SapientWolf
Trucker Sexologist
I thought Broken Age was an excellent game. But I haven't played the second half yet so there's that.
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Psychonauts 2 needs to sell over 2 million copies at $60 for Fig Investor break even
- Thread starter hollomat
- Start date
They just have to be good and people will follow the high scores. Good word of mouth helps too.
But being a sequel doesn't help this game whatsoever. Witcher 3 was an amazing huge open world game that sold even better once people found out through word of mouth.
Some niche games have a lot of potential for success because the times has changed. But Psychonauts may not find that group of people now. But who knows..
pretty done
Member
LOL
The first game has only 1.4m owners on Steam and I'm almost positive it's been in $1 tier bundles.
The first game has only 1.4m owners on Steam and I'm almost positive it's been in $1 tier bundles.
mugurumakensei
Member
You misunderstand why some people invest. You're starting with the assumption that investing means you're looking to profit. The people who choose to be an investor on fig are the type of investors who back passion projects with the goal of seeing the person or groups passion project completed. With Kickstarter, you only have rewards. However, just because an investor paid into a project doesn't mean they actually want the product. They just wanted to fullfill somebody's dream. Fig offers traditional crowdfunding rewards, but, for those people who dont actually want the games, they can choose to invest instead and maybe get some money back.
RoboticWater
Banned
I don't think simple word of mouth was that much of a boon to Witcher 3's sales. That game had an extensive marketing budget and massive hype behind it. Hell, it had TV commercials. Good word of mouth earns you loyalty, not necessarily a massive consumer base. Also, bear in mind that niche games usually get, at most, niche success. It's nice for the CRPG revivals or high end indies with decent budgets and reasonable sales expectations, but $120 million isn't really feasible.
I seriously doubt most investors are the kind of people who would just drop a large sum of money not expecting some degree of payout. That's the reason you invest. To get money back. If they were so altruistic that wanted to "fulfill someone's dream," presumably they would just donate the money to the artist so the artist wouldn't need to pay them back.
IgotElbows
Member
Even if the game is 20$ it would need 6 million sales. lol...
So maybe after it goes on sale many times, and becomes a Humble bundle Monthly game, and then a regular Humble Bundle game. Maybe after all that it can break even.
So maybe after it goes on sale many times, and becomes a Humble bundle Monthly game, and then a regular Humble Bundle game. Maybe after all that it can break even.
Uhh, I think you're being naive here. First of all, many sites, including Kickstarter, will let you donate and patronise projects without asking for a reward. Secondly, Fig itself heavily promoted the ability to profit from a games success and mix traditional crowdfunding with investor backers. Third, patrons who care neither for the project itself or the money they donate are surely rare, and signing on as an investor is a clear sign of non-altruistic motivations. Moreover, I'm not sure what your point is, since getting money back is whats being discussed here.
I hope not. I'm not investing but I want to see Inexile succeed and something like this could hurt them badly.
At this point it could be just another Double Fine fuckup.
Rhazer Fusion
Member
500,000 would be an insurmountable task, but at $60? Nah. Not going to happen.
This is a...weird post.
Investors invest in order to see a return. If all you want to do is donate money, you can do that on Kickstarter.
If they're aiming for designs in the game to mirror that of X-COM, at best they're aiming for X-COM numbers, which the game can easily make.
That's a far different target then "sell as much as a leading IP in this genre dominated by Nintendo almost exclusively" which Psychonauts 2 is hilariously aiming at.
Lightning_Roller
Banned
Oooooo, shit. Good luck with that Double Fine, ya'll gonna need it.
LurkerPrime
Member
Does the return of investment apply to just Psychonauts 2, or all FIG projects?
In any case, that kind of return is absolutely insane. Investors might as well be burning their money. Like, I tried to look up Double Fine's sales (and failed), but anyways I can't help but think none of their games have done anywhere near that kind of movement.
What? If you mean XCOM: EU by Firaxis, it had four key things going for it that really helped build momentum for sales (3 of which are impossible for Wasteland 3 to attain):
Making something kind of similar and assuming you'll sell as much as XCOM is just bananas. It struck lightning in more ways than one.
In any case, that kind of return is absolutely insane. Investors might as well be burning their money. Like, I tried to look up Double Fine's sales (and failed), but anyways I can't help but think none of their games have done anywhere near that kind of movement.
What? If you mean XCOM: EU by Firaxis, it had four key things going for it that really helped build momentum for sales (3 of which are impossible for Wasteland 3 to attain):
- A massive legacy/cache from the original game in the series, X-COM: UFO Defense;
- the backlash from The Bureau: XCOM Declassified being revealed first (which was an FPS, not the strategy game everyone expected of the X-COM franchise);
- made by one of the foremost strategy developers in the business, Firaxis;
- and a really incredible game on their hands that demoed well and had some good marketing by lead designer Jake Solomon & co.
Making something kind of similar and assuming you'll sell as much as XCOM is just bananas. It struck lightning in more ways than one.
peanutbutterlatte
Member
Get Justin Bieber to voice Rez this time around. Problem solved.
Breakfast at Noon
Member
I did not know they wad making it.
Dragon Puncher
Member
Not surprised. Fig always felt like a scam to me.
Triggerhappytel
Member
Good luck with that, Double Fine. It might do maybe a quarter of that at full price.
Possumowner
Member
Oh dear,the more I hear about this the more I smell a failure.Well I'll hold out cus the game could still turn out good... could
Fox Mulder
Member
This type of model of making fans investors is bullshit and kind of scammy anyways.
Project cars did it and forums had people pushing the game and not really disclosing when they had some stake in it selling well.
Project cars did it and forums had people pushing the game and not really disclosing when they had some stake in it selling well.
Beer Monkey
Member
As far as Broken Age goes, it's the most worthwhile Kickstarter that I've put money into. Fuck the Broken Age haters. Yeah, it was late, and split in half. But it's no less of a good game, or full game, than I expected.
That said, I'm not investing in this, though I did fund the fig for PC+console codes at the early bird price.
That said, I'm not investing in this, though I did fund the fig for PC+console codes at the early bird price.
From Fig's and Double fine's position it looks pretty good, they won't care if it flops since they'll have the investor money.
For investors it is structured like it'll never return a dollar.
I guess that is one way to fund games that are going to crash and burn and only ruin a website and game studios reputation.
For investors it is structured like it'll never return a dollar.
I guess that is one way to fund games that are going to crash and burn and only ruin a website and game studios reputation.
Then the whole platform is a fraud, investing isn't a charity or a black hole to throw money at. The whole point of investing is to share in the rewards and risk...this is not structured to do that.
ScientificPizza
Banned
I mean, I genuinely can't imagine anyone investing in this assuming they were going to make a profit.
If they did they are not intelligent enough to be investing money
It is structured to do that. It's just a big risk with little reward. If the investment was more of a sure thing on a return then they wouldn't need to go anywhere near crowdfunding
If they did they are not intelligent enough to be investing money
It is structured to do that. It's just a big risk with little reward. If the investment was more of a sure thing on a return then they wouldn't need to go anywhere near crowdfunding
Hot Coldman
Banned
I feel like the Fig investment tiers still operate on some level of "look, you're still primarily interested in making this game happen, even ahead of making some money". It's still passion led, surely, because anyone expecting Psychonauts 2 to make them some money is OUTTA THEIR MIND.
Not excusing any incompetence on fig's part, of course.
Not excusing any incompetence on fig's part, of course.
spindoctor
Member
Here's what I don't get. How did the investment change from x copies at $21 to y copies at $60? First of all, a game sold at $60 is not making $60 of revenue for the studio. At the very least they lose 30% to the platform holder. That seems to be accounted for in the $21 figure but not here. Second, is the game actually going to cost $60? That's AAA price and I don't think Tim and his small studio working out of SF can produce a AAA game on a 12 million dollar budget. Also, No Man's Sky has happened. Besides, I feel like there won't be many people who would pay $60 for Psychonauts 2 and I'd guess a good number of people who would have already been caught in the crowdfunding net. Where are they going to get these full priced sales? And if it's not going to be a $60 game then why mention it? They could have said the break even point was half a million sales at $240 a piece. That would have been numerically the same as two million at $60 each and just as unlikely.
And what happens to the budget of the game if investors realize it's a losing proposition and back out? Does it get smaller in scope? Does it's very existence go back into question?
And what happens to the budget of the game if investors realize it's a losing proposition and back out? Does it get smaller in scope? Does it's very existence go back into question?
Honestly I assumed people who were investing through Fig weren't really expecting to get rich off it, it's basically more of a kickstarter donation with an off chance of getting some money back.
Eh calling Fig scam/fraud seems a little harsh. I honestly doubt they spent so much time dealing with legal matters to do so when they could easily do it on Kickstarter with little consequences. Even if DF didn't have a great record there, people really wanted Psychonauts 2.
However I think they overlooked the complexity of this investors system and they really have to tone down the unrealistic forecast. It's not just DF, look at the Rock Band PC pitch. Let's just say... it's not uncommon indies overestimate the demand for their creations they injected so much love into
However I think they overlooked the complexity of this investors system and they really have to tone down the unrealistic forecast. It's not just DF, look at the Rock Band PC pitch. Let's just say... it's not uncommon indies overestimate the demand for their creations they injected so much love into
Gameplay was pretty uninteresting for the most part. And you can bet it will be made even more uninteresting and dumbed down in the sequel in order to hit those AAA sales figures Schafer is aiming for.
This happened with the first game and even after all that it's only sitting at 1.7M sales. So it's very unlikely.
The portion that was funded by investment hasn't been collected yet. The SEC just gave FIG the approval to collect it, so they're starting to collect it now. However anyone who "pledged" to invest can back out (and in my opinion should if they're looking at it as an actual investment), which would leave the game underfunded (at least based on funds from FIG).
SliceSabre
Banned
The only kind of platformers I imagine that sell that much are like Mario and Rayman.
I wish them luck but can't see this game selling that much.
I wish them luck but can't see this game selling that much.
Rayman is not even remotely close. It's Mario, and then it's everyone else.
sixteen-bit
Member
Anyone have more detailed NPD data for the original Psychonauts?
crazy monkey
Banned
They should have been less ambitious. May be should have done game in parts and see how the intrest is.
Shao Kahn Brewing a Stew
Banned
His Majesty
Banned
mainly the reason why I avoid Fig
sad to see InXile go this way for their new project(s)
Vince DiCola
Member
I do not see this happening.
I mean it will hopefully do well and might end up selling as well as the first but only after a year or 2 and a few sales.
I mean it will hopefully do well and might end up selling as well as the first but only after a year or 2 and a few sales.
Shao Kahn Brewing a Stew
Banned
They went to fig because it's friends supporting friends. I bet the support is more friendlier and lenient than Kickstarter. That and idea of "investing" rather than pledging sounds nice.
Now that folks know about this, it'll change.
thelongestj
Member
I stayed away from looking at Psychonauts 2 when it was being crowdfunded so I didn't know until now that the early bird price to get the game was $33 and then $39 which they advertise as being less than the full price when the game will be released. I find that actually shocking that they think they can sell this as a $60 game! I can't see how they will even get 200k at that price let alone 2 million.
I had thought they were aiming around the $25 price range of Broken Age. I backed that for $15 and I quite enjoyed it. I've actually been really enjoying all their adventure remasters and I will definitely buy Full Throttle: Remastered at the full price of $15. However, I bought the original Psychonauts at the "full price" of $10 on GOG and then once again when it was in the humble bundle. $10 is almost the most I will pay for Psychonauts 2 and is what I will happily wait until 2020 or whenever it reaches that price to buy it.
I really like Double Fine and Tim Schafer has made some of my favorite games of all time but I find myself questioning their decisions a lot of the time.
I had thought they were aiming around the $25 price range of Broken Age. I backed that for $15 and I quite enjoyed it. I've actually been really enjoying all their adventure remasters and I will definitely buy Full Throttle: Remastered at the full price of $15. However, I bought the original Psychonauts at the "full price" of $10 on GOG and then once again when it was in the humble bundle. $10 is almost the most I will pay for Psychonauts 2 and is what I will happily wait until 2020 or whenever it reaches that price to buy it.
I really like Double Fine and Tim Schafer has made some of my favorite games of all time but I find myself questioning their decisions a lot of the time.
akilshohen
Member
Signed on as an investor and did not think they were gonna ask for $60 a unit 😱
A better way to think of it is that they need to hit gross retail revenue of over $120 million before investors get their money back.
So if they priced at $40 instead of $60, they'd need to sell over 3 million copies at that price.
Memorabilia
Member
Not happening. Market is far too saturated n prices generally fall too quickly to ever come close to the re-configured (scam) terms. It'll be lucky to sell 1 million @ ~$20 average by the time its through.
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