I know just about nothing about circumcisions, even though I'm cut. My girlfriend (future wife) is a nurse and is staunchly for circumcision based on health factors that have been mentioned throughout this thread. I could honestly give a shit whether my son(s) are cut or not.
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Circumcision doubles autism risk, study claims
- Thread starter Sage00
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I know just about nothing about circumcisions, even though I'm cut. My girlfriend (future wife) is a nurse and is staunchly for circumcision based on health factors that have been mentioned throughout this thread. I could honestly give a shit whether my son(s) are cut or not.
GameGuru59
Banned
I never even thought about circumcision before coming to GAF. I thought the entire developed world did the practice for whatever reason.
Muskieratboi
Member
I'm personally part of the "keep it their choice" crowd, but yeah.. that's one of the dumbest medical correlation's I've ever heard.
Freshmaker
I am Korean.
It's the new vaccine scare.
Shin Kojima
Banned
Interestingly, before I came to GAF I thought the entire developed world had done away with it. I had two adopted brothers who were both circumcised (before they got adopted obviously) so it wasn't an outlandish concept to me. Nor do I think a cut penis looks freaky, just incomplete.
BreezyLimbo
Banned
Cut off part of your dick right now. Tell me that shit don't hurt. Now try it when you're a baby, where the concept of pain doesn't exist to you.
That shit hurts, mang.
manueldelalas
Time Traveler
How do gaffers feel about piercing ears in baby girls?
I'm expecting my third girl and the first two reacted allergically (is that a word?) after a year using earrings, and now they don't use earrings and the holes in their ears have cicatriced (again, is this a word?) and they will need piercing their ears again if they want to use normal earrings... They get allergic reactions even if they use earrings pressed to the ears.
I'm seriously thinking about not piercing her ears and let her choose when big enough whether she wants or not, because she'll probably be allergic too...
I'm expecting my third girl and the first two reacted allergically (is that a word?) after a year using earrings, and now they don't use earrings and the holes in their ears have cicatriced (again, is this a word?) and they will need piercing their ears again if they want to use normal earrings... They get allergic reactions even if they use earrings pressed to the ears.
I'm seriously thinking about not piercing her ears and let her choose when big enough whether she wants or not, because she'll probably be allergic too...
I think this is a joke, but just in case people actually do this - WTF.
manueldelalas
Time Traveler
Why is this a joke? You've never seen a baby with earrings? It's absolutely normal in my country, they don't even ask you, the godfathers give her earrings at birth, and the nurse goes and in five minutes the baby comes with earrings.
Shin Kojima
Banned
I view it about the same.. You don't do that to a kid when they don't have a choice. Your child is not a fashion accessory. They'll let you know if they want their ears pierced or not when they're old enough, boy or girl.
I haven't - though that's a really interesting cultural response that I wasn't expecting.
I took your post to mean purely for convenience - so that they could wear earrings later. Which didn't make much sense since earlobe piercings don't actually hurt and are surely something you'd want to let the person decide for themselves about anyway.
boiled goose
good with gravy
I'm ccompletely against childhood circumcision but this sounds crazy. ...
If I had to guess people only do it so the gender of the baby is pristinely clear when you put your eyes on it. As far as I know it is very common in a lot of places to pierce the ear lobe of baby girls. Not that I approve it, anyway.
boiled goose
good with gravy
As a a not circumcized guy in the USA I must say it has never ever been an issue with women. It has not even come up. It must be an issue with teenagers because older women have never given a fuck.
The health benefits are Bs. Completely cancelled by normal hygiene. If you want to have a slightly lower risk of STDs and infections when having sex with multiple partners without showering for multiple days go ahead. I'm sure you also advocate removing the outer labia of the vagina?
The health benefits are Bs. Completely cancelled by normal hygiene. If you want to have a slightly lower risk of STDs and infections when having sex with multiple partners without showering for multiple days go ahead. I'm sure you also advocate removing the outer labia of the vagina?
NekoFever
Member
Heh, I thought completely the opposite until I ran into the online arguments over it. Growing up somewhere where hardly anyone has it done, I thought it was purely a Jewish thing.
manueldelalas
Time Traveler
In my opinion, I don't have any problem with intervention in babies due to traditions, be it tattoos, circumcision, piercing or other things.
I think people saying is cosmetic fail to see the taurine behind.
If there is scientific consensus that it's harmful, then by all means that practice need to be stopped, and I think this study is not conclusive, but it's a huge start.
But people saying they do it for "health reasons" are the biggest idiots of them all, because the only ones they are fooling are themselves.
In my culture, it's completely normal (and by normal I mean 100% of the people) to pierce girl baby ears at birth, and I honestly never even have it a thought, and if my daughters didn't turn allergic, I would honestly not even care, to me it's a good thing, not because of bullshit like health reasons, but because my ancestors who were good people did it, and I admire them and want to be like them.
To say I do it for styling or treat my baby like a doll is insulting to me, and is also insulting to speak about mutilation when speaking about circumcision (even though I personally think it is, and would never even think about it).
It's the same for other traditions, but say it's tradition and don't try to bullshit us by saying health reasons. And if you do it because you think it's cute or something, that's wrong too IMO.
I think people saying is cosmetic fail to see the taurine behind.
If there is scientific consensus that it's harmful, then by all means that practice need to be stopped, and I think this study is not conclusive, but it's a huge start.
But people saying they do it for "health reasons" are the biggest idiots of them all, because the only ones they are fooling are themselves.
In my culture, it's completely normal (and by normal I mean 100% of the people) to pierce girl baby ears at birth, and I honestly never even have it a thought, and if my daughters didn't turn allergic, I would honestly not even care, to me it's a good thing, not because of bullshit like health reasons, but because my ancestors who were good people did it, and I admire them and want to be like them.
To say I do it for styling or treat my baby like a doll is insulting to me, and is also insulting to speak about mutilation when speaking about circumcision (even though I personally think it is, and would never even think about it).
It's the same for other traditions, but say it's tradition and don't try to bullshit us by saying health reasons. And if you do it because you think it's cute or something, that's wrong too IMO.
Going to try to read the study today. I'm curious how they are making the correlation from traumatic pain to ASD.i know a few people doing research on ASD and they should be interested as well. Initial impressions of the what I've read makes the results seem a bit confusing, but this should be addressed in their analysis.
I mean, you know this is just adding to the thing you are complaining about, right?
I mean, you know this is just adding to the thing you are complaining about, right?
Personally I'm not doing it for my daughter. When and if she asks me about it I will let her. It will be her choice.
We have friends who did it to their 1 year old.
9 times out of 10 these correlation/causation articles prove to be false.
I also think people are specifically sensitive about autism, mostly because of Jenny McCarthy and the whole "vaccines cause autism" thing
HolyBaikal
Banned
Boys are diagnosed a lot more. A lot of things that people call Autistic are gender roles.
And there are a lot of people believe that girls can't be Autistic, so people are less likely to diagnose girls with Autism than boys.
My husband wanted to circumcise our son when he was born, I believe more as a family thing than anything, since we're not religious and few in our families are.
The pediatrician and family doctor said it's easier on the baby if it's done very soon after birth, and we missed our "window", so to speak. We're not bothering now. He can do it when he's older, if it's something he wants.
The hygiene thing has always been a debate-- personally I think it depends on who's on the other end of the dick, and how well they maintain themselves
Like many other body parts, it's gonna get gross if it's left unattended.
I will say, I was really surprised at how many patients my hospital sees day to day for phimosis treatment. That's gotta suck. Much more common than I'd originally thought.
The pediatrician and family doctor said it's easier on the baby if it's done very soon after birth, and we missed our "window", so to speak. We're not bothering now. He can do it when he's older, if it's something he wants.
The hygiene thing has always been a debate-- personally I think it depends on who's on the other end of the dick, and how well they maintain themselves
Like many other body parts, it's gonna get gross if it's left unattended. I will say, I was really surprised at how many patients my hospital sees day to day for phimosis treatment. That's gotta suck. Much more common than I'd originally thought.
I can't even begin to imagine how they ever came up with such an article. Even a trained monkey will understand that circumcision will never lead to you developing a genetic, hereditary disorder at any point after birth. Sure, it may manifest itself later with some than others, but that is an entirely different discussion...
I stumbled over this article calming circumcision changes the brain a few days ago so this seems like an follow up claim. And a lot more credible with having an actual sample size versus using an MRI on a single kid.
I don't think a single study/case is enough material to base the claim on, but hopefully the medical community will look further into both of these.
I don't think a single study/case is enough material to base the claim on, but hopefully the medical community will look further into both of these.
Always-honest
Banned
Thanx!
So could any trauma/ surgery maybe permanently change the brain of a young kid?
There's a lot of published research that shows distressed infants produce stress hormones like cortisol and adrenaline. This can happen from anything from acute pain (something like an ear infection) to fear (someone letting a newborn "cry it out" instead of attending to them).
That's where studies such as these need strict controls. Saying that a single traumatic event is the primary factor in childhood development is specious, at best, because any stress an infant experiences can produce an identical biological response - hell, an overtired infant has a brain that's being flooded with the same stress hormones.
Sàmban;146997983 said:
Seems legit to me. Or at least, far more legit than "pain from circumcision helps cause autism" (I don't know about any other issues that might cause, but autism specifically seems unlikely). Isn't it established that autism is largely genetic by now, or am I mistaken?
P.S. As an uncut person, cleaning your dick is incredibly easy. Though apparently some people aren't aware that they can/should do that... so I guess that's what's responsible for the STD risk correlation. :|
IISANDERII
Member
"Our problems began when we attempted to publish our findings in the open medical literature. All of the participants in the research including myself were called before the hospital discipline committee and were severely reprimanded. We were told that while male circumcision was legal under all circumstances in Canada, any attempt to study the adverse effects of circumcision was strictly prohibited by the ethical regulations. Not only could we not publish the results of our research, but we also had to destroy all of our results. If we refused to comply, we were all threatened with immediate dismissal and legal action."
WTF???
OminoMichelin
Member
Whoah ok is this true?
kame-sennin
Member
Everybody's got a little skin in the game.
D
Deleted member 13876
Unconfirmed Member
Some more than others.
VanillaCakeIsBurning
Member
This raises some interesting questions if true.
TwEE-N-Toast
Banned
Thanks Harper.
Always-honest
Banned
Exactly. Thanx.
The message then should be to make sure this kind of trauma should not happen to children.
Some stuff we can't avoid. But we can avoid circumcision at a young age if it's not a medical necessity.
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