GhostTrick
Banned
As I said, 3DS/Wii U are two different SKUs.
Also, the game never was lower than 9 dollars. That was before the new expansion which raised the price. So that argument is kinda off too.
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Death Squared developers pleased with Switch sales, underperformed on Steam
- Thread starter Jonneh3003
- Start date
As I said, 3DS/Wii U are two different SKUs.
Also, the game never was lower than 9 dollars. That was before the new expansion which raised the price. So that argument is kinda off too.
So their best performing platform is two wildly different platforms, one of which is a handheld and the other isn't? Makes sense.
Lister
Banned
Even if you are right, and I don't think we cna be sure of that, I'd wager in terms of PROFIT, PC is sitll probably 1st.
Catchpenny
Member
It's so fun to discuss Nintendo sometimes...
"Third parties aren't on Switch because their games don't sell on Nintendo platforms."
*indie developer is happier with Switch sales than Steam sales*
"That only happened because Switch owners are starved for games, whereas Steam has a bazillion titles"
*someone points out there are over 80 titles on the Switch eshop in just over four months*
"They need to do a better job showcasing these games!"
GhostTrick
Banned
It's also nice to read the thread too.
Happier than a game bombing on Steam isnt a sale data. How much did it sell on Switch ? What would it represent for other devs ?
Some draws conclusion that if X indie game on Switch sells better on Switch than Steam, then Switch is more viable. Although people gave reasons why this fame bombed on Steam and sold better on Switch:
Steam is crowded with good games. Even cheaper ones. Switch is new and has not a ot of games. 80 games (it seems to be actually less than that) in 4 months is basically 4 games a week or so. This is barely nothing.
funkystudent
Member
I'd say if you are a console indie developer, right now you would be foolish not to try get your game on Switch.
Clearly its a platform with a audience hungry for games and a bit more willing to give things more of a chance then the others who have been flooded with indie games for so long the market has kinda sagged a bit. Also since its such a new platform with few games its easier to stand out versus on PS4 where 20 random games release a week or Steam where the new releases screen changes hourly.
Clearly its a platform with a audience hungry for games and a bit more willing to give things more of a chance then the others who have been flooded with indie games for so long the market has kinda sagged a bit. Also since its such a new platform with few games its easier to stand out versus on PS4 where 20 random games release a week or Steam where the new releases screen changes hourly.
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
There's no contradiction or tension between those three things?
Jaded Alyx
Member
Well to be fair to them, it's not their fault you don't pay attention to the News section on the Switch. They even put it on the side of the screen when you wake the system.
Cuningas de Häme
Member
Really glad for the devs!
If indies are smart, they work their ass off to bring their games to Switch. Easier to get more visibility and a proper change to sell full priced vs Steam sales.
And especially for local MP games Switch is great and I hope that most if the upcoming games like that will come for Switch.
If indies are smart, they work their ass off to bring their games to Switch. Easier to get more visibility and a proper change to sell full priced vs Steam sales.
And especially for local MP games Switch is great and I hope that most if the upcoming games like that will come for Switch.
Mbolibombo
Member
There's actually across all regions, 91 games on the Switch as we speak. 12 are locked to Japan though.
Another 9 releasing the upcoming week.
Without any previously generated hype, the natural order of things on Steam nowadays is for your game to simply disappear on launch. There are too many games being released so the front page views each game is guaranteed to get is very small.
That's why indies love them new platforms and underdog platforms like Vita and Wii U, even on an userbase order of magnitude(s) smaller, the increased visibility window often results in higher sales numbers.
That's why indies love them new platforms and underdog platforms like Vita and Wii U, even on an userbase order of magnitude(s) smaller, the increased visibility window often results in higher sales numbers.
GhostTrick
Banned
I dont think it's about being hidden. It's more like being average or anything special.
I mean a lot of games on Steam found their way without any previous hype. Just look at PUBG, Undertale, Stardew Valley or even Hollow Knight.
This game is just another 15 dollars puzzle game which doesnt look any special.
It's both. It's not llike PUBG couldn't have failed too, or Hollow Knight, like, by definition the reason people aren't buying games like this one is because they're already going for something else that caught their attention - ergo SOMETHING had to do it. Like even if you released the same game 2000 times with different names, one of them would catch on and the others wouldn't, it wouldn't mean that that one did something right that the others didn't. That's intentionally reductive to make my point, but it's still true even when the deck is already stacked against certain titles.
Being good doesn't guarantee success, and being bad doesn't guarantee failure. The fact that SOME indies have done very well, doesn't mean that those games were just better or more appealing, it just illustrates the compounding effect popularity brings to sales. Your game only has to be good 'enough' for that to happen, and most games probably are as long as they can tap into that initial wave (being online multi helps a lot with that of course, but undertale for example did just fine without that).
GhostTrick
Banned
Well in any case, they had something to stand out. We're talking here about a market drowning in quality game.
And this game looks average.
...How many titles do you think Steam has...? I think at least 80 get released a week.
http://store.steampowered.com/search/?sort_by=Released_DESC&page=3&os=win
Yeah, steam gets a ton of games. I don't see how anyone can even be trying to make the argument that the Switch and Steam releases are in the same league. That's just the way it is, nothing wrong with Switch, just a not comparable.
All these small indie games are performing so well on the Switch.
Many of them people never heard of, but now got a bit of attention when they arrived on the Switch:
- Implosion
- GoNNER
- Kamiko
- Snake Pass
- Wonder Boy: The Dragon's Trap
- VOEZ
And the other bigger Indies are doing well on the Switch too like Shantae, Mighty Gunvolt, Shovel Knights, Binding of Issac, Cave Story etc.
Many of them people never heard of, but now got a bit of attention when they arrived on the Switch:
- Implosion
- GoNNER
- Kamiko
- Snake Pass
- Wonder Boy: The Dragon's Trap
- VOEZ
And the other bigger Indies are doing well on the Switch too like Shantae, Mighty Gunvolt, Shovel Knights, Binding of Issac, Cave Story etc.
MisterR
Member
This.
It's harsh but Steam is so popular now and has so many good games on the market, you have to be more than just average to stand out. That market really separates the wheat from the chaff.
Basically if you're smart get your games on Switch right now while the market is empty and the user base is hot to buy anything.
Basically if you're smart get your games on Switch right now while the market is empty and the user base is hot to buy anything.
Saucycarpdog
Member
I wouldn't even call it harsh. It's the nature of a booming competitive market.
I could name you several high quality AAA games that didn't sell well.
Guess what? Not every good or great game gets to have success.
Developer here. This thread has been a great read.
A few things from us;
We launched during a crowded period. Not just on steam but in general. Right after Zelda BOTW, just before ME3. We were originally going for Feb 14 (valentine's day) but were delayed on a console approval so missed that date. (woirst part we delayed because we wanted to give enough time for reviews! LOL)
March 14 was not a great launch week it seems.
This lead to a lack of proper reviews for the game from mainstream media. Being an indie means that unless there is major hype the big sites dont really want to talk about you as they rely on page views to live. Why talk about an unknown game when you can talk about a character skin in Overwatch and get more views. That's my cynical view but if you're a week or two old then you're dead to these news sites.
We launched on Switch with a lower price point and have since updated the other platforms to the $15 USD price vs $20. So lower price helps.
We have been on sale on Steam twice now but havent converted the bulk of the 8000+ people who have us on their Wishlist.
Lack of online multiplayer? We looked at Overcooked and thought "well they did it so we dont need it either" but seems we underestimated how many people do not have the ability to play with friends locally. Would this have made the difference? Maybe... maybe not. The game is still fun to play by yourself but that is something we didnt push too hard in the trailers.
The best trailers for us have been the "let's plays" by the community.
But being on the Switch this early has allowed us to reach an audience in an uncluttered store and also get the news media support we didnt get in the original launch period. We also think that the game has good word of mouth as people who play it, like it. So that helps with the tail.
The "cube" design hate is funny as you always hear about "we want gameplay first" but then people are (on the whole) so enamored by graphics. It's a tough balance as we think the game looks good but it doesnt have the OMG wow graphics or style of other games. Noted for next time to focus on the art more.
We're thankful that the game is doing well on Switch and learned a lot with our first venture into the console game scene.
Oh and the 74-78 on metacritic. We find that if the reviewer just played by themselves they mark lower than someone who plays with a friend. Also we got a 5.5 from someone and that just seems overly harsh. And when you only have a dozen or so reviews each one weighs highly compared to the games that get 50+ reviews.
This game dev thing is a real hustle. if this was our only title as a studio we'd probably be out of business. But we've got a wide slate of releases coming up and games already out there bringing in revenue so we're doing OK. I think that is an important thing for any studio. Don't out all your eggs into one basket.
Side note: I had no idea Hollow Knight was an Aussie game! F yeah!
A few things from us;
We launched during a crowded period. Not just on steam but in general. Right after Zelda BOTW, just before ME3. We were originally going for Feb 14 (valentine's day) but were delayed on a console approval so missed that date. (woirst part we delayed because we wanted to give enough time for reviews! LOL)
March 14 was not a great launch week it seems.
This lead to a lack of proper reviews for the game from mainstream media. Being an indie means that unless there is major hype the big sites dont really want to talk about you as they rely on page views to live. Why talk about an unknown game when you can talk about a character skin in Overwatch and get more views. That's my cynical view but if you're a week or two old then you're dead to these news sites.
We launched on Switch with a lower price point and have since updated the other platforms to the $15 USD price vs $20. So lower price helps.
We have been on sale on Steam twice now but havent converted the bulk of the 8000+ people who have us on their Wishlist.
Lack of online multiplayer? We looked at Overcooked and thought "well they did it so we dont need it either" but seems we underestimated how many people do not have the ability to play with friends locally. Would this have made the difference? Maybe... maybe not. The game is still fun to play by yourself but that is something we didnt push too hard in the trailers.
The best trailers for us have been the "let's plays" by the community.
But being on the Switch this early has allowed us to reach an audience in an uncluttered store and also get the news media support we didnt get in the original launch period. We also think that the game has good word of mouth as people who play it, like it. So that helps with the tail.
The "cube" design hate is funny as you always hear about "we want gameplay first" but then people are (on the whole) so enamored by graphics. It's a tough balance as we think the game looks good but it doesnt have the OMG wow graphics or style of other games. Noted for next time to focus on the art more.
We're thankful that the game is doing well on Switch and learned a lot with our first venture into the console game scene.
Oh and the 74-78 on metacritic. We find that if the reviewer just played by themselves they mark lower than someone who plays with a friend. Also we got a 5.5 from someone and that just seems overly harsh. And when you only have a dozen or so reviews each one weighs highly compared to the games that get 50+ reviews.
This game dev thing is a real hustle. if this was our only title as a studio we'd probably be out of business. But we've got a wide slate of releases coming up and games already out there bringing in revenue so we're doing OK. I think that is an important thing for any studio. Don't out all your eggs into one basket.
Side note: I had no idea Hollow Knight was an Aussie game! F yeah!
Laughing Banana
Weeping Pickle
You're talking as if those who buy Switch are stupid gamers who buy any and all games available regardless good or not or something.
I think it's just quite funny (or sad?) that you need to offer justification as to why your game sells better on Switch than Steam. As if that is a "wrong" thing to accomplish.
The only person calling them stupid is you sir. There is a lack of games on the switch, it does have some quality ones but there is nowhere near enough on it ATM.
Laughing Banana
Weeping Pickle
"Nintendo gamers are only buying games because they are starved for content" is a common thing said by numerous people in here, it's not exactly a public secret or anything.
Just because the content is perhaps not abundant yet doesn't mean gamers that buy Switch are "ravenous" for "any" and "all" games as if they aren't capable of discerning whether the games they buy are good or not.
This argument took literally 2 minutes to get made in a Switch thread? New record?
GhostTrick
Banned
It doesnt mean Switch owners will buy any shovelware.
It just mean they have a lot less choice, thus making smaller profile release more visible.
There are enough that I cant afford all the ones I want, nor have the time to play them all. I guess its kind of a matter of perspective.
GhostTrick
Banned
Yeah, but you're not the only Switch owner. 80 games is a lot for one person. It isnt for a wide range of millions of people, with different tastes.
For being 4 months out? I'd be interested in knowing what you thought of the PS4 and Xbox One libraries at their equivalent point.
evil monkey
Member
I think it's amazing it did well considering the eShop page doesn't even have a trailer nor does it tell what sort of game it is. It bodes well for indies in general though, so that's cool.
Nah. Everyone is just playing PUBG
GhostTrick
Banned
Pretty much of the same ?
Although with more games.
Sure, being 4 months old is an explanation. But it doesnt change the fact that 80 games is nothing and barely 4 to 5 games a week.
FWIW, this is a game I recently (as in last week) got in my Steam discovery queue, had not known about before, and immediately put on my wishlist. This happens statistically less than once per queue. I was surprised that I was completely unaware of something which looks this nice and fits the profile of stuff I want.
The reason I put it on my wishlist and didn't buy it immediately is that even in the particular niche this occupies for me (good-looking local coop puzzle-focused game) there are already multiple unplayed games sitting in my Steam library, and yet more on my wishlist.
So no, I don't think it's because Steam is "flooded with crap". It's because Steam is awash with good games in almost every genre (and subgenre), and without an obvious unique selling point (or, I guess, Youtube popularity) it's hard to generate immediate demand.
The reason I put it on my wishlist and didn't buy it immediately is that even in the particular niche this occupies for me (good-looking local coop puzzle-focused game) there are already multiple unplayed games sitting in my Steam library, and yet more on my wishlist.
So no, I don't think it's because Steam is "flooded with crap". It's because Steam is awash with good games in almost every genre (and subgenre), and without an obvious unique selling point (or, I guess, Youtube popularity) it's hard to generate immediate demand.
If you look only at local coop puzzle games, and only at good ones, are there still far more than you can play? Because that's basically Steam.
Looking good, Death Squared is now 2 on the recent AU charts
http://twitter.com/smgstudio/status/889263770777698304
http://twitter.com/smgstudio/status/889263770777698304