Haunted
Member
Honestly, if the Switch performs like that, I'm very worried for the WiiU version. Don't want an otherwise great game marred by subpar performance/tech.
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Digital Foundry: Let's Play Zelda: Breath of the Wild on Nintendo Switch
- Thread starter Equanimity
- Start date
For the tech guys:
If this is really a bandwith bottleneck, is it possible that because this is a wiiu game they cant use gpu features to circumvent the bottleneck ?
I have no idea if such features exist, but it would be nice to know if future titles of this scale can fix this problem.
If this is really a bandwith bottleneck, is it possible that because this is a wiiu game they cant use gpu features to circumvent the bottleneck ?
I have no idea if such features exist, but it would be nice to know if future titles of this scale can fix this problem.
geordiemp
Member
You cannot compare open world to a racing game, its like comparing Forza on Xb1 at 1080p60 to say Witcher 3 on Xb1 which is 900p30. Tetris will run at 4k60 if needed....
Nobody will know the bottlenecks until someone leaks the actual specs of the switch, my guess is memory bandwidth and access speed if the leaked specs on that Switch development thread on GAF are near to reality.
ShadowFox08
Member
We're talking about an 8 month old build. We have no idea what the final wii u build works right now until we get it.
7DollarHagane
Banned
This is the biggest wtf for me with the reveal of the switch.
It IS a handheld system. That it works on a TV is irrelevant..All the processing and power is contained in a portable system.
Judging it against a unit with the size, cooling, power draw, and storage of the ps4 is totally off base.
D
Deleted member 465307
Unconfirmed Member
Indeed. Comparing the size of the Switch's actual hardware against something like the PS4 Slim or Xbox One S should drive the point home that it was an unrealistic dream to think Switch would ever be at their level without some kind of external hardware supplement. Switch 2, maybe, with top mobile chips could be there, but not this first one. But it is Nintendo who keeps calling it a home system.
lowrider007
Licorice-flavoured booze?
I agree with you but Nintendo are essentially pitching it the other way around, a Home console that you can take outside, and what with the design of the Wii-U I can see why people would buy into that, I certainly don't though.
It's still a mobile chip.
But apparently that is not what Nintendo thinks:
http://www.polygon.com/2016/10/20/13347910/nintendo-switch-home-gaming-system
DirgeExtinction
Member
Blame Nintendo for marketing it as a home console you can use on the go.
-shadow-
Member
Well it helps that the original teaser was never claimed to be real-time and fully playable on the WiiU unlike the Ubisoft demos each and everytime.
lowrider007
Licorice-flavoured booze?
Exactly, I swear some people believe there is some magic in the dock, it could be replaced with a cable.
I give Nintendo some credit, the dock design was a good idea with regards to giving it some resemblance to a console but it does make it confusing.
Psycho_Mantis
Banned
It looks ugly....damn ugly. The environments, shadow, aliasing...everything except the character models (who look disconnected from the ugly environments). Ugly graphics period. Art style can only do so much for the character models. Thanks to the high-bitrate DF video you can see how this game properly looks.
The textures are like some early PS360 game.
KainXVIII
Member
Sorry, but Switch always will be home console for me
Comfort Jones
Banned
I'm sorry but you're so off trying to claim this should be seen as a new handheld when Nintendo has clearly marketed this as a home console you can take outside. That combined with the fact that it's getting games that look like something I'd much rather play on a tv leads me to believe we're not getting a home console from Nintendo stronger than a PS4 for years. Like 4-5 minimum.
I think that's the issue a lot of people have here, we're not seeing "strongest portable system ever" we're seeing "Nintendo's big AAA games are still going to be ham stringed by weak hardware".
Nintendo revealed switch as a 'portable console'. They said they tried 1st with the gamecube, but it was still to big and too early. But it had not left their mind. So the Switch is that long time dream of theirs for a portable console.
It should be judged alongside other portables for this reason. It does what consoles cannot do.
I do not know who was asking for a portable console outside of Nintendo, but I can assure you it wasn't me. I would have much preferred a more traditional console with PS4 levels of power, and keep the portables as portables.
N has stated that they want to build an ecosystem between the home and portable similar to apple OS, where there are many shared commonalities between the desktop and phone OS.
Comfort Jones
Banned
Serious question if I'm supposed to judge the Switch as a portable, can I expect a strong home console in the near future? If so, why would any of the Switch's games not get ported to that and why on Earth would I want to spend 300 dollars on this thing? A big budget 3d Zelda deserves better IMO.
A big budget 3D Zelda game deserves only the best hardware, but I don't see Nintendo developing for PC anytime soon
We are supposed to judge the Switch as we want it. Some people just want the next PS4 and that's fine, but I do recognize the value of the Switch in my case. I have a strong lineup of console games on the go, I have the strongest local multiplayer offering out there (even on the go!) and I have a fairly future proof concept since Nintendo will be focussing on Switch titles. There may be a Nintendo Go and a Nintendo TV out there at some point, but I am sure that Switch titles will work on either of those. It's just that more quality options like with the PS4pro will be added onto it.
It's a console launch. People buy into the potential of the console and I do see more potential here than with the WiiU. Or even the 3DS at some point.
It looks ugly....damn ugly. The environments, shadow, aliasing...everything except the character models (who look disconnected from the ugly environments). Ugly graphics period. Art style can only do so much for the character models. Thanks to the high-bitrate DF video you can see how this game properly looks.
:\
ViewtifulJC
Banned
if the new defense of Switch's underwhelming graphics is "its a handheld its not supposed to look good", then are we effectively admitting that Nintendo has dropped out of the console business?
Its a fair question, and given what N said at the Switch reveal, I wouldn't count on it anytime soon. I think some of the 'Switch' is metaphoric for where they have positioned themselves as a hardware maker now.
Clearly they were not interested in keeping up with PS4 and X1S in terms of power, so they 'invented' (in their mind lol) the portable console. I can see re-releases of switch with more powerful, but I really do not forsee a return to the traditional home console anytime soon after how they have presented the Switch during the reveal and how they have positioned themselves in the home console market.
I think they have carved out a niche for themselves outside of PS4 and X1S that they think is unique and plan to 'live' in this portable console region. Are they still hardware makers, yes. Is it still a home console? yes, but the hardware is not modern for a home console, and it is not built as a home console, it is built as a portable that doubles as a home console.
They already dropped out with the Wii, so they try to follow the Blue Ocean strategy.
But: what is "underwhelming" in your eyes? What did people expect? Zelda is a WiiU-title up and foremost and we all knew that there will be slight improvements and a more stable frame rate. They deliver that, so how is that "underwhelming"?
Comfort Jones
Banned
Problem is between the price, the kinds of games that are Switch exclusive (games I'd rather play on a TV), and the battery power this thing is absolutely going to be competing against PS4 rather than coexisting with it.
Don't hate, it will be the most beautiful and best game ever made.
Blizzard doesn't use next gen gfx and their games are like 10 times better than the ones on next gen consoles.
ViewtifulJC
Banned
its just so funny, cuz I remember just a couple months ago people made the exact opposite argument towards me. That the Switch is gonna be 2.5x as powerful as the Wii U, that Zelda is gonna look like all the bullshots on the Switch, the draw distance and IQ improvements, its not gonna be like TP GC vs Wii.
and now its "Well technically its just a handheld I mean what did you want, basic AA? Texture filtering? c'mon lets be serious"
right now it seems like the Switch is just a portable Wii U. Good luck selling that.
We don't, but unless they put some magic sauce on the Wii U disc the system isn't going to get any more powerful. The game is obviously pushing the limits of what is possible on the Wii U hardware.
It's a console, so no. Did they drop out of the arms race? Yes, 11 years ago.
I think you are correct pointing out that the games will be more traditional console games than 'handheld' games, but thats a good thing. It needs just enough beef to be able to host console games, and it can also easily play traditional handheld games. This is part of the idea of the cohesive Apple ecosystem N talked about adopting.
I think we will see games diverted from 3DS to go live on Switch, or possibly ported and live in both 3DS and Switch.
Battery power is on par with other N handhelds.
The major issue I see is the price, which is a bit steep - my personal opinion would be that $249 was the sweet spot and it would be bundled with download code for 1,2, switch to help 'showcase' the new HD rumble tech and Joy-con unique abilities.
Pricing at $299, does infact give them the opportunity to later drop to $249 sweet spot for holiday sale, when they have more units in production. Right now, I expect that we are seeing very high demand and expect a sold out scalp launch
Joeshabadoo
Member
man, people who take the overall stance that the collective style and imagery this game achieves is 'ugly' ... just cant relate to you and dont really ever want to see the world through your eyes
i mean fucking obviously a game like Horizon is pushing far more high poly models and lighting and texturing and nailing a photo-realistic approach, but BotW is executing on a studio ghibli type aesthetic to great success/effect considering the lowest common denominator hardware it's built upon. i find it gorgeous and its characters extremely emotive and well designed (non human types especially)
i mean fucking obviously a game like Horizon is pushing far more high poly models and lighting and texturing and nailing a photo-realistic approach, but BotW is executing on a studio ghibli type aesthetic to great success/effect considering the lowest common denominator hardware it's built upon. i find it gorgeous and its characters extremely emotive and well designed (non human types especially)
brochiller
Member
Man people who don't want to play this game because it's "ugly" blow my mind.
I agree, for me the art style is king and while the textures are rough and the wild is a bit sparse, the game looks incredible and I can't wait to play it. Without a doubt, this is the best looking LoZ we have ever seen.
Opus Angelorum
Member
The texture filtering is really poor, the part he runs over the bridge you can see the texture resolving literally right in front.
Palette Swap
Member
In that case, good luck with a 330 handheld.
yeah.. about that..
Edit: hmmm too small. Here's a video of 2005's Kameo . Draw your own conclusions..
ViewtifulJC
Banned
Here comes the Cameo (2005) pictures
Milly Osworth
Member
Why is Zelda so bright? It feels like I need to wear sunglasses to play it.
MisterR
Member
Nintendo says it's their new home console. So it will be compared with other home consoles. If you have a problem with it, then take it up with Nintendo.
icecold1983
Member
its always like this with nintendo and its die hard fanbase
ratchet and clank executes on that properly
Dictator93
Member
^^ yeah I am not sure if I even find the graphical execution of this "simple geo and simple bright colours" to be super effective in BotW. I think the bloom may be a bit too intense for the lack of inner-surface detail present on most things. So any surface seems to bloom out and give the appearance of being even less detailed.
BigTnaples
Todd Howard's Secret GAF Account
Wait. Was this an attempt to make a case that the game doesn't have terrible graphics?
I hope not.
The game looks at home in 2006. That said, we all knew that going in. Hopefully the game itself is great.
Damn...is Switch even on the same level of a 360? Right now I cant even imagine Switch displaying something like Perfect Dark's textures
High quality AF is not requiring high RAM amount, it is requiring high bandwidth to RAM. And Switch does not have large data pipe between core SoC and RAM.
That horse's legs look kinda stumpy.
When even PS4 games (inexplicably) have suffered from a lack of AF, I really wouldn't expect that to be a given on the Switch.
DirgeExtinction
Member
Graphically, it's a bit dated. Artistically, it's very nice.
It is understandable that Nintendo supporters want to defend the console, mainly with the point that it's a handheld first and a home console second but the truth is Nintendo stopped caring about high specs a long time ago, i believe the success of the underwhelming Wii make them believe you don't need a powerful console to succeed and that led to the failure of the Wii U and most likely the switch will fail as well, Nintendo IMO has probably the strongest and most recognizable IP of any company in the world, everyone knows who's mario but your own games alone will not sustain your console, i for one lost hope after owning a Wii U, the first party titles were awesome but no third party support meant the console was left unused for months and there's a huge probability the switch will suffer the same fate of third parties not caring, if you have the money, don't care much about low specs console and everything that entails and are okay knowing there's a chance big AAA third party games won't be on the console than go for it, zelda at least looks spectacular from the gameplay department to be honest