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[SPOILERS] Star Wars: The Force Awakens - It's True. All of it.

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S

SpotAnime

Member
MrHoot said:
Well suddenly it makes way more sense. I wish the movie had some of that in though to explain, especially the relation between leia, the republic and the first order.

How did the first order managed to build Starkiller tho ? If they barely have funds for ships, but turning a planet into a base with a superweapon is all good ?
Click to expand...

And, once Starkiller gets turned into a star itself, that action basically nukes the majority of the First Order, doesn't it? Episode VIII should end up being the same situation in reverse - a small band of FO troops with Ren hunting down Skywalker, and the Resistance having the upper hand in terms of troops and ships.

The only way that's an even fight is if Snoke and Ren have something up their sleeves, which makes me way more interested in where Episode VIII could go.

jackdoe said:
I think it's pretty clear that JJ Abrams wanted her to be Luke's daughter. Especially with how much import is placed on her family and her connection to the Skywalker lightsaber. Whether Rian Johnson goes with this is up in the air, but I think he will.
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I keep seeing people say this, or perhaps lineage to Kenobi, but wouldn't that entail that Luke or Ben had a wife? And wouldn't that be in violation of the "Jedi Way"? Immaculate Conception theories aside, I find Rey being a descendant of Luke or Obi-Wan unlikely for this reason alone.
 
N

NihonTiger90

Member
CrichtonKicks said:
Inside the former Empire or Inside the First Order?

Given that the First Order seems to be made up primarily of people who are literally indoctrinated shortly after birth and undergo regular reprogramming sessions it does not seem surprising that getting reliable Human Intel is difficult.
Click to expand...

Also keep in mind that Finn was freaking out about being found. Sounded like to me that the First Order quickly disposes of anyone who might decide to leave them.
 
V

Veelk

Banned
One disappointment for me was that 3CPO was back. I fucking hate this guy. His entire character is one long unfunny gimmick. If you're going to do something with him, then just...do something with him. I want to see a scene where he just loses his shit and just goes nuts at something. I can't stand how he's been the same character in every damn scene he's in.
 
S

speedpop

Has problems recognising girls
MiamiWesker said:
Saw it a second time, even better than the first time!

I also read the vehicle cross section book that had a crazy amount of info about the governments. So in the book it mentions that the new class of star destroyer is a violation of the weapons treaty the republic had with the first order. which means the first order is a legal government entity recognized by the republic.

The first order was formed in the "unknown territories", this is where they built Starkiller base, trained all the children and builtall their ships to hide it from the republic. They don't have infinite funds like the empire has so they needed to focus more on protecting their investments. The book says that unlike the empire they don't view their pilots as expendable, so the new TIEs have built in shields. The book makes mention that they have far fewer resources than the empire. Because they can't build so many star destroyers they made sure to fix the flaw from ended, so now there is an emergency bridge inside the ship in case the top one is blow up.

Now the resistance is explained as well. Leia knows the first order is run by Snoke, the republic doesn't believe a Sith Lord is running this new group, in fact the republic doesn't know of any of the illegal operations the first order is running. So Leia gets support from all her close friends in the republic to form the resistance. They use whatever ships they can salvage, the transport she arrives in is a modified b-wing for instance. She has no capital ships, it's just a small group of... Rebels basically.

There is a bunch of cool stuff about the Falcon and the freighter Han owns. The falcon has a special room as a wedding gift for Leia. On the freighter There is a mysterious cargo container that has always been locked and Han doesn't know the code so it just sits there unopened. It talks about the falcon ownership line and a few thinks Han and Chewie were doing as smugglers.
Click to expand...

This is cool information. Thanks for sharing.
 
T

Toa TAK

Banned
Veelk said:
One disappointment for me was that 3CPO was back. I fucking hate this guy. His entire character is one long unfunny gimmick. If you're going to do something with him, then just...do something with him. I want to see a scene where he just loses his shit and just goes nuts at something. I can't stand how he's been the same character in every damn scene he's in.
Click to expand...

Give it time, Veelk. It's coming:

c36ZQjR.jpg
 
B

BlastProcessing

Member
Dead said:
Between this and hearing about "too many ships are confusing" thing, Seems there was a lot of conscious dumbing down for the lowest common denominator meetings going on behind the scenes
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The lowest common denominator gets a bad rap. Simplicity and clarity aren't necessarily bad things.
 
F

Fata1moose

Banned
Also they were blowing up republic planets with Starkiller, is it speculated/a consensus that Coruscant was the planet they showed?

:lol When they first showed him I was annoyed he was giant, then it turned out to be a hologram and I was relieved.
 
L

LegalEagleMike

Member
SpotAnime said:
And, once Starkiller gets turned into a star itself, that action basically nukes the majority of the First Order, doesn't it? Episode VIII should end up being the same situation in reverse - a small band of FO troops with Ren hunting down Skywalker, and the Resistance having the upper hand in terms of troops and ships.

The only way that's an even fight is if Snoke and Ren have something up their sleeves, which makes me way more interested in where Episode VIII could go.
Click to expand...

according to the novelization the majority of the First Order fleet is not at Starkiller base because they feared that concentrating their full forces there would lead to its discovery before it was ready. Also according to one of the art books Snoke keeps himself constantly on the move, so he may actually be with the fleet.
 
T

TAJ

Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.
NihonTiger90 said:
Well, building it into the planet may be a bit less expensive than the construction of an entire structure as the Death Star was. That's about the only explanation I think makes sense for it.
Click to expand...

No, because as they showed in the "This is totes different than the other Death Stars because it's so big, SO BIG! Just look at it!" scene the cannon alone would have required far more resources than an entire Death Star.
 
1

140.85

Cognitive Dissonance, Distilled
YuShtink said:
I dunno I think a lot of you guys are being way too critical of potential plot holes and unknown stuff due to the film's by-the-seat-of-your-pants feel and it's lack of backstory and exposition - but think about A New Hope in a vacuum. Go back and watch that movie as if you were going into the series blind and you'll see it's very bare bones in exposition and backstory too. So much is left to the imagination or merely referenced in passing as we go on a wild ride with young Luke. This film is very much about capturing that spirit, whether you feel that's a good choice or not is another thing. But it was one of the things that many people loved about the first Star Wars film. It just gave you a teasing glimpse into a huge universe of possibilities.
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Yeah. I have this experience when I watch the old films with friends that have never seen it. They ask questions about stuff that to me are obvious but then I remember that unlike me, they haven't seen all the films multiple times and had things explained.
 
M

munchie64

Member
Veelk said:
One disappointment for me was that 3CPO was back. I fucking hate this guy. His entire character is one long unfunny gimmick. If you're going to do something with him, then just...do something with him. I want to see a scene where he just loses his shit and just goes nuts at something. I can't stand how he's been the same character in every damn scene he's in.
Click to expand...
His intro made his appearance worth it.

Plus I love him.
 
M

MiamiWesker

Member
Veelk said:
One disappointment for me was that 3CPO was back. I fucking hate this guy. His entire character is one long unfunny gimmick. If you're going to do something with him, then just...do something with him. I want to see a scene where he just loses his shit and just goes nuts at something. I can't stand how he's been the same character in every damn scene he's in.
Click to expand...

This is the worst post in the thread. C3PO forever. His entrance in this movie was classic. I want more 3PO
 
V

Veelk

Banned
For those who read it, is the novelization actually well written, or is one of those that just literally transcribes the events of the movie in a bland prose?
 
F

Fata1moose

Banned
earvcunanan said:
Serkis says Snoke is someone who's been around "long enough" to know what's been going on, but at the same time it'll be a new character. People still think Snoke might be Plagueis, though.
Click to expand...

I wouldn't hate for him to be Plagueis, but it seems like Kasdan didn't even know who that was at a panel.
 
S

SpotAnime

Member
LegalEagleMike said:
according to the novelization the majority of the First Order fleet is not at Starkiller base because they feared that concentrating their full forces there would lead to its discovery before it was ready. Also according to one of the art books Snoke keeps himself constantly on the move, so he may actually be with the fleet.
Click to expand...

Thanks for that. Makes me want to read the ADF novelization even more. Love his OT stuff.
 
P

Psychoward

Banned
Snoke sucks and I thought he was a giant at first

the movie was cool

best part was X-Wings approaching low over the water

the end of my thoughts
 
K

kurahador

Member
YuShtink said:
I dunno I think a lot of you guys are being way too critical of potential plot holes and unknown stuff due to the film's by-the-seat-of-your-pants feel and it's lack of backstory and exposition - but think about A New Hope in a vacuum. Go back and watch that movie as if you were going into the series blind and you'll see it's very bare bones in exposition and backstory too. So much is left to the imagination or merely referenced in passing as we go on a wild ride with young Luke. This film is very much about capturing that spirit, whether you feel that's a good choice or not is another thing. But it was one of the things that many people loved about the first Star Wars film. It just gave you a teasing glimpse into a huge universe of possibilities.
Click to expand...

Except ANH isn't beholden to any plot continuity from previous movies.
 
L

lybertyboy

Thinks the Evil Empire is just misunderstood.
In the novel it seems clear that R2-D2 didn't know he had the information about the missing piece of the map until they are all at the conference table talking about the fact that the First Order claim they already have the missing piece. He then proceeds to roll up and tell 3PO that he believes he might have access to that info from Imperial data he had pulled in the past.
 
C

CrichtonKicks

Member
Jarmel said:
The First Order is comprised of the former Empire. Hux's family for example comes from the Empire.

The amount of resources to create something like Starkiller would have been insane. It's beyond belief that nobody heard about the First Order building a Death Star that is even larger than the old ones.
Click to expand...

Depends on what information gets out. Maybe they think it's for a fleet of Star Destroyers instead? Which is why we don't see much in the way of capital ships because it's all being diverted?


The Republic pretty clearly isn't a super power type hegemony. Which probably makes sense given that the new structure has only been in existence for 30+ years if that. The new status quo makes it pretty clear that the Empire didn't just fold and lay down their arms after the battle of Endor.
 
E

eyeball_kid

Member
MiamiWesker said:
I also read the vehicle cross section book that had a crazy amount of info about the governments. So in the book it mentions that the new class of star destroyer is a violation of the weapons treaty the republic had with the first order. which means the first order is a legal government entity recognized by the republic.

The first order was formed in the "unknown territories", this is where they built Starkiller base, trained all the children and builtall their ships to hide it from the republic. They don't have infinite funds like the empire has so they needed to focus more on protecting their investments. The book says that unlike the empire they don't view their pilots as expendable, so the new TIEs have built in shields. The book makes mention that they have far fewer resources than the empire. Because they can't build so many star destroyers they made sure to fix the flaw from ended, so now there is an emergency bridge inside the ship in case the top one is blow up.

Now the resistance is explained as well. Leia knows the first order is run by Snoke, the republic doesn't believe a Sith Lord is running this new group, in fact the republic doesn't know of any of the illegal operations the first order is running. So Leia gets support from all her close friends in the republic to form the resistance. They use whatever ships they can salvage, the transport she arrives in is a modified b-wing for instance. She has no capital ships, it's just a small group of... Rebels basically.
Click to expand...

What the... if they had even presented half of this information the film would've made so much more sense. This stuff is actually important to set the chess pieces for the new story.

Veelk said:
One disappointment for me was that 3CPO was back. I fucking hate this guy. His entire character is one long unfunny gimmick..
Click to expand...

What. The girl next to me started crying when C3PO said to R2, "I missed you, old friend" and frankly I got a little something in my eye too. He's a fantastic character and the friendship between C3 and R2 is heartwarming.
 
F

Fata1moose

Banned
JTripper said:
I'd also like to point out the little detail that Starkiller Base turning into a sun when it was destroyed is fucking awesome.
Click to expand...

It turned into Han's grave too. :p

It didn't make a lot of sense, but I liked it turned into a sun, when they said it collapsed I expected a black hole.
 
C

Chitown B

Member
Dead said:
I feel she should be Luke's daughter, as I definitely see the main Star Wars movies as the Skywalker saga and that was definitely what George intended.
Click to expand...

he intended that for 1-6. after that all bets are off. if he wanted to make 7-9 he could've but he wanted out.
 
D

Dead

well not really...yet
DarkHeartedKill said:
Was looking up some Star Wars stuff and found this article http://www.pennlive.com/entertainment/index.ssf/2015/12/star_wars_force_awakens_5_worst_parts.html

How much do you guys agree with the list? I'm interested in knowing.


Also, speaking of the Finn and Rey relationship, I like how he got knocked out and she went to his side, then he asked her is SHE was okay lololol.
Click to expand...
Points 5 and 3 are definitely two of my biggest criticisms. 5 is typical JJ Abrams bad and lazy storytelling (Star Trek was horrible with this), and 3 is just...bad storytelling. I get that some people don't want scenes with senators, generals and whatever going on about shit, but this is one of the few times that exposition was needed in the movie. Screw off with that "its explained in the novel" crap
 
M

MetalFearSolid

Banned
I am so confused with Rey family ties stuff why would her family abandon her in a place like Jakku? To fend for herself. But them again was someone tasked to look after her or was she sold as a slave or something? Someone was grabbing her either to look after her or she was being sold.

Couldn't she be someone with just high
Midi-chlorian.

So another Anakin
 
Kssio_Aug

Kssio_Aug

Member
Speevy said:
I don't think any character came across as having ridiculously extraordinary ability.

The fighting in the prequels felt rather like the characters were doing some sort of laser show dance. In this movie, I liked that they seemed to beat the shit out of each other and really struggled to the death for each blow. It felt raw and brutal.

This quibbling over whether Rey can be a master Jedi right now is missing the point. We want to see someone who is skilled like this. It's been 10 years.
Click to expand...

I agree. Besides the tech making some good to episodes 1~3, the fights felt too unnatural. They totally got it right in The Force Awakens, with much more brutal and natural fights, less acrobatic and more aggressive. The lightsabers also got a better treatment now, they felt like really powerful weapons capable of great damage, like when Kylo Ren touches it against Finn shoulders making him scream in pain.

Other thing I liked is that stormtroopers finally did look like capable soldiers! Like when a random stormtrooper fight agains Finn "hand to hand", I loved that scene besides I did felt a bit disappointed when they shot him in the chest (lol).
 
T

Tamanon

Banned
Hmm, just got back from a 3-D showing. It was dumb fun, but seemed to be super paint-by-the-numbers. I liked Rei, and Finn had his moments. Overall it just seemed to move too quickly. Everyone identifying a weakness in the Starkiller over a 3 minute brainstorming session was weird. Also, people can really book in a limited time. The amount of ground they cover over 15 minutes was amazing.

Good film, but pretty dumb IMO. Really hope they don't go with Rei being Luke's daughter.
 
M

MattyG

Banned
I suspect they left a lot of the politics between the Republic and the First Order out because they would've gotten comparisons to the prequel's politics (even if they'd handled it all perfectly).
 
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