Support NeoGAF

[evilromero]

Pokémon shuffle on mobile is The Pokémon Company's doing, no Nintendo nor Creature Inc, do you really thing they'll help?

It's a trademark dispute and Nintendo owns the trademark.

 

[Ally of Justice]

I hate Trademark Laws, they're stupid as hell.
In layman's terms, Cartamundi has the rights (or they're in process of owning) of the use of the word "Shuffle" when it's related to:

Apparatus for recording, transmission or reproduction of sound, images or other data; apparatus for receiving of sound, images or other data, namely, audiovisual receivers and mobile data receivers; magnetic, optical, numerical and electronic data carriers, namely, prerecorded magnetic data carriers featuring games; data processing equipment and computers; computer game software and computer hardware; computer software platforms for playing games; electronic and computerized video games software; downloadable electronic greetings cards and trading cards, namely, digital trading cards in the nature of multimedia software recorded on magnetic media featuring games; downloadable electronic publications in the nature of magazines and books in the field of games; downloadable electronic manuals and handbooks in the field of computer games; electronic diaries; electronic memo books in the nature of handheld computers; downloadable electronic books in the field of computer games, downloadable electronic game programs; downloadable audio and video recordings featuring games; downloadable music files; downloadable video and computer game programs; downloadable digital music from the Internet; downloadable electronic game programs” and “Games and playthings, namely, game cards; playing cards and cards for games; electronic hand-held game units; musical games, namely, musical arcade games; electronic playthings, namely, electronic learning toys; handheld electronic games, namely, hand held units for playing electronic games; apparatus for games, namely, handheld game consoles; decorations for Christmas trees” and “Education services, namely, providing classes, seminars and workshops in the field of card games; providing of training in the field of card games; entertainment, namely, providing an online board card game; provision of on-line entertainment, namely, providing on-line computer card games; providing of non-downloadable electronic publications online in the nature of magazines and books in the field of games; electronic publication of books and magazines online; games services provided online from a computer network, via computer databases or via the Internet, namely, providing online electronic games; providing information online relating to computer games and computer enhancements for games; providing information from an on-line computer database in the field of computer games; information relating to entertainment, provided on-line from a computer database or the Internet; providing on-line music, not downloadable; arranging of online computer games via the Internet; rental of books, films and computer game programs; games equipment rental; rental of video games

...Everything related to Digital Services and Digital Games, which is why they cannot "allow" Nintendo to use it in Pokémon Shuffle, because the final product (The "Pokemon Shuffle" game) is:

Downloadable electronic game programs; downloadable electronic video game software; electronic game programs; electronic game software; video game programs; video game software,

a videogame, which is included in their list of "properties".

 

[L Thammy]

To think, all those times I was playing Go Fish as a kid and had to shuffle the deck. We could have been sued!

 

[Zee-Row]

How can someone own a verb?

 

[redmetal86]

Getting Banner Saga or Scrolls flashback :lol

If this is anything like King trying to sue companies that used the word Saga, this is gonna be over quick.

Time for another Game Jam!

 

[Ally of Justice]

How can someone own a verb?

You can't, but you can own the rights to use the verb under a certain context.
It's like how Apple doesn't own the word "Apple", but the use of the the word "Apple" when it's related to Computers and Software.

 

[Rafavert]

I hate Trademark Laws, they're stupid as hell.
In layman's terms, Cartamundi has the rights (or they're in process of owning) of the use of the word "Shuffle" when it's related to:



...Everything related to Digital Services and Digital Games, which is why they cannot "allow" Nintendo to use it in Pokémon Shuffle, because the final product (The "Pokemon Shuffle" game) is:



a videogame, which is included in their list of "properties".

That's quite clear D: those laws really are a mess...

Does this mean Cartamundi is actually in the right?

 

[Haunted]

cartamundi will lose this because they won't be able to prove that there's going to be confusion in the marketplace between their product and a game called pokemon shuffle

 

[M3d10n]

Big mistake. If only they kept quiet, they could ride on the free hits from people searching for "Pokemon Shuffle" on the app store. Depending on how hard Nintendo's lawyers bite, they might be the ones needing to change their name.

 

[Exile20]

They have a crap ton of those shuffle app on the google play.

 

[Nanashrew]

This will certainly go well!

The Pokemon Company isn't afraid to sue people rather than C&Ding sometimes. Like the recent PAX party thing where they openly used official Pokemon art and buying tickets to it and so on.

As for Nintendo proper. Their legal teams are incredibly thorough. Like here when they blew DirecTV out of the water because DirecTV believed that Nintendo was infringing on their trademark for the nameThe 101 http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=627636

 

[JoeM86]

Why did they wait until now and not when the game came out in February?

Nintendo will win out here.

Pokémon shuffle on mobile is The Pokémon Company's doing, no Nintendo nor Creature Inc, do you really thing they'll help?

Pokémon Shuffle is a Nintendo 3DS game published by Nintendo and The Pokémon Company on February 18th 2015, with Nintendo of America owning the trademark "Pokémon Shuffle"

 

[TheSlySoul]

Trademark law is really stupid if you can trademark one word only.
Just saying...

 

[Gentleman Jack]

Why did they wait until now and not when the game came out in February?

It only released on Android and iOS yesterday. By the Pokemon Company

 

[KingBroly]

It only released on Android and iOS yesterday.

That doesn't matter.

 

[JoeM86]

It only released on Android and iOS yesterday. By the Pokemon Company

Pokémon Shuffle is the trademark in question, not Pokémon Shuffle Mobile. Pokémon Shuffle is a Nintendo 3DS title that was released on February 18th 2015, co-published by Nintendo and The Pokémon Company with Nintendo owning the trademark.

 

[Gentleman Jack]

That doesn't matter.

I'm answering the 'why didn't they raise a stink in February?' and that's probably the reason; Cartamundi doesn't publish anything for the 3DS eShop.

 

[JoeM86]

I'm answering the 'why didn't they raise a stink in February?' and that's probably the reason; Cartamundi doesn't publish anything for the 3DS eShop.

No, but the basis of their complaint still existed, and the mobile version has been known to exist for well over a month. Unless, of course, they just sit refreshing app stores for the word Shuffle...

 

[Machina]

I know its necessary for Nintendo to do this to survive in the long term in Japan, but god damn does it sicken me to think that they have to sink to these levels in order to accommodate a horrid cancer on the industry

 

[Scum]

I know its necessary for Nintendo to do this to survive in the long term in Japan, but god damn does it sicken me to think that they have to sink to these levels in order to accommodate a horrid cancer on the industry

 

[Gentleman Jack]

No, but the basis of their complaint still existed, and the mobile version has been known to exist for well over a month. Unless, of course, they just sit refreshing app stores for the word Shuffle...

Maybe it takes time to prepare legal opposition? Nintendo's mark was only published for opposition two months ago.

 

[Remembrance]

Why did they wait until now and not when the game came out in February?

This is a trademark opposition, which can only be filed during a designated 30-day opposition period. In this case, that period started on July 7 and was extended by another 30 days by request.

Cartamundi's trademark application is also in this 30-day opposition period for a few more days.

 

[fredrancour]

It only released on Android and iOS yesterday. By the Pokemon Company

Nintendo still owns the pokemon trademarks and therefore would be the one responsible if infringement were actually happening. Yes it is quite the legal pretzel.
also:
for the mark POKÉMON SHUFFLE, as a trademark for use in connection with “Downloadable electronic game programs; downloadable electronic video game software; electronic game programs; electronic game software; video game programs; video game software,”

this is the scope of trademark that nintendo applied for back in january. it's non-platform-specific.

 

[KingBroly]

I'm answering the 'why didn't they raise a stink in February?' and that's probably the reason; Cartamundi doesn't publish anything for the 3DS eShop.

Again, that doesn't matter, because of the category this trademark is filed under. It doesn't matter where it's released, this trademark would cover 3DS eShop titles as well.

 

[L Thammy]

It's probably about how Nintendo is releasing mobile or mobile-style games, and thereby supporting the death of the industry or something. Nothing to do with the actual topic.

Although, I kind of wonder what opinion they have on Tetris, Yoshi's Cookie, Puzzle League, and all of the other puzzle games Nintendo released back before mobile games existed. Because Pokemon Shuffle isn't too far off from those.

 

[Rolf NB]

Someone should totally release a game called Shuffle Edge tomorrow.

 

[BronzeWolf]

Cartamundi.

I hope you are ready to be sued into oblivion. Nintendo does not fuck around

 

[Rösti]

Cartamundi has filed, they did so yesterday on September 8, a second opposition against US App. Ser. No. 86/502,850, Pokémon Shuffle under G&S "Protective carrying cases for hand-held video game systems; toy figures; hand-held video game machines; hand-held units for playing electronic games; plush toys; promotional game cards; puzzles; toy action figures; balloons; toy balls; toy key chains":

Source: http://tsdr.uspto.gov/caseviewer/pdf?caseId=86502850&docIndex=2#docIndex=2

The grounds for opposition are more or less the same as for the previous opposition.

 

[fredrancour]

Someone should totally release a game called Shuffle Edge tomorrow.

might as well call it "shuffle edge saga" while we're at it.

 

[Rösti]

A document dated October 09, 2015, shows that Nintendo of America Inc. has requested 30 additional days to answer the petition, and the reason is quite peculiar:

The Defendant's Time to Answer is currently set to close on 10/11/2015. Nintendo of America Inc. requests
that such date be extended for 30 days, or until 11/10/2015, and that all subsequent dates be reset accordingly.

Time to Answer : 11/10/2015
Deadline for Discovery Conference : 12/10/2015
Discovery Opens : 12/10/2015
Initial Disclosures Due : 01/09/2016
Expert Disclosure Due : 05/08/2016
Discovery Closes : 06/07/2016
Plaintiff's Pretrial Disclosures : 07/22/2016
Plaintiff's 30-day Trial Period Ends : 09/05/2016
Defendant's Pretrial Disclosures : 09/20/2016
Defendant's 30-day Trial Period Ends : 11/04/2016
Plaintiff's Rebuttal Disclosures : 11/19/2016
Plaintiff's 15-day Rebuttal Period Ends : 12/19/2016

The grounds for this request are as follows:
- Parties are engaged in settlement discussions
Nintendo of America Inc. has secured the express consent of all other parties to this proceeding for the extension
and resetting of dates requested herein.
Nintendo of America Inc. has provided an e-mail address herewith for itself and for the opposing party so that
any order on this motion may be issued electronically by the Board.

Source: http://tsdr.uspto.gov/caseviewer/pdf?caseId=86502847&docIndex=1#docIndex=1

I guess Cartamundi can expect a check then, probably sometimes next year.

Also, all further correspondence regarding the opposition will be handled by Perkins Coie LLP: http://tsdr.uspto.gov/caseviewer/pdf?caseId=86502847&docIndex=2#docIndex=2

 

[Peltz]

Sounds like an interesting case. It's not as cut and dry as I originally anticipated.

 

[Maintenance]

So NoA buckled.

 

[Rösti]

Update (January 06, 2016):

This concerns both trademarks:

ESTTA Tracking number: ESTTA718751
Filing date: 01/06/2016

IN THE UNITED STATES PATENT AND TRADEMARK OFFICE
BEFORE THE TRADEMARK TRIAL AND APPEAL BOARD

Proceeding. 91223590
Applicant: Defendant Nintendo of America Inc.
Other Party: Plaintiff Cartamundi Services NV
Have the parties
held their discovery
conference
as required under
Trademark Rules
2.120(a)(1) and
(a)(2)?
No

Motion for an Extension of Answer or Discovery or Trial Periods With
Consent

The Defendant's Time to Answer is currently set to close on 01/09/2016. Nintendo of America Inc. requests
that such date be extended for 60 days, or until 03/09/2016, and that all subsequent dates be reset accordingly.

Time to Answer : 03/09/2016
Deadline for Discovery Conference : 04/08/2016
Discovery Opens : 04/08/2016
Initial Disclosures Due : 05/08/2016
Expert Disclosure Due : 09/05/2016
Discovery Closes : 10/05/2016
Plaintiff's Pretrial Disclosures : 11/19/2016
Plaintiff's 30-day Trial Period Ends : 01/03/2017
Defendant's Pretrial Disclosures : 01/18/2017
Defendant's 30-day Trial Period Ends : 03/04/2017
Plaintiff's Rebuttal Disclosures : 03/19/2017
Plaintiff's 15-day Rebuttal Period Ends : 04/18/2017

The grounds for this request are as follows:
- Parties are engaged in settlement discussions
Nintendo of America Inc. has secured the express consent of all other parties to this proceeding for the extension
and resetting of dates requested herein.
Nintendo of America Inc. has provided an e-mail address herewith for itself and for the opposing party so that
any order on this motion may be issued electronically by the Board.

Source: http://ttabvue.uspto.gov/ttabvue/v?pno=91223590&pty=OPP&eno=9

 

[Zombegoast]

Welcome to America.

And it's only going to get worse

 

[-Horizon-]

Man, this system yo. Wtf.

 

[BY2K]

So what does this mean? It's not over?

 

[Brawly Likes to Brawl]

Any "market confusion" caused by this is the fault of the company that decided to give their game a one-word title straight from the dictionary. Hope these guys lose.

 

[Rösti]

So what does this mean? It's not over?

Not yet, they are still in settlement discussions. Nintendo of America saw some changes in litigation executives last year (in August), that may be why this is taking so long. Or Cartamundi is asking for an unreasonable sum of money.

 

[Rösti]

The settlement discussions continue. On March 8, 2016, Nintendo requested an additional Extension of Answer:

Source: http://ttabvue.uspto.gov/ttabvue/v?pno=91223689&pty=OPP&eno=11