Indeed. It's crazy to see how differently this has worked out than some people's expectations preceding these consoles' announcements. The overwhelming belief back then was that Sony wouldn't manage to create a better gaming machine than Microsoft. This perspective was quite reasonable, as MS had built up a lot of goodwill over the intervening console generation (minus some discontent at their increased focus on Kinect titles).
Then came the massive MS meltdown. Everyone saw a humbled Sony's vision for the future paired against a suddenly massively anti-consumer Microsoft. I know I was absolutely nonplussed. I'm pretty sure I haven't seen so many policy reversals prior to a product's launch.
Now we've arrived at a point where gamer sentiment has largely shifted against Microsoft, while Sony seem to be in the good graces of many. A point where it seems that Sony's console is not only more powerful, but also easier to develop for. A point where their console is actually CHEAPER, something that I know I certainly didn't predict (just look at old prediction threads for kicks). It's amazing how much things can change in a few months; I certainly wouldn't have put any money down on such an outcome.
It has to be a hard time to be a staunch Xbox fan, likely to the same degree that it was for Sony fans in 2006. I'd imagine that if you loved the experiences you had with that brand, you could feel compelled to defend it, like many would reasonably want to do for their hobbies. Just looking at a scattering of other forums (like N4G), it's sad to see how disheartened some posters are by the lack of good news on the Xbox front. Just as it was in 2006 with Sony fans.
The issue with this shift is that it has left several posters with no recourse but to claim that certain forums are unfairly biased against their console of choice. The problem with that line of thinking is that it implies that this sentiment against MS is unearned. It isn't, just like the discontent with Sony was also warranted in 2006.
I hope that MS can turn it around, because I'm a fan of games--any major games company fucking up is bad for gaming. It's going to take time for MS to regain the ground they've lost, but damn am I excited for that journey! I believe that a MS that is aggressively trying to win back the gaming community is more likely to increase their output, resulting in more games on the market. Any value that they decide to add to patch the wound is just icing on the cake.
One thing we can be certain is that Nintendo probably won't move much consoles and they will release their next console in 2-3 years just like they did with Wii after Gamecube failure and if they are smart they will buff up specs to get "best experience on" sign and get developers and publishers onboard. Right now ship has sailed and without UBI supporting them it would be already dead. I
Why the fuck would anyone post a gif from the Dexter finale less than a week after its showing?! It's revealing enough to be considered a spoiler;; and IMO banworthy. I absolutely hate this habit of posting gifs of just aired TV series on completely unrelated threads. There's no way to avoid them, like the official threads about the series, where gifs like that should be confined in.going by the expression, Dexter probably heard something related to his close ones, so now anyone who sees it knows there's something bound to happen to some of them
and it was known.
I will ask this question and hopefully it will be a civil discussion point, but how will companies like Activision deal with PS4 being stronger and running games that are associated with the Xbox brand better than their own partner? I know we've had this discussion in another thread, but realistically can we expect. I know I hate the series, but playing CoD: Ghosts with KZ and BF4 has me hard as hell.
Problem with that conclusion is that it assumes the Wii U was competently targeted at the casual audience to begin with; between the high price, pathetic marketing and confusing naming/design ("it's a tablet add-on for the Wii right?"), it's hardly so, and wound up failing to find any audience besides the Nintendo faithful.That approach failed with the WiiU. the expanded audience doesn't exist anymore. Chasing it a third time is disaster.
Nintendo will bow out.
Despite the many issues with the Wii U, bad marketing, widespread market confusion, price, performance, etc. the real issue is Nintendo simply do not have the bandwidth to sustain two platforms with where graphic technology is currently at.
That leaves them with two options, fight to significantly increase their internal development bandwidth, which is costly, and risky, or focus exclusively on one platform.
They'll support the Wii U as they are until they're ready to launch the follow up to the 3DS, then they'll drop Wii U support and leave the console space.
I'm not even sure that's viable. the Wii was nintendo targeting a completely different audience because they were either incapable or had no desire to compete with Sony and Microsoft head to head.
That approach failed with the WiiU. the expanded audience doesn't exist anymore. Chasing it a third time is disaster.
At the same time, they don't have the resources or engineering capability to design something on the level that sony or MS do. sure, they could design a superior system 3 or 4 years out without too much effort, but whatever it is will just get steamrolled two years from then when new systems roll out. releasing halfway through the gen just doesn't make much sense.
I haven't read the entire thread, but it's a bit of a leap to suggest that everyone who isn't vehemently anti-Microsoft is a shill. That attitude makes some of you look like lunatics.
I'm going to get an Xbone, either around Titanfall or the next Halo. Some people just want to play games and not turn everything into a holy war, FFS.
This whole post, and this particular point, is excellent. Well done sir.
I didn't mention money.This is bullshit.
Nintendo do have the resources and money to go toe to toe with Sony and MS.
The current leadership is the problem not their resources.
I haven't read the entire thread, but it's a bit of a leap to suggest that everyone who isn't vehemently anti-Microsoft is a shill. That attitude makes some of you look like lunatics.
I'm going to get an Xbone, either around Titanfall or the next Halo. Some people just want to play games and not turn everything into a holy war, FFS.
And it's not even fully accurate. Every PS4 owner will have an exact performance benchmark. While maybe 1% or less of all PC owners will have hardware specs that match or exceed the PS4 on day 1. So yes, the PC CAN have the greatest performance, especially as the generation gets older, but to emphatically say "The PC version is the best" rests squarely on the shoulders of the individual PC owners and the hardware they've purchased.
As a PC gamer, I personally cannot play these games at the same level that the PS4 will play them. Maybe in a few years if I choose to buy another gaming laptop or something. So for ME on the day the PS4 comes out, the PC version of these games will NOT be the better version.
(But besides graphics and hardware, the PC version will technically still be better because it has guaranteed backward compatibility to ensure that when I do eventually get new hardware, 10 years down the road for example, the game will be able to look insanely good and run at 120 fps and probably have player-made mods such as higher res textures and 4k resolution support, so the legacy improvement of older games ensures that eventually the PC version still comes out on top due to ever-increasing hardware combined with infinite backward compatibility.)
I haven't read the entire thread, but it's a bit of a leap to suggest that everyone who isn't vehemently anti-Microsoft is a shill. That attitude makes some of you look like lunatics.
I'm going to get an Xbone, either around Titanfall or the next Halo. Some people just want to play games and not turn everything into a holy war, FFS.
True story. That show has been going downhill for a while, though.He did you a favor, the final season was shit. Worst season and finale ever
Microsoft is missing the point with viral marketing. They're completely missing the boat. They wouldn't need people to shill to the hardcore gaming community if their management could communicate effectively, drop the hubris, and essentially keep their mouths shut. I prefer the PS4, but even I can admit that most of Microsoft's current problems stem from awful PR and backward philosophy. Not to say that Sony didn't revamp their image and learned to be less arrogant, but Microsoft holds a large part in their own tarnished image.
I haven't read the entire thread, but it's a bit of a leap to suggest that everyone who isn't vehemently anti-Microsoft is a shill. That attitude makes some of you look like lunatics.
I'm going to get an Xbone, either around Titanfall or the next Halo. Some people just want to play games and not turn everything into a holy war, FFS.
This is a great post.
I too am excited for this journey, and hopeful for a MS that comes out humbled and hungry in a few years like Sony is right now.
That thread i mentioned is living proof of that. Absolute shit ton of people banned in matter of 24h. Probably Bish longest ban streak he ever had.
They really don't. People should begin accepting the cold harsh reality that was evident over a decade ago, and that is the fact the majority of people don't care enough for Nintendo franchises for them to sustain a console. The Wii was a big fluke and its success was more to do with Wii Sports, not Zelda or Mario or some other obscure Nintendo IP which some fans will vehemently claim to be popular. The industry went in one direction and Nintendo isolated themselves by going another. Industry support is important, and it's why Sony and Microsoft are in much better positions. Good luck to them but they're not long for the console world.This is bullshit.
Nintendo do have the resources and money to go toe to toe with Sony and MS.
The current leadership is the problem not their resources.
Indeed. It's crazy to see how differently this has worked out than some people's expectations preceding these consoles' announcements. The overwhelming belief back then was that Sony wouldn't manage to create a better gaming machine than Microsoft. This perspective was quite reasonable, as MS had built up a lot of goodwill over the intervening console generation (minus some discontent at their increased focus on Kinect titles).
Then came the massive MS meltdown. Everyone saw a humbled Sony's vision for the future paired against a suddenly massively anti-consumer Microsoft. I know I was absolutely nonplussed. I'm pretty sure I haven't seen so many policy reversals prior to a product's launch.
Now we've arrived at a point where gamer sentiment has largely shifted against Microsoft, while Sony seem to be in the good graces of many. A point where it seems that Sony's console is not only more powerful, but also easier to develop for. A point where their console is actually CHEAPER, something that I know I certainly didn't predict (just look at old prediction threads for kicks). It's amazing how much things can change in a few months; I certainly wouldn't have put any money down on such an outcome.
It has to be a hard time to be a staunch Xbox fan, likely to the same degree that it was for Sony fans in 2006. I'd imagine that if you loved the experiences you had with that brand, you could feel compelled to defend it, like many would reasonably want to do for their hobbies. Just looking at a scattering of other forums (like N4G), it's sad to see how disheartened some posters are by the lack of good news on the Xbox front. Just as it was in 2006 with Sony fans.
The issue with this shift is that it has left several posters with no recourse but to claim that certain forums are unfairly biased against their console of choice. The problem with that line of thinking is that it implies that this sentiment against MS is unearned. It isn't, just like the discontent with Sony was also warranted in 2006.
I hope that MS can turn it around, because I'm a fan of games--any major games company fucking up is bad for gaming. It's going to take time for MS to regain the ground they've lost, but damn am I excited for that journey! I believe that a MS that is aggressively trying to win back the gaming community is more likely to increase their output, resulting in more games on the market. Any value that they decide to add to patch the wound is just icing on the cake.
Why is it that these companies let power/success go to their heads? Don't they learn from the competition's mistakes (Sony launching with a $600 PS3, Nintendo upping the 3DS price to $250, and then Microsoft with anti-consumer policies after the success of 360)? Get a grip, guys!
It's from last season but you can't deduce absolutely anything useful or spoilerific from that gif, trust me.I hope that isn't a spoiler about the last season of Dexter, that ended only less than a week ago.
*checks rinemy's email account*
*immediately recognizes Microsoft partnership*
*calls to wife for advice on how to spell 'disingenuous' for the ban message*
*goes back to playing GTA V*
I just cant wait until we get some real in depth reviews with people who have spent time with both consoles. I have both preordered but decided im only getting one. At first xbone because of DR3, but the more I think about it I realize how boring the other DR were after a few hours. Now im thinking ps4 simply because of power. Oh well, still got some time to decide, and yay first post!!
What really ticks me off are the guys who rag on consoles and go all Master Race on every game in every thread and about the saviour 60 fps when they play on low end or low mid end cards.
Why is Microsoft so obsessed with Gaf?
I don't really understand how out of all three companies, Microsoft spread their shills like flower petal confetti at a carnival .
Indeed. It's crazy to see how differently this has worked out than some people's expectations preceding these consoles' announcements. The overwhelming belief back then was that Sony wouldn't manage to create a better gaming machine than Microsoft. This perspective was quite reasonable, as MS had built up a lot of goodwill over the intervening console generation (minus some discontent at their increased focus on Kinect titles).
Then came the massive MS meltdown. Everyone saw a humbled Sony's vision for the future paired against a suddenly massively anti-consumer Microsoft. I know I was absolutely nonplussed. I'm pretty sure I haven't seen so many policy reversals prior to a product's launch.
Now we've arrived at a point where gamer sentiment has largely shifted against Microsoft, while Sony seem to be in the good graces of many. A point where it seems that Sony's console is not only more powerful, but also easier to develop for. A point where their console is actually CHEAPER, something that I know I certainly didn't predict (just look at old prediction threads for kicks). It's amazing how much things can change in a few months; I certainly wouldn't have put any money down on such an outcome.
Welcome! I would caution you against making your decision based on one game or the power differences. Instead, I would urge you to look at the list of exclusive games and features of the upcoming consoles, and their predecessors. Find the one with more experiences that appeal to you. The power difference could end up being a noticeable thing, but I doubt that it will impact third party games to the point where they aren't playable on the weaker console. If you can live with possibly reduced resolution or effects while retaining all the essential experience of the game, then I'd say that the power difference shouldn't impact your decision too much. If you are more graphically inclined and don't care about exclusive games, then I'm sure that the power difference would hold more sway in your calculations.
Either way, you can't really make a "wrong" decision. Both consoles will offer plenty of value over the next generation. Your satisfaction is pretty much guaranteed either way.
Why is Microsoft so obsessed with Gaf?
I don't really understand how out of all three companies, Microsoft spread their shills like flower petal confetti at a carnival.
True, im still unsure if im going to get either one actually. Might just stick to PC. I have my firstborn coming in March, and I just cant picture myself justifying $60 a game. I know,weak but oh well.
Problem with that conclusion is that it assumes the Wii U was competently targeted at the casual audience to begin with; between the high price, pathetic marketing and confusing naming/design ("it's a tablet add-on for the Wii right?"), it's hardly so, and wound up failing to find any audience besides the Nintendo faithful.
I was not talking about creating new Wii 2 i was talking about Nintendo going for strong hardware.
Wii U plan was to get casuals on board like Wii did. It failed, casuals play their games on mobile phones now. If they want to sell consoles they need to target hardcore gamer first and then later casual people as console will sell.
I have no doubt Nintendo fans would sing songs with tears in their eyes if they would get console from Nintendo to match PS4/Xbone or even outclass them (considering it will release later).
It's not just GAF, paid marketers are everywhere. Reddit, Amazon reviews, Facebook, etc. Shillwork is not a Microsoft exclusive. I recently read 20% of online reviews are from fake shills.
Microsoft has been using shills going back to Windows. Shillary can work if there's decent material to work with in the first place, but in the Xbone's case the hardware situation is so greatly stacked against them that anyone making claims about equality are suspect.
Having said that, I think a lot of Microsoft employees genuinely think the Xbox One is mostly equal to the PS4 from a HW perspective. When you're in a vacuum all day and that's the message you keep hearing over and over you sort of buy into it. Since moving to Seattle I've got to meet a lot of MS folks and while most of them have been indifferent on the topic I have talked to a few who were clearly high on the Kool Aid.
Have you ever seen these?
Embrace, Extend, & Extinguish.
Criticism of Microsoft.
Fear, Uncertainty, & Doubt (Microsoft).
Now tell me that they're not a bad influence on everything that they touch.
The thing is I feel like being humble isn't the only thing that matters. Somehow even cocky Sony didn't felt as evil to me as Microsoft does right now. Yes, Sony thought they own the gaming industry after the PS2 was THE gaming console, but MS with their DRM (used games, always on), NSA, Kinect decisions just appear to be very greedy and anti-comsumer in general. They just do the most necessary things for gamers, like having about 3 big Xbox IP's and that's kinda it. While Sony seems to create/buy more and more exclusive studios and games.
Sony doesn't care about selling our personal data and Kinect-like advertising possibilites (look at their UI - no ads!), they just want the whole core market and a PS1/2-like monopoly. Maybe it's the difference between western/japanese mentality. Somehow I don't trust Google and Facebook as much as Nintendo for example.
But that's just my opinion of course.
COMPETENTLY targeted? no. Nintendo misread the market to a great degree, trying to sell a tablet controller to an audience that already had $130 kindle fires. But targeted squarely at the casual audience (and nintendo faithful) it was. The WiiU is in NO WAY a machine for the X360 audience in any respect.
My only point was to say that, claiming "the expanded audience doesn't exist anymore" as a reason for the Wii U's failed approach just seemed inappropriate, when I'd say I agree with this assessment in that the Wii U wouldn't have found that casual audience to begin with. Not to say it'd be easy for anyone to light a spark like the original Wii did again, but I'd wager the experiences people expect between a home console dedicated to vidya versus a mobile device with cheap/free apps are two different animals.
Welcome! And your english is probably better than mine, and it's my first language.Hi guys,(20 pts?)
I've been lurking for quite awhile(around cboat esram yields). Its my first day being a junior. I hope you're lenient with me ....
Hi guys,(20 pts?)
I've been lurking for quite awhile(around cboat esram yields). Its my first day being a junior. I hope you're lenient with me
I was not really interested about the power gap in the first place since I was more interested in the games shown to me during e3, particularly FFXV, MGSV and KH3, and I already had my console choice buying all its iterations and handhelds. I then learned that those 3 were not exclusives anymore. Suddenly I was more interested with PS4 having a large power gap with xbox one or just its power and specs in general. This mean I'll be getting the absolute best version( for consoles only PC guys ), the definitive version of those 3 games when I buy the PS4 and I think that's what drew me more and maybe others more to the PS4 even if Xbox one has very good exclusives such as Ryse and Forza.
Microsoft's DRM policies drew me away from them when I heard rumors about it since internet's kinda weak where I live so it really was PS4 for me at the time. I'm not really a multiplayer kind of guy so I think you know what I'll choose even if you give me reasons such as better online experience and that's what the PS brand is better know for which is single player stuff.
I bought the PS3 for GOW3, FFVersusXIII, MGS4 and FF7remake and I think people who bought the 360 for their sequels and compelling exclusives were the same too. Maybe if I had an OG xbox and played MS' exclusives then, maybe I too would have bought the 360 and the One next gen but the better multiplayer that PS4 has gives it a much better leverage than the One if you owned both the 360 and the ps3.
Off topic: I can't help but notice that it was always bish that bans people and I haven't seen any other mods do so for my whole stay at Gaf. Is there an unwritten rule that only bish gets to ban people?
PS: English is my 3rd language. Sorry for any wrong grammars,spelling, lack of punctiations and just my writing in general.
Maybe we should get back to talking about Tech & forget about all this who shot johnny industry stuff.
All I know is that for the devs to be saying that the PS4 is 50% more powerful than the Xbox One even after the CPU\GPU upclock there has to be something going on that we don't know about or PS4 APU design is just that good.
All I know is that for the devs to be saying that the PS4 is 50% more powerful than the Xbox One even after the CPU\GPU upclock there has to be something going on that we don't know about or PS4 APU design is just that good.
Indeed. It's crazy to see how differently this has worked out than some people's expectations preceding these consoles' announcements. The overwhelming belief back then was that Sony wouldn't manage to create a better gaming machine than Microsoft. This perspective was quite reasonable, as MS had built up a lot of goodwill over the intervening console generation (minus some discontent at their increased focus on Kinect titles).
I'll be getting the absolute best version, the definitive version of those 3 games when I buy the PS4.
I think we will have a lot of NDA dates until the launchSo I was looking at this rinemy guy reddit account and I stumbled upon this http://www.reddit.com/r/xboxone/comments/1nbf88/nda_lifts_tomorrow_for_some_aspects_of_xbox_ones/
They're saying that NDA lifts tomorrow, is this true?.
It wasn't a common belief but MS where in a (better) position to do what Sony is doing right now spec wise. They had been very successful money wise (software sales + live subs) this gen. So they could bulldoze their way with a loss leader model targetting higher specs. Instead they chose to go for the profit on day 1 route but not reaching for the specs.
Pretty much.
I think we will have a lot of NDA dates until the launch
I think this is where the multimedia features are biting MS on the arse, they decided they needed 8gb of ram for these and at that time, this meant DDR3, this in turn meant they need APU space for some kind of embedded ram, which put them at a huge APU even now. If they were to up the Performance of the machine from this point it would be incredibly costly to match the PS4, not just in raw upfront costs but in hugely decreasing the yields of the APU by making it even bigger, These things are fabricated on wafers and you can only have so many Wafers in the oven at a time so to speak and they take a long time, I would say Microsoft, whjilst setting out with having 8gb of ram and expensive audio hardware to handle kinect, have actually done quite a good job of getting the performance they currently have.