No idea, perhaps their pre-launch graphics engine isnt mature enough to support 7 cores.
Their Killzone 2 graphics engine only used 4 SPUs. Doesnt mean the other 3 available SPUs were reserved for the OS.
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Kotaku: "Only 90% of Xbox One GPU usable for games"- PS4 GPU up to 66% more powerful?
- Thread starter Gemüsepizza
- Start date
No idea, perhaps their pre-launch graphics engine isnt mature enough to support 7 cores.
Their Killzone 2 graphics engine only used 4 SPUs. Doesnt mean the other 3 available SPUs were reserved for the OS.
Why do people keep saying this. It's not even remotely true (it will only reach that speed for short bursts). People act like the ddr3 with esram is no drawback. Blows my mind.
Indeed, that is only for theoretical peak bursts where everything you want perfectly split in the eSRAM and DDR as you want it (or mirrored, depending on how it works). With 32MB, and some of that used for framebuffer presumably, I would assume you'd have many more misses than hits. It will help substantially, and well micromanaged it may even get you to well above the DDR3 speed alone on average, but it's not the same as a unified fast bank. People were using the same defense for the Wii U, that the 32MB fast memory would somehow completely fix the 12.8GB/s main.
If this were the case, AMD and Nvidia would be crazy not to go with a small eDRAM cache and DDR3, rather than full GDDR5 on high end parts. But they don't.
oldergamer
Member
soulassssns
Banned
why should we non techies believe you though?
Common sense?
The thing is, it's only 170GB/s in an absolutely ideal scenario. That's not what I would call "effective bandwidth".
You clearly didn't understand, with a console 66% less powerful you can't have beautiful games, even if has 10x more horsepower than its predecessor or 40x with cloud computing.
Didn't know where to ask, but it says the project is worth $3+b. Is that how much its costing to build the amd chip? (including r&d etc..) Seems expensive for what is an average gpu or is it including cpu as well.
http://www.linkedin.com/pub/bob-feldstein/7/796/9a4
http://www.linkedin.com/pub/bob-feldstein/7/796/9a4
This probably covers expected lifetime royalties also. I don't know if AMD if charged with manufacturing or managing manufacturing - I thought they were fabless? - but if so that would also explain it.
The design itself wouldn't cost nearly that much.
Auto_aim1
MeisaMcCaffrey
Can you paste the quote? Looks like membership is needed to view third-party profiles.
krypt0nian
Banned
The full quote is this:
Since he talks about his role in supply management and a multi-year deal etc. I imagine it's the estimate gross value of the deal across the system's lifetime rather than costs already incurred (in the design of it).
Slayer-33
Liverpool-2
Of course, but we'll see how that translates into the experience
krypt0nian
Banned
How so? You can launch games, and launch apps. Do you mean the silly "watch TV" shit?
As far as gaming, I don't think they care.
This was always going to be the case no matter what either company did.
Gemüsepizza
Member
Regarding TV features and motion controls? Yes. Regarding software performance? No, not at all.
Auto_aim1
MeisaMcCaffrey
Thanks, yeah, I think you're correct. $3b is simply too much for just the design part. For example, Sony spent $400 million on the Cell processor.
mysteriousmage09
Member
In exchange for being far ahead in the category that matters most, which is the tech to power the games.
PS4 uses BSD Unix, operating system that was released 15 years before first version of Windows and is still heavily used in enterprise sector [servers, large computing systems, dedicated devices]. So... dont worry about OS department, Sony can create whatever it wants with it.
~edit: 13 years
Audioboxer
Member
Interesting, didn't know that until now! It seems like a good thing.
I know, It's where the fun is so how can Sony not understand.
In regards to features not applicable to gaming, absolutely. XBO will have windows 8 after all.
In regards to gaming it looks like PS4 might have the edge when it comes to gameplay available as fast as possible.
I was going start a thread about this question, but I'll just ask here since the subject got brought up.
Although it is rumored that the PS4 will reserve 1GB for the OS, compared to 3GBs reserved to MS's machine. Does the fact that the PS4's 1GB is GDDR5 ram make up for anything? any benefits to it?
Although it is rumored that the PS4 will reserve 1GB for the OS, compared to 3GBs reserved to MS's machine. Does the fact that the PS4's 1GB is GDDR5 ram make up for anything? any benefits to it?
way premature to still assume 1GB reserve 2 at least and even then it's not going to make a difference in games for a few years...
The difference in overall usable power is not as far apart as people like to submit or that raw numbers (or silly charts) assume. People will be shocked to see just how close these two look on games... nobody outside of readers of DF will notice...
Only now we have to hear 6 years of "damn Xbox holding back PS4 graphics" to defend what is not understood about these specs.
The difference in overall usable power is not as far apart as people like to submit or that raw numbers (or silly charts) assume. People will be shocked to see just how close these two look on games... nobody outside of readers of DF will notice...
Only now we have to hear 6 years of "damn Xbox holding back PS4 graphics" to defend what is not understood about these specs.
Ironic and presumptuous.
Presumptuous.
So objective data/facts will have to be undermined because you believe people don't understand what the numbers translate into.
I would have labelled it arrogance but I will settle for saying, "ah, but its the clowd".
Tripolygon
Banned
Gemüsepizza;59454233 said:
PS3 with 50MB RAM has TV and DVR functions even while gaming, PS Vita can stream live TV from PS3 and also watch or copy recorded TV shows from PS3. What Sony doesn't have the ecosystem of WindowsRT apps that could potentially run on Xbox One.
krypt0nian
Banned
You are way the fuck out there, aren't you? So you just type anything that enters your mind?
LittleJohnny
Banned
Yea yea, next week we're going to hear how Xbone only has 4 of the 8 CPU cores available for games. God I can't wait for E3 when we can compare actual games... you know, REAL WORLD comparisons?
It's too difficult to discern what's real and what's FUD from the competition at this point.
It's too difficult to discern what's real and what's FUD from the competition at this point.
R3TRODYCE
Member
I think we all knew that would happen.
But PlayTV does not run in background. It's like a game and it has obviously access to the whole 512MB.
could they use the cloud to get more bandwidth???
AMD has contract with fab (TMC if i remember correctly), so this is manufactured via that contract...
apsolutely... up to 40x more as they said.
nope, thats exact opposite of whats possible
It is not about how much, but how fast. Does your internet do 170GB/s? I don't understand this stuff either but think before saying...Unless you were facetious, in which case the jokes on me.
LittleJohnny
Banned
Ideal scenarios can happen 100% of the time on closed platforms, developers create the ideal scenarios, it doesn't just happen.
Xbone's software development kit will handle the brunt of the work in terms of bandwidth allocation much like 360 did with eDram.
PS4's bandwidth pipleline is like one huge ass fire hose pouring water out of a tank at 176 Gallons an hour, while Xbone's bandwidth pipeline is a set of hoses, the main hose providing 68 gallons an hour, with 4 other hoses (move engines) feeding a combined 102 gallons an hour reserved for the higher bandwidth tasks. Not everything needs high bandwidth all the time and that's where the move engines come in. When done correctly the system does still combine a total of 170GB/s of bandwidth.
LOL, that's a funny joke.
Evolution_1ne
Banned
because it's running on an early devkit. Not a coincidence, just common sense
Kung Fu Grip
Banned
But the difference in power is not like it was with PS3 and 360. This time the PS4 really has many advantages. And it's going to be much easier to exploit.
From what we know so far about the PS4's OS, it has more than enough features to stay competitive. I don't see how anyone can't be satisfied. I don't see XB1 having a large advantage like 360 did.
Please just stop, you have no idea what you're saying.
LittleJohnny
Banned
FTFY
If you want to disprove what I just said you've gotta do better than that, it's a pretty laymans terms explanation but the system does provide 170GB/s of aggregate bandwidth with the move engines. Of course GDDR5 is better overall but we definitely cannot plainly compare DDR3 vs GDDR5 as most people mistakenly do. If you argue that then it is you who have no idea what you're talking about. Do some research and come back when you do, mmkay?
Pristine_Condition
Member
Since you have done so much research, and apparently your expertise in breaking down this complex tech so the "common man" can understand is above questioning:
What does this magical system "provide 170GB/s of aggregate bandwidth" to, precisely?
And since data flows in more than one direction, how does your firehose analogy hold up in that regard?
Please help us crude ignoramuses understand, mmkay?
krypt0nian
Banned
Things are getting kookoo again.