ethomaz
Banned
It was more about to be free to do what they wanted.
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Microsoft mismanagement ofthird party partnerships leaving developers in a bad state?
- Thread starter nynt9
- Start date
Sure but they don't have to sign it or can do so in terms that are favorable to them. Bungie might very well be the best compensated stidio in the AAA market today.
LukasTaves
Member
So called insiders saying outright lies happens all the time.
I think right now the most reliable source would be the guy that leaked it first, and he never said anything like that.
Halo was probably boring by that point and obviously money, they will be minted, way more than they were at Microsoft and after that 10 years can do what they want freely.
ethomaz
Banned
Bungie did split off from MS in 2007.
JayWood2010
Member
I dont think Microsoft expected them to take 4+ years to make it either. Again, its all about those deadlines.
And not really personally. I was never a Fable fan. I thought Scalebound looked good, where as most people on Neogaf pissed all over it.
It's already confirmed for Vive, where the brunt of development is happening. That isn't at all likely to change to being exclusive
VincentMatts
Member
MS let them leave, in return MS kept the Halo franchise. Now Bungie make halo under a different skin, only they own it.
I just love when people jump at the chance to defend a faceless multi-billion dollar company.
AusRoachman
Member
I never knew I wanted a fable action game from platinum until just now . Omg damn you ms you should have done that .
Yes, but they didn't 'leave'. They were owned by Microsoft. Microsoft let them go.
They had a good relationship with them.
ethomaz
Banned
I mean Bungie worked a lot to MS after split... OSDS, Reach, etc... they were 3rd developing to MS and they have a lot of complain that ended in they wanted to set off.
2000-2007 - MS owend Bungie
2007-2011 - Bungie worked like a 3rd party
I remember Bungie saying they left MS because MS wan't interested in giving Bungie the freedom or resources they desired that fits with the same situation of others 3rd complains talked in this thread.
VincentMatts
Member
Yeah, they had a contract to fulfill. They owed 2 more games to MS after halo3. So they made ODST and reach.
oldergamer
Member
The piling on here is humorous but misguided imo. Theres two sides to every story.
Ive been on both developer and publisher sides and have been witness to shady tactics, complete mismanagement, and even embezzlement. Just because someone posts some shit on the internet, doesnt mean they had the real picture of how it went down. When its cancelled devs blame publishers and pubs blame devs. the true answer is somewhere in between.
For every game you hear is cancelled there are 10 others that you dont hear about. Game development isnt easy and theres many factors that lead to products being cancelled.
Ive been on both developer and publisher sides and have been witness to shady tactics, complete mismanagement, and even embezzlement. Just because someone posts some shit on the internet, doesnt mean they had the real picture of how it went down. When its cancelled devs blame publishers and pubs blame devs. the true answer is somewhere in between.
For every game you hear is cancelled there are 10 others that you dont hear about. Game development isnt easy and theres many factors that lead to products being cancelled.
theindieboy
Member
Meant Crackdown 3 its on the front page of their website http://www.sumo-digital.com/ also think i heard via Kinda Funny they are heavily (from their studios perspective) involved in Crackdown that may not mean they are a large part of the developement but from there perspective are
hue hue hue hue hue
That was part of the deal for them to earn their independence. They had to make 2 additional Halo games. ODST went from an expansion to a full price release and Reach was the last Halo title they were contractually obligated to work on. MS allegedly also got rights of first refusal on their next project.
Kinda.
VincentMatts
Member
Complain? I have no idea what youre talking about. MS treated Bungie like kings. Only reason Bungie wanted to leave was because they wanted creative freedom.
When Halo2 was scrapped and had to be reworked, MS gave them the time. MS treated them really well, they just might not have realized it at the time.
"ugly divorce" (at the corporate level) is closer to what happened
To be more accurate, ODST was made 60$ because Microsoft refused to have any multi-disc title not be 60$.
Outrun
Member
Yes, they do. But this idea does not fit a certain evil MS narrative.
Banjo-Kazooie
Member
Technically if it works on Vive and not PSVR, and Vive is supported on XB Scorpio, then it would be console exclusive. For whatever that's worth lol
gollumsluvslave
Member
I say this as an Xbox owner, but Microsoft's corporate culture is NOT conducive to the kind of game development and IP fostering that I'd like to see.
You only need to look at their history and the amount of interviews out there to realise that they are very unlikely to change.
- read any Ed Fries interview
- Look at Bungie - even after Halo 1-3 they still had corporate MS trying to tell them how to do things! If that's how MS treated Bungie, their Golden Ticket, how do you think Platinum or Darkside or any other dev will fare?
- Any AAA MS published game will no doubt be focus-tested and design-by-comitte to death.
- RIP Ensemble, RIP Lionhead, RIP Press Play etc.
- GFW, UWP, etc etc
Games are not a huge cornerstone in the Microsoft Corporations plans and I don't think they even have a cohesive vision of how they fit in anymore.
I think Phil Spenser has done a decent job of trying to project a different picture, but i don't buy what Phil is selling - I think he is actually genuine, but i bet even he has been blindsided by other directives from higher up.
I think this is the biggest difference when you compare Microsoft to Sony and Nintendo; games are the lifeblood of the latter 2, whereas for Microsoft they are simply a means to an end - and I'm not even sure they know what that end is.
You only need to look at their history and the amount of interviews out there to realise that they are very unlikely to change.
- read any Ed Fries interview
If anything I bet that is even worse today for Spencer & co
- Look at Bungie - even after Halo 1-3 they still had corporate MS trying to tell them how to do things! If that's how MS treated Bungie, their Golden Ticket, how do you think Platinum or Darkside or any other dev will fare?
- Any AAA MS published game will no doubt be focus-tested and design-by-comitte to death.
- RIP Ensemble, RIP Lionhead, RIP Press Play etc.
- GFW, UWP, etc etc
Games are not a huge cornerstone in the Microsoft Corporations plans and I don't think they even have a cohesive vision of how they fit in anymore.
I think Phil Spenser has done a decent job of trying to project a different picture, but i don't buy what Phil is selling - I think he is actually genuine, but i bet even he has been blindsided by other directives from higher up.
I think this is the biggest difference when you compare Microsoft to Sony and Nintendo; games are the lifeblood of the latter 2, whereas for Microsoft they are simply a means to an end - and I'm not even sure they know what that end is.
nekkid
It doesn't matter who we are, what matters is our plan.
It is?
RichiRamjag
Member
They need to get their asses on a new sonic racing!
AFIAK the Scorpio is technically supposed to support any VR headset that can decode the signal being sent down the HDMI cable because Microsoft isn't making their own VR gear.
The controller part would be the more interesting question
VincentMatts
Member
That i kinda agree with, i feel like Xbox was at its best when it was "separated" from MS. They had their own building, working on their own stuff, and MS just let them.
Now that Xbox is in MS campus, i feel like this is worse for them. Xbox isnt windows, and it shouldnt be.
wapplew
Member
Preach.
theindieboy
Member
This is Rockstar you are talking about they might not even support Scorpio or Pro niether 1st party would have the power to make them, to be honest I expect it might but they do like making there games as close as possible between platforms and doubt adding pro/scorpio features would actually sell more games as well most people will buy it regardless, we will see, Rockstar march to the beat of their own drum.
SlipperyFishes
Banned
Bungie is a tough one to use as an example because for all their flaws Microsoft kept the beast happy and doing good things.
Bungie in recent years has become a toxic workplace thanks to the Activision model (see: Infinity Ward)
Well I give thanks to Microsoft for what lead to Obsidian's severe struggles that thankfully led to their hugely successful Kickstarter of Pillars of Eternity - which in turn kicked of a renaissance of CRPGs and a like on PC, and also led to the wonderful re-imagining and evolution of Stromlands that MS cancelled, into Tyranny.
I can only hope that Platinum can similarly find their footing in spite of MS
I can only hope that Platinum can similarly find their footing in spite of MS
Bits N Pieces
Member
Todd Howard was at MS's E3 last year in the Scorpio video talking about FGallout 4 VR and how he is looking to bring it to Scorpio.
2+2=Scorpio supports Vive?
Was transformed a bomba or what? the fact that the best competition that MK has in a long time doesn't have a sequel in the near future really saddens me
FlutterPuffs
Member
Rather than blame this entirely on Phil Spencer, I think it's more on the execs in the Xbox team to oversee games.
Phil Spencer is the big boss, but the problems regarding dev relations could have stemmed from the same group of people that were under Mattrick and him.
Like how Adam Boyes (well was) and Gio Corsi were under Shuhei Yoshida.
Phil Spencer is the big boss, but the problems regarding dev relations could have stemmed from the same group of people that were under Mattrick and him.
Like how Adam Boyes (well was) and Gio Corsi were under Shuhei Yoshida.
Lol at the "both sides" stuff here. Yeah I'm sure this publisher with multiple shady stories of their acts now and in the past (that are similar to those of several other asshole publishers) is the same as this developer reknowned for getting things done in tight deadlines.
Worse part is that, unlike Sony with early PS3, MS are so big I'm not sure it's possible for them to get a wake-up call, as they can just dump their console efforts and do other things if it goes wrong.
Worse part is that, unlike Sony with early PS3, MS are so big I'm not sure it's possible for them to get a wake-up call, as they can just dump their console efforts and do other things if it goes wrong.
martino
Member
i can see this being true and if it is it means Microsoft need to learn the lesson sony learnt last gen (with blu ray etc....)
VincentMatts
Member
The fact that so many key people left/gotfired Bungie after the split tells me youre right. Bungie isnt the same anymore and its a shame.
The closest thing we're likely to get to an official statement.
I just noticed the slight edit on JP's Twitter profile
Hoping Platinum aren't hit too hard by this :/
Outrun
Member
How about not blame anyone? The chap who decided to post a crytic tweet needs to commit to the story that he has started.
Papacheeks
Banned
I have said this a lot on GAF, but I feel the xbox brand/ division needs a reboot to find it's soul of where it fits in the market. Right now I have this huge question mark above xbox. If you had asked me during early 360 days, i would say it was where you can play local/ or online co-op with friends, and play some unique PC style titles.
I would have said that during OG XBOX as well especially since they had Bioware at the time making games exclusively for them. The had ODD world spin off's, halo, Porject gotham, ralley, fusion frenzy, lucas gems like armed and dangerous. Port's of PC gems like Enclave.
It's crazy to see they dont see that they could have been the PC/Console. Where they had console games from third party's for sure, but contracted or owned PC developers making games only for their box. Like they could have been the haven for RTS games on consoles.
The brand needs a complete reboot and scorpio is just a bandaid, and even worse only enables more of the same crap that's killing their division and brand.
We do have a pretty extensive story in the case of Phantom Dust though.
Hopefully Schreier can get some info on what happened with Platinum as well, but Japanese developers are generally tight lipped and don't air dirty laundry.
Outrun
Member
Fair point on Phantom Dust.
lightskintwin
Banned
You have an extensive one sided story in the case of Phantom Dust. Not saying the story is wrong, but we really have no details from Microsoft's side in order for a balanced report on the situation.
Kindly explain.
Papacheeks
Banned
Thanks for Contributing, such a great post.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Leaving aside the she said, he said and whose fault it is. Matter of fact MS is hemorrhaging exclusives they propped up before and it makes them look bad moreso than the developer.
Doesn't help that Scalebound was the last exclusive on their list I was looking forward to and have a PC that can play current generation stuff well enough now.
Might be time to sell my day one edition, I still have the code for the achievement laying around somewhere.
Doesn't help that Scalebound was the last exclusive on their list I was looking forward to and have a PC that can play current generation stuff well enough now.
Might be time to sell my day one edition, I still have the code for the achievement laying around somewhere.
Banjo-Kazooie
Member
Typing on mobile and missed a keyword there... *if! Apologies haha