• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Black Panther - Official Trailer

The only answers I were seeing, intermitted with assholes, was that it's because of their Vibranium and intelligence. Not because throughtout time they've sent people out exploring other countries and learning from the other countries and bringing that knowledge back and building on it in isolation. (I'm referring to posts after I asked my question) I hadn't read any of the pages before)

I appreciate you actually listening and understand what we're saying, but what I just explained to you is something I've already explained to others multiple time in both BP trailer threads and still people refuse to acknowledge something as logical as that, simply because the concept of a sci-fi city in the heart of Africa is too much for their biases to allow.

We're fed up with it not because of junior members or anything, but because it KEEPS coming up and we keep having to explain it despite it being not that hard to grasp.
 

Garruson

Member
Cool, well there we go I overlooked it. Either way I now know a bit more about Wakanda than I did when I initially posted about it.

EDIT: I hadn't read this thread before when I posted, I hadn't read further than beyond what I last quoted.

Pai Pai MAster, like I said I hadn't gone through and read them all. I'll leave it at that. In the end it's a discussion forum, I wanted to discuss it. However, being an ass to someone because they're a junior member and you've explained it before doesn't make it any better. If you're commenting on such a topic and you've explained it a tonne it's obvious that other people who haven't discussed it will comment on it too, and no one is obliged in having to read a whole thread or other related threads in order to make a comment. But that's that. Like you said I was asking in order to understand and not be bias, I would have hoped that was clear in saying I had no knowledge of it at all.

But thank you for explaining, sorry I overlooked. It's just frustrating how aggressive people can be when you're genuinely interested in it.
 
I mean there's ignorance & questioning because you genuinely don't know and want to, and there's ignorance & questioning because you refuse to learn and understand. The user example I responded to you with was just one such example where it's clear that bias was feeding the ignorance. There are many more such examples across the various Black Panther threads we've had. But that one was particularly grating to me and I don't feel like digging through them all to find more posts that are just gonna piss me off lol
 
Who said it was too over the top? It was pretty much just curisosity from everyone asking, it's people like you that overblow that questioning because you automatically jump to the conclusion of the person trying to be racist.

That's not too hard to comprehend. What's hard to comprehend is that this Marvel Universe frames itself to be set in our world - so to have a utopia that's extremely technologically advanced, surround by many many countries in a huge continent that is considerably less technologically advanced than the rest of the world does leave pause for question on believability of farfetchedness, NOT because it's a place occupied by black people. You could remove the colour of their skin and replace it for any other colour, and it would STILL be unbelievable how a place surrounded by many other countries less technologically developed than the rest of the world is the most technologically developed place in the world. Even more so considering how the rest of the world came to be so technologically advanced. Especially as people's answers seem to just be they have a lot of vibranium and wealth. A mineral and wealth doesn't contstitute for the many reasons needed for a place to be not only technologically the most advanced, but medicinally also.


The reason why no one questions Iron Man is because like I said, it's framed to be set in our world. Which brings with it everything that would have given countries rise to being how they are portrayed in the film and in that/our world. It's not much of a leap that a man who lives in such a technologically built country that he can produce more far-fetched technology such as a working mechanical protective exoskeleton with a power reactor, two things which already exist in the real world to some extent, with military exoskeletons being built and explored, and power technology getting smaller and stronger.

No one questions Thor, because it's not set in our world, it's just portrayed as magic, or science that we don't understand, it only really become a problem now that it becomes more connected.

The problem is that Wakanda is set to be placed within our real world, that hasn't built itself on magic or alien influence. Therefore it's weird for a place in Africa (not because it's in Africa, but because most countries in Africa are developing nations. It would be like having a place in the heart of Europe that is as advanced to the state that Wakanda is (from what I'm being told of curing cancer/ilnesses etc.) and then every surrounding country just entering the industrial development or a renaissance type era), which throughout time, compared to many other countries in the world, is far less technologically advanced up until recent years/century. That's not racism at all, it's believability in a fictional space.

People's problems are that they're projecting their own concerns of the films being attacked because it has a black cast for people genuinely asking questions about it. My first post was admitting I'm ignorant of the lore and knowledge of Black Panther and was simply asking how in the comics a place like it came to be - but even asking such a thing is racist and losing your shit now because you're genuinely interest... because the trailers looked really good and sparked an interest for something that I have no idea about. Perhaps some of my phrasing was shit in mentioning Africa. I understand there's many different countries within the place, but there's many countries that are developing. I also don't understand how people are misconstruing how I can't understand that Wakanda would want to keep it's technology and wealth protected and safe, yes I can understand why they would want to do that. I don't understand HOW they got their technology. The only vague asnwer that some people have given is Vibranium... more people have cared about trying to cause shit by being over protective in defending it, if it were literally any other topic, explaining to someone who is ADMITEDLY proclaiming ignorance of knowing anything about it, then they would just explain the lore... I understand it to some degree, because there will be people saying shit about it because it is a black film.

Also that shit with junior member therefore shitposter? Get off your high horse!

The Marvel Universe isn't set in our world. It's a fictional place. The Earth most of the heroes live on does not exist. The galaxy the Guardians inhabit does not exist. The existence of Iron Man and Thor and super soldiers and gamma radiation monsters and helicarriers and sentient robots and aliens popping in to pick up alien/human hybrid children and Nazis using death rays and a sect of sorcerers defending the planet and Pym particles and microverses should be all the evidence you need that the Marvel Universe isn't. Fucking. Real.

I apologize for calling everyone who types posts like this racist. Some of you are just fucking morons. God.

It's a comic book movie. If they say there is a hidden civilization in Africa with amazing tech, there is a hidden civilization in Africa with amazing tech. We're in a universe with magical monks, space vikings, gundams, Honey I Shrunk the Kids, a talking racoon with his tree companion, and the world's most dangerous man who has yet to leave his chair in 10 years.

There was a door you probably should of checked out on some 8 years ago. First Ironman was about as plausible as we got.

Thank you.
 
100x better than the first trailer, Wakanda looks interesting. Hope they spend a good amount of time there instead of shuffling it aside like Thor 1 did to Asgard, and GL to Oa.
 

slade

Member
Wakanda's advanced because fuck you, that's why.

It's all the reasoning I'll ever need. Just surround that reason with a good story.
 

Slayven

Member
There are no bad Eternals books. Read them all from beginning to end and then send Marvel a letter demanding to bring them back.
See that is why I like you. Eternals are gold.
Who's more advanced technologically? Wakanda or the Inhumans?

What about the Atlanteans.

Edge a bit to Inhumans

Wakanda went to war with Atlantis

c7521a0a089fe6455f6b383288471f69.jpg


It didn't last long
 
Ahhh, okay, that makes sense compared to just having Vibranium and wealth. I mean I find it a bit implausible that for such a small country that wants to actively hide and protect their resource of Vibranium and wealth, that they would have the ability to travel and explore to the rest of the world centuries before other countries in order to have such a technology, but I don't find that unbelievable compared to just the answer of Vibranium and Intelligence.

Perhaps people should just answer people's questions instead of attacking them due to their own insecurity...

So it's in the sense that they sent researches out who used the knowledge from all the other countries in the world having wars etc. leading to new discoveries and taking that back with them. I genuinely have no knowledge and Wakanda or Black Panther but this makes sense. And makes it even more interesting how they have kept their cultural identity mixed with their technology (panther guns, fuck yeah!).

In anycase, really looking forward to this simply for a new setting we've not had before.

I mean there were ancient non-western civilizations in our own real world that were ahead of their peers in tech and did what you just said. Traveled widely, incorporated outside ideas and grew before they were cut down/set back by invaders. Is it that hard to imagine a what-if where one of them went into hiding from colonialism and continued to do that? You continued incredulity of even the idea of that being far fetched in a comic universe makes a lot of your posts suspect. "I don't know the lore" has nothing to do with it. Just the fact that something this simply extrapolated seems so unlikely to you is fascinating.
 
i like how the bias displayed by some posters here is just proving the idea they are arguing against.
they refuse to believe such an advanced African country could exist, and refuse to believe that the world wouldn't notice it.
but no shit the world wouldn't notice it if so many believe the idea of it to be so impossible that they cant even accept it when having it explained to them in detail.
 

ElyrionX

Member
The music in thst trailer is goddamn amazing.

Also, serious question but I can't tell the villain and hero apart in that trailer. Why does it feel like the villain is also wearing a black panther costume?
 

The Kree

Banned
The music in thst trailer is goddamn amazing.

Also, serious question but I can't tell the villain and hero apart in that trailer. Why does it feel like the villain is also wearing a black panther costume?

They're both wearing panther costumes. Can you tell that one is has gold details and the other has purple?
 

Kaizer

Banned
Man, I just hope all these people questioning Wakanda will be around for the same discussion when the Aquaman trailer drops.
 
The music in thst trailer is goddamn amazing.

Also, serious question but I can't tell the villain and hero apart in that trailer. Why does it feel like the villain is also wearing a black panther costume?

The Black Panther is not just a superhero persona. It is literally the mantle of Wakanda's king.

Killmonger dons his own Panther costume because he is challenging T'Challa to the throne and believes himself to be the rightful Panther.
 

Slayven

Member
The Black Panther is not just a superhero persona. It is literally the mantle of Wakanda's king.

Killmonger dons his own Panther costume because he is challenging T'Challa to the throne and believes himself to be the rightful Panther.

Yeah it is more like donning a big hat and robes and walking into the Vatican with your balls out saying "listen to me...I am the pope now"
 
Yeah it is more like donning a big hat and robes and walking into the Vatican with your balls out saying "listen to me...I am the pope now"

And that's how it works. Wakanda's law allows that anyone can challenge the King to the throne. If you best The Black Panther in combat, you become king.
 
They are all in the same universe tho... this isnt dc and marvel. Its marvel and marvel... and marvel.
Who said anything about DC?

Just cause the universe is the same doesn't mean they all have to feel and look the same. The separated heroes all used to feel distinct, the directing and art of their worlds were dinstinctive to each particular character. Cap was grimy war time, Ironman was modern military, Thor was scifi fantasy, Guardians was 80s pop scifi.

But at some point they all started to look like the Avengers world. And now Thor 3 just looks like a Guardians movie (although still looks great). Now Black Panther looks too much Avengers sterile tech world, not nearly enough of the African culture influence. I think it comes down to the direction, framing, lighting, set design and CG etc all looking very similar across movies
 
This is why I said earlier the people asking these questions are either racists or idiots. Neither of which is a good look.

"How can an entire country this advanced technologically exist without others knowing?"

The answer is in the fucking question. It's right fucking there. Anybody can easily make the jump to "some kind of tech the let's them cloak themselves". But they're completely incapable here.

Not to mention insinuating that Wakanda needs the help of SHIELD to suppress themselves doesn't make sense when Wakanda is more advanced than SHIELD is. This is so easy.

You won't get these kinds of questions about Atlantis when Justice League drops.

Being an idiot is believing there has never been one Wakanda asshole who decided to spill the beans about the tech to the world. Ever. Or the neighbouring countries never noticing anything, ever. Or ignoring the fact colonialist countries would have tried to take over and make note of why they couldn't. A country being more advanced doesn't make them gods able to control the world, if SHIELD looked they would find out, Hydra too.


Atlantis comparison already been covered

Atlantis:
- A city
- At bottom of sea
- Nobody knows about it (is a myth at best)
- Doesn't interact with surface people.

Wakanda
- An entire country
- Landlocked between other nations
- Is known about
- Interacts with the world
- Draws attention to itself with its super metal.

See how one is more believably hidden?

Bonus, Wonder Woman!

- An island
- In middle of the ocean
- Nobody knows of it
- Cannot be seen
- Doesn't interact with outside world


Savage Land is stupid though. That shit woulda been discovered a million times already.
 

ElyrionX

Member
They're both wearing panther costumes. Can you tell that one is has gold details and the other has purple?

The Black Panther is not just a superhero persona. It is literally the mantle of Wakanda's king.

Killmonger dons his own Panther costume because he is challenging T'Challa to the throne and believes himself to be the rightful Panther.

Yeah I noticed the gold and purple detailings but I thought it might just be suits with different properties worn by the same guy. That shit is confusing af for a trailer.
 

Slayven

Member
And that's how it works. Wakanda's law allows that anyone can challenge the King to the throne. If you best The Black Panther in combat, you become king.

Yeah but you can still be kicked out as king by the council. But to be fair T'Challa needed that time in Devil's kitchen
 

Da-Kid

Member
Actually.. Killmonger isn't a Panther, he's a Jaguar. Hence the spots on his helmet and golden color and hue on the suit.
black-panther-golden-jaguar-1038552-320x180.jpg
 

Slayven

Member
Actually.. Killmonger isn't a Panther, he's a Jaguar. Hence the spots on his helmet and golden color and hue on the suit.
black-panther-golden-jaguar-1038552-320x180.jpg

I feel nerdy for knowing this but Panthers are just black jaguars. All panthers are jaguars but not all jaguars are panthers
 

Stinkles

Clothed, sober, cooperative
This thread is crazy. This movie is going to be a Rorschach test for racism. I hope it does big box office otherwise Hollywood will turtle on diverse casting again.
 
i like how the bias displayed by some posters here is just proving the idea they are arguing against.
they refuse to believe such an advanced African country could exist, and refuse to believe that the world wouldn't notice it.
but no shit the world wouldn't notice it if so many believe the idea of it to be so impossible that they cant even accept it when having it explained to them in detail.

I mean there are 54 countries in Africa (most people don't even know that ffs) right now, if one of them were technologically advanced and kept to themselves most folks would never know because most folks don't give a single fuck about Africa. When vast majority of people think "Africa" they think of a bunch of black folks in huts.

So really Wakanda existing but nobody knowing about it is probably the most believable thing about MCU tbh.
 
I wonder if they are gonna go with Kilmonger being an MIT grad, because I noticed MBJ was missing an accent from the character

Golden jaguar*

Its been mentioned several times in the thread.

jake-no.gif


dont like that name...

Wait. What?

Why does the most advanced country on earth choose its head of state via combat?

Judging by shots of Wakanda, you will see they obviously are not detached from their traditions no matter how advanced they are...

Besides... It's easier said then done to best a Black Panther
 
And that's how it works. Wakanda's law allows that anyone can challenge the King to the throne. If you best The Black Panther in combat, you become king.

Wait. What?

Why does the most advanced country on earth choose its head of state via combat?

Also is Wakanda a monarchy ass monarchy, or is it like the British Royal family where you don't have real political power, but you do the PR rounds and also you have superpowers?
 

Kaizer

Banned
Being an idiot is believing there has never been one Wakanda asshole who decided to spill the beans about the tech to the world. Ever. Or the neighbouring countries never noticing anything, ever. Or ignoring the fact colonialist countries would have tried to take over and make note of why they couldn't. A country being more advanced doesn't make them gods able to control the world, if SHIELD looked they would find out, Hydra too.


Atlantis comparison already been covered

Atlantis:
- A city
- At bottom of sea
- Nobody knows about it (is a myth at best)
- Doesn't interact with surface people.

Wakanda
- An entire country
- Landlocked between other nations
- Is known about
- Interacts with the world
- Draws attention to itself with its super metal.

See how one is more believably hidden?

Bonus, Wonder Woman!

- An island
- In middle of the ocean
- Nobody knows of it
- Cannot be seen
- Doesn't interact with outside world


Savage Land is stupid though. That shit woulda been discovered a million times already.

I mean, at this point I don't know what you want man. This discussion is pretty much going in circles at this point. People have come up with ample evidence for why Wakanda doesn't "break" the established setting of the MCU & others have disagreed with it - that's okay. At the end of the day, it's a comic book story & things don't always totally lineup with reality. It's okay to suspend disbelief a little bit.

And even in our world, you can look at countries like North Korea or Japan as an example. North Korea a country that for the most part is still closed off & no one truly knowing what daily life is like there. Japan was a closed off society for many years & didn't give a shit about interacting or sharing shit with anyone for the most part for quite a long time. Hell, there are dozens of countries in Africa right now that most people probably have no idea about their culture, customs, people, history or government.

And as far as at least "one Wakandan asshole" slipping out the truth, the very first trailer of this movie details how there have been rumblings & rumors about the true nature of Wakanda for a very long time around the world, with no one being able to nail down anything concrete until now. So who's to say there haven't been attempts to invade/takeover Wakanda that were thrwarted, wiped out & supressed from the public at large? With the technological advancements they have, it wouldn't be hard to eliminate any external threats from the other underdeveloped nations that border them if problems did arise. It doesn't really seem that different to me than how we examine a country like North Korea with all the rumors & rumblings of the true nature of daily life there or how the citizens feel, etc.
 

atr0cious

Member
Black people are type casted as the materialistic vultures of white society. Having two black men fight over wakanda when white society is what has them in solitude to begin with, feels short sighted and almost petty, no matter how great wakanda is.
 

Slayven

Member
Wait. What?

Why does the most advanced country on earth choose its head of state via combat?
They have real ruling power, but the day to day stuff is handled by a council who have the power to kick the king out if they want too.


It's not choosen, it is usually handed down through the panther line.

But if you think you can do better, step up. There are like 12 other tribes with their own gods and chosen.
 
Top Bottom