The story is fine (not the best ever), but it´s comparable to movies you like. Don´t watch them over and over again or they get boring. Small doses.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Max Payne 3 is a bad game [very long rant]
- Thread starter Messofanego
- Start date
The story is fine (not the best ever), but it´s comparable to movies you like. Don´t watch them over and over again or they get boring. Small doses.
Got Max Payne for Christmas and I loved it! Max Payne has probably the best gun play in any (at least 3rd person) game out there.
I also really loved the attention to detail regarding the environment and the animation. The way Max holds his two-handed gun in his hands while using his pistol is great! Also reloading while holding another gun really looks phenomenal. Normally they just stick the gun to the characters magnetic back.
I personally really loved the story the way how Max talks to himself, I can understand though how people might not. The locations you visit in the game are great as well in my opinion, the feel like actual real places and they all look just great!
Maybe getting into this game without any expectations is the best way to experience this game. I was totally blown away by it and I even finished it two times in a row which I never do with games. Considering a third time at the moment!
I also really loved the attention to detail regarding the environment and the animation. The way Max holds his two-handed gun in his hands while using his pistol is great! Also reloading while holding another gun really looks phenomenal. Normally they just stick the gun to the characters magnetic back.
I personally really loved the story the way how Max talks to himself, I can understand though how people might not. The locations you visit in the game are great as well in my opinion, the feel like actual real places and they all look just great!
Maybe getting into this game without any expectations is the best way to experience this game. I was totally blown away by it and I even finished it two times in a row which I never do with games. Considering a third time at the moment!
:O
Yeah, I hardly ever replay games but I ended up playing MP3 6 times, still not bored of the cutscenes either.
Yes it does. It's called Alan Wake.
ii Stryker
Banned
Totally agree with you OP. max Payne 3 is a boring heap of dung.
If you don't care about the story(which I didn't) the gameplay is over a decade old and it feels like it too.
If you don't care about the story(which I didn't) the gameplay is over a decade old and it feels like it too.
Maybe if you like repetitive games with bad shooting mechanics.
Well, I can't argue with the repetitive part, but the shooting mechanics are great.
I don´t know how you can call shooting mechanics where you barely need to aim good. Just watch somehow in the direction of the enemies and you get them. No hit zones, no KI, no tactics, no dynamics, only left trigger for flashlight, right trigger for shooting. Rinse and repeat.
mickcenary
Member
Apologies if this is taken out of context, but a question like that is completely missing the point. Rockstar - or anyone developer, for that matter - shouldn't be making a game that requires that much loading that frequently, UNLESS they can mask it in a way that doesn't absolutely decimate the pacing of the game. Cautiously peering over a ledge is not cutscene worthy; it is not anything worthy. It only serves to annoy the player.
I don't really now how loading stuff works, but MP looked fantastic had some big enviroments etc. it seemed like they needed them.
No it didn't. Max Payne had small linear levels that sometimes merged it into larger areas that every game and their dog has managed to do for years without that much loading.
Dick Justice
Banned
It's unlikely, but I hope the last DLC pack includes a single player survival mode, like Dead Man Walking from MP2. No cutscene bullshit, just straight up survival against impossible odds.
Nabs
Member
Yep.
They'd need to change the bullet time implementation for that to work well though.
Yeah, I agree with this.
Dick Justice
Banned
How so?
rosaceadude2112
Member
It was more Tony Scott than Michael Mann. It's like noone here's even seen one of his movies seeing how often he gets brought up where he doesn't apply.
darkistheway
Member
It's a Rockstar game, of course it sucks!
Seriously. Why do their games have such terrible controls? And weird character animations? And strange, floaty physics?
Seriously. Why do their games have such terrible controls? And weird character animations? And strange, floaty physics?
It did.
The loading might have taken too long, as I said I don't really know how it works. There is no need for the amount of criticism it gets though.
BrLvgThrChmstry
Banned
Best third person shooter I had the pleasure of playing last year.
Lord Panda
The Sea is Always Right
The loading/unskippable cutscenes nearly ruined the game for me.
Acquiescence
Member
But the controls, animations and physics in Max Payne 3 are second to none.
Disagree on every point, except Last Stand. Not being able to reload (especially if you ran dry right as you died), and having enemies go out of line of sight so you can't kill then should've been fixed in testing. Other than that the game was amazing, once I learned staying in cover got me killed and John Wooing got me success.
Even if it's true it doesn't counter my point.
Because it all works flawlessly, unlike everything in Max Payne 3.
While there is no reticle in American Nightmare, and you can shoot enemies anywhere due to the generous auto aim, in MP3 anything other than headshots is mostly usless outside of easy mode (making the off by default free aim absolutely crucial).
American Nightmare has no cover system. MP3 has a clunky cover system which often obscures your aim with vertical scenery that Max won't lean around for some reason.
American Nightmare has a variety of different enemies which require a range of tactics to deal with. Max Payne 3 has guys with guns, or guys with guns + body armor who necessitate the deep tactical use of even more head shots.
American Nightmare has a smooth as silk evade mechanic. MP3 has physics which allow Max to dive face first, like some sort of drunk Chow Yun-Fat, into every stunningly detailed obstacle littered throughout it's environments.
Alan Wake can run, and controls responsively in all situations. Max Payne can lumber, or lumber slightly faster, and generally controls like a clumsy tank.
Also, Max Payne 3 constantly makes you wait to use any of it's mechanics while it forces you to watch it's banal cutscenes. Ilkka Villi hamming it up as Mr. scratch, while awesome, is totally optional.
I'd argue that any game that arbitrarily forces you to sit through cutscenes under the false pretence of "Still loading" is worthy of scorn. The game receives hefty criticism for its unskippable loading screens/cutscenes for the simple fact that this limitation is not one imposed by necessity as it so ardently claims but is instead purely a misguided design decision.
Just experienced this borefest for myself. The bullet time is neat for awhile, but wave after wave of generic guys coming out of nowhere and after seeing the final shot death scene for the 100th time, it got old very fast. Also, the story and characters are beyond dull and I just found myself really not giving a shit.
Then there is the weird visual effects, color changes, lines going across the screen like there is something wrong with my television and the constant freeze frames and storyboarding... just ugh. With the exception of Manhunt 2, I have never played a more dull game from Rockstar. Hated it, and I am usually very forgiving.
Then there is the weird visual effects, color changes, lines going across the screen like there is something wrong with my television and the constant freeze frames and storyboarding... just ugh. With the exception of Manhunt 2, I have never played a more dull game from Rockstar. Hated it, and I am usually very forgiving.
Dan Houser's ego-rubbing right there.
Don't you dare skip his masterfully orchestrated cutscenes!
Messofanego
Banned
Thank you for nailing down why I'd way more prefer to play a Remedy game than a Rockstar game. They just nail down the controls and feel. Dodging in the right direction in Alan Wake feels great, and cinematic without taking away control like Max Payne 3.
Instead of the skill in a usual shooter being aiming for headshots, the skill in Alan Wake is group combat management. Playing on the hardest setting is actually even more fun because if you're running out of ammo or being surrounded, chasing towards a light check point feels so tense when a chainsaw or heavy is behind you and you're low on health. It feels more survival horror then. American Nightmare really upped the enemy variety (those splitters are a tricky bunch), and makes the combat that much more engaging than in the original game.
Except, again: Rockstar wants you play it that way. Enemies will come in and sit in the middle. "Flanking" you only if you get one or two of them and then you can blind-fire at the one coming at you.
Here's how you play it:
*sit in cover at the start of the shoot-out since Max ALWAYS goes into cover*
BAM BAM BAM *dead dude*
BAM BAM BAM *dead dude*
BLAMBLAMBLAMBLBLAMBLAMBLAM *blind-fire dead dude*
Bullet-time start BLAMBLAMBLAM *dead dude after popping out and starting bullet time, as you're returning to cover, bullet-time end*
rinse and repeat.
Unless you reach a hallway stairs, then *snap to edge* BLAMBLAMBLAMBLAM *kill enemies that were there to try to take you by surprise*
Except it didn't. You basically get no damage sitting in cover and there's no pressure if you abuse the blind-fire.
Yes, you're forced to do it that way when the game won't let you push into a building to take the sniper out. Won't let you move around the initial cover to push forward/rush the airline stairs for the boss. Won't let you stay out of cover because Max ALWAYS goes into cover before a shootout and the players control is removed.
EXCEPT IN NEW YORK MINUTE: Where the game forces you to rush. And since you're rushing the game can't force you into those cover/stop-and-pop mindset-mechanics.
Which is my whole point, the game is having an "identity crisis" as that other posted stated. It wants to try to be a Max Payne, but it keeps putting Max into cover where the best option is to just sit there, bullet-time as you're coming out of cover shoot dudes quickly and pop-into-cover as you're ending bullet-time once in cover to reload.
Yes, exactly.
Stallion Free
Cock Encumbered
Using cover in Max Payne 3 is like the worst way to play the game. Shoot dodge for life. Cover is just a shoot dodge stop-gap.
Messofanego
Banned
Too bad the game forces you into cover after every single cutscene.
Stallion Free
Cock Encumbered
As opposed to throwing you into fire? It throws you into cover so that you can feel out the environment and then chose your shootdodge path of destruction.
Dick Justice
Banned
Apart from some of the more frustrating parts of later levels, I spent most of my time out of cover. I feel sorry for anyone who played it as a boring cover-shooter.
I do wish more cutscenes had you running towards enemies rather than into cover, though, like that office level.
I do wish more cutscenes had you running towards enemies rather than into cover, though, like that office level.
Stallion Free
Cock Encumbered
Even the final encounter I was shoot dodging around like crazy.
You remind me of another gripe. I constantly found myself getting stuck in cover and I could not even aim or shoot. Guys would just come around and take me out while I could not move. It was awful.
It has to be integrated into the trest of the mechanics, i believe, though it isn't a regular covershooter by any stretch.
Sometimes it does, sometimes it doesnt and really, it's just the most logical thing, so you can plan your own way of clearing the room.
Dick Justice
Banned
That was a glitch introduced in one of the patches. It's fixed now, I believe.
Why would you do that? With the exception of the grenades (that you can shoot if you see them coming) there's no reason to move. Enemies BARELY flank you in that part. Just sit there on top of the refill ammo box and just blindfire. PEW PEW PEW.
Rockstar Games presents: Stop and Pop Shooter 3!
Stallion Free
Cock Encumbered
Because I play games is the coolest and most entertaining way?
I just played 2 days ago on PS3 and it was still doing it, though. Regardless, I simply did not care for the game in general. Bored the hell out of me and the bombardment of weird visual effects got on my nerves.
DenogginizerOS
BenjaminBirdie's Thomas Jefferson
One of my top games of 2012. Totally loved every minute.
Dick Justice
Banned
Yes, how dare he play the game in the way he finds most fun. Shame on him. He should play it like every other fucking cover shooter out there.
You said some rubbish and people are proving you very wrong, yes it counters your point.
Why would you just sit behind cover and not make use of the main feature of the game that distinguishes itself other the third person shooters out there.
Baffling
I'm not saying that people shouldn't complain, it is a rightful complaint I just think people are overreacting a little bit.
I said some rubbish?
Anyway it wasn't really a counter point because I said I THINK people are overreacting (It gets more criticism than it should) and I was shown that they don't actually mask the load times all the time, they aren't really related in that way.
Spring-Loaded
Member
And when the cutscene goes into gameplay? What happens then?
Most shootouts start with Max already in cover. You have the option to sit in cover all the time. You apparently chose to never leave cover and then complain about how it's boring. I didn't want to play this as a cover shooter and had a blast. You are actively making the experience less fun for yourself and I still can't tell why exactly.
I say it's frustrating to just sit in cover all the time because even when your cover isn't easily compromised like in the favela levels, you get shot after only a second of peeking over/around cover (and on Hardcore mode, getting shot two-three times can kill you), so you end up popping up and down rapidly, which is tedious and frustrating.
You are not being forced to play it like a cover shooter.
You can get shot while shooting from cover because of enemies' accuracy. I played the game recently and they still have accurate enough aiming to hit you while shooting from cover. You haven't given convincing evidence as to how you "asically get no damage," Blind-fire is really inaccurate and ammo is not infinite. Considering all the places without decent cover in the game and enemies ability to throw grenades later on, saying there's "no pressure if you abuse blind-fire," is a pretty dubious assertion to make.
You are not being forced to play it like a cover shooter. Seriously.
...And then you regain control after the cutscene and can get out from behind cover. The sniper section makes you kill the sniper before going inside the building. Yes, this is limiting, yet I could make a similar complaint about shooting the cables on the radio tower thing at the end of Max Payne or doing the same thing in the last part of Max Payne 2. Games in general have narrow design in scripted situations. At the very least, when this game does open-up and let you tackle rooms of enemies how you see fit, it's about as dynamic as any pure shooting game out there.
Even in those situations, you're not being forced to play the game like a cover shooter.
It doesn't force you to stay in cover, unless you're talking about that glitch that was apparently patched. New York Minute is the same goddamn game. It's the same game with a time-limit.
So when there are molotov cocktails being throw over cover at you, just sitting there and burning is the best option? When there are grenades? When your cover consists of office cubicles or wooden planks that are being shot to bits? When guys decide to rush at you and you're low on ammo? When a guy is shooting a grenade launcher at you?
And even if there's no logical, in-game reason to jump into the open (and there are plenty, let's stop pretending there aren't), why not do that if it's what you want to do???? You may get shot in the game, you may get killed. But if it's fun, then so the what?
And that's fine. But saying that kind of gameplay is inherently bad and discussing this solely based on your own hangups about the game, treating them like gospel, is bull.