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[justjim89]

Naw. iNeed is pretty old, and it's a cool mod.

I don't know if it's 5 dollars cool but...it's cool.

What's the difference between iNeed and something like Realistic Needs and Diseases?

And modders certainly have a right to be paid if the channels are made available to them, but this isn't about modders getting paid. It's about developers and publishers getting money from a source that they weren't before. Which is kinda gross. Especially the only reason the Elder Scrolls games have such legs is because of modding communities.

Don't you have to make a minimum of $100 on a mod before you get paid for it?

 

[Netherscourge]

Originally Posted by hobblygobbly

Next step: Early Access Mods

Hi there.

I can't imagine the comments that mod is going to get...

 

[Mesoian]

Do people in here really think this will kill the free modding community?

Honestly, my biggest problem with this whole thing is that if Valve was taking this seriously, it could herald a new age of modding. I want someone to get filthy rich off of a mod that is absolutely spectacular and endorse that the system DOES in fact work. I don't think they're doing that at all. Other than the option of having an avenue of monetary payment for mod makers, I don't see Valve supporting creators in a meaningful way in the future. As we discussed already, they might, but outside of things like total conversions, I can't see it happening right now.

But we'll see. This is gonna be one hell of a wacky ride if the past hour has been any indication.

 

[crazyrabbits]

Don't you have to make a minimum of $100 on a mod before you get paid for it?

$400, and they hold the money indefinitely until you hit that mark.

 

[Mesoian]

What's the difference between iNeed and something like Realistic Needs and Diseases?

And modders certainly have a right to be paid if the channels are made available to them, but this isn't about modders getting paid. It's about developers and publishers getting money from a source that they weren't before. Which is kinda gross. Especially the only reason the Elder Scrolls games have such legs is because of modding communities.

Don't you have to make a minimum of $100 on a mod before you get paid for it?

If memory serves, iNeed is basically RNaD, wet and cold and an eating mod rolled into one very neat and tight package. If you want more immersion in the game, iNEED is super cool. It gives food, sleep and cooking a purpose.

But that's not why I go to Skyrim, so I never installed it.

 

[Nzyme32]

So how much stuff do you think will remain free on the Nexus once people start making money off simple weapon skins on the Workshop?

How many times have you downloaded a collection of mods and found them to be incompatible with other mods? In some playthroughs of Skyrim I've had over 100 mods running and to get it working I've had to cut out some mods and add in others as a work around. Now imagine doing that when you have to pay say £1-3 per mod.

Like I've previously stated, I see no good coming from this.

What's next? Blocking unauthorised none workshop mods?

The last question is pretty silly, because you could never do that on an open platform. People have been modding for years for free, because they enjoy it as a hobby, for fun or to get experience and make a name for themselves. I don't think any of these things will change, especially when there is a pay what you want option that scales from free to what ever anyone wants to pay.

The authors have the ability to view the sales data and download stats themselves. They will see it clear as day that charging for a mod that has no changes to their prior free version will earn then very little and crush their downloads vs pay what you want.

The community will flock to the mods that are either free, or reasonably priced for the content and work that they output over time. Equally they will shout out the shit, as they are now. I see nothing bad coming from this in that sense. I do see the viability of larger scale mods and larger collaborative works in projects that take off and that the community get behind, that workshop can definitely help with

 

[NinjamicWZ]

I'm totally down for mod creators being able to ply their talents and be rewarded for good work, but the type of modding I'm interested in requires tons of experimentation, trial and error and balancing to get everything working together in harmony, as much as it can. I'll spend just as much time testing and putting together something in mod organizer than I will actually utilizing it. It's too much uncertainty for me to just pay for that, and spend any amount of time trying to make a case for refunds by the dozens afterwards.

That, and the cut is really low for the mod creators, the motivation for implementing is just more parasite behavior in action, and places like nexus will be forced to compete by doing the same thing, or die. A creative, flexible wild west will likely shrink into something less risky, less malleable and dominated by painless, silly reskins that make the most profit with the least amount of effort, with people actually giving their all for %25 of almost nothing feeling slighted and inadvertently demotivated.

 

[SteveWinwood]

Just an observation, that's all. They have tiny margins as it is and now the rogue PC fans who relied on free mods are definitely not gonna support this at all which means even less money for the creators.

some fans they are

 

[tuxfool]

I'm not sure this point has been raised, but apparently refunds don't go back into your bank account but rather remain stuck in the steam wallet.

 

[YuShtink]

some fans they are

So now we're supposed to blame gamers for enjoying free mods?

 

[Felix Lighter]

Hopefully the pay what you want option allows you to go back and set a price after trying a mod out. I have no problem rewarding modders for their effort. I've donated to many in the past. But sometimes I like to try many similar mods out before choosing one to actively use. I'd to have the option to mess around before making the choice but ultimately tip the creators for the mods that work out well.

 

[Nzyme32]

Midas and Wet and Cold were both free but were updated and now cost money.

Actually you are wrong with Wet and Cold for example - the free version is still available, but the paid version adds new features and intends to be regularly update (yet to be seen) vs the free version

"Wet and Cold v2.0+ has been largely remade to reduce its performance impact. Along with a new framework, there are new items that can be found worn on NPCs. Future plans include refining the current features/assets and possibly creating new ones based on feedback. "

I see no issue with paying the low end "pay what you want" prices if their content output is shown to be good over time; right now however I would wait and see

 

[MUnited83]

So now we're supposed to blame gamers for enjoying free mods?

No, but if they think they are entitled to get free content then they should be heavily criticised, yes.

 

[Mesoian]

So now we're supposed to blame gamers for enjoying free mods?

Poe's law

 

[wickfut]

The last question is pretty silly, because you could never do that on an open platform.

Yes you can and quite easily. Look at the DLC and how that's added to your game.

The authors have the ability to view the sales data and download stats themselves. They will see it clear as day that charging for a mod that has no changes to their prior free version will earn then very little and crush their downloads vs pay what you want.

People are greedy. They will remove their free versions of a mod and only the paid version will be available. Some of these mods have x,000,000s of downloads on the Nexus. Do you really think people will put up quality mods for free while other moders with similar content are earning thousands in revenue?

I wish I shared your optimism. I think it's time people should head off to the Nexus to down every mod they can before they jump ship.

 

[Deadstar]

What if you have mods installed that you downloaded for free like the spooky scary skeleton mod? If they start charging do I have to pay?

 

[justjim89]

I'm not sure this point has been raised, but apparently refunds don't go back into your bank account but rather remain stuck in the steam wallet.

Well of course! Valve wouldn't want your money to leave their system Better keep your Steam wallet full for next weekend's Premium Moddable Games Super Springtime Sale!*

*the games that support the mods will be on sale but the mods remain full price.

 

[YuShtink]

No, but if they think they are entitled to get free content then they should be heavily criticised, yes.

Valve fanboys hate free things apparently.

 

[SteveWinwood]

So now we're supposed to blame gamers for enjoying free mods?

i mean these are people stealing content that the creators on every level believe are worth something

just because you think something should be free doesn't mean you get to steal it

you can make the argument that it will fail because of what people are used to and that's fine because free market or whatever

but going oh yeah people are mad and going to boycott because they're such big fans of the people creating the things they're boycotting... wait a sec

 

[Nzyme32]

Yes you can and quite easily. Look at the DLC and how that's added to your game.



People are greedy. They will remove their free versions of a mod and only the paid version will be available. Some of these mods have x,000,000s of downloads on the Nexus. Do you really think people will put up quality mods for free while other moders with similar content are earning thousands in revenue?

I wish I shared your optimism. I think it's time people should head off to the Nexus to down every mod they can can before they jump ship.

As I said before, NO, because the other guys will not be making "thousands in revenue" because people will mostly flock to the free version that does the same things. People will not buy something when the guy doing it for free and doing it better shows up, which will happen. That guy will get the credit and the following for what they do next. IF they update the content regularly, support it well and expand upon it, then maybe they will find success as a paid mod IF the price is low and reasonable.

 

[Bornstellar]

I would assume that an option in "Pay what you want" would still be 0.

Nope. Lowest it goes is 0.99 cents.

 

[tuxfool]

some fans they are

They might be fans of the mod. But they might not be fan enough to only give 25% of what they're paying to the creator, while letting valve and bethesda eat the rest.

 

[SteveWinwood]

As I said before, NO, because the other guys will not be making "thousands in revenue" because people will mostly flock to the free version that does the same things. IF they update the content regularly, support it well and expand upon it, then maybe they will find success as a paid mod IF the price is low and reasonable.

Woah are you saying that's the key to success?

Man that's almost the same as like... anything else on steam.

 

[Orin GA]

Yes you can and quite easily. Look at the DLC and how that's added to your game.



People are greedy. They will remove their free versions of a mod and only the paid version will be available. Some of these mods have x,000,000s of downloads on the Nexus. Do you really think people will put up quality mods for free while other moders with similar content are earning thousands in revenue?

I wish I shared your optimism. I think it's time people should head off to the Nexus to down every mod they can can before they jump ship.

I tell you what...5 years down the line, if the skyrim section of nexus is a shell of it's former self...I owe you a coke.

 

[MUnited83]

Valve fanboys hate free things apparently.

You are not entitled to get content that can take in some cases several years to make. Stop having your head up your own ass. Is it nice that there's cool free mods? Yes it is. You are in no way entitled to them. You are not entitled to people working for your enjoyment for free. Feel free to try and argue otherwise, but you won't, as the only reply you could think of was starting calling people fanboys.

 

[SteveWinwood]

Nope. Lowest it goes is 0.99 cents.

the creator can set whatever I'm pretty sure they can set it to zero I thought I saw that in a picture already

They might be fans of the mod. But they might not be fan enough to only give 25% of what they're paying to the creator, while letting valve and bethesda eat the rest.

so these valiant souls can donate to the patreons or kickstarters or PayPals the creators have surely set up

I'm not sure why everyone seems to think the creators have getting fucked here... have you tried asking them if they think it's fair?

 

[Nzyme32]

Nope. Lowest it goes is 0.99 cents.

Completely depends on the mod. It seems that creators have the option to choose the start price and go as low as free

Woah are you saying that's the key to success?

Man that's almost the same as like... anything else on steam.

I guess that is what I am saying, yes

 

[Bornstellar]

Hey, just wanted to say thanks for this, and for your work.

The entitlement of some gamers who feel like they're owed mods for free is just insane.

The fact that Valve is enabling talented developers to earn much-deserved revenue will be as groundbreaking in the next few years as the entire Workshop itself has been for years.


Good luck to all of you!

The problem isn't in having talented devs get revenue from the their work, the problem is that *almost* every mod created is done so with the use of other people's work as well. For example, most mods are built with USKP at the base, and incorporate changes / fixes from USKP. As a contributor to USKP, I'm rather unhappy with the idea.

 

[Tworak]

this deff not a good thing

 

[wickfut]

As I said before, NO, because the other guys will not be making "thousands in revenue" because people will mostly flock to the free version that does the same things. People will not buy something when the guy doing it for free and doing it better shows up, which will happen. That guy will get the credit and the following for what they do next. IF they update the content regularly, support it well and expand upon it, then maybe they will find success as a paid mod IF the price is low and reasonable.

what makes you think the "free" versions of the mods will be available?

I tell you what...5 years down the line, if the skyrim section of nexus is a shell of it's former self...I owe you a coke.

Skyrim is 4 years old.. has it really got that much life left in it?

Look at the bigger picture and what future game mods will be like. Do you think that the next Elderscrolls or big modder game is going to have free new maps, weapons, followers etc?

 

[YuShtink]

i mean these are people stealing content that the creators on every level believe are worth something

just because you think something should be free doesn't mean you get to steal it

you can make the argument that it will fail because of what people are used to and that's fine because free market or whatever

but going oh yeah people are mad and going to boycott because they're such big fans of the people creating the things they're boycotting... wait a sec

Modders in the past have gone into modding for the fun of modding and making mods they want with the understanding that they aren't going to charge people for their work. It was always one of the biggest selling points of PC gaming that you could get community made content for free to add to the games you paid for. It was A NICE THING. If you needed to make money, modding just wasn't for you.

 

[Portugeezer]

Valve taking 75% is absurd.

 

[Nzyme32]

what makes you think there still be "free" versions of the mods available?

Because they are there now

Valve taking 75% is absurd.

Bethesda and Valve. I'd speculate it is 50% Betheda, 25% Valve, 25% Creator (Based on Valve doing 50-50 split with their other games)

 

[MUnited83]

Valve taking 75% is absurd.

They don't.

 

[SteveWinwood]

Modders in the past have gone into modding for the fun of modding and making mods they want with the understanding that they aren't going to charge people for their work. It was always one of the biggest selling points of PC gaming that you could get community made content for free to add to the games you paid for. It was A NICE THING. If you needed to make money, modding just wasn't for you.

so you've missed two very popular mod creators in the last few pages saying this isn't true

are you a modder by chance? or are you speaking for a group of people you don't know?

 

[justjim89]

i mean these are people stealing content that the creators on every level believe are worth something

just because you think something should be free doesn't mean you get to steal it

you can make the argument that it will fail because of what people are used to and that's fine because free market or whatever

but going oh yeah people are mad and going to boycott because they're such big fans of the people creating the things they're boycotting... wait a sec

But it's not the modders getting the money, largely. There's a donation feature on Nexus to support modders you appreciate. This is Bethesda cashing in on the goodwill and devotion of a modding community that's made Skyrim dozens of times better than they originally developed. And Valve is reaping the benefits of a work they have even less to do with by acting as the middle man.

I understand it's a company's purpose to make money.

But making money off of mods whilst eventually throwing a bone to the people that make them as a means of justification is despicable. The ripple effect it's going to have on the modding community is just the sprinkles on the shit sundae.

 

[Allnamestakenlol]

24 hour refund period.

There are two problems with this, from my experiences. 1) You're going to have a difficult time in some instances trying to troubleshoot a problem with a mod before your refund period is up. You'll have to decide pretty quickly whether you want to immediately ask for a refund or hope you get help from the mod author/community before time is up. 2) You sometimes don't realize a mod has hosed your save file until days later.

 

[YuShtink]

You are not entitled to get content that can take in some cases several years to make. Stop having your head up your own ass. Is it nice that there's cool free mods? Yes it is. You are in no way entitled to them. You are not entitled to people working for your enjoyment for free. Feel free to try and argue otherwise, but you won't, as the only reply you could think of was starting calling people fanboys.

Mods of that scale and quality are very few and far between. If all these modders are so upset about not making money off their mods, then just don't make the fucking mods. Don't turn the entire modding community into an awful cesspool of overpriced junk.

 

[dLMN8R]

The problem isn't in having talented devs get revenue from the their work, the problem is that *almost* every mod created is done so with the use of other people's work as well. For example, most mods are built with USKP at the base, and incorporate changes / fixes from USKP. As a contributor to USKP, I'm rather unhappy with the idea.

This is a problem that needs to be solved between the various creators, not be preventing all financial incentive entirely.

 

[YuShtink]

so you've missed two very popular mod creators in the last few pages saying this isn't true

are you a modder by chance? or are you speaking for a group of people you don't know?

They should just stop making mods instead of ruining all of it for the rest of us.

 

[SteveWinwood]

hear that durante?

please stop your efforts you're ruining everything for everyone

 

[ashecitism]

http://gamasutra.com/view/news/2418...sold_on_the_Steam_Workshop_for_real_money.php

Update: A Valve representative responded to Gamasutra's request for clarification on revenue splits by highlighting the Skyrim Steam Workshop page, which notes that all revenue from sales of Skyrim Steam Workshop content will be split between Valve, Bethesda and the content creator(s).

People who sell Skyrim content on the Workshop get a 25 percent cut of the revenue, but it seems that the amount a content creator receive is ultimately up to a game's publisher or developer. New supplemental terms for the Steam Workshop legal agreement state that "the percentage of Adjusted Gross Revenue that [content creators] are entitled to receive will be determined by the developer/publisher of the Application" for which they've created content.

Presumably, content creators work out the details of that revenue split when they give their payment information to Valve, at which point they can choose to set prices for their mods or allow their patrons to pay what they want. They can also choose to send a set portion of their revenue to a Valve-approved user or community, like the Nexus Mods hosting platform. More information is available via the links above, as well as Valve's dedicated page for Steam Workshop paid content.

 

[Puppet Shadow]

Great idea.

I have a ton of mods already, but it will be interesting to see what gets added going forward. Considering the 100+ hours I've played, tossing a few dollars more for something I want seems fair.

 

[wickfut]

Because they are there now

what bizarre logic.

 

[MUnited83]

They should just stop making mods instead of ruining all of it for the rest of us.

Your heard it here folks, Durante is ruining all of it for everyone.


Jesus fucking Christ at the whiny entitled kids here.

Mods of that scale and quality are very few and far between. If all these modders are so upset about not making money off their mods, then just don't make the fucking mods. Don't turn the entire modding community into an awful cesspool of overpriced junk.

And yeah man, the devs now are totally forced to charge for their mods. Free mods literally don't exist anymore. /s

 

[Metrotab]

One part of the fun of modding Skyrim was trying out all kinds of mixes, mod variants, troubleshooting compatibility issues, basically shaping the game on your personal whims, using the mod library as this great toolset to insert and remove whatever your pleased. I spent an entire day doing so, and it was lots of fun to explore all the different options and creations people had made available.

If, let's say, one third of such content is behind a paywall because these modders don't want 'entitled people' enjoying their content for some reason, how the hell am I going to replicate that feeling of shaping a personalized version of Skyrim, or whatever game? How can I mix and match if I first have to hand over some coin, no matter how small the value, just to access some content? And there isn't even quality control involved, like a genuine commercial product would be subjected to.

Mods being free to all was a great thing. It was an inherent part of the appeal to me. Free flow of creativity in all directions. It made PC gaming great. DOOM still has content produced for it because of that dynamic.

Sad to see some modders would rather have their products evolve to some kind of third party DLC. I'm sure they'll be successful, financially. But the dynamic will never be the same.

 

[Bornstellar]

This is a problem that needs to be solved between the various creators, not be preventing all financial incentive entirely.

It's almost an impossible problem to solve, however. Which is why I think asking for donations is fine, but going beyond that is irresponsible.

 

[Corronchilejano]

So... when I create a game for Steam, I'm sure as hell going to make sure you can mod it to get some extra money on the side.

... is this how it's going to work?

 

[tuxfool]

the creator can set whatever I'm pretty sure they can set it to zero I thought I saw that in a picture already


so these valiant souls can donate to the patreons or kickstarters or PayPals the creators have surely set up

I'm not sure why everyone seems to think the creators have getting fucked here... have you tried asking them if they think it's fair?

I certainly have tipped mod creators in the past via PayPal.

Regardless of what the creators think is fair, people might not like the fact that if valve and bethesda weren't in the picture the price of items would be only 25% of what is currently charged. Like that ridiculous pack earlier with about a dozen items going for the same price as the entire game.

 

[xzeldax3]

This is a terrible idea, IMO. People are uploading stuff that isn't theirs, game updates can break the mods, and it just feels wrong.