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[ShadowkillXNA]

I think that one reason why some people arent that impressed by this gen so far is because graphic improvements from last gen to current gen arent really obvious in screenshots but only in motion. Things like better anti-aliasing, steady framerates and less screen tearing are things that you cant see in screenshots.

 

[tazz3]

Waite for a price drop to get a xbone 1.ps4 is awesome

 

[turcy]

Unreal and quake called. They'd like credit for their style being rediscovered.

as an avid q1/q2/q3/unreal/unreal2/ut2003/ut2004 player... please explain?

 

[Y2Kev]

I'm embarrassed at the number of people agreeing with that fever-dreamish rant post by Coffeeling. The nodding and back-patting at someone complaining about "Antichrist David Cage" because he wants "games" is some kind of "old mad yells at cloud" insanity. Cage is on record as saying he wants games to be developed for everyone and satisfy all tastes; Cage says he wants games to be open to all themes and genres and that the purchasing behavior of the consumer are paramount in determining where games go as a medium.

But whatever, by all means open your anus and release directly onto the internet so that you feel better about how things have gone down the drain.

“If they don’t like games that are story-driven, that are more meaningful, different, that maybe don’t just provide adrenaline, fair enough. All I’m saying is that there should be games for every taste.”

What an Antichrist. Childish, exclusive ranting that the market is rewarding by eliminating its objects of affection and adoration. Seriously, grow up. The blue ocean is great except for when somebody wants to make something you don't like. Then that person is the antichrist.

 

[butman]

You don't see a difference between this

and this?

And we're only 5 months into this gen. And the above is an open world game made by a 100ish-man team.

Retaking this pics. This is just like seeing this comparaisson:

It just the same like the Infamous shots. Not a big leap, but nicer graphics.

Now from this:

To THIS.

That's was HUGE. And it will never happen again.

I'm not impressed either with this gen. It's clear that its just more a nicer version of past games thanks of by a improvement on lighting, textures size, facial capture, fps and resolution until we get to the "real life" graphics.

 

[StevieP]

I'm embarrassed at the number of people agreeing with that fever-dreamish rant post by Coffeeling. The nodding and back-patting at someone complaining about "Antichrist David Cage" because he wants "games" is some kind of "old mad yells at cloud" insanity. Cage is on record as saying he wants games to be developed for everyone and satisfy all tastes; Cage says he wants games to be open to all themes and genres and that the purchasing behavior of the consumer are paramount in determining where games go as a medium.

But whatever, by all means open your anus and release directly onto the internet so that you feel better about how things have gone down the drain.

“If they don’t like games that are story-driven, that are more meaningful, different, that maybe don’t just provide adrenaline, fair enough. All I’m saying is that there should be games for every taste.”

What an Antichrist. Childish, exclusive ranting that the market is rewarding by eliminating its objects of affection and adoration. Seriously, grow up.

The David cage thing is personal opinion on coffeling's part.

What isn't an opinion and what is correct is that gaming on the whole is far more impressive when boundaries are being pushed in some fashion rather than the complacency we have now for the most part.

Edit: and further, when gaming is more insular I tend to find that it becomes more homogenous as well, hence why market expansion is pretty important. Contrary to the below poster, more polygons (or expansive cutscenes) are obviously not required to provide quality experiences. Where I think David cage came into it is that mechanics and their improvements represent the core of gaming to many, and to which most outside the core look for

 

[botty]

I'm not impressed either. The only next gen experience I've seen so far is The Wonderful 101.

Yeah, The Wonderful 101 polygons is the premiere next gen experience.

No one will be impressed by next gen until Final Fantasy XV.

 

[Y2Kev]

The David cage thing is personal opinion on coffeling's part.

What isn't an opinion and what is correct is that gaming on the whole is far more impressive when boundaries are being pushed in some fashion rather than the complacency we have now for the most part.

Edit: and further, when gaming is more insular I tend to find that it becomes more homogenous as well, hence why market expansion is pretty important. Contrary to the below poster, more polygons (or expansive cutscenes) are obviously not required to provide quality experiences.

I agree. So gaming should be more inclusive, including the games David Cage wants to make. The two opinions ("gaming should be more inclusive" and "David Cage is the antichrist because he wants to make things I don't consider games") are not compatible.

 

[orborborb]

the only game that wouldn't be just as fun on previous consoles so far is Nintendoland

 

[LightofRohan]

Expecting immense graphic innovations, gameplay innovations and player experience innovations in the first 6 months of a console's launch... let's relax a bit here...

But also you must ask, isn't this the most jaded gamer community generation? I'm pretty sure very little will impress the gaf community anymore that is actually reasonable.

Before people were impressed when you'd see less pixels when getting close to a wall texture, now everyone wants photo-real fidelity while having incredibly different and interesting gameplay.

 

[Gorillaz]

Shit just came out and we are already disappointed.

The gen is still new to the point people are still calling it next gen instead of current. Give it time yall

 

[grumble]

Honestly aside from the graphics the games appear to be very similar to titles from the ps3 gen. Nicer graphics are fun but they won't keep people engaged. You need better gameplay and new experiences. The only one really trying this is ubisoft with their online titles like the division, as far as I can tell. If anything cost will make it less likely to have innovative games that could flop.

 

[Coffeeling]

I agree. So gaming should be more inclusive, including the games David Cage wants to make. The two opinions ("gaming should be more inclusive" and "David Cage is the antichrist because he wants to make things I don't consider games") are not compatible.

I don't have a problem with Cage making the kind of stuff Cage makes. Advocating that games essentially stop being games as we know them (as he does in the speech you linked)? That I have a problem with. Dissociating a certain sense of physicality from the games, a constant undertone of "game needs to talk talk talk talk", etc. Advocating for that to become the standard, as if it's some elevated form of... uh, digital entertainment?
No thanks.

Furthermore, to people getting upset about the Cage remark, you especially:

A bunch of my friends jokingly call him David "Antichrist" Cage because of that. We don't want Heavy Rain. We want games.

There is no vitriol in that. We just found it amusing that Cage would want games to become even more not-games in an age where they're more and more not-games in the sense we understood the term.

Expecting immense graphic innovations, gameplay innovations and player experience innovations in the first 6 months of a console's launch... let's relax a bit here...

But also you must ask, isn't this the most jaded gamer community generation? I'm pretty sure very little will impress the gaf community anymore that is actually reasonable.

Before people were impressed when you'd see less pixels when getting close to a wall texture, now everyone wants photo-real fidelity while having incredibly different and interesting gameplay.

I'd settle for games finally managing to make stone that doesn't look like plastic again. It's pretty sad when SD Wii games have more stone-looking stone than 360/PS3/xbone/PS4/PC. I mean, the lo-fi texture looks obviously fake, but the stone in games like Xenoblade and Conduit brings to my mind stone. Dark Souls and all the military shooters and Planetsides and Skyrims? I just see plastic, painted to look like stone.

 

[Niteandgrey]

I finally played Second Son for the first time yesterday, which DF said was the best looking game on any platform in their technical article, and I thought I would finally come away really impressed.

I understand being underwhelmed a bit, especially so early on with this new generation. But I have to say, if you're not impressed with Second Son, you might be a bit jaded.

 

[Yagharek]

It applies to NES/Gameboy and Wii/DS both. SNES was actually a decline in many ways, because games started becoming more complex and abandoning the simpler low market games that bring new people into the hobby. SNES is when controllers started turning into monsters and parents started to stop playing. In many ways, NES/GB and Wii/DS are the same. You can literally go through Usenet news posts and find the exact same dismissals 360/PS3 fanboys threw at the Wii directed at the NES by people who played 16-bit computers. I mean, the damn thing literally used a processor from the last decade

I'm not saying Nintendo had a clearer vision with the Wii than now or during SNES/N64/GC, though that is certainly true. What I'm saying is that Nintendo has done a near-complete 180 on the values that gave us the Wii and the DS. Maybe they got complacent, I don't know. All I know is that they don't feel sane anymore like they did back in the Wii/DS days.

OK in that case, I understand your point completely. Good job.

 

[brutes]

It's not so obvious anymore because everything is so advanced.
Back in the old days obviously you could tell the huge difference in graphical leaps, but nowadays you cannot.

 

[jsnepo]

I agree with the title at least. Maybe because the old gen is still pumping out great looking games.

 

[-PXG-]

This gen just started though...

However, we are kinda seeing diminishing returns. Plus, I don't think we will ever see another leap as significant as the one made from 2D to 3D. Mario 64 blew my mind as a kid. Could that feeling and amazement be replicated and done again now? Doubt it.

 

[Chinner]

I agree. So gaming should be more inclusive, including the games David Cage wants to make. The two opinions ("gaming should be more inclusive" and "David Cage is the antichrist because he wants to make things I don't consider games") are not compatible.

heh, some of my friends and i joke about hideo kojima. he has openly admitted that he wants videogames to be like films. thats why we jokingly call him hideo ' PRESIDENT OBAMA' kojima.

 

[elcapitan]

I'm embarrassed at the number of people agreeing with that fever-dreamish rant post by Coffeeling. The nodding and back-patting at someone complaining about "Antichrist David Cage" because he wants "games" is some kind of "old mad yells at cloud" insanity.

I thought I was the only one. My main takeaway from David Cage is that games can be more than games. The idea that games should only be games is limiting. If someone wants to do more with it as a medium, then let them. In today's climate, gaming has never been more diverse. There's something for everyone.

As for the topic, the best time to define a generation is its end. When all's said and done, I think this generation will be looked on quite fondly. Current software has only scratched the surface of what these machines are capable of.

 

[dragonbane]

I don't have a problem with Cage making the kind of stuff Cage makes. Advocating that games essentially stop being games as we know them (as he does in the speech you linked)? That I have a problem with. Dissociating a certain sense of physicality from the games, a constant undertone of "game needs to talk talk talk talk", etc. Advocating for that to become the standard, as if it's some elevated form of... uh, digital entertainment?
No thanks.

Not sure how you can take this away from: "All I’m saying is that there should be games for every taste."

He advocates for his colleagues to try different things. Not abandoning existing genres or doing exactly what he does. Also you said "We don't want Heavy Rain, we want games" implying you do have a problem with the kind of stuff Cage makes. Also rather objectively speaking, this point makes zero sense, as Heavy Rain is a game by every known standard. His games are derivative of the point and click adventure genre. I'm sure you are familiar with some of the classics and the stuff Telltale still makes. That's essentially the basis of his games. It's an established genre. Which pretty much brings us to the result that you don't like a sub-genre of games, which is perfectly fine. I don't like every genre either.

 

[Yagharek]

I'm embarrassed at the number of people agreeing with that fever-dreamish rant post by Coffeeling. The nodding and back-patting at someone complaining about "Antichrist David Cage" because he wants "games" is some kind of "old mad yells at cloud" insanity. Cage is on record as saying he wants games to be developed for everyone and satisfy all tastes; Cage says he wants games to be open to all themes and genres and that the purchasing behavior of the consumer are paramount in determining where games go as a medium.

But whatever, by all means open your anus and release directly onto the internet so that you feel better about how things have gone down the drain.

“If they don’t like games that are story-driven, that are more meaningful, different, that maybe don’t just provide adrenaline, fair enough. All I’m saying is that there should be games for every taste.”

What an Antichrist. Childish, exclusive ranting that the market is rewarding by eliminating its objects of affection and adoration. Seriously, grow up. The blue ocean is great except for when somebody wants to make something you don't like. Then that person is the antichrist.

I dont think a throwaway comment about David Cage invalidates the general points of his post.

The greater point I took away was that gaming as it is now has a lot of barriers between demographics, and that a lot of the current high end of the market is hostile (or at least unwelcoming and inaccessible) to newcomers. In my experience, when I have shown friends games like Heavy Rain, or semi-serious blockbuster stuff like your Halos or Gears of War, their eyes roll when it gets to story bits. It's just not usually written well, and in games where story is billed as being important, this is a significant miss on the part of the developer.

Conversely, the same people will mention how they used to play games when they were like Pac Man or Space Invaders and then stopped when they became too complicated.

The over-arching point I got from coffeeling's post was that the industry has to a great extent, collectively forgotten this is how it grew so quickly in the first place, not that David Cage was a bad thing (as an aside, I think it's good we can see more diverse ideas from people like that. I don't think he's the Antichrist even though I'm not too fond of his games due to non sequitur story development, but that's another issue).

I hope you dont consider this to be a case of childish, exclusive ranting. I think you focussed far too much on one comment and missed the bigger picture.

 

[Coffeeling]

Not sure how you can take this away from: "All I’m saying is that there should be games for every taste."

He advocates for his colleagues to try different things. Not abandoning existing genres or doing exactly what he does. Also you said "We don't want Heavy Rain, we want games" implying you do have a problem with the kind of stuff Cage makes. Also rather objectively speaking, this point makes zero sense, as Heavy Rain is a game by every known standard. His games are derivative of the point and click adventure genre. I'm sure you are familiar with some of the classics and the stuff Telltale still makes. That's essentially the basis of his games. It's an established genre. Which pretty much brings us to the result that you don't like a sub-genre of games, which is perfectly fine. I don't like every genre either.

He clearly seems to think that games that are just games should move more to the background, when by rights they should be at the forefront. Basically, it's the same problem as now: I don't have an issue with people making AAA QTE things with movie-like presentation. There is clearly a market for them. What I am against is them being the foundation of the industry because everything I've seen within the last 8-9 years points to them being an unhealthy foundation.

I also take issue with the "more than a game" rhetoric because it implies the simple action born in the arcades is somehow inferior. Yet what speaks more to the human condition than a tool for having pure, blissful fun? What is wrong with being "just a game"?

To put it in different words, Cage and the industry don't seem to know their place. Their products are distinctly upmarket It's like an audiophile disparaging cheap, easy to use speakers because they would get more out of their music with a studio setup and a 100-band EQ. When I lambast such an idea it is not because I think no hi-fi equipment should be made, but that the hi-fi proponents understand reality. That reality is that their products are niche.

I'm an MTG player. Within the last six years or so, Wizards has dramatically simplified the game in certain ways, like taking away drawbacks from most cards. As a result, it is booming, more popular than ever. However, their changes have taken something I enjoy from the game (I entered during one of the most complicated sets of all time with complex boardstates). I'm basically not the target audience anymore. Some cry that the game is being dumbed down, and that is kind of true. I'm also disappointed that I'm no longer the target audience probably. But I understand that you need to bring in new players or the game will die. My solution, for now, is to explore other games like Android:Netrunner that seems to have a dev team shooting closer to the level of card complexity and design philosophy I enjoy.

Or take Atlus. They understand their products are niche, so they act like it. Small print runs that can be sold out, collectors' editions their dedicated fans love to bits, not-astronomical development budgets and so on. They don't aggrandize that their way should be The Way. They know they won't get grandma, but they know they get someone, and focus on ensuring that someone is a happy customer.

 

[Chinner]

You come across as a disillusioned Nintendo fan. A really dismissive point of view, where indie games are all 'pretentious' and games are dismissed if they don't match your strict definition.

I like the broad interpretation of gaming, as opposed to mascot obsessed performers.

 

[Yagharek]

You come across as a disillusioned Nintendo fan. A really dismissive point of view, where indie games are all 'pretentious' and games are dismissed if they don't match your strict definition.

I like the broad interpretation of gaming, as opposed to mascot obsessed performers.

This itself is an unreasonably dismissive post.

 

[ymmv]

This itself is an unreasonably dismissive post.

I thought his comment was right on the mark.

 

[CadetMahoney]

I finally played Second Son for the first time yesterday, which DF said was the best looking game on any platform in their technical article, and I thought I would finally come away really impressed.

But no, I was not impressed, like at all.

c'mon now, anyone could see that was pure hyperbole just by looking at the game in motion. Still, this gen is underwhelming, especially considering when you compare things side by side to what PC will be doing in a years time.

 

[BigSpleenRupture]

Lol no. This is the smallest jump ever in generational power. Of course the op isn't impressed. It will get better, but you're not going to ever be overwhelmed. Consoles Should have stayed in last gen a few more years so the hardware could improve.

Total garbage and nonsense.

 

[Hello.]

Retaking this pics. This is just like seeing this comparaisson:

It just the same like the Infamous shots. Not a big leap, but nicer graphics.

Now from this:

To THIS.

That's was HUGE. And it will never happen again.

I'm not impressed either with this gen. It's clear that its just more a nicer version of past games thanks of by a improvement on lighting, textures size, facial capture, fps and resolution until we get to the "real life" graphics.

It looks like someone finally gets it.

Yeah, this generation is pretty boring. Every console is full of the same garbage and rehashed ports (Wii U has some of its own original games though) but still.

 

[Psycho_Mantis]

I'm embarrassed at the number of people agreeing with that fever-dreamish rant post by Coffeeling. The nodding and back-patting at someone complaining about "Antichrist David Cage" because he wants "games" is some kind of "old mad yells at cloud" insanity. Cage is on record as saying he wants games to be developed for everyone and satisfy all tastes; Cage says he wants games to be open to all themes and genres and that the purchasing behavior of the consumer are paramount in determining where games go as a medium.

But whatever, by all means open your anus and release directly onto the internet so that you feel better about how things have gone down the drain.

“If they don’t like games that are story-driven, that are more meaningful, different, that maybe don’t just provide adrenaline, fair enough. All I’m saying is that there should be games for every taste.”

What an Antichrist. Childish, exclusive ranting that the market is rewarding by eliminating its objects of affection and adoration. Seriously, grow up. The blue ocean is great except for when somebody wants to make something you don't like. Then that person is the antichrist.

Thank you. Someone had to say it for that frankly embarrassing remark.

As much as it pains you to admit, Heavy Rain and B2S are both video games; video games that millions of people actually like. There should be no prerequisite in what a video game should entail just because of the past or from a personal preference.

 

[jimi_dini]

The two opinions ... "David Cage is the antichrist because he wants to make things I don't consider games") are not compatible.

That's not an opinion. It's just plain wrong. Heavy Rain is a game. The King's Quest adventure games were also games.

I'm embarrassed at the number of people agreeing with that fever-dreamish rant post by Coffeeling. The nodding and back-patting at someone complaining about "Antichrist David Cage" because he wants "games" is some kind of "old mad yells at cloud" insanity. Cage is on record as saying he wants games to be developed for everyone and satisfy all tastes

.

 

[Melchiah]

I'm embarrassed at the number of people agreeing with that fever-dreamish rant post by Coffeeling. The nodding and back-patting at someone complaining about "Antichrist David Cage" because he wants "games" is some kind of "old mad yells at cloud" insanity. Cage is on record as saying he wants games to be developed for everyone and satisfy all tastes; Cage says he wants games to be open to all themes and genres and that the purchasing behavior of the consumer are paramount in determining where games go as a medium.

But whatever, by all means open your anus and release directly onto the internet so that you feel better about how things have gone down the drain.

“If they don’t like games that are story-driven, that are more meaningful, different, that maybe don’t just provide adrenaline, fair enough. All I’m saying is that there should be games for every taste.”

What an Antichrist. Childish, exclusive ranting that the market is rewarding by eliminating its objects of affection and adoration. Seriously, grow up. The blue ocean is great except for when somebody wants to make something you don't like. Then that person is the antichrist.

You come across as a disillusioned Nintendo fan. A really dismissive point of view, where indie games are all 'pretentious' and games are dismissed if they don't match your strict definition.

I like the broad interpretation of gaming, as opposed to mascot obsessed performers.

I couldn't agree more.

In my experience, when I have shown friends games like Heavy Rain, or semi-serious blockbuster stuff like your Halos or Gears of War, their eyes roll when it gets to story bits. It's just not usually written well, and in games where story is billed as being important, this is a significant miss on the part of the developer.

Conversely, the same people will mention how they used to play games when they were like Pac Man or Space Invaders and then stopped when they became too complicated.

The over-arching point I got from coffeeling's post was that the industry has to a great extent, collectively forgotten this is how it grew so quickly in the first place, not that David Cage was a bad thing (as an aside, I think it's good we can see more diverse ideas from people like that. I don't think he's the Antichrist even though I'm not too fond of his games due to non sequitur story development, but that's another issue).

I wouldn't take something like Gears of War as a good example of well-written story, whereas the likes of Shadow of Memories, Silent Hill 2, Journey and The Last of Us are hardly going to be met with rolling eyes. I wouldn't be surprised if all of those would fall into the non-game category, if we asked Coffeeling's opinion.

As for games getting too complicated for the larger market, it's odd that the userbase increased tremendously on the PS1 and PS2 eras, eventhough the games got more complicated, and story-driven.

I'd settle for games finally managing to make stone that doesn't look like plastic again. It's pretty sad when SD Wii games have more stone-looking stone than 360/PS3/xbone/PS4/PC. I mean, the lo-fi texture looks obviously fake, but the stone in games like Xenoblade and Conduit brings to my mind stone. Dark Souls and all the military shooters and Planetsides and Skyrims? I just see plastic, painted to look like stone.

Here's a couple of captures of rocks found in Killzone: Shadow Fall from the screenshot thread.

It's pretty odd to suggest that the environments on Wii games looked more realistic than on any other system, PC included. Perhaps you should take off those Nintendo glasses, that distort the view.

 

[Roland Deschain]

That Mario comparison on this page is how I feel about it. It's still early of course but I think I'll be good for a couple more years with my PS3 and 360.

 

[BigDaddyFatSack]

Retaking this pics. This is just like seeing this comparaisson:

It just the same like the Infamous shots. Not a big leap, but nicer graphics.

Now from this:

To THIS.

That's was HUGE. And it will never happen again.

I'm not impressed either with this gen. It's clear that its just more a nicer version of past games thanks of by a improvement on lighting, textures size, facial capture, fps and resolution until we get to the "real life" graphics.

2D -> 3D transition was huge yes. So is the 3D -> Virtual Reality with stereoscopic 3D

Blew my mind the first time I tried Oculus Rift. Holy ***.

I strongly recommend all of you to try the Dev Kit 2 if you guys are fortunate enough to get your hands on one.

 

[Melchiah]

2D -> 3D transition was huge yes. So is the 3D -> Virtual Reality with stereoscopic 3D

Blew my mind the first time I tried Oculus Rift. Holy ***.

I strongly recommend all of you to try the Dev Kit 2 if you guys are fortunate enough to get your hands on one.

I wish I could have tried them at the local gaming expo last year, but there was only one unit, and the line was about 20 meters long. =/

 

[Coffeeling]

You come across as a disillusioned Nintendo fan. A really dismissive point of view, where indie games are all 'pretentious' and games are dismissed if they don't match your strict definition.

I like the broad interpretation of gaming, as opposed to mascot obsessed performers.

This itself is an unreasonably dismissive post.

Half of it is still true, though - I am a disillusioned Nintendo fan among other things.

This, though:

I like the broad interpretation of gaming, as opposed to mascot obsessed performers.

Is asinine bullshit. I like games that are not ashamed of being games. That are unpretentious and don't feel an obsessive need to be something else. The 2D platformer is one example, but nowhere near the only one.

I wouldn't take something like Gears of War as a good example of well-written story, whereas the likes of Shadow of Memories, Silent Hill 2, Journey and The Last of Us are hardly going to be met with rolling eyes. I wouldn't be surprised if all of those would fall into the non-game category, if we asked Coffeeling's opinion.

As for games getting too complicated for the larger market, it's odd that the userbase increased tremendously on the PS1 and PS2 eras, eventhough the games got more complicated, and story-driven.

If you actually read the two big posts I wrote on page 8, you'd notice that I said past gaming growth has happened, but has happened on the back of things like population growth and multiple console ownership. The PSX/PS2 are notable in that they unified the US and Europe, so to speak. Before that, Nintendo did well in the US and Sega well in Europe. Sony caught the audience on both continents, which is why the numbers are so large.

Here's a couple of captures of rocks found in Killzone: Shadow Fall from the screenshot thread.

It's pretty odd to suggest that the environments on Wii games looked more realistic than on any other system, PC included. Perhaps you should take off those Nintendo glasses, that distort the view.

Please find where I called Wii rock textures more realistic than HD ones. I think you'll find the words "plainly fake" instead. It is not that old rock textures are more realistic than new ones, no.

But looking at them, my mind sees the suggestion that this prop in the set of the game is supposed to be rock. It is recognized for the stage prop it is, but it brings to mind rock as a first association.
With most HD textures, the suggestion my mind sees is "this is plastic" first. It's something about how they are done. I don't know why, but that's how it is.

 

[Celine]

Retaking this pics. This is just like seeing this comparaisson:

It just the same like the Infamous shots. Not a big leap, but nicer graphics.

Transition between NES->SNES was a big leap which was visible even from the launch games:

Battle of Olympus

Act Raiser

3D Hot Rally

F-Zero

EDIT:

As for games getting too complicated for the larger market, it's odd that the userbase increased tremendously on the PS1 and PS2 eras, eventhough the games got more complicated, and story-driven.

A big part in the increase between NES -> PS1 was due to Europe embracing finally the console.
Before PS1, most european gamers played on dedicated home computers like ZX Spectrum, C64, Atari ST and Amiga.

 

[scoobidoo112]

Diminishing returns.....there is nothing wrong with you OP, as we go from generation to generation the differences will be smaller and smaller.

 

[Kaswa101]

Are people forgetting what games looked like at the start of last-gen? Why is everyone comparing games at the start of the current gen to games at the end of the last one? Wtf?

Give it a few years, OP. When we reach the end of this gen, you'll undoubtedly see the difference.

 

[Melchiah]

If you actually read the two big posts I wrote on page 8, you'd notice that I said past gaming growth has happened, but has happened on the back of things like population growth and multiple console ownership. The PSX/PS2 are notable in that they unified the US and Europe, so to speak. Before that, Nintendo did well in the US and Sega well in Europe. Sony caught the audience on both continents, which is why the numbers are so large.

The overall userbase per gen according to the image:
NES/SMS - 77 million
SNES/Gen - 84m
PS1/N64/Sat - 144m
PS2/GC/DC/XB - 210m
Wii/PS3/360 - 250m (GameTrailers pic, now +260m)

The unification of EU and NA don't explain the growth alone. Sony's marketing and the games available on the PS1/2, that were directed to young adults, attracted new gamers, and those who used to play on C64 and Amiga prior to that. The latter goes especially for Europe, where those platforms had a sizeable userbase.

As for Wii opening the industry for the blue ocean of casual customers, there really isn't that much of a difference between the last two gens, that it would warrant such a claim. Especially as PS3 and 360 make 160 million of the overall userbase, with Wii being left with 100 million, which is 2 millions less than the PS1 had. On that basis, you might say the casual market shrunk from the PS2 days.

Please find where I called Wii rock textures more realistic than HD ones. I think you'll find the words "plainly fake" instead. It is not that old rock textures are more realistic than new ones, no.

But looking at them, my mind sees the suggestion that this prop in the set of the game is supposed to be rock. It is recognized for the stage prop it is, but it brings to mind rock as a first association.
With most HD textures, the suggestion my mind sees is "this is plastic" first. It's something about how they are done. I don't know why, but that's how it is.

Well, "plainly fake" and unrealistic sound pretty much the same to me.

It also sounds to me it's more about art direction, than the textures themselves. Which is why I'd really like to see an example from Wii, which has better looking rock textures than, say, Knack.

EDIT: Missed this...

A big part in the increase between NES -> PS1 was due to Europe embracing finally the console.
Before PS1, most european gamers played on dedicated home computers like ZX Spectrum, C64, Atari ST and Amiga.

Yeah, we came to the same conclusion apparently.

 

[Yagharek]

I wouldn't take something like Gears of War as a good example of well-written story, whereas the likes of Shadow of Memories, Silent Hill 2, Journey and The Last of Us are hardly going to be met with rolling eyes. I wouldn't be surprised if all of those would fall into the non-game category, if we asked Coffeeling's opinion.

I'm not saying it was an example of a good story, more that it is framed as an important story by the game itself, the marketing, the tone. It's as if the writers come across as thinking they have made an epic (pardon the pun) story when they have made a juvenile one. (As opposed to games which have well written stories as per your examples)

 

[-PXG-]

Until we have full body, hologram-like VR, I don't think we'll have anything as significant as the jump from 2D to 3D. Oculus and Morpheus are mini steps but they aren't the full realization of what we all imagined true VR would be since we were all kids.

 

[dragonbane]

He clearly seems to think that games that are just games should move more to the background, when by rights they should be at the forefront

Well, he can think whatever he wants. That shouldn't bother you. The point is, he doesn't advocate for "games" going away or existing genres to disappear.

Or take Atlus. They understand their products are niche, so they act like it. Small print runs that can be sold out, collectors' editions their dedicated fans love to bits, not-astronomical development budgets and so on. They don't aggrandize that their way should be The Way. They know they won't get grandma, but they know they get someone, and focus on ensuring that someone is a happy customer.

That applies to his games as well. Rather modest budgets for an AAA game, decent sales, team is happy with the niche audience they have. Cage games are far from the mainstream.

Is asinine bullshit. I like games that are not ashamed of being games. That are unpretentious and don't feel an obsessive need to be something else. The 2D platformer is one example, but nowhere near the only one.

This again. His games are not ashamed of being games. They are just different and belong into the genre of point and click adventure taken to the next step. Same applies to The Walking Dead for example. There is really no point trying to dismiss them as non-games, it's simply not true. They are just in a different genre, which brings its own expectations to gameplay with them. If it's a minimal form of interaction based on story, then that's part of this genre only. It has all rights to exist.

 

[dr guildo]

It's not about how far we are from last gen, it's about how close we are to reality. That's how "diminishing returns" works actually, 'cause the main target when it comes to high level graphics, remains to make a real life's carbon copy :

Spoiler

And now compare those shots to this :

And at last, compare this to the main target aka real life :

 

[Mael]

What an Antichrist. Childish, exclusive ranting that the market is rewarding by eliminating its objects of affection and adoration. Seriously, grow up. The blue ocean is great except for when somebody wants to make something you don't like. Then that person is the antichrist.

That's actually pretty funny considering how much people here hate on anything blue ocean with a passion...

fuckton of images

At least quote your images!
And you're comparing your hd screenshots to a sd shot?
You could at least take a 2k shot of New York or something
And for the last time, diminishing return is NOT about how close we are or how far we go, it's a budget thing in the 1rst place.
There's a wiki, use it.

 

[TTUVAPOR]

I want next-gen to move on from the COD-esque copycat clone games. I'm so tired of classic franchises like Halo, Gears, and Battlefield, getting the COD treatment.

Medal of Honor re-boot was killed because of this COD-virus. Moreover, EA shuts down the studio making the MOH re-boots and blames it on sales...couldn't be the design of the game eh?

So far, the next-gen games that have released since launch of X1 and PS4 are eh...okay to say the least. There's still plenty of games I play on my Xbox 360 that I get more time and enjoyment out of.

 

[dr guildo]

That's actually pretty funny considering how much people here hate on anything blue ocean with a passion...



At least quote your images!
And you're comparing your hd screenshots to a sd shot?
You could at least take a 2k shot of New York or something
And for the last time, diminishing return is NOT about how close we are or how far we go, it's a budget thing in the 1rst place.

You could even choose 4K Infamous2 bullshot if you want, it's not only a matter of IQ, but more a matter of shaders and light. And wiki is not a source...

 

[Mael]

You could even choose 4K Infamous2 bullshot if you want, the problem is not the IQ, but the shaders. And wiki is not a source...

And yet you choose to compare that with a 640x480 pics of real life to show how close I:SS is to real life?
And while not a source, stop using terms you have no idea what it means it invalidates your opinion and shows clear ignorance.

 

[dr guildo]

And yet you choose to compare that with a 640x480 pics of real life to show how close I:SS is to real life?
And while not a source, stop using terms you have no idea what it means it invalidates your opinion and shows clear ignorance.

Errrh, are you aware that the more my ISS shots are big, the less they will look impressive and meanwhile they are bigger than that real life shot ?
For the Infamous2 shot, sorry but I took the pic that used to be shown in that thread.
And for the reality shot, I wanted to express the global mood of image (color fidelity, reflections...) and how it compares to ISS, the IQ is irrelevant in that case... And why to choose an 2K NY shot when everybody knows what real life looks like ?!

edit : oh, and why are you so angry ?

 

[lefantome]

You don't see a difference between this

and this?

And we're only 5 months into this gen. And the above is an open world game made by a 100ish-man team.

every time people forget to specify that the first Infamous came out 4 years in the old gen, not 4 months.