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Fallout 4 Officially Revealed for PC, Xbox One, PS4 [Reddit Rumor = Ban]

D

DudeWithNoName

Member
Krakn3Dfx said:
Looking forward to
PrkDYv4.png
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HFS I almost choked on my afternoon coffee.
 
P

Ponn

Banned
JetBlackPanda said:
so they can megaton us with the release date at E3.
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Well, I mean people kinda already knew it was coming but they could have hit us with a bigger "Oh shit!" factor of the full game reveal and release date at their presser. Do they have something else they are dropping on us now? Seems like a bit of a hole to fill. Diehard fans who were going to pay attention anyways will still now but I doubt people will tune in just for a release date.
 
Ooccoo

Ooccoo

Member
The E3 walkthrough will be very interesting because that trailer was nothing special at all. Hopefully the game has deep RPG elements with a living world, real consequences and good gameplay. Unfortunately I'm pretty sure Cyberpunk from RED will shit on Fallout4 once it's released (probably in 2017+).
 
K

KatamariOnTheRocks

Member
El Topo said:
There's valid criticism or commentary and then there's "This game looks worse than San Andreas".
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Absolutely, I totally agree.

I personally believe the assets to look around late-gen 360/ps3 games ( TLOU was on PS3, not that I'm saying every game can achieve those exact visuals, just that the hardware ran it)

That are touched up and higher resolution and though I gave a more detailed explanation in my previous posts, I think saying it looks like anything older than 360/ps3 is hyperbole.

The example I used in my explanation was that it looks like when 360/ps3 games get ported to PC without any additional features one would expect on PC resulting in more or less the same visual fidelity but simply a higher resolution.
 
E

Etnos

Banned
KatamariOnTheRocks said:
My insinuation was not that an open world game can achieve the same graphics as those more linear experiences. It was that a higher level of graphical fidelity is expected across the board when it's been proven possible on this Gen of hardware.

I wouldn't expect this fallout to look like the order or TLOU remastered, but I certainly expect it to look better than a 360/ps3 game, which it does not.

Is your problem with the fact that I have standards and expect improvements between games made by the same dev?
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paulgandersman said:
Am I the only one not impressed by this trailer? The graphics.... don't look good (some of the wide shots in the middle look decent). But overall this looks like a PS3/360 game to me....
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Zoned said:
Mam the graphics look like 2011 ps3/Xbox 360 level
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Man I just red this wonderful story in a book, but there were no graphics!, I'm totally incapable of immerse myself in a world without next-genz graphicz, I'm imagination disable, lack of visual fidelity offends me!
 
K

Kallor

Member
If it was coming in 2015 they would have wanted to put that in the trailer. Far more people are gonna see that trailer than the conference..

Anyway it looks good. Nothing crazy, but modders will take most of the Beth out of the game within a year. I'm sure it'll be fun when it comes out too though.
 
stufte

stufte

Member
KatamariOnTheRocks said:
It must be pretty great to be a dev and have people willing to apologize and make up excuses for you all for free.

Valid criticisms are valid especially when the expectation is that a AAA title will have comparable graphics to other AAA titles released in the same time period.

I don't think anyone should shit all over a game or someone that made the game, but to be exempt from valid criticism is simply unreasonable.
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You have no idea what you're talking about. You talk like all devs hang out and share secrets about what they're doing and compare notes. "Why doesn't this game made in secret by one developer match up to this other game made in secret by this other developer? It's so stupid!"

:\
 
E

ekim

Member
Some thoughts on the matter:
Aliasing is really bad for some reason - what if this is actual console footage? It wouldn't suddenly be a "fake trailer" if they added some more AA to it.
 
S

Summer Haze

Banned
Croatoan said:
You do realize there are performance tradeoffs right? Look up draw calls in relation to performance.

A Bethesda game has a massive amount of draw calls because almost every object is dynamic (meaning it is not baked into the environment thus saving draw calls).

Every single mesh that can be moved is a draw call and if they don't use texture atlasing then you can say that every single mesh is 2 draw calls (mesh and material). But wait then you have to add shadows which, depending on the method can add at least 1 more draw call.

So lets say they use texture atlasing for all the small objects. That still means that there are at least 2 draw calls per movable object. Remember that just about everything in the game can be moved (everything that isn't is likely batched into one big mesh to save on draw calls when possible).

Walk into a house in FO:NV and you might find 50 objects you can mess with. Thats at bare minimum 100 but more than likely closer to 200 draw calls, then you have to take into account the draw calls the house itself and all the non movable objects that are not batched. The UI itself is probable 3 or more draw calls.

Beyond that you also have the character and weapon (likely 10 draw calls) and any enemies which would be 4-10 draw calls each. Add into that the draw calls from outside the house which depending on LOD distance can balloon out into 2000+ easy if there is grass and trees.

Culling can help with some of the draw calls but it has its own performance cost.

Now with all of this we still haven't gotten to post processing, Textures sizes, AI, scripting, physics (Beth games have dynamic physics which eats the CPU like nothing), and the lighting engine.

Are there multiple lights in the house casting multiple shadows? Whelp if there are then you can go ahead and double your shadow draw calls.

Do you not see how a Beth style game balloons out into a performance nightmare?

How do other games look so good (Witcher 3)?

Well they use a hell of a lot of static assets that can be batched (combined in both mesh and texture) to vastly limit draw calls which allows them to have better "graphics". Ever notice how almost all loot in the witcher games is found in chests? Well, that is another way to limit draw calls, keeping dynamic objects off the map (lower draw calls, lower physics budget, ect).

People need to educate themselves on how games are made before they start frothing at the mouth over OMG bad graphics. Not every game has the same base, or even the same goals.
Click to expand...

post-23187-Dwayne-The-Rock-Johnson-Clappi-UqCk.gif
 
E

Extra Sauce

Member
As a PS4 guy for whom a smooth framerate is the priority when it comes to graphics... if Fallout 4 can achieve that on PS4 it will already look better to me than The Witcher 3.
 
F

foxtrot3d

Banned
Bethesda just shot themselves in the foot.

I don't know how much the rest of you know about PC gaming culture (I'm an expert), but graphics and 60 fps are huge parts of it. It's not like it is in casual land where you can become successful by releasing games at 900p/30 fps. If you screw someone over in the PC gaming world with sub-par graphics, you bring shame to yourself, and the only way to get rid of that shame is repentance.

What this means is that the PC gaming community, after hearing about this, is not going to want to purchase Fallout 4, nor will they purchase any of Bethesda's games. This is HUGE. You can laugh all you want, but Bethesda has alienated an entire market with this move.

Bethesda, publicly apologize and cancel Fallout 4 and TES: VI for the PC or you can kiss your business goodbye.
 
S

Sande

Member
Codiox said:
ugh....i cant even imagine how "good" the downgrade will look....

still super hyped for this, but come on, not this fucking engine again. the one with the creepy zoomed in textbox conversations.

175.jpg
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That has nothing to do with the engine. They already changed the conversation system with Skyrim anyway.

And the funny thing when games look reasonable from the get-go is that it probably won't need a downgrade.
 
O

On Demand

Banned
Croatoan said:
You do realize there are performance tradeoffs right? Look up draw calls in relation to performance.

A Bethesda game has a massive amount of draw calls because almost every object is dynamic (meaning it is not baked into the environment thus saving draw calls).

Every single mesh that can be moved is a draw call and if they don't use texture atlasing then you can say that every single mesh is 2 draw calls (mesh and material). But wait then you have to add shadows which, depending on the method can add at least 1 more draw call.

So lets say they use texture atlasing for all the small objects. That still means that there are at least 2 draw calls per movable object. Remember that just about everything in the game can be moved (everything that isn't is likely batched into one big mesh to save on draw calls when possible).

Walk into a house in FO:NV and you might find 50 objects you can mess with. Thats at bare minimum 100 but more than likely closer to 200 draw calls, then you have to take into account the draw calls the house itself and all the non movable objects that are not batched. The UI itself is probable 3 or more draw calls.

Beyond that you also have the character and weapon (likely 10 draw calls) and any enemies which would be 4-10 draw calls each. Add into that the draw calls from outside the house which depending on LOD distance can balloon out into 2000+ easy if there is grass and trees.

Culling can help with some of the draw calls but it has its own performance cost.

Now with all of this we still haven't gotten to post processing, Textures sizes, AI, scripting, physics (Beth games have dynamic physics which eats the CPU like nothing), and the lighting engine.

Are there multiple lights in the house casting multiple shadows? Whelp if there are then you can go ahead and double your shadow draw calls.

Do you not see how a Beth style game balloons out into a performance nightmare?

How do other games look so good (Witcher 3)?

Well they use a hell of a lot of static assets that can be batched (combined in both mesh and texture) to vastly limit draw calls which allows them to have better "graphics". Ever notice how almost all loot in the witcher games is found in chests? Well, that is another way to limit draw calls, keeping dynamic objects off the map (lower draw calls, lower physics budget, ect).

People need to educate themselves on how games are made before they start frothing at the mouth over OMG bad graphics. Not every game has the same base, or even the same goals.
Click to expand...


Thank you for this post. People comparing Fallout to The Witcher and other games have no idea how differently designed these games are.
 
eot

eot

Banned
The animations stood out to me more than the quality of the rendering. When half your trailer is a close up of a dog you might want to make sure it animates better than something out of a Raven idTech 3 game.
 
X

Xiraiya

Member
RustedPieces said:
Just watched the trailer again, you complainers need to as well.
Looks really good to me.
Click to expand...
Yeah, looks like it'll be just fine to play, but it still looks like a game from 2012, I'll probably enjoy it just fine, but realistically it is what it is.

eot said:
The animations stood out to me more than the quality of the rendering. When half your trailer is a close up of a dog you might want to make sure it animates better than something out of a Raven idTech 3 game.
Click to expand...
That was probably the weirdest thing to me, I mean I'm pretty sure the Dog in fallout 3 is animated the exact same way.

It was no D.D.
 
G

GreatestHits

Member
foxtrot3d said:
Bethesda just shot themselves in the foot..
Click to expand...

I'm pretty sure they're going to clean house, blow up metacritic, etc..

-duskdoll- said:
Am i the only one who likes the engine in Fallout 3 and NV? I can't picture a Fallout game without it...
Click to expand...

It is by far my favorite engine. I miss the days when you could make your house in any cave any place you want to. I hate that they have to do cleanup of lots of locations. I love making my 'house' in odd locations
 
Z

Zimbardo

Member
i thought the trailer looked pretty good. should be a great game anyway.

just curious ...is the game using ID Tech 5? (used in the game RAGE)? some of the scenes reminded me of RAGE ...so i was just wondering.
 
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