate than the high-end one and slowly starts gobbling up the advantages enjoyed at the high end (graphics + performance + AAA content)?
The question is: will they keep their eye on the ball this time? They didn't with Wii, and they'd never have been able to achieve this with their past handhelds for obvious reasons.
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Deleted member 752119
Unconfirmed Member
Of course. I didn't imply otherwise. My post was just about the console market, as that rant everyone is up in arms over was about how Nintendo sucks for console gamers. When they were great for console gamers back in the day.
Obviously Nintendo is still hugely relevant in the gaming world. They dominate the portable market. They're off to a great start in mobile as well, and could well become a dominate player there.
Us console/PC only types just have to accept paying more than we'd like for hardware we actively dislike to play their still great games OR say fuck it and move on from them all together. It sucks, but just is what it is as the type of games they make, and art styles they focus on, just don't appeal to the console gamer market enough to justify them ever putting out a PS/Xbox clone type device again. They've lost that market and just have to move on. They missed their chance to buy up some western devs and diversify their exclusive library to help keep mindshare, and lost more mindshare among the core console gamer crowd with the casual focus/marketing approach with Wii and DS.
The Third Heat
Neo Member
It's my tight-wad nature coupled with the desire to really dig in deep to one game and not shuffle through two or three. If my Switch gathers dust, then so be it. I don't play my 3DS or Vita all the time, and I do often have to dust them off, but I still love them all the same. Gaming is a hobby for me, not a lifestyle. I don't need a firehose of content, just a steady trickle of quality titles.
But that's not to say I wouldn't have looooooved Mario Odyssey or Mario Kart 8 DX at launch. I'm not a crazy person.
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Deleted member 752119
Unconfirmed Member
That's definitely the path they need to take.
I don't think it will ever make them relevant in the console space as mobile tech is just never going to keep up graphically with large GPUs and CPUs in consoles, much less PC.
But as I and other's note, they don't really need that space. The portable and mobile sector is huge business. Tons of profits from cheap games that are addictive and get people spending way more than $60 per title etc.
It's just likely that more of us that grew up with Nintendo but only enjoy console/pc style gaming are going to have to accept that it's time to move on. Switch is their last chance for me. I'm hoping having all their games in one place (once 3DS support is killed off anyway) will make it worth it for me despite not liking the hardware. If I end up disenchanted with it again (which would be 3 straight Nintendo generations for me) then I'll be permanently done with them.
Yea, I'm in a similar position. Got a PS4/3DS backlog, and Nier and Persona to also look forward to. I could only really hesitate over getting a Switch if it was literally the only gaming console I'd own.
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Deleted member 752119
Unconfirmed Member
Yes, but that doesn't really matter. So is Splatoon really. Yes, it will have a (presumably) short SP campaign like the first. But the vast majority of play time is spent online.
Overwatch would do well from people wanting to play other places in their house other than the gaming TV (which may be used by others) on college campuses between class (most have fast wifi these days), breaks at work if they have fast wifi there etc.
Inferno313
Banned
Well... It's an online shooter, so yeah, kind of has to be.
I suppose they could do what Splatoon is doing and add unranked 4v4 local matches too.
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Deleted member 752119
Unconfirmed Member
That's me as well. As soon as I beat Zelda (and before if I don't finish it) I'll be on to Mass Effect Andromeda (unless it ends up sucking) which is my most anticipated time of the year. Then it's circle back to Horizon, and then Persona 5 etc.
Hell, Zelda, Splatoon 2 and Mario are the only sure buys for me on Switch this year, though I'll probably get MK8 and Fire Emblem Warriors, and I'm fine with that. Nintendo is a distant third platform to PS4 and PC for me.
If I thought this would get a big price drop within a year I may wait. But I don't see that happening with all the tech they crammed in it and them not wanting to take a loss ever. Given that I rarely play more than 5ish games a year on Nintendo platforms, no real reason not to buy day one. The decision was more whether to buy at all or skip for good for me than to wait or not. As above, I decided to give them one more chance hoping that having unified development will mean I actually get the 5ish games a year from them I REALLY want to play. Ended up playing many I wasn't super keen on this past gen just to get something different than my usual PS4/PC fare.
Vegetable Lasagna
Member
Only thing I'm interested in besides Zelda is Splatoon 2. I guess Isaac of Binding, but I have that on multiple platforms already. I don't need Mario Kart 8 again. The lineup is dismal.
It takes vision to understand what Splatoon will do. 4 vs 4 or simply 4 friends gathering as a local team to take on online opponents. That's one of the Switch use cases that makes the system unique and amazing.
Polygonal_Sprite
Gold Member
Ocarina_117
Banned
Man fuck Sony for forcing a niche with Uncharted and TLoU releasing them on the ps4. If only they'd publish their games for PCs rather than their mediocre consoles.
Fuck Microsoft too. I want Halo on my superior PC.
Fuck them both for forcing niches and forcing me to pay for their consoles with my money.
Quite possibly the worst serious post I've read on this forum.
The Third Heat
Neo Member
This is bang on. The resentment is real and it suuuuucks. But I also concede that sometimes when it seems like Nintendo is off their rocker, they're actually doing something quite smart. Splatoon's motion controls is a big example of this. I thought it sounded awful, but after playing it, it made so much sense and I wish more games would try it. So I buy their underpowered consoles and hope that they give me something I didn't know I wanted. Graphics are great, but I often find myself in awe one minute and completely over them the next. But a great gameplay experience hits you deep and I think that drives Nintendo more than power. Obviously.
I do hope, however, that if Nintendo does one thing right graphically, it's pushing for 60fps on their titles. They did a pretty decent job of that on the Wii U, so I have my fingers crossed.
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Deleted member 752119
Unconfirmed Member
That's overstating it. It would help get some people off the fence as they'd see appeal in playing those games on a portable and having access to Nintendo games.
But most in the mainstream are still mostly just wanting to play those games on their big screens.
What those games would be, is a huge boon for the Nintendo only crowd who's long missed out on such games due to refusing to buy other hardware. I do think all would sell very well to the Switch base. I just don't think they'd have a huge impact on moving Switch units--that really takes compelling exclusives.
The Third Heat
Neo Member
YEEEESSSSSS
Just hope Nintendo gets their online act together to make online play feasible and fun, rather than cumbersome and terrible.
Absolutely. They need to start cutting checks ASAP
LegendofLex
Member
My favorite thing about this suggestion is it nicely complements Switch's year one lineup:
Splatoon 2 --> Overwatch (team shooters)
Mario Kart 8 Deluxe w/ battle mode --> Rocket League (frantic driving action)
Breath of the Wild + Mario Odyssey --> GTAV (open-world sandbox)
My progress in games is glacial, so Zelda will last me for months. Which is a good thing, as it looks like a Wii U software situation all over again.
I'm kinda resigned to this, but my main platforms will remain the PC and PS4. If you're treating the Switch as your primary console, then just like the OP, I bet you're having trouble justifying it.
I'm kinda resigned to this, but my main platforms will remain the PC and PS4. If you're treating the Switch as your primary console, then just like the OP, I bet you're having trouble justifying it.
I too am in that as boat as well. I enjoyed my Wii U and the titles that came for it. and I'll enjoy my switch. I've never been one to feel like i was getting a less product from Nintendo because it's not as powerful Sony's and Microsoft's counter parts.
After the gen 7 I went to PC and Wii U because Japnese publishers had begin to show interest in PC versions of games, and when Microsoft said that Xbox was a platform in early 2013, I predicted that Xb1 games would get a dual release on PC. So i would only be missing 1-5 Sony exclusives (that i would want) at best this gen if i went PC and WiiU. (if horizon turns out the way i expect to be, i plan on borrowing a friend's system for a bit to play it, I WILL play that game).
All that said I never think about how game a would look on a different platform. If it accomplishes what it set out to do from a user perspective, then I'm all good.
I just appreciate the games on what they bring to the table, being it compelling game play or the next level of visual fidelity. It all pushes devs to go further in game development. I'v
Hmmm...
TBH, I have (or had) the opposite problem.
I grew up with SNES, PS, PS2 with a GameBoy on the side that I pretty much only played Link's Awakening, Kirby, and Pokemon on. My brother then went multi-console partway through PS2 and I reconnected with home console Nintendo that way as well as getting into the western RPG support XBox was getting and enjoying my Sony platformers, JRPGs, MGS, TimeSplitters, etc. on the PS2.
Then I got an XBox 360 as a gift near launch or whenever Oblivion came out. I enjoyed Oblivion a lot, even if Morrowind had captured my imagination much more, but overall the device was disappointing to me coming off the XBox. A lot of that is on BioWare failing to catch me with Mass Effect like they had with KotOR or Jade Empire. Come 2011 and I decided to be done with XBox, get a better PC, and just play whatever few big console/PC western games I wanted alongside my strategy games.
I got a PS3 for Metal Gear Solid 4. It ended up being mostly a PS2/PSX box (I went out of my way to make sure I got the OG model). Resident Evil 5 disappointed and I skipped 6. I didn't even bother buying FFXIII. DQ ended up on my DS instead. Platformers dried up in favor of shooters. The device was basically a second 360 as I saw it.
I was in college from 2009-2013 and for a lot of that I just played DS, SimCity 3000, and Civilization IV. I missed PS3 growing into its own, so there's that to consider. I probably would have liked Demons' Souls given that I have been enjoying Dark Souls and Bloodborne as I come late too them. I did borrow TLoU a couple years late and it didn't really appeal to me.
The point is, AAA, "mainstream" western core gaming has left me behind. I only recently bought a PS4 for TLG, a PS2 throwback in terms of the sort of software Sony puts out, and the curious slew of Japanese games coming out for it at the moment. I am enjoying it quite a bit at the moment and I hope that continues. If not I should at least have 10 or so solid games capped off with Persona 5, so it was a good investment. But I'm not playing much in terms of AAA content.
...
In this same decade, the Wii and the Wii U happened, both console I have enjoyed, particularly the Wii, as the Wii U has so far been completely lacking in new Metroid and new Zelda, Galaxy 1+2 caught me more than 3D World, etc.
I have felt that Nintendo was shrinking, been irked by the narrowing of their focus (which I feel has started to widen again going into Switch. Late Wii U was a positive time for Nintendo, imo) to core properties like 2D Mario, Kart, and Smash, leaving other properties ignored (METROID) or giving them new coats of paint that put me off (FE and Paper Mario). I mean even 3D Mario became beholden to 2D Mario and Miyamoto spoke as if 3D was a mistake and he had failed with 64 to make it approachable (I like Galaxy, Galaxy 2 or 3D World. On the eve of Odyssey, I'm wondering how much I'll miss them. More the narrative Nintendo gave and direction that troubled me.)
So the picture is being pushed into Nintendo because they were doing the most right by me, and not an insignificant amount, while the modern AAA console pushed me away.
...
I missed a lot of DS/3DS third party software, but I've been on a quest to find more games that appeal to me and the kind of games I like and, unsurprisingly, DS/3DS have quite a few that I've been working on for 1-2 years now. PS2, too. But nothing has really pulled me back into PS3 or 360. Instead my backlog and wishlist is mostly SNES-PS2 and then DS/3DS.
A lot of it is just following the games. I do prefer playing at the TV to having a handheld close to my face, and handheld was secondary gaming for most of my life. I am growing more attached to the form factor, moving around gaming, closing it for convenient sleep mode, etc.
I guess the thing is, a) I'm not so pushed away from the hardware, b) I'm mostly a software person, and c) I can't overstate b): I can easily move back to retro consoles, I'm bad at recognizing anything put terribly unsteady frame rates, I like good graphics, but they don't factor much into my purchasing habits, etc.
Switch is intensely exciting for me because of its software potential, both Nintendo and, hopefully, Japanese third parties.
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Deleted member 752119
Unconfirmed Member
That's very fair and Nintendo is certainly hoping their are a lot of you that are disenchanted with Western gaming--including lapsed gamers that didnt' have Wiis or Wii U's like you--that they'd can bring back by having all their games in one place.
My gaming tastes just shifted a lot in the the prior to generations and I'm mostly into realistic graphics, immersion and cinematic/narrative driven experiences.
Why I still have a place for Nintendo is a do like mixing in some light hearted, more gameplay focused things at a time. Nintendo is still great at that, and with their kid/family/casual focus they do a good job of making fun games that are relatively simple mechanically and not overly difficult. Where as a lot of gameplay focused stuff on other platforms end up being more complex/difficulty for my liking.
LegendofLex
Member
But you have to realize that all of these qualities are obviously valued most by high-end customers who, by definition, are not the majority of the addressable market.
Jaded Alyx
Member
Zelda, Arms, MK8D, Splatoon 2, Fire Emblem Warriors, Xenoblade 2, Super Mario Odyssey + whatever else is announced throughout the year/at E3, within the first year, seems like a continuous flow to me. Far better than the Wii U or 3DS ever had.