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Anyone else disappointed by Pokemon Sun / Moon? (Spoilers obviously)
- Thread starter ZSaberLink
- Start date
elshoelace
Member
This, they are the best. I loved sun and moon, and have a hard time messing around in gen 6 games now cause I cant stand how they look.
PrinnyBomb
Member
I love Sun/Moon.
Love the quality of life changes, most of the new Pokemon designs, the removal of HMs, the SOS mechanic, the theme/setting, pokepelago, and the revamped Dex.
Didn't like the ride music, the starters, the difficulty of leveling up past 60s, and the exp share (quite fond of the old hold item).
I am quite sad they opened up the pokebank, I quite liked the "closed environment" the game seemed to have.
Love the quality of life changes, most of the new Pokemon designs, the removal of HMs, the SOS mechanic, the theme/setting, pokepelago, and the revamped Dex.
Didn't like the ride music, the starters, the difficulty of leveling up past 60s, and the exp share (quite fond of the old hold item).
I am quite sad they opened up the pokebank, I quite liked the "closed environment" the game seemed to have.
AlexFlame116
Member
I'll take that dare after my playthrough. Can't be worse than EDIT: Wait a second...
Sun and Moon is at the top with me together with the BW duology and HGSS. It had a great cast of characters, great pokemon designs, and it was a fresh experience in the series.
I would be a perfect Pokemon game if it had PSS and skippable cutscenes.
And call for help is fine, it made Trials interesting and are pretty easy to deal with when battling wild pokemons.
I would be a perfect Pokemon game if it had PSS and skippable cutscenes.
And call for help is fine, it made Trials interesting and are pretty easy to deal with when battling wild pokemons.
A few nagging things aside (the online quests are dumb, for example), it's my favorite gen in the series, only rivaled by B/W. and some of the remakes Feels fresh and fun, story isn't insulting (quite good in fact), lots of good post game content and lots of previous staples like EV training, HMs and Gym battles were refined in a very positive way. I hope that some of the newer things like Calling for Help and UBs are refined if they stick around, but overall i was very happy.
Dr. Black Jack
Member
So it's only a good game if it has satisfactory replay value for you?
ZSaberLink
Media Create Maven
I think he's saying if you take a step back and play it after all the hype, etc. has died down your opinion may change.
Btw, what do people think of Hau? I think he's adorable, but until the second Aether visit (where he gets better), he seriously is just a super happy masalada eating kid and absolutely nothing else lol....
Totem Pokemon have the right idea on boss battle compared to gym leader though, that is stacking the odds against the player. In majority if not all Pokemon games, players always have more options than their boss opponent like more Pokemons, healing items, or battle items. In other turn-based single player games, this advantages usually compensated on the boss side by vastly outpowered the player via raw stats or strong moves. However in Pokemon games, most of the boss (gym leaders, team leaders, etc) weren't given that advantages as their Pokemon still works on the same level as the players. Totem Pokemon
and Lusamine 2nd battle
Despite what I'm just said, the battle could be quite easy. Of course that would be the case since the game still designed for all ages audience. Not to mention that, if you utilized every battle options that available to you, you can always trivialize the game. This is always the case with every Pokemon game ever, only this time unlike in XY, you need to exploit the system a little bit more.
Agreed on this. SOS battle becomes a chore if you're completing pokedex entries without status mons in your team. The game does not properly tells you that status effect like paralyze and sleep disable SOS battle which makes it potentially more frustrating for people.
This is more technical limitation that anything. The game graphic was overhauled to look better and realized than what we had in XY. But such improvement come at cost of performance where the game runs at inconsistent 30fps even when played on N3DS. This is why triple and rotation battle get cut out from the game since it can barely handle double battle as shown by extremely choppy framerate.
Regardless of hardware limitation, big cities doesn't really fit well into Alola region. Alola wasn't a very big place and it is split into 3 islands of various sizes. It is made more sense for Alola to have multiple medium sized cities on each island rather than a single big cities on one island.
Don't know about this since I guess it can be pretty subjective. Rehearing XY music, it just have too much electric instrument to my taste, which is weird caused I don't think I have such problem before when I played it for the first time. While the overworld musics of Sun Moon mostly forgettable at times, it have the best Victory Road theme across all the generation (undermined greatly by the shortness of the Victory Road itself). The trainer theme also quite decent, but the top of the cream really is the theme for the Guardian Deities of Alola Islands. I guess overall BGM of Sun Moon is inoffensive and forgettable at worst, but when the BGM at it best, Sun Moon can easily beat the others on that department.
This is another price to be paid with the games put more emphasis on story. While I firmly believe that good story and open design to Pokemon region isn't mutually exclusive, they need to make the game linear so the story could work. Thankfully though, in my opinion, it's worth the paid off since the story was executed really well. I don't mind linear Pokemon game if there's something to replace it. The focus on the story makes me feel that Pokemon Sun Moon is having a different sort of adventure from the previous games, which bad or good depends on your own view of Pokemon games.
Yeah they are useless, but I prefer funny and silly team rather than stupid teams that take themselves too seriously. They are less grating and does not makes me grind my teeth every time I encounter them.
OniBarubary
Banned
Ehhhhh...I'm...not entirely certain that people look to Pokemon games for that.
Hero Prinny
Member
I love team skull, they're without a doubt my favorite villains in any pokemon game. they're just so incompetent but they embrace it.
Honestly, Hau is finally the friendly rival character where Game Freak managed to get their execution right. He's friendly, overtly at times, but it was clear that he is determined to defeat you fair and square. He never sulk or overthink on why he lost, as he just move on, keep smiling and being friendly while trying to get stronger to beat you each time. I feel there's competitive spirit resides within him beneath that smile. Compared to half-baked competitive rival like Cheren, hyperactive rival with daddy issue like Barry, or secondary rival that occupied with overcoming his own problem like Wally, Hau is more fully realized rival compared to them. The only problem he had is that Game Freak never give him a full team like they did with Blue and Silver.
Played Moon a month and a half after Sun. Still loved it just as much. The games work very well in its Pokemon distribution, difficulty curve, bosses, and generally finding new areas to get to.
There really needs to be a skip cutscene option, but the story itself is fine. Not sure it's as good as Black/White, but I'm fine with it as long as they make the effort. Pokemon is a JRPG after all. There should be some story there.
I don't know if it's my favorite initial Pokemon pair (regarding singleplayer) but it's definitely top 2 with Black/White overall for having a solid challenge, an interesting region, and generally attempting to improve the series in many ways.
MrSaturn99
Member
Only just found the drive to start really playing through it. The constant handholding and SOS battles are huge downers.
cagelessrat
Member
I play through every Pokemon game, but I might give up after 12 hours of this one. There's far too much talking. I feel like I can play by just looking at the map screen and smashing A. The Z moves feel overpowered. And I actually miss the gyms and the little maze puzzles they brought with them.
SM is great for what they are (first entry in a generation), so I'm willing to be more lenient on the problems like too many cutscenes, some weirdly inconsistent difficulty dips, postgame, etc.
I'm expecting Stars will address many of the issues people had with SM...except for the online, they're probably gonna lock Festival Plaza behind Nintendo's paywall.
I'm expecting Stars will address many of the issues people had with SM...except for the online, they're probably gonna lock Festival Plaza behind Nintendo's paywall.
Same. Trials feel pretty formulaic in their own way. They were generally fight 3 Pokemon and then fight the totem, and grand trials felt a lot like gym leader battles, except more straight forward. Really miss the puzzle element.
With the Pokeride system, they could have given us more overworld puzzles but it looks like they're still overly cautious about it and avoiding it for the most part.
Benzychenz
Member
I thought it was the best in the series and was my GotY.
SciencePilot
Member
It's my favorite Pokemon game. I didn't play X/Y but based on what I've heard about it I can't see how it would be better.
But relative to other Pokemon games I've played, here's what I thought Sun/Moon did well:
- Best graphics by a huge margin
- Best music by a small margin
- Best characters and plot. Not amazing by JRPG standards, but definitely amazing by Pokemon standards. Also the many world-building details are really great.
- Speaking of which, legendary Pokemon are actually integrated into the plot in a meaningful way that makes you feel connected to them
- Most interesting and characterized region. Alola has way more interesting locations than other Pokemon regions
- Totem Pokemon are actually decent boss fights. Way better than gym leaders. I'll agree that trials aren't great, they're mainly just a prelude to the totem fights.
- Actually a decent difficulty.
- Some much needed quality of life improvements.
But relative to other Pokemon games I've played, here's what I thought Sun/Moon did well:
- Best graphics by a huge margin
- Best music by a small margin
- Best characters and plot. Not amazing by JRPG standards, but definitely amazing by Pokemon standards. Also the many world-building details are really great.
- Speaking of which, legendary Pokemon are actually integrated into the plot in a meaningful way that makes you feel connected to them
- Most interesting and characterized region. Alola has way more interesting locations than other Pokemon regions
- Totem Pokemon are actually decent boss fights. Way better than gym leaders. I'll agree that trials aren't great, they're mainly just a prelude to the totem fights.
- Actually a decent difficulty.
- Some much needed quality of life improvements.
superNESjoe
Member
I was pretty disappointed. I liked X/Y more than most, and think it was much better. There's great elements to Sun/Moon but it has some downright awful pacing and an annoyingly stupid story that just won't leave you be.
I think the game takes way too long to get going, and just when it starts to feel like you're free to play and explore, it drags you back into more slow and inconsistent parts. You get an amazing period there were there's an outrageous variety of Pokemon to catch near the beginning and truly start building a unique team. It provides a bar for the game that the rest of it fails to live up to.
I think the game takes way too long to get going, and just when it starts to feel like you're free to play and explore, it drags you back into more slow and inconsistent parts. You get an amazing period there were there's an outrageous variety of Pokemon to catch near the beginning and truly start building a unique team. It provides a bar for the game that the rest of it fails to live up to.
I feel like Sun/Moon had some really great ideas and introduced some meaningful quality of life adjustments to the formula, but overall I enjoyed XY more.
My major issues with SuMo are:
1. Not enough new Pokemon, especially when you consider 75% of them were revealed pre-launch. For me, the discovery of new Pokemon is the core part of my enjoyment.
2. Lacking post-game, which wouldn't be a problem if the main narrative was a bit longer and more enjoyable.
3. The woeful variety of wild Pokémon. TPC have over 800 Pokémon at their disposal, yet they insist on only allowing very few of them in the main game. And what's worse is that they continue to repeat them across the islands. Why kill team variety?
4. Poor replayability continues to plague the series. Where are the random events and extensive subquests from games like Yokai Watch? Once I've caught your measly offering of wild Pokémon, what incentive is there to explore the world again?
Pokémon is a series that continues to evolve for the better, but it's series prestige and solid battle foundation are the only things keeping it more popular than the infinitely superior Yokai Watch series (especially 3) in my opinion.
Been a fan of Pokémon since the original Green/Red launch in Japan, but have to say that I put 35 hours into SuMo, and over 120 into Yokai Watch 3 (and about 150 into YW2). The next instalment needs to change the formula up to improve replayability and more player freedom/variety. It's on the cusp of greatness, but can never seem to get there.
My major issues with SuMo are:
1. Not enough new Pokemon, especially when you consider 75% of them were revealed pre-launch. For me, the discovery of new Pokemon is the core part of my enjoyment.
2. Lacking post-game, which wouldn't be a problem if the main narrative was a bit longer and more enjoyable.
3. The woeful variety of wild Pokémon. TPC have over 800 Pokémon at their disposal, yet they insist on only allowing very few of them in the main game. And what's worse is that they continue to repeat them across the islands. Why kill team variety?
4. Poor replayability continues to plague the series. Where are the random events and extensive subquests from games like Yokai Watch? Once I've caught your measly offering of wild Pokémon, what incentive is there to explore the world again?
Pokémon is a series that continues to evolve for the better, but it's series prestige and solid battle foundation are the only things keeping it more popular than the infinitely superior Yokai Watch series (especially 3) in my opinion.
Been a fan of Pokémon since the original Green/Red launch in Japan, but have to say that I put 35 hours into SuMo, and over 120 into Yokai Watch 3 (and about 150 into YW2). The next instalment needs to change the formula up to improve replayability and more player freedom/variety. It's on the cusp of greatness, but can never seem to get there.
silenttype01
Member
Pertaining to the music, it bothers me that the Team Skull Grunt battle music is a call back to another song from a previous game, but I can't remember which one in particular
It makes total sense though.
NinjaCoachZ
Member
What actually bugged me was that one of the Kahunas was someone who came out of nowhere and we'd never seen before. I actually liked using them as the Elite Four since it made plot sense and there was a connection with them that made things seem nice from a character perspective.
That and that one painter girl you meet on the mountain, she didn't really do anything in the main story. I thought for sure she'd have a bigger role than she did. Is there a post-game sidequest with her or something? Haven't done too many of those.
Vital Tundra
Member
I hate how the story always interrupts you and you still can't skip tutorials. I should be able to skip tutorials.
HawthorneKitty
Sgt. 2nd Class in the Creep Battalion, Waifu Wars
That's called character growth.
Couldn't agree more, OP. You nailed every point. (With the exception of the music. Poni Island has stunning music all over the place.) But I was super disappointed with it at the time and the rapturous reception was a shock to me. Surprised you didn't mention what a disaster Festival Plaza is, or the unforgivable frame rate on the OG 3ds.
However, on a second playthrough I found myself enjoying it much more. I was expecting the linearity and constant interruptions so I just mashed through them.
What I noticed was that the story beats, while not particularly good, made the game much more memorable in my mind than X/Y. I found myself saying 'Oh, this is the part where XYZ happens, I remember this.' I couldn't say the same about X/Y. Just wasn't as memorable. That in and of itself tells me that the story approach is a good one, they just need to back off a bit, give you more freedom, stop interrupting so often and edit the dialogue down. How many times did I need to see Lillie scolding Nebby, for fuck's sake?
Also, the challenge and balance was far better than X/Y and that's not an insignificant point in Sun / Moon's favour.
X/Y was the first game to introduce the stunning new 3D models which was a joy in and of itself, and it had the PSS and wonder trades and all this other great stuff. As such, it'll always be more favoured than Sun / Moon but I have come around to the later games a little bit.
However, on a second playthrough I found myself enjoying it much more. I was expecting the linearity and constant interruptions so I just mashed through them.
What I noticed was that the story beats, while not particularly good, made the game much more memorable in my mind than X/Y. I found myself saying 'Oh, this is the part where XYZ happens, I remember this.' I couldn't say the same about X/Y. Just wasn't as memorable. That in and of itself tells me that the story approach is a good one, they just need to back off a bit, give you more freedom, stop interrupting so often and edit the dialogue down. How many times did I need to see Lillie scolding Nebby, for fuck's sake?
Also, the challenge and balance was far better than X/Y and that's not an insignificant point in Sun / Moon's favour.
X/Y was the first game to introduce the stunning new 3D models which was a joy in and of itself, and it had the PSS and wonder trades and all this other great stuff. As such, it'll always be more favoured than Sun / Moon but I have come around to the later games a little bit.
Tavernacle12
Member
The story kept interrupting gameplay to a point where I didn't even care if it was interesting or not, I just wanted to go more than one map screen without getting stopped by it.
Online is awful this go around as well.
And, still, wtf at no National Dex?
Online is awful this go around as well.
And, still, wtf at no National Dex?
lvl99 Pixel
Member
"pokemon arent for collecting"
in a game based entirely around collecting.
yeah fuck off
in a game based entirely around collecting.
yeah fuck off
AlexFlame116
Member
For the first paragraph, apparently Kahili was once an island champion and was traveling the world getting stronger but then got came back after she got invited to be an Elite Four. Also she's the daughter of the big hotel owner guy and a golfer.
Second paragraph, she's in the UB side quest as a battle and then you can battle her again on the way to the Battle Tree.
On the subject, the only Pokèmon games that I found tiring were the Black 2/White 2 series and OR/AS. I can't find the desire to finish OR even though I'm so close.
SciencePilot
Member
This is a problem that has plagued all Pokemon games. Since gen 5 specifically, Gamefreak has clearly become self-aware of how immoral Pokemon games are. It's just something we have to suspend our disbelief for in order to enjoy the games.
GuitarGuruu
Member
I love Sun and Moon. I can't fault GameFreak for trying something different and it works very well. A more story focused Pokemon game is something I've been wanting since Black and White and the sequels so it was a very welcome addition.
Sadly they removed the PSS which was about 100x smoother than the Festival Plaza that they have now which makes online modes sort of inconvenient but they work. Overall its probably my 3rd favorite generation of Pokemon. Can't wait for "Stars."
Sadly they removed the PSS which was about 100x smoother than the Festival Plaza that they have now which makes online modes sort of inconvenient but they work. Overall its probably my 3rd favorite generation of Pokemon. Can't wait for "Stars."
lvl99 Pixel
Member
it worked better when they werent self aware.
The whole game is a mix of both 4th wall breaking nonsense NPC tutorials and a story that takes itself super seriously where you end up fighting sephiroth. It all feels really really inconsistent.
when you try and explain fantasy you end up with Midicloreans