Support NeoGAF

[Finale Fireworker]

No one cares about quality.

Even to this day, DVDs outsell Bluray discs in many markets.

IHS had a report that in the UK, in 2015, there were almost 5x as many DVDs sold as blurays.

Thow blows my mind. Even though I understand that it is true, it is always a shock to me to hear. I won't even watch a DVD if a Blu-ray is available. The quality is just so much better.

Which is why I guess I am the market for the PS4 Neo.

 

[geordiemp]

I agree but I'm not saying its a guarantee. There are a bunch of cross gen games that run horribly.

You know what, some games ran horribly on bloody everything, even sli TITAN X. Thats life bud, that has not much to do with the Neo being better than Ps4 being better than Xb1.....and just rushed game development.

If I am confident a game dev is using a great engine or has great track record, I buy that game if it appeals when I want to. Otherwise I wait for DF or GAF impressions..New iterative consoles changes nothing.

 

[Sora the Cat]

I prefer to see new soft at E3 than new hardware, so I'm totally fine with this.

 

[Daft Punk]

There are Neo devkits out in the wild - it's far too late to change the spec on it, and trying to beat Scorpio without another year of price reductions would guarantee that it'd be insanely expensive.

That's why people need to look at it less as "Sony can reel it back in and change the PS4 to be stronger!" and more as "What will Sony do to keep customers when they end up being the least powerful?" I know people don't want to consider it, but I legit think that Scorpio is going to end up being the most powerful console compared to Neo. Sony's focus will then to do whatever it takes to keep customers' eyes on Neo and not Scorpio. It should be interesting.

 

[Nephtes]

If you've actually attended an E3, that makes it even worse.

I struggle to believe that you genuinely think a crowd of journalists would chant to see a hardware upgrade.

They're not all journalists...
And the journalists that are there aren't necessarily the traditional Water Gate investigational journalists...
Many game journalists are just as big of game enthusiasts as anyone on GAF...

 

[Skux]

Do you seriously expect a crowd made up of journalists to chant something...?

This isn't PSX.

People chanted "Sony" during the E3 no-DRM reveal.

 

[kodecraft]

Games sell the hardware, no hardware being shown doesn't mean a disappointing E3.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Haha actually, all the more reason to

Was just responding to guy who said it was guaranteed

I am going to go with the fact that the games have been performing better this gen, than they have in a long time, as more evidence that things will be okay.

And no, it is not even more of a reason, it is concern trolling repeated ad nauseum.

You know what, some games ran horribly on bloody everything, even sli TITAN X. Thats life bud, that has not much to do with the Neo being better than Ps4 being better than Xb1.....and just rushed game development.

If I am confident a game dev is using a great engine or has great track record, I buy that game if it appeals when I want to. Otherwise I wait for DF or GAF impressions..New iterative consoles changes nothing.

Testify!

 

[Jln1221]

You know what, some games ran horribly on bloody everything, even sli TITAN X. Thats life bud, that has not much to do with the Neo being better than Ps4 being better than Xb1.....and just rushed game development.

If I am confident a game dev is using a great engine or has great track record, I buy that game if it appeals when I want to. Otherwise I wait for DF or GAF impressions..New iterative consoles changes nothing.

Harsh.

 

[Jln1221]

I am going to go with the fact that the games have been performing better than they have this gen, in a long time, as more evidence that things will be okay.

And no, it is not even more of a reason, it is concern trolling repeated ad nauseum.

Concern trolling? That's a thing?

Anyway if you don't like my conversations you don't need to continue joining in.

It's just a little bit embaressing when someone shares an opinion you don't agree with you start accusing/insulting.

 

[robertsan21]

So can we expect the neo to be released this year?

Im depressed with the lack of neo at E3 :-(

 

[Liamc723]

They're not all journalists...
And the journalists that are there aren't necessarily the traditional Water Gate investigational journalists...
Many game journalists are just as big of game enthusiasts as anyone on GAF...

They may well be just as enthusiastic as us, but when they're at E3, they're there to do their job.

They're not going to chant for a god damn console upgrade.

 

[Calm Mind]

So can we expect the neo to be released this year?

Im depressed with the lack of neo at E3 :-(

Nope. 1Q 2017 at the earliest.

 

[gamerforever]

Well to be honest what exactly are Sony even going to say about it? That its more powerful etc etc, but won't be out for a while and this will detract from the software.

It also looks like they are seeing what microsoft have to offer before they come out with their idea, which is a smart move.

Microsoft won't announce a more powerful console unless its out this summer as it will kill xbox one sales altogether.

I just hope this means sony have some good software to show, because i feel they will need to. Microsoft will have learnt from sonys e3 2015 and won't let them get one up on them again!

 

[DeepEnigma]

Concern trolling? That's a thing?

Anyway if you don't like my conversations you don't need to continue joining in.

It's just a little bit embaressing when someone shares an opinion you don't agree with you start accusing/insulting.

I can assure you there was no insulting, lol. Just because you have an opinion, does not mean it has to be agreed with or better yet, mutually respected. Especially when you kept at it this entire thread, ignoring evidence against such concern.

I'm thinking that games released that include a base mode and Neo mode will be like cross-gen games. The Neo mode will be what PS4 was three years ago and the base PS4 mode will be what PS3 was years ago.

That's how I see it happening. It's basically going to be cross-gen within the same generation.

Huh?

How about the PS4 mode is what the PS4 is now, and the Neo mode is either what PS4 is now, or extra bells and whistles if devs see fit?

No NX, and no Neo.

WTF is this E3.

Like last years, only more exciting now since we got that out of the way. Bring on God of War 4, Gears of War 4, For Honor, Matterfall, Detroit, VR, etc.!

 

[Deleted member 471617]

I'm thinking that games released that include a base mode and Neo mode will be like cross-gen games. The Neo mode will be what PS4 was three years ago and the base PS4 mode will be what PS3 was years ago.

That's how I see it happening. It's basically going to be cross-gen within the same generation.

 

[geordiemp]

Harsh.

But fair, I recall watching a total biscuit review of a game running on his SLI Titan X, cannot remember the game, and it ran like shit. He was going nuts. Just goes to show power does not cure everything.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5eBX7PgcFg4

CoD Ghosts ran better on ps4 than his monster titan rig lol. There are a few examples...

 

[ZombiePlatypus]

No NX, and no Neo.

WTF is this E3.

 

[The God]

That's why people need to look at it less as "Sony can reel it back in and change the PS4 to be stronger!" and more as "What will Sony do to keep customers when they end up being the least powerful?" I know people don't want to consider it, but I legit think that Scorpio is going to end up being the most powerful console compared to Neo. Sony's focus will then to do whatever it takes to keep customers' eyes on Neo and not Scorpio. It should be interesting.

Must be why they're making Knack 2.

 

[ASilentProtagonist]

No NX, and no Neo.

WTF is this E3.

More games. Which i'm totally ok with.

 

[Calm Mind]

No NX, and no Neo.

WTF is this E3.

Games promised years prior and games that will not be released for years to come. Like every other E3.

 

[icespide]

So can we expect the neo to be released this year?

Im depressed with the lack of neo at E3 :-(

no reason to think it couldn't come out this year. unveil at E3 is not a requirement for that

 

[Jln1221]

I can assure you there was no insulting, lol. Just because you have an opinion, does not mean it has to be agreed with or better yet, mutually respected. Especially when you kept at it this entire thread, ignoring evidence against such concern.

You don't have to respect my opinion but theres no reason to act like a bully everytime I post something. There is no evidence that you can give me that will prove something wont happen regarding a game that doesnt exist yet. Fair enough?

 

[StrongBlackVine]

That's why people need to look at it less as "Sony can reel it back in and change the PS4 to be stronger!" and more as "What will Sony do to keep customers when they end up being the least powerful?" I know people don't want to consider it, but I legit think that Scorpio is going to end up being the most powerful console compared to Neo. Sony's focus will then to do whatever it takes to keep customers' eyes on Neo and not Scorpio. It should be interesting.

It has nothing to do with beating Scorpio. If it releases a year later it should be more powerful. The fact is the insider that said they had two specs to choose from reiterated that same comment today which means they haven't made a final decision . So regardless of how it stacks up to whatever MS is working on the specs that we have seen leaked are in no way final. Since when does distributing dev kits before a product has even been officially announced mean you are locked into the specs? That is relatively flimsy evidence.

You don't have to respect my opinion but theres no reason to act like a bully everytime I post something. There is no evidence that you can give me that will prove something wont happen regarding a game that doesnt exist yet. Fair enough?

Stop playing the victim card. To be frank you made a horrible first impression and crying about how people are responding to you is not going to help matters.

 

[UmbraeCruxis]

So can we expect the neo to be released this year?

Im depressed with the lack of neo at E3 :-(

Nope. 1Q 2017 at the earliest.

Not necessarily true. The gap between announcement and release of the PS3 slim was like a month. I would probably expect an announcement at Gamescom in August or so honestly.

 

[DeepEnigma]

You don't have to respect my opinion but theres no reason to act like a bully everytime I post something. There is no evidence that you can give me that will prove something wont happen regarding a game that doesnt exist yet. Fair enough?

Bully? Because I counter your 'concern'? What has happened to the internet?

I will not respond to you further, lol.

It has nothing to do with beating Scorpio. If it releases a year later it should be more powerful. The fact is the insider that said they had two specs to choose from reiterated that same comment today which means they haven't made a final decision . So regardless of how it stacks up to whatever MS is working on the specs that we have seen leaked are in no way final. Since when does distributing dev kits before a product has even been officially announced mean you are locked into the specs? That is relatively flimsy evidence.

Agreed. And since it is supposedly the same chip on the 480 being released (Polaris)... they can up the clocks within their cooling solution threshold, and get more Flops out of it.

MSFT upped the clocks within their thermal threshold on the Xbox One, well after dev kits had been out. Hell, within a couple months before launch (reacting to Sony most were saying).

Right now the early leaks on the Neo, echo'ed a low end clocked Polaris '480' with the threshold at the time. The new card coming soon, and Scorpio's supposed leak, show they have made advancements on said thermals for clocking.

 

[Captain Tuttle]

Disappointing

Maybe Scorpio spooked them

 

[KinofChaos]

Disappointing

Maybe Scorpio spooked them

LOL this thread man.

 

[...Scatter...]

I don't believe it. They will have to address it in some capacity. That's like me telling my 5 year old I have a treat for him when I walk in the door and not telling him what it is or when I'm going to give it to him.

 

[Deleted member 471617]

Huh?

How about the PS4 mode is what the PS4 is now, and the Neo mode is either what PS4 is now, or extra bells and whistles if devs see fit?

What do you mean by "extra bells and whistles"? There isn't supposed to be any differences between the PS4 base and PS4 Neo versions. I'm expecting this - games to be exactly the same but running at 1080P/30FPS on Neo and the same or less on the base PS4. I don't see 1080P/60FPS games. At least not on a consistent basis anyway.

 

[Jln1221]

Bully? Because I counter your 'concern'? What has happened to the internet?

I will not respond to you further, lol.

Theres no countering. It ends there.

 

[BradleyLove]

Nope. 1Q 2017 at the earliest.

Have anything to back that up?

 

[ZombiePlatypus]

More games. Which i'm totally ok with.

Games promised years prior and games that will not be released for years to come. Like every other E3.

Yeah, I know it's about the games first, but I can't help and imagine what a spectacular event it would have been if both consoles were also finally showcased properly there.

Oh well. Last year's was the E3 of a lifetime anyway. So long as some neat titles are shown this year, it'll be alright.

 

[icespide]

What do you mean by "extra bells and whistles"? There isn't supposed to be any differences between the PS4 base and PS4 Neo versions. I'm expecting this - games to be exactly the same but running at 1080P/30FPS on Neo and the same or less on the base PS4. I don't see 1080P/60FPS games. At least not on a consistent basis anyway.

of course there will be differences, otherwise what is the point?

 

[Hero_of_the_Day]

Do not remember full 1080p, but it should have the horsepower to do so since most OG games now run at 1080p. I believe over 90% at least. I do remember they cannot perform worse than the OG version, regardless if it pushes higher fidelity.

Looking at the original Giant Bomb article, it appears you don't remember it because I made that part up.

 

[Daft Punk]

It has nothing to do with beating Scorpio. If it releases a year later it should be more powerful. The fact is the insider that said they had two specs to choose from reiterated that same comment today. So regardless of how it stacks up to whatever MS is working on the specs that we have seen leaked are in no way final. Since when does having does distributing dev kits before a product has even been officially announced mean you are locked into the specs? That is relatively flimsy evidence.

Not necessarily. Yes, specs can always be upgraded and blah blah, but let's look at what Scorpio is doing. Making a 6TF beast vs. a 4.4TF upgraded PS4. If Sony is going to have studios make Neo compatible games starting in September and have all games before then have a retroactive patch, it's hinting that the system is gearing up for a launch soon enough. If Sony have been planning this whole thing out, why would they want to try and go toe to toe with MS if they are in the driver's seat? They would be better served letting MS go crazy while you build up your library with more deals with companies and potential exclusives. It's almost like looking at the PS2 again with Xbox.

 

[...Scatter...]

What do you mean by "extra bells and whistles"? There isn't supposed to be any differences between the PS4 base and PS4 Neo versions. I'm expecting this - games to be exactly the same but running at 1080P/30FPS on Neo and the same or less on the base PS4. I don't see 1080P/60FPS games. At least not on a consistent basis anyway.

Do you actually believe this? They're would be a fucking riot after the first DF article.

 

[Aostia]

of course there will be differences, otherwise what is the point?

But what kind?
We should also consider the competitive picture. Which is the meaning to have a stronger Scorpio if the games will necessarily be developed also for the basic consoles?
Will there be significant diffwrences? Will the basic consoles owners have issues? Will this sony/ms upgrades split the fanbase?
I am so confused...

 

[Deleted member 471617]

That's the problem though. If the differences are major and substantial, you're basically screwing over the 40m PS4 owners because they would then have the inferior version.

I think that the entire mid gen upgrade idea is a horrible move for both companies. More for Sony than Microsoft because they're dominating and look at Uncharted 4. PS4 is fine. There's nothing wrong with it.

It's up to the developers to fully maximize and correctly optimize the games and it's up to the publishers to give their developers the time to do so.

Have to wait and see how it all plays out but im seeing a clusterfuck.

 

[Dlacy13g]

Well this certainly puts me on hold for a possible PS4 purchase. I want to see what the details of the NEO actually are an while I know its more than $350...how much more? This just really muddied the waters for me for this holiday.

 

[slavesnyder]

Have anything to back that up?

Just logic. If it came out this year, E3 would be the perfect stage to reveal it.

 

[StrongBlackVine]

Not necessarily. Yes, specs can always be upgraded and blah blah, but let's look at what Scorpio is doing. Making a 6TF beast vs. a 4.4TF upgraded PS4. If Sony is going to have studios make Neo compatible games starting in September and have all games before then have a retroactive patch, it's hinting that the system is gearing up for a launch soon enough. If Sony have been planning this whole thing out, why would they want to try and go toe to toe with MS if they are in the driver's seat? They would be better served letting MS go crazy while you build up your library with more deals with companies and potential exclusives. It's almost like looking at the PS2 again with Xbox.

So basically "screw what the person actually knows something said my theory is what counts." I guess our conversation is done. I'm not interested in guesswork when we have access to somewhat reliable sources.

 

[Deleted member 471617]

Do you actually believe this? They're would be a fucking riot after the first DF article.

Believe? No but I wouldn't be surprised. For me personally, if I see the base version for example running at 920P/30FPS or less and the Neo is a full 1080P/60FPS, im going to be pissed as hell.

Sorry but neither Sony or Microsoft should be doing this. It would far easier, cheaper and simpler to just release PS5 and Xbox 4 respectively then this is going to be.

 

[SMattera]

So what are you arguing? Bluray is not going anywhere, and will just continue to grow, and prices come down.

The adoption rate timeframe, they knew would be slower due to disc cost. But in no way is it to be 'written off' as 'no one gives a shit'.

No, Blu-Ray will begin to decline in the near future. 4K discs will never see widespread adoption. The market for them is likely to be smaller than the market for 3D Blu-Rays.

 

[...Scatter...]

That's the problem though. If the differences are major and substantial, you're basically screwing over the 40m PS4 owners because they would then have the inferior version.

I think that the entire mid gen upgrade idea is a horrible move for both companies. More for Sony than Microsoft because they're dominating and look at Uncharted 4. PS4 is fine. There's nothing wrong with it.

It's up to the developers to fully maximize and correctly optimize the games and it's up to the publishers to give their developers the time to do so.

Have to wait and see how it all plays out but im seeing a clusterfuck.

They won't be screwing anyone over. Base PS4 owners will just have a lower res game at medium settings while NEO owners will have higher res at High settings.

 

[DeepEnigma]

What do you mean by "extra bells and whistles"? There isn't supposed to be any differences between the PS4 base and PS4 Neo versions. I'm expecting this - games to be exactly the same but running at 1080P/30FPS on Neo and the same or less on the base PS4. I don't see 1080P/60FPS games. At least not on a consistent basis anyway.

Better shadow resolutions, framerates, drawn distances, foliage densities, physics calculations, lighting, shaders, etc., are all an option with more than double the Flops.

If games are hitting 900p/60 in multiplayer (like Battlefront/UC4), 1080p/60 in DOOM, I can see them hitting 1080p/60 in the Neo. My X1 scaler is God Tier, so I am content with 1080p native for all on Neo.

 

[Boke1879]

That's the problem though. If the differences are major and substantial, you're basically screwing over the 40m PS4 owners because they would then have the inferior version.

I think that the entire mid gen upgrade idea is a horrible move for both companies. More for Sony than Microsoft because they're dominating and look at Uncharted 4. PS4 is fine. There's nothing wrong with it.

It's up to the developers to fully maximize and correctly optimize the games and it's up to the publishers to give their developers the time to do so.

Have to wait and see how it all plays out but im seeing a clusterfuck.

Who is being screwed over? If you're ok with your ps4 don't upgrade. People will buy the cheap model or spend a little bit more if they want a premium experience.

You said it yourself Uncharted 4 looks fine. So why would anyone feel screwed over?

People who don't care won't buy it. People who do want it will buy it. There won't be this mass hysteria. It's actually pretty simple

 

[geordiemp]

That's the problem though. If the differences are major and substantial, you're basically screwing over the 40m PS4 owners because they would then have the inferior version.

I think that the entire mid gen upgrade idea is a horrible move for both companies. More for Sony than Microsoft because they're dominating and look at Uncharted 4. PS4 is fine. There's nothing wrong with it.

It's up to the developers to fully maximize and correctly optimize the games and it's up to the publishers to give their developers the time to do so.

Have to wait and see how it all plays out but im seeing a clusterfuck.

No, why cant a consumer pay more money to have uncharted 4 run at 60 FPS.

It does not mean your game will run worse, its only if you have some issue with others having something better than you that they paid more for.

How do you play Witcher 3 knowing some guy is playing it at 1440p60 on his dual Titans ?

What will you do ? Buy a PC, someone is always better than whatever you have. What do you do when someone overtakes you in his Ferrari ?

The only purpose of a Neo would be to allow users to play say Witcher 3 / Bloodborne at 60 FPS as an option if the dev allows it. If Neo cant do that, it will sell like shit and be irrelevant anyway IMO, it has no purpose.

All PC devs allow this, its normal, and for AAA devs they only need 2 settings not 1000 settings like for PC. Allot of good engines and AAA games now have adjustable scaling, 720 to 1080p60 (Frostbite). I can imagine strong engines like this will just run better on better hardware with NOTHING to do.

And lets face it, every medium is doing this now, IOS, Sony, MS, PC, Andriod and probably Nintendo too. Better start accepting it.

 

[...Scatter...]

Believe? No but I wouldn't be surprised. For me personally, if I see the base version for example running at 920P/30FPS or less and the Neo is a full 1080P/60FPS, im going to be pissed as hell.

Sorry but neither Sony or Microsoft should be doing this. It would far easier, cheaper and simpler to just release PS5 and Xbox 4 respectively then this is going to be.

Prepare to be pissed. Though I'm not confident NEO is strong enough for 1080p 60 in most titles unless they upgrade the cpu.

 

[ZombiePlatypus]

Well this certainly puts me on hold for a possible PS4 purchase. I want to see what the details of the NEO actually are an while I know its more than $350...how much more? This just really muddied the waters for me for this holiday.

Yup, same boat here.

Guess I'll keep waiting. With the current backlog, and PS4 not currently having PS3 or PS2 BC, there's no rush anyway.